Bitcoin2Cash.com - Cash-Only Marketplace

[JamezQ]

reading the other thread and this one, I can see bitcoin2cash's point of view.  bitcoin2cash is really trying to open a legal business.  for example his business has an LLC to protect his personal wealth.  madhatter prefers to work in the dark away from legal or govt intervention.  bitcoin2cash already says he doesnt need advice but the madhatter just keeps adding input.

I'd like 2 c bitcoin2cash do what madhatter cannot be done.  it would be a leap in bitoin adoption

++ They have a disagreement, I say lets let them run.

No more bickering, I'm interested.

[The Madhatter]

bitcoin2cash is really trying to open a legal business.  for example his business has an LLC to protect his personal wealth.  madhatter prefers to work in the dark away from legal or govt intervention.

An LLC will not protect your personal wealth from a criminal charge/investigation. Ask any lawyer.

I don't operate 'in the dark'. I operate as a full liability man, standing on my own two feet. I, personally, have no use for "limited liability".

Also, I thought Bitcoin was about freedom. It doesn't make sense to me to intentionally enter unnecessary contracts with the state, tacit or intentional.

[NghtRppr]

An LLC will not protect your personal wealth from a criminal charge/investigation. Ask any lawyer.

Who said that it would? Nobody. That's a straw man argument. It protects my personal assets from civil lawsuits and business debts, which is the point. Also, before you ask "what possible lawsuits or debts", that's the point. I don't know. If I could predict the future then I wouldn't need to worry.

I don't operate 'in the dark'. I operate as a full liability man, standing on my own two feet. I, personally, have no use for "limited liability".

Then you have no business giving anyone advice on how to run a business. That's an unnecessary risk which is not the kind of thing an entrepreneur should be doing.

Also, I thought Bitcoin was about freedom. It doesn't make sense to me to intentionally enter unnecessary contracts with the state, tacit or intentional.

It's only unnecessary if I don't mind putting my personal assets at risk for lawsuits or debts, which I do.

[fetokun]

guys... please, stop!

you're both very serious and professional... everyone got that!

No need to "defend your honor" through more pages and threads

[左]

Lol.

[fetokun]

Why do I get "insuficient funds" when trying to bid with my 5 dollars?

[NghtRppr]

Why do I get "insuficient funds" when trying to bid with my 5 dollars?

It should mean that you tried to place a bid that would require more than 5 dollars. What was the price and amount you used?

[nanaimogold]

> the only other cash-by-mail Bitcoin exchange

Oh, contraire!

There are several others.

Nanaimo Gold is the oldest and largest exchanger of bitcoin. I likely do more cash by mail than all the other services combined. My daily volume often exceeds that of Mt Gox and I am only one trader. I have been backing up bitcoin with gold, silver and digital currency since day one. I have been involved for almost a decade in the design of this P2P money. Not for the sake of making exchanges, but for the sake of the commerce it allows.

OK, that being said, Madhatter is right on all accounts. I can tell you from a vast experience that you can't mail cash to strangers. If they are not outright lying about not receiving their mail, they are outsmarting themselves by having you send to the empty house next door where the crackheads are currently squatting or they are failing to provide you with a deliverable address because they are too stupid to address a snail mail.

Everyone is responsible for what he mails. You are never going to qualify your cash recipients as honest, and you are never going to have force of law in international trades. When your cash is lost to thieves, as it certainly will be on occasion, you will be obligated to replace it. Everyone is responsible for what he sends. Nobody is responsible for what he fails to receive.

Don't forget that the people of the USA are minor players in this trade. If you restrict yourself to just that one country, you will be barring more than 70% of your potential business. If not, most of your cash mailings will have to cross customs and you will have to know what mail ports are not safe, in what countries. This knowledge is hard won and took me many years.

Don't expect the police to help you combat fraud. They are players for the bankster owned government that already hates you as a unique terrorist.

I have been involved in cash trade for gold by mail for 30 years, since before many readers of this forum were even born. I know all the tricks and all the pitfalls.

Listen to the Madhatter. He is correct.

If you are not too arrogant to consider a partial solution to the problem; you can safely deposit cash to your recipient's bank accounts as long as they are using a national bank that you can reach a branch of. That will cover about 8% of your potential trades. If you can prove to be a team player, which I currently doubt, I can send you to make lots of deposits on behalf of Nanaimo Gold as I only have one US bank account (BoA).

Your idea that any of us are competing suggests to me that you don't know what you are doing. There is too little profit to be made here. The exchangers are vital to the health of the bitcoin economy. The more the merrier. We need MANY more services like your's and Madhatter's if the prices are to ever stabilize enough for merchants to adopt bitcoin. Just don't expect to make much money from doing exchange. The real money is in the commerce that bitcoin will eventually facilitate.

I expect I know how you will react to this sage advice, so really, this post is for the benefit of those not still enduring the teenaged know-it-all years. You can't trust people unless you know them. You can't have anonymous trade if you have to qualify customers for credit.

And who the hell is going to pay you $15 just to mail a letter? I only charge $7 to stand through a bank queue! All you are going to attract with that pricing scheme are scammers who will try to get you to pay twice.

I predict your service will fail and be gone within 45 days. Anyone care to bet against me?

Flame me all you like. I won't bother to respond. You can have the last word on this thread. Anyone who want's my attention can reach me through the NG website. Reading this forum can harm one's intelligence, so I tend to ignore it.

[NghtRppr]

Everyone is responsible for what he mails. You are never going to qualify your cash recipients as honest, and you are never going to have force of law in international trades. When your cash is lost to thieves, as it certainly will be on occasion, you will be obligated to replace it. Everyone is responsible for what he sends. Nobody is responsible for what he fails to receive.

When you request a withdrawal you have to agree to terms of service that says exactly that. We aren't responsible for lost mail.

Your idea that any of us are competing suggests to me that you don't know what you are doing. There is too little profit to be made here.

I've already addressed this. Profit is only one possible motive. The satisfaction of acting superior is another possibility. It's a fallacious reasoning to assume that just because there are little profits to be made that people won't be vindictive for other reasons. Some people just like acting like they are king of the hill.

And who the hell is going to pay you $15 just to mail a letter?

That price will definitely go down. I figured that it would be better for me to charge more rather than less until I figure out exactly how much gas/time/effort etc is going to be required to keep this up. It's also to cover possible international mail costs too. Eventually I'll have separate rates depending on the country.

Thanks for your comments.

[NghtRppr]

I predict your service will fail and be gone within 45 days. Anyone care to bet against me?

I'll bet you 5000 BTC. Care to put your money where your mouth is?

Oh... he left. Well, if anyone would care to pass the message along to him. I'd like to make some easy money.

[nanaimogold]

Generally, horses are not permitted to bet on their own races. There is nothing to stop you from pretending to remain in business past 45 days just to win the bet.

The offer to bet must be limited to those not involved with your enterprise.

Any takers?

[NghtRppr]

Generally, horses are not permitted to bet on their own races.

You said "anyone". Be more careful with your wording next time.

I think you will need to clarify what you mean by "in business" before anyone will take you seriously.

[bitjet]

Cool service, the only thing that would stop me from using it is that the fee is too high.

[NghtRppr]

Cool service, the only thing that would stop me from using it is that the fee is too high.

In your opinion, what would be a more reasonable fee?

[BitterTea]

Generally, horses are not permitted to bet on their own races. There is nothing to stop you from pretending to remain in business past 45 days just to win the bet.

The offer to bet must be limited to those not involved with your enterprise.

Any takers?

I'll take your bet for 50 BTC.

I think you and MadHatter are right, and I don't think mailing out cash is sustainable, but I think it can last more than 45 days.

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If bitcoin2cash.com is no longer operating as an exchange 45 days from 2011-04-08, and operation is suspended for a period of more than 30 days, I will pay 50 BTC to nanaimogold.
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[NghtRppr]

You meant 5000 BTC, not 50 BTC right? *cough*Igotyoucovered*cough*

[JamezQ]

If the bet is 50 BTC, I would take that bet . I think they will still be in business.

[BitterTea]

If the bet is 50 BTC, I would take that bet . I think they will still be in business.

bitcoin2cash is the one that said 5000 BTC, nanaimogold didn't specify an amount.

[NghtRppr]

The funniest part is that I've already been in business since July of 2010. This is just a site redesign. It's not really a new service other than the automation. I've been sending/receiving cash for quite a while now.

Here's proof: http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1303.msg17158#msg17158

Maybe I shouldn't have said anything but I can't, in good conscience, let you take nanaimogold's money like that. Unless of course, it's me doing it. 

[Keefe]

Cool service, the only thing that would stop me from using it is that the fee is too high.

In your opinion, what would be a more reasonable fee?

How about a discount offer to mail up to $100 (and only round dollars) within the USA for $2 with a one week delay? It should only cost $0.50 for a 1oz US stamp, envelope, and wrapping paper, and no more than 5 minutes of your time to pick bills, fold in paper, put in envelope, and write the address, assuming you go by a mailbox at least once a week anyway. Since you've been doing this for a year, don't you already have a good feel for what's involved and what's a reasonable price?