Trump bans Alipay and seven other Chinese apps

[Hydrogen]

US President Donald Trump has signed an executive order banning transactions with eight Chinese apps.

The apps include popular payments platform Alipay, as well as QQ Wallet and WeChat Pay.

The order, which takes effect in 45 days, says that the apps are being banned because they are a threat to US national security.

It flags the possibility that the apps could be used to track and build dossiers on US federal employees.

Tencent QQ, CamScanner, SHAREit, VMate and WPS Office are also included within the order, which only kicks in after Mr Trump has left office.

"The United States must take aggressive action against those who develop or control Chinese connected software applications to protect our national security," the order said.

President Trump's order says "by accessing personal electronic devices such as smartphones, tablets, and computers, Chinese connected software applications can access and capture vast swaths of information from users, including sensitive personally identifiable information and private information."

The Trump administration has ratcheted up pressure on Chinese companies in its final months in office, including those it considers a national security risk.

President Trump has signed executive orders against a range of Chinese firms arguing they could share data with the Chinese government.

Chinese social media app TikTok and telecoms giant Huawei have been among the casualties of Washington's crackdown.

Last month, the Commerce Department added dozens of Chinese companies, including the country's top chipmaker SMIC and drone manufacturer DJI Technology, to a trade blacklist.

The administration also restricted a number of Chinese and Russian companies with alleged military ties from buying sensitive US goods and technology.

China has consistently denied claims that these firms share their data with the Chinese government and has responded by imposing its own export laws restricting the export of military technology.

In August, the US ordered ByteDance, the owner of social media app TikTok, to either shut down or sell off its US assets.

Despite missing a deadline to complete the sale, the US is yet to shut down the app and negotiations continue over its future.

Delisting debacle

The latest ban comes as the White House quietly pushed the New York Stock Exchange (NYSE) to consider a second U-turn on its decision to delist three Chinese telecoms giants.

Last week the NYSE announced it would delist the China Mobile, China Telecom and China Unicom in line with another executive order.

On Monday, however, the NYSE reversed that decision, announcing it had decided not to delist the three companies after further consultation with US regulators.

The NYSE made the decision based on ambiguity about whether the securities were actually covered by the order.

However, the exchange has come under pressure over its decision.

The US Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin called the NYSE President Stacey Cunningham to tell her he disagrees with the decision, according to Reuters.

Republican Senator and China hardliner Marco Rubio has also spoken out, saying that the NYSE's refusal to delist the companies was an "outrageous effort" to undermine the President's executive order.

The NYSE is owned by Atlanta-based Intercontinental Exchange (ICE), which is run by billionaire Jeffrey Sprecher.

His wife Kelly Loeffler is one of two Republican senators facing run-off elections on Tuesday in Georgia.

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-55555269

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Not certain how long these bans will remain in effect. Biden could overturn these executive orders the second he assumes office?

Perhaps this could influence china into taking a less harsh stance on crypto exchanges and mining in the country. If Trump bans all of china's fiat apps then bitcoin and crypto would be the only things they had left?

China has announced bans on cryptocurrency exchanges and cryptocurrency mining in the past. With mixed enforcement and results.

[jackg]

Does Congress have to vote it in, has it already or is the US president just allowed to make laws like this?

It's possible Biden will pull it put if it wasn't on the advice of the security council (or whatever its called) but banning some Chinese companies from operating over there (it's just a like for like exchange) .

[Hydrogen]

Does Congress have to vote it in, has it already or is the US president just allowed to make laws like this?

Its an executive order. Its not required to be voted on by house or senate. In the years leading up to Trump's inauguration US Presidential executive orders were expanded upon. To a point where Trump can order things like this on a broad scale without oversight.

I would guess Trump and his lawyers investigated carefully to try to find a way to make executive orders which the following administration would have difficulty overturning. Without specifics being divulged its difficult to know what type of long term durability these measures have.

[The Sceptical Chymist]

Does Congress have to vote it in, has it already or is the US president just allowed to make laws like this?

