A question concerning: Bitcoin wallets, and the bitcoin bull run

[mk4]

As we all know, bitcoin has been going up A LOT in price recently; And, friends and family asking us about bitcoin is pretty much inevitable, especially by the time we break all-time highs.

This morning, a friend of mine sent me a message on social media. Non-verbatim: "Hey, I finally bought some bitcoin! What wallet do you suggest that I'd use?"

And as per tradition, even when responding to newbies on Bitcointalk asking about which wallet to use, it's like my fingers automatically typed in "Electrum" by reflex.

I then thought about it before I tapped on send— "Why the heck don't I suggest using a Lightning Wallet instead?". Since we already have Lightning wallets with great UX like Phoenix[1], Breez[2], and BlueWallet[3] anyway? If we want lightning adoption, why not make it a general recommendation for the beginners, right?

Now, I definitely don't find myself the best in terms of technical stuff, and a lot of people here are definitely smarter than me especially in the technical stuff. So here's the question: Is there any reason why we shouldn't be starting to recommend lightning wallets to the beginners? Instead of the typical recommendations like Electrum, Mycelium, Blockstream Green, BRD, etc? Is it still "risky" at this stage?


P.S.

I created a topic months ago concerning one of the Lightning wallets I've mentioned: Topic: Opinions on Phoenix Wallet?

[1] https://phoenix.acinq.co/
[2] https://breez.technology/
[3] https://bluewallet.io/

[HCP]

Personally, I still think that Lightning is nearer to "experimental" than "ready for prime time"... unless you have a real need for being able to conduct a lot of micro transactions, then the regular "on-chain" BTC MainNet is probably the best option for newbies.

Channel capacity always seems to be the limiting factor with Lightning... Although this is a bit of a catch-22 type situation... not enough channels == no capacity, no capacity == people not wanting to use the system and create channels

[NeuroticFish]

Instead of the typical recommendations like Electrum, Mycelium, Blockstream Green, BRD, etc? Is it still "risky" at this stage?

I also think that the "risky" at this stage still fits well. Also .. isn't Electrum also offer LN too (I didn't try that though).
But when I've read I was thinking "why is he concerned about LN yet and not about privacy wallets?" A thought would be that maybe we should start suggesting wallets like .. Wasabi?

[mk4]

Personally, I still think that Lightning is nearer to "experimental" than "ready for prime time"... unless you have a real need for being able to conduct a lot of micro transactions, then the regular "on-chain" BTC MainNet is probably the best option for newbies.

These wallets still have their main-net functionalities though, so I guess it's fine? On second thought, I guess not much services accepts lightning payments right now anyway lmao. 🤦‍♂️ But I guess having a lightning-ready wallet is good?

But when I've read I was thinking "why is he concerned about LN yet and not about privacy wallets?" A thought would be that maybe we should start suggesting wallets like .. Wasabi?

Definitely not something I'd immediately introduce to a beginner. The last thing I would want a beginner to feel is to be immediately overwhelmed so early on.

[o_e_l_e_o]

I agree with HCP, but also the old saying about learning to walk before you learn to run.

There is no denying that self custody of your bitcoin is a big step for many people, and will be more "technical" than anything they have ever done before. They already have enough to learn from scratch, from seed phrases, inputs, outputs, transactions, fees and how to calculate them, the mempool, coin control, and so on, without even touching on the technology underlying bitcoin and blockchain if they so choose. It's probably wise to keep things as simple as possible for newbies without throwing Lightning channels, HTLCs, watchtowers, etc. in to the mix as well.

Let them understand and use layer 1 first before you introduce them to layer 2.

[mk4]

It's probably wise to keep things as simple as possible for newbies without throwing Lightning channels, HTLCs, watchtowers, etc. in to the mix as well.

Let them understand and use layer 1 first before you introduce them to layer 2.

Totally agree. The thing though is, some of the lightning wallets we have right now, especially the first one(Phoenix), are pretty much easy to use without almost all these complications. I've tried it myself months ago, and it already almost felt like a typical on-chain wallet.

