Is lying or cheating in support of stealing an election okay?

[iamsheikhadil]

Here's the thing though. From a neutral perspective, there is no proof of fraud. There's just none.

Now coming to voting process, look, Trump has been president and is still president. He knew all rules etc. The voting process is going on and counting of votes are done following rules which were already established.

The matter of the fact is when Trump says "Don't count vote that came after election day" itself undermines democracy. Each and every vote should and must be counted for. Because that's democracy.

It's not God vs Devil. It's an election between two politicians. Just because your side didn't win doesn't mean there were frauds. Sometimes acceptance is the key. Just because you support a particular politician doesn't in anyway define you or your uniqueness. Move on, Trump is a rich guy, he has his life settled. He ain't gonna pay our bills.

[KingScorpio]

....

the democrats think everyone is allowed to vote....

No, this is true of a small minority of them. I know many Democrats, and they do not think this way.

But the small minority, here in the US, is very vocal and is assisted by foreign interests.

well since the democrats sided with the defund the police movement, after the georgy floyed execution,

they have become completely untrustworthy,

trump forever

they now are trying to steal their election with a left wing media coup that tries to dictate the nation its agenda,

they also have nothing to do with liberalism or progressivism,

they have a black fist as a logo, they are fascist neonazis and racists, disguising themselves as liberal and progressive civil rights movement

they also are trying to replace the professional police with racist and tribal vigilanties

[Cnut237]

a strong minority really hate Trump, and they may feel that cheating and lying is okay to get him out.

I would have disagreed with this statement, however I'm surprised to see that the results of the poll - so far - do suggest that you might have a point. It's only 2 out of 17 who think that, but still, it's non-zero. We could do with some more respondents to see where this leads.

It's also worth noting that whilst we are talking about the possibility of illegal fraud to manipulate election results, the democratic process as it is is some way from perfect. Media outlets and public figures manipulate voters hugely with selective truths, willful misrepresentation and outright lies. Even if that were somehow solved, we still have the unfair 'winner takes the whole state' approach, which should more ideally be replaced with proportional representation - if everyone gets a vote, then every voting preference (above some minimum % threshold) should be represented in government. A broader spectrum of representatives might also work to mitigate the oppositional and factional nature of the current two-party system.

[Spendulus]

a strong minority really hate Trump, and they may feel that cheating and lying is okay to get him out.

I would have disagreed with this statement, however I'm surprised to see that the results of the poll - so far - do suggest that you might have a point. It's only 2 out of 17 who think that, but still, it's non-zero. We could do with some more respondents to see where this leads.

It's also worth noting that whilst we are talking about the possibility of illegal fraud to manipulate election results, the democratic process as it is is some way from perfect. Media outlets and public figures manipulate voters hugely with selective truths, willful misrepresentation and outright lies. Even if that were somehow solved, we still have the unfair 'winner takes the whole state' approach, which should more ideally be replaced with proportional representation - if everyone gets a vote, then every voting preference (above some minimum % threshold) should be represented in government. A broader spectrum of representatives might also work to mitigate the oppositional and factional nature of the current two-party system.

The number of liars and cheaters is never equal to the number of people who admit they are liars and cheaters.

But coming on five years of trump derangement syndrome and orangemanbad, I figured some people might readily admit to being worthless lying cunts, and they do. The poll is whatever people vote it to be.

[suchmoon]

It's only 2 out of 17 who think that, but still, it's non-zero. We could do with some more respondents to see where this leads.

But coming on five years of trump derangement syndrome and orangemanbad, I figured some people might readily admit to being worthless lying cunts, and they do. The poll is whatever people vote it to be.

You guys crack me up

A poll on a board brimfull of anonymous nutjobs... it's about as much proof of intent/willingness of cheating in the election as Trump's abject failure to prove that he won said election.

Spendulus - just let Trump go. He lost. On the bright side you'll be able to criticize Biden/Harris for the next four years without having to pretzel excuse after excuse for why one stupid tweet or another is not actually stupid.

[Spendulus]

It's only 2 out of 17 who think that, but still, it's non-zero. We could do with some more respondents to see where this leads.

But coming on five years of trump derangement syndrome and orangemanbad, I figured some people might readily admit to being worthless lying cunts, and they do. The poll is whatever people vote it to be.

You guys crack me up

A poll on a board brimfull of anonymous nutjobs... it's about as much proof of intent/willingness of cheating in the election as Trump's abject failure to prove that he won said election.

Spendulus - just let Trump go. He lost. On the bright side you'll be able to criticize Biden/Harris for the next four years without having to pretzel excuse after excuse for why one stupid tweet or another is not actually stupid.

