Bitcoin whales selling to institutions as Grayscale adds 7,188 BTC in 24 hours

[Wisbrown]

Bitcoin gain value by the number of interest, now that Bitcoin whale selling to institution and universities are using it as a tuition payment the value must definitely increase.

[bryant.coleman]

One reason why the institutional investors are reluctant to invest in Bitcoin is because of its volatility. But if it can be proven that the returns from investing in Bitcoin can be much greater than investing in other mainstream assets, then the institutional investors may consider cryptocurrency. Who doesn't want to invest in an asset, which could potentially give you 5x or even 10x returns in a matter of two-three years?

[jacafbiz]

I read the analysis but  the name of the game is the greater fool , the price will keep going up as long as the demand is more than the supply. once the supply is more than demand you will see price correct significantly, something just tells me that the whales are waiting for the price to crossover $20k before they allow the price to correct, they correction is coming I don't know when

[amishmanish]

Those weak hand whales could have more BTC than anyone because I know you wouldn't just give it up.

They were actually opportunist whales which only joined the crypto investment scheme to manipulate and also profit from it only, the best every genuine crypto enthusiast have to do is to accumulate more BTC whenever they dump it or in the future they may cause a big problem on the market because crypto haters may use them as their weapon.

This is dangerous thinking. All the positive sentiment notwithstanding, don't ever discount that bitcoin price is actually governed by the value that common users attach to it and the amount of usage or use-cases it can have. There is no need for someone to put their savings on the deck for them to be a crypto enthusiast.

I wonder if Grayscale knows something that others not or if they are only raising the price so they can dump from a higher price...

There are lots of rumors saying there will be a big monetary reset and bitcoin will be the new world reserve currency.

I wonder if Grayscale believes it really.

I too ponder on this. Some of these institutions are visibly bullish about bitcoin on their twitter and such but the reasoning that you will hear is little more than "Bitcoin is it". I don't think institutions make their decisions like that. It can only be a very conscious decision because of these companies planning to launch or sponsor financial products backed by bitcoin. They can range for simple buying and lending to cross-border investment and transfers.

"The Great Reset" is something I feel is conspiracy theories arising from the precarious conditions post-pandemic, particularly in the USA, and Trump's loss.

[Lucius]

I wonder if Grayscale knows something that others not or if they are only raising the price so they can dump from a higher price...

What they know for sure is that they earn very well from the fees for their services, and by what @fillippone posted some 20 days ago, currently that fee is an incredible 27 BTC per day, which is a little over $500 000 each day

Also, Grayscale does not own this BTC, they are owned by their clients so it cannot happen that Grayscale decides to sell them at any time.

I am afraid they do not have any plan or strategy to buy the bitcoins. They only react to money inflows of in-kind buying.
This is their business model: they don’t risk their own money, that would require a proper buying plan, but they only look for their risk free daily management fees of 27 bitcoins. Whatever the price their client get long bitcoins.

[fillippone]

What they know for sure is that they earn very well from the fees for their services, and by what @fillippone posted some 20 days ago, currently that fee is an incredible 27 BTC per day, which is a little over $500 000 each day
<...>

You are right. I actually wrote that post a few times ago, and in the meantime the daily fee increased up to 30 daily BTC (that’s another 10% increase).
I am going to publish something later today helping getting track of this.

[wxa7115]

Was it not surprising that the price of bitcoin falled to $16600 recently from a price over $19000, but the price later increase back and having a resistance at $19000. Noramlly, people would have expected the price of bitcoin to crash again when it falled, but the price rose back to over $19000. In today's crypto news, I read it is as a result of institutions buying bitcoin from bitcoin whales. Before the fall, many whales move bitcoin to exchanges, and we know it will not be for any two reasons but to sell the bitcoin, it could be some of the bitcoin that will be sold, but that known to them.

