Best non kyc exchange to use and how it fits with trezor

[beltran834]

Recently on here someone  kindly linked me to a page listing non kyc exhanges.

 These included bisq network,  hodlhodl   and localcoinexchange. I mention these 3 b/c they look to me like the ones where I might have the best chance of figuring out how to use these exchanges to buy and maybe later to sell bitcoin. I own no btc at all at the mo.

 Could someone who uses or has used one of these exchanges suggest to me which might be best for me to go with? I'm in uk and would probably prefer to use paypal but I of course have no idea if that's the best safest and quickest way.

Also how does using a trezor device fit in with using an exchange like one of the above.

As is probably obvious I'm clueless about how to get started buying and cold storing btc and am finding the whole thing quite confusing and bewildering. Any help and advice gratefully appreciated.

[mk4]

Bisq and HodlHodl are great. Though personally, I mostly use HodlHodl simply because it's a lot more convenient though Bisq is better in a privacy perspective.

As for PayPal, chances are, you wouldn't be able to buy bitcoin with PayPal as people wouldn't trust someone with zero positive feedback. Depending where you're from, you're probably going to find bitcoin sellers that accepts online banking and such. As for selling bitcoin for PayPal, there are a few people with decent amounts of feedback that pay with PayPal; but still watch out for scammers.

Also how does using a trezor device fit in with using an exchange like one of the above.

After buying the bitcoin, you send them over to the Trezor wallet that you've generated on the Trezor device itself. The Trezor is a hardware wallet, and hardware wallets are mainly used for securely holding your funds.

If you don't know much about wallets yet, probably read the basics:

• https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1631151.0
• https://cryptosec.info/wallets/

[BitMaxz]

All exchanges that you mention above are all P2P exchanges except for "localcoinexchange" never heard it or you might be talking about localbitcoins.com?

Localbitcoins and hodlhodl exchange are both accepting PayPal except for Bisq according to their documentation. Only these two that you can use to buy Bitcoin with PayPal.

If you want to buy on Bisq check this guide below how to buy bitcoins.
- https://docs.bisq.network/getting-started.html

Then if you want to use your trezor just get the address from your Trezor and withdraw your Bitcoin from Bisq(Same on both Hodlhodl and localbitcoins.). Make sure that you have full control of your wallet from your Trezor.

Check this video guide on buy Bitcoin on Bisq.

- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9JW25wXnPls

Here's for LocalBitcoins
- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzHLeeU1tFE

For HodlHodl you can follow this guide below, the guide is for litecoin but it should be also work if you are going to buy bitcoin.
- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZjD0dkGxlw
You can also use testnet of hodlhodl to learn how to trade or buy bitcoins just like on the video above.

[The Cryptovator]

If you are wondering to buy bitcoin from peer to peer exchange then besides Bisq, you may use LocalCryptos, it's a self custodial peer to peer exchange. Since you will control your wallet there, it's almost safe. But if you want to store bitcoin for a long time, then move your bitcoin to the hardware wallet as you mentioned in the post. Just make sure, you haven't stored your seed at any online or offline machine, write it on multiple hard papers and save it in multiple safe places. So if in case you lost one, you can recover your fund easily. Reading what is suggested by @mk4 will lead you to a few best wallet where you may compare each other.

[o_e_l_e_o]

All exchanges that you mention above are all P2P exchanges except for "localcoinexchange" never heard it or you might be talking about localbitcoins.com?

Localbitcoins is no longer a decentralized, KYC-free exchange. They require personal details and copies of identity documents to be able to trade. Localcryptos on the other hand (which used to be localethereum) is still KYC-free.