[bob123]

I then thought about it before I tapped on send— "Why the heck don't I suggest using a Lightning Wallet instead?". Since we already have Lightning wallets with great UX like Phoenix[1], Breez[2], and BlueWallet[3] anyway? If we want lightning adoption, why not make it a general recommendation for the beginners, right?

Well, the lightning network shouldn't even be considered in beta yet.
It is like an early alpha version and the probability of severe bugs and vulnerabilities is still relatively high.

It should really be only used with money one is willing to completely lose.
I believe it still will take a while until it is ready for the mass and even longer until new people can be introduced into it.

[o_e_l_e_o]

Totally agree. The thing though is, some of the lightning wallets we have right now, especially the first one(Phoenix), are pretty much easy to use without almost all these complications. I've tried it myself months ago, and it already almost felt like a typical on-chain wallet.

I must confess I've never used any of the three wallets you have quoted in your OP. Comparing them against your other suggestion - Electrum - which I have used, how do they compare for non-Lightning functionality? Coin control? Setting fees? Viewing all addresses? RBF support?

Bear in mind of course that Electrum now has Lightning support as well, which will only grow and develop over time. And at the end of the day, it is a fairly quick and straightforward process to move to a new wallet. If after a few months someone wants to move from Electrum to one of these other wallets, then they are free to do so. I think it's better to start newbies with a wallet which has huge community support and plenty of set up guides and people to help them, than a more niche wallet where if they run in to a problem they may be stuck trying to figure it out themselves.

[dkbit98]

I would not confuse crypto newbies even more with Lightning Network if they don't know the basics and value of bitcoin and regular wallets.
They should first learn to use simple Bitcoin wallets like Electrum, and later you can explain what second layers and LN is.
I didn't use other wallets you mentioned like Phoenix, Breez, and BlueWallet, but I watched some reviews for BlueWallet and I like it's open source software.

[pooya87]

suggesting a wallet to a newcomer is a complicated matter in my opinion and the suggestion may be different depending on the person. for example i would go as far as suggesting custodial wallets for an absolute beginner who is incapable of or unwilling to learn about bitcoin. most of such people can handle an account a lot easier than they can handle a desktop wallet safely and not lose their keys to a simple malware.

but if they were willing to learn, then the choice should be the easiest to use wallet with least amount of complications. even having less features could be a positive point because at the beginning it is very easy to be overwhelmed by a lot of new things that you don't understand. which means i wouldn't recommend LN or LN wallets to a beginner.
Electrum is a good choice because of its simplicity while having many features. for example while a newbie doesn't have to do any coin selection, the option is available. same with its LN features that aren't by default.

Blockstream Green,

i wouldn't recommend this wallet to anyone. it is more centralized compared to other wallets. for example it creates 2of2 addresses by default and the user always relies on this company to be able to spend their money, so the company can some day decide to block his access! (they added 2of3 later due to complaints but default behavior didn't change). the wallet also connects to their centralized servers by default for communication.
also as far as i am aware, after blockstream bought this wallet and changed the name from GreenAddress the code changes they've made have not been reviewed by anyone. which is also why it has been removed from bitcoin.org

[hugeblack]

The description of the word "best wallet" raises a lot of questions, for example, the Electrum wallet is not the best for the Android OS and I will not recommend it to beginners.
Answering the questions ---> https://bitcoin.org/en/choose-your-wallet?step=5 helps a lot in choosing the "best wallet".

Blockstream Green,

Please stop recommending this wallet for beginners, it is hard/impossible for newbies to get some hard forks when using it and I have lost some hard forks because of it + there is no feature that makes it better than others for beginners.

[mikeauerbach]

What lightning wallet will be better for iPhone users? Now I use ownr wallet, but want to try a LN wallet too. Unfortunately, Éclair, the first LN wallet is available on Android only.

[Lucius]

mikeauerbach, BlueWallet is available for iOS so if you want to start from somewhere I see no reason not to go in alphabetical order Joke aside, I don't think you have too many choices when it comes to iOS, and according to this list, which I see was last edited 13 June 2020, the total number of supported wallets is currently only 5.

Open-source Lightning wallets