After that, the price of bitcoin still fall but still rose back, which would be as a result of institutions like Grayscale, Square and PayPal that are buying the bitcoin from the whales and also from miners. Expecially Grayscale proving to be one of the reasons.


Grayscale Bitcoin buys versus flow in November 2020. Source: Coin98/ Twitter

Grayscale bought more than the mined bitcoin in November, 2020. Simultaneously, this week saw Bitcoin break all-time highs and challenge $20,000, only to encounter massive selling pressure.

Having bounced off lows of $18,100 and returned to circle $19,000, BTC/USD looks primed for another test of the seminal level, but selling dynamics remain unusual. With sell walls at $20,000 still firmly in place, longtime hodlers and whales looking to exit have reliable buyers in the form of Grayscale and other institutions. Evidence points to increasing inflows from whales to exchanges this week, something which coincided with the $20,000 attempt. Should selling already be keeping prices down, BTC should thus be finding its way from whales to the stronger hands of Grayscale and its clients.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/cointelegraph.com/news/bitcoin-whales-selling-to-institutions-as-grayscale-adds-7-188-btc-in-24-hours/amp

If you think about it this is a little bit frightening in a way, whales are without a doubt strong hands otherwise they would have been unable to keep their coins since they got them at a cheap price years ago, but now even stronger hands willing to buy at a price close to 20k have appeared which tell us that most likely those coins are never going to be back in circulation again or if they do then it will be when the price of bitcoin is incredibly high.

Bitcoin is slowly entering a new era in which institutional investors will begin to dominate the market and become the new whales, I do not know if this is good or bad but the dynamics of the market are bound to change because of this.

[suzanne5223]

Those weak hand whales could have more BTC than anyone because I know you wouldn't just give it up.

They were actually opportunist whales which only joined the crypto investment scheme to manipulate and also profit from it only, the best every genuine crypto enthusiast have to do is to accumulate more BTC whenever they dump it or in the future they may cause a big problem on the market because crypto haters may use them as their weapon.

This is dangerous thinking. All the positive sentiment notwithstanding, don't ever discount that bitcoin price is actually governed by the value that common users attach to it and the amount of usage or use-cases it can have. There is no need for someone to put their savings on the deck for them to be a crypto enthusiast.

You make a good point cause people don't need to put their saving in crypto before they can be a crypto enthusiast but i need you to understand that most of the positive sentiment made by 95% of whales that just join crypto investment is because they see Bitcoin as a fast means for them to making money.

[24Kt]

Those weak hand whales could have more BTC than anyone because I know you wouldn't just give it up.

They were actually opportunist whales which only joined the crypto investment scheme to manipulate and also profit from it only, the best every genuine crypto enthusiast have to do is to accumulate more BTC whenever they dump it or in the future they may cause a big problem on the market because crypto haters may use them as their weapon.

This is dangerous thinking. All the positive sentiment notwithstanding, don't ever discount that bitcoin price is actually governed by the value that common users attach to it and the amount of usage or use-cases it can have. There is no need for someone to put their savings on the deck for them to be a crypto enthusiast.

You make a good point cause people don't need to put their saving in crypto before they can be a crypto enthusiast but i need you to understand that most of the positive sentiment made by 95% of whales that just join crypto investment is because they see Bitcoin as a fast means for them to making money.

I think that's a fact more or less, if they don't believe that bitcoin will not give them huge profits, then what are they doing here, right? So yes, I also believe that they have the notion that this type of investment will reap high returns in the future. Because if you don't believe in one thing, you won't waste your resources to it.

[Lucius]

24Kt, if you read a few posts back then you can find out that Grayscale provides a service that currently brings them around 30 BTC per day in the form of a fee they charge his clients. The question now is whether they keep that BTC or sell it as soon as the fee is paid, but the way they set things up is a win-win situation for them.


24Kt, suzanne5223, wxa7115, please pay attention to how you use the quote option - you can edit post/s and leave only the part to which you respond, and it is completely unnecessary to quote the whole OP.