...wait, that's GOT TO BE advice from a board brimful of anon nut job!

[suchmoon]

...wait, that's GOT TO BE advice from a board brimful of anon nut job!

Well done,  I knew you can do it. Now on to the anger stage. Smash a plate or something. We'll get through this together.

[squatz1]

It's only 2 out of 17 who think that, but still, it's non-zero. We could do with some more respondents to see where this leads.

But coming on five years of trump derangement syndrome and orangemanbad, I figured some people might readily admit to being worthless lying cunts, and they do. The poll is whatever people vote it to be.

You guys crack me up

A poll on a board brimfull of anonymous nutjobs... it's about as much proof of intent/willingness of cheating in the election as Trump's abject failure to prove that he won said election.

Spendulus - just let Trump go. He lost. On the bright side you'll be able to criticize Biden/Harris for the next four years without having to pretzel excuse after excuse for why one stupid tweet or another is not actually stupid.

Yeah I really would take any poll results here with a grain of salt because it really isn't going to get you anywhere. If you want to see if Pew Research, or some sort of polling group would be interested in looking into this that is one thing. As they're a reputable outfit that is going to try to ensure that their results are close enough to what the general populace thinks.

Polling groups may be wrong sometimes, but this poll on bitcointalk forum isn't indicative of anything of real substance.

[Spendulus]

...wait, that's GOT TO BE advice from a board brimful of anon nut job!

Well done,  I knew you can do it. Now on to the anger stage. Smash a plate or something. We'll get through this together.

Think of how much you still have yet to do, though, with your bitter memories of Trump. There MIGHT JUST BE a way to blame the Biden initiated wars on the TRUMP!

Wait, we're not quite to a Biden win yet. So there's still a possibility Trump could win and no wars.

https://issuesinsights.com/2020/11/12/look-closely-trump-still-has-a-good-shot-at-winning-reelection/

The facts are, as of Monday, a full week after election day, Biden is behind President Donald Trump in the undisputed electoral count — Biden’s 226 to Trump’s 232 (assuming Trump wins North Carolina) — with a full 80 outstanding electoral votes in seven states still in a legal fog and unlikely to be determined much before the Dec. 14 state deadlines to report the count to Congress.

Only the candidate with at least 270 actual electoral votes reported to Congress on that date will be declared the winner. Nothing more and nothing less. And it certainly won’t be “declared” by CNN’s Anderson Cooper.

So what can we say at this point about the outstanding 80 electoral votes in those seven states? What are the states in play and what are the ultimate likely outcomes?

The seven states still counting votes, or with recounts ordered, or audits forecast, or credible evidence of fraud or system “glitches” include:

    Georgia’s 16 electoral votes under a scheduled recount.
    Pennsylvania’s 20 electoral votes under a scheduled audit and a Supreme Court order.
    Michigan’s 16 electoral votes with statehouse subpoenas for election officials.
    Wisconsin’s 10 votes under a scheduled recount and statewide canvas.
    Nevada’s six votes chasing legal challenges for fraud and a Bill Barr Justice Department investigation.
    Arizona’s 11 votes still counting and under scrutiny for voter irregularities.
    And Nebraska’s one electoral vote in their District 2 under investigation.

That’s 80 outstanding Electoral College votes for which no one can at this point reliably predict a final resolution. How can anyone possibly know the results of any investigation, audit or recount before they have begun?

The only thing that is known for certain at this date is that Biden needs to capture 44 of the remaining 80, while Trump needs only 38. The combination of states to get to either of those totals are a bit varied, but there is one final determinate that heavily advantages Trump.

Of those seven outstanding states, all but Nevada’s six electoral votes are the responsibility of strong Republican statehouse majorities. Why, you might ask, is that important?

The Constitution of the United States provides in Article 2 that the final authority for every elector from each state is solely vested in that state’s legislature. Meaning any final disputes or resolutions of accusations of fraud will be determined by the majorities in those states. And since all but six of these outstanding 80 votes are controlled by Republicans, Trump has more than a good shot at being re-elected.

Former House Speaker Newt Gingrich cited on Fox on Nov. 9 the legal precedent that where election law has been violated, the court has invalidated the results of that entire vote. Even to the point of switching the result of the election from a corrupt Democrat to a Republican challenger.

So now you know why the left and their handmaidens in the media are so wild-eyed about projecting Biden now.

[Cnut237]

~

Yeah, I appreciate it hardly constitutes conclusive evidence - maybe I'm a credulous fool, but I still take the responses at face-value, and I'm surprised that it appears that some people want Trump out more than they want fair elections.

Meanwhile... the final results in my own poll are in, and I can reveal there was a surprise late swing!