As mk4 says, you are going to struggle as a new trader to use PayPal. Because it is so easy to reverse PayPal payments, then there is a high risk of a bitcoin seller being scammed. You can see what other payment methods are accepted below:

https://docs.bisq.network/payment-methods
https://medium.com/@hodlhodl/payment-method-at-hodl-hodl-cb26afa66a4c

When trading peer-topeer, I tend to find that direct bank transfers are the fastest and cheapest way of transferring money, and also have one of the best liquidities on decentralized exchanges, but your mileage may vary depending on your geographical location.

[LeGaulois]

Localbitcoins has never been decentralized. No KYC doesn't mean decentralization.
Whatever

@beltran834
From my experience despite what people say, you will be able to buy bitcoins using Paypal, but there are 2 drawbacks:

The price: be ready to pay 20% above the market price with this payment method (due to the fact payments are reversible)
The seller may ask you to send a picture with your face holding your ID card. Something not a lot of people feel comfortable to do.

To buy or sell, I have always found Bitcointalk to be the best place, considering rates, etc but as a new user it'll be difficult I have to admit.
To get the best of your bucks, I advise you to use something else than Paypal or a debit card

[erikoy]

Why not adapt or make a buy on good exchanges? I think they too securing their database of identities but of course itis not an assurance that your identity will not get compromised.

Still I do believe in centralized exchange or exchanges doing KYC. If you really wanted to avoid making KYC then try to use the uniswap decentralized exchange and once you get your coin the transfer it to cold storage but then again this is a load of work compare to buying directly to exchanges.

Anyway, if you will just get use of good exchanges then there will be no problem.

[beltran834]

Ok thanks a lot quite a lot to take in there but at least now I know that using paypal most likely wouldn't be the best option for me.

[o_e_l_e_o]

I think they too securing their database of identities but of course itis not an assurance that your identity will not get compromised.

There are plenty of reasons to avoid using centralized exchanges, KYC hacks are only one. Even big exchanges like Binance have been hacked for KYC details, and other big exchanges like Coinbase have been actively sharing and selling KYC details with governments and third parties. Centralized exchanges track your purchases and deposits and report you to governments. There is also the whole security side of things having to deposit your coins to a centralized wallet.

If you really wanted to avoid making KYC then try to use the uniswap decentralized exchange

Please correct me if I'm wrong as I have never used Uniswap, but I though it was only for Ethereum and ERC tokens? As far as I am aware, it doesn't trade bitcoin and it doesn't have any fiat options for on/off ramping.

[Upgrade00]

Ok thanks a lot quite a lot to take in there but at least now I know that using paypal most likely wouldn't be the best option for me.

Take it a step at a time, consuming lots of information at a time can be quite overwhelming and lead to overload. It would be better to identify what your looking for in an exchange to help narrow your search;
• Since you specified 'non kyc' you probably value privacy, this of course rules out PayPal as you wrote, there are centralized exchanges that help you buy/sell without submitting documents, but only for transactions below a certain amount.
• Autonomy is also another quality that goes hand in hand with privacy, decentralizated exchanges usually do not require documents, but as said by another user above, that is not always the case.
• Other qualities you should look out for is credibility and reputation.
One note I should add on the hardware wallet, you could probably use a coin mixing or joining service so as to break the chain of transaction and protect your privacy, this is of course for when you've actually made a purchase.

[beltran834]

I'm only interested in non kyc because I don't need or want a smartphone or scanner either of which I'd need to transfer pics of ID docs online. Don't even have a digicam anymore as I've no longer any use for one.  

I quite like the look of the localcryptos site linked to by someone earlier. Looks like paypal is unfortunately out as an option for me and on localcryptos and others it mentions bank transfer as a payment option. (Among other things I've never even heard of.) Previously I've only ever used paypal to send or receive payments (all unrelated to btc) and a credit card to pay for stuff online. By "bank transfer" are they talking about online banking? I've never considered online banking to be safe enough so am not keen on it.  I'd just withdraw funds from paypal to bank account then withdraw at the ATM.

I'd really rather not set up online banking and also avoid the hassle involved in setting it up.  Am I going to be able to buy and later potentially sell bitcoin without online banking? If not is there some other practical way?