[davis196]

So we,as Bitcoin supporters have to rely on a few big companies and trust funds like Grayscale to pump the Bitcoin price by increasing the overall demand for BTC?
Is this supposed to be a positive sign?What if funds like Grayscale start selling BTC?The price will probably go back to 6K USD in no time.I know that Grayscale is buying BTC mostly for long term HODLing,but we can't predict how this company will react to the BTC market and what will happen,if Garayscale has new shareholders,who aren't Bitcoin maximalists.
I'm still waiting for mass Bitcoin adoption and the creation of a BTC market,that would be almost free(100% freedom is impossible)of the influence that institutional investors and crypto whales have over the price.

[NorrisK]

So we,as Bitcoin supporters have to rely on a few big companies and trust funds like Grayscale to pump the Bitcoin price by increasing the overall demand for BTC?
Is this supposed to be a positive sign?What if funds like Grayscale start selling BTC?The price will probably go back to 6K USD in no time.I know that Grayscale is buying BTC mostly for long term HODLing,but we can't predict how this company will react to the BTC market and what will happen,if Garayscale has new shareholders,who aren't Bitcoin maximalists.
I'm still waiting for mass Bitcoin adoption and the creation of a BTC market,that would be almost free(100% freedom is impossible)of the influence that institutional investors and crypto whales have over the price.

Part of mass adoption is big companies and institutions jumping in. You can't expect them to all wait until you hit your price target and have them buy your coins from you at that price right? They will always have a big influence just because of their massive size.
These funds will not be selling and dumping the price back to 6k as bitcoin is basically their business model. If the shareholders want to get out, they will have to sell their shares to other interested people.

[el kaka22]

Over the counter trading in bitcoin world needs to get bigger and bigger and there needs to be ways to get thousands of bitcoins for these huge companies to get involved. Do you think that companies like JP Morgan who would invest maybe a billion, or maybe even few billion into bitcoin would do that over coinbase? That is nearly as impossible as it sounds, which is why they won't get in until it is possible.

What could make it possible however is an over the counter middle man system where people with thousands of bitcoins and people with billions of dollars could make the exchange a lot more legally binding way face to face and sign some papers (when you do business in billions, I am sure actually being face to face costs shouldn't matter) so that it could be more professional.

[The Sceptical Chymist]

In today's crypto news, I read it is as a result of institutions buying bitcoin from bitcoin whales.

I think that's exactly what's happening.  And this time, some of these whales have faces, e.g., MicroStrategy, Grayscale, and others. 

That's the how, but I'm wondering about the why, as in why are these large corporations snapping up bitcoin as soon as its mined.  Somehow I don't think it's just bitcoin fever hitting them, because they're accountable to their shareholders (I'm thinking of MicroStrategy here) and there must be a damn good reason they're heavily investing in such a risky asset as bitcoin.

But hey, it's great times for everybody who owns bitcoin right now.  We're getting closer to the ATH and 2020 hasn't even ended yet....but the paranoid little bird that lives on my shoulder is telling me that the banking system and/or global economy is about to take a serious spin-kick to the liver.  That wouldn't be good for any of us.

[exstasie]

I think that's exactly what's happening.  And this time, some of these whales have faces, e.g., MicroStrategy, Grayscale, and others.  

That's the how, but I'm wondering about the why, as in why are these large corporations snapping up bitcoin as soon as its mined.  Somehow I don't think it's just bitcoin fever hitting them, because they're accountable to their shareholders (I'm thinking of MicroStrategy here) and there must be a damn good reason they're heavily investing in such a risky asset as bitcoin.

How risky is it? It isn't 2010 anymore. Grayscale launched their Bitcoin trust 7 years ago. Institutions have been quietly entering the market for years, since before the last bubble in 2017. Plus, there is a whole spectrum of institutions in terms of how much risk they are willing to take on. Pension funds opt for less risk. Hedge funds opt for more.