I'm no expert on the US government or how exactly laws are passed, but I am a US citizen and I'm pretty sure Trump is just trying to pull a bunch of bullshit in his last days in office which Biden will likely reverse.  I wouldn't expect anything Trump signs between now and the 20th of this month to hold up for long, and I wouldn't worry about this news story in particular.

Not certain how long these bans will remain in effect. Biden could overturn these executive orders the second he assumes office?

Whatever Trump decrees as a lame duck president Biden can easily overturn (I'm fairly sure of this, but perhaps someone with a bit more knowledge than me can give a better answer). 

So happy Trump is headed out of the White House, even if he's not going willingly.

[DaveF]

I would guess Trump and his lawyers investigated carefully to try to find a way to make executive orders which the following administration would have difficulty overturning. Without specifics being divulged its difficult to know what type of long term durability these measures have.

From what a lawyer friend explained, yeah the next administration can remove most of them on day 1.
Things like this will probably be litigated.
Since it does not go into effect for 45 days it's plenty of time for the lawyers to get in billable hours

-Dave

[jackg]

Does Congress have to vote it in, has it already or is the US president just allowed to make laws like this?

I'm no expert on the US government or how exactly laws are passed, but I am a US citizen and I'm pretty sure Trump is just trying to pull a bunch of bullshit in his last days in office which Biden will likely reverse.  I wouldn't expect anything Trump signs between now and the 20th of this month to hold up for long, and I wouldn't worry about this news story in particular.

I imagine that might mean it's coming back to him saying he passed laws that Biden wants to repeal (if he runs again in the next election) as part of the start of his next campaign for banning a bunch of things and doing things that looks good now. Like how he wanted the stimulus checks to go up (from what I can tell). Although with Biden in charge there might be a chance European or Canadian systems are taken on for the rest of the pandemic.

[n0ne]

Already USA was making investigation on more number of Chinese application that is being used. Earlier itself with the banwog tiktok from India, USA announced its closure of more number of applications for security reason. Now this has been taking effect, as the ruling party is surrendering everything required for the governance.

[Darker45]

There is reason to adopt a very cautious or even a suspicious approach in terms of Chinese apps and companies. And even if I am not a fan of Trump, I am certainly in support of his courageous decisions against these Chinese companies.

Everybody knows there is no freedom nor independence in China. If an ordinary individual is not free to speak up whatever it is in his/her mind, how much more to a company which is trying to do business and profit? The Chinese government is the almighty. It is the be-all and end-all of everything Chinese. It can handily use people as well as companies to meet their objectives.

[bits4books]

As much as I like Trump as a politician (despite all his populism) this is one of those decisions that I don't really support. I understand his attitude about China and support it, but such prohibitions are too obvious and too stupid a measure to take, because such an action creates a very strong opposition. I am sure that Biden will repeal this law to show how progressive it is and that America is able to fight on an economic basis with China and without political interference but this will be a very bad decision.

[bassbity]

Trump's impeachment is better before things go awry. Trump is here as a former president, so that Trup's policy must be stopped for the sake of balancing the American economic system. In addition, Biden must be clear that he has full control over whether the application is prohibited or not. Even though it was launched from China, of course if it is prohibited then there is a kind of restricted freedom.
America must prove that as a democracy it must be an example for all countries, otherwise it does not deserve to be called a democracy that upholds freedom of interaction.

[Lucius]

I'm not familiar with the new president's views on China in general, but somehow it seems to me that the Chinese could breathe a little easier when Trump moves away from the White House. However, I do not think that the new administration will just remove all the bans and restrictions imposed on China over the past 4 years, unless the evidence of espionage turns out to be false.

The US and China are the two biggest competitors in the world, but it is more than obvious that they need each other when it comes to trade. As far as I know from 10 largest ports in the world, as many as 7 are located in China and provide incredible logistics for world trade. Also, their labor is pretty cheap and there are more than enough workers - and while the world may not agree with the Communist Party's methods, let someone tell