[o_e_l_e_o]

I'd really rather not set up online banking and also avoid the hassle involved in setting it up.

You can still arrange bank transfers either via the phone (if you have that set up), or in person by walking in to your bank. Other payments methods which could be an option would be a cash deposit (you walk in to a bank and deposit cash in someone else's account - not sure if this is possible in the UK?), or if you live in or close to a big city, trading cash in person.

LocalCryptos does allow PayPal, but you may struggle to find a seller since you are a brand new users. No harm in trying though. There are other payment methods like MoneyGram or Western Union you could look in to.

[CryptopreneurBrainboss]

Am I going to be able to buy and later potentially sell bitcoin without online banking? If not is there some other practical way?

If this is all you want then I think you're on the right track and asking the right questions here. Following the suggestions above in regards to the recommended peer2peer exchange to use and also inquiring if they allow non online banking payment system would be the best option for you. Cash deposit are quite common in most of the peer2peer exchange so I don't think you'll having any difficulties.

On the other hand, why don't you try contacting a trusted bitcoin Investors in your locality and buy directly from them? I do this often for noobs from my region so I'm quite sure you'll get someone from your end too that'll be willing to sell or help you in acquiring some bitcoin from the exchange although some extra charges might apply.

While this advice is more easier than the others you still have to be very cautious as the possibilities of getting scammed is high. I'll advice you only transact with those you know outside bitcoin investing and not strangers you met online especially since escrow won't be available.

[beltran834]

Thanks.

"You can still arrange bank transfers either via the phone (if you have that set up), or in person by walking in to your bank."

If I can just physically go to the bank and deposit cash (or withdraw from paypal on to the account) to then use to buy bitcoin on an exchange like localcryptos or whatever then that's more or less what I was looking for, though I still haven't got hardly a clue as to how exactly to do that, the buying bitcoin part I mean. I still have to somehow start to get familiarised with using the interface on whichever exchange I decide to use. I think hodlhodl has a feature called tresnet which allows you to play around buying and selling pretend bitcoin which is  good idea for someone in my position. Maybe you have to register with them first I'm not sure.

Thanks again for all help and advice.

[erikoy]

<snip>

yeah sorry for that info. I was able to use it once only. I did realize that it only works on ethereum network and based coins. I agree too that it could not buy any coins from that exchange.

Giving KYC is dangerous as what others has told but again it all depend on the user whether to submit KYC or not. In my case I already did and that I hate sometimes to think why is it they are needing that KYC and why not let their customer get btc based on buying capabilities.

[o_e_l_e_o]

-snip-

So as has been mentioned above, and as much as I hate centralized exchanges, there is no doubt that they are easier to use than decentralized exchanges. If you are (rightly) keen to avoid KYC by using a decentralized exchange, then it will take a bit of time to become familiar with the process.

You can't deposit cash to a decentralized exchange like you suggest. All the exchange does is match up people who want to buy bitcoin with people who want to sell bitcoin. You need to send the cash directly to the person you are trading with, either by depositing it to their bank account, handing it to them in person, or similar. Different sellers will advertise different payment methods which they accept, and it's up to you to find a seller with a payment method which works for you.

[Coin_trader]

Since you are aiming for a P2P exchange only, why not try the Currency Exchange Board here in the forum. You are using PayPal so basically you are on the safe side of the transaction. Just deal with trusted user here that offers BTC/PayPal exchange so that you will be safe. The rate on P2P exchange is almost same on the offer in Currency Exchange Board.

But choosing on the exchange that you provide. I highly recommended bisq because I used it several times and its not complex to use.

[bitFlowers]

Does anyone here have a nice list of non-kyc exchanges? I've got SouthXchange, unnamed.exchange, FreiExchange, TradeOgre, EREX, Fides. Would like to hear of any others! Especially ones with any liquidity and volume