But anyway, for institutional funds it's all about performance. It's no secret on Wall Street at this point that, from a purely technical (price) perspective at least, Bitcoin is one of the most attractive investment assets on the market. I think we're seeing institutions flooding into the Bitcoin market now for the same reason they were flooding back into the stock market this past summer. It's all about the returns, not about the fundamentals. Everyone is watching everyone else profit, and they want in. When I've talked in the past about positive price feedback loops and how they propel bull markets forward, this is exactly what I mean.

[fillippone]

Over the counter trading in bitcoin world needs to get bigger and bigger and there needs to be ways to get thousands of bitcoins for these huge companies to get involved. Do you think that companies like JP Morgan who would invest maybe a billion, or maybe even few billion into bitcoin would do that over coinbase? That is nearly as impossible as it sounds, which is why they won't get in until it is possible.
<…>

Well, I get your point, but this is exactly how Microstrategy got into BTC: trough Coinbase.
Read here.

They chose Coinbase to execute a series of automated trades and OTC trades to get in.

[lixer]

Seems like this Greyscale just wants to buy up every Bitcoin in the market, it’s now like a competition for them, they keep more and more bitcoins and storing them up. This makes me wonder what’s going to be the situation if they happens to sell a major share of their Bitcoin holdings, the market will go down seriously.

Anyway, I am guessing that wouldn’t be the case as time goes on they will be having more and more clients and all of them wouldn’t be selling at once, as they are selling they will be buying more as well. I wouldn’t like the whales to mess everything up .

[slapper]

This is good news for bitcoin lovers and whoever hold bitcoin. 7000 is truly a big number and I doubt that there are many people who are capable of buying such an amount of bitcoin unless you are a whale.

Should we consider Grayscale, Paypal as whales? If they could add 7199 bitcoin in 24 hours, they can easily sell off their bitcoin in less than 24 hours. Just looking forward to the best. I don't think that they will try to make a huge impact on the price of bitcoin. There is no reason unless they want to manipulate the market and create FUD. Creating FUD is the easiest way to collect more bitcoin at a cheaper price. However, Investors are currently smarter than they used to be in 2017. They will not give up on bitcoin effortlessly

[Charles-Tim]

Should we consider Grayscale, Paypal as whales? If they could add 7199 bitcoin in 24 hours, they can easily sell off their bitcoin in less than 24 hours. Just looking forward to the best. I don't think that they will try to make a huge impact on the price of bitcoin. There is no reason unless they want to manipulate the market and create FUD. Creating FUD is the easiest way to collect more bitcoin at a cheaper price. However, Investors are currently smarter than they used to be in 2017. They will not give up on bitcoin effortlessly

The main reason why institutional whales like grayscale and microstrategy are buying bitcoin is because they know bitcoin is a store of value and that this will help their company in return. I remember what the Microstrategy CEO says about gold, that unlike bitcoin that has a limited supply, that the limited supply will help bitcoin later in time in a way its price will increase that it is very possible people will be leaving gold for bitcoin. Also, it is clear to us how fiat are depreciative in nature and why people may prefer bitcoin over fiat and why these companies are criticizing fiat. In my opinion, these companies are likely going long term because they know how bitcoin is valuable because of its limited supply, the characteristic many assets is not having. And, I believe bitcoin is just still like new, with time we will realize this, how limited supply will have more positive effects on bitcoin price and adoption.

[LogitechMouse]

As this institutions are slowly gathering Bitcoin, I'm quite afraid a bit that there is a possibility that there will be a time that they will take profit and will sell a huge portion of the Bitcoins they are holding.

I'm not as happy as it is showing because I'm thinking of the negative side of it more than a positive side. Its obvious that this run is mostly institution-driven since we saw companies like Grayscale, Square and Paypal buying Bitcoins and more companies will do it too. Now we are not just seeing the whales buying it but also the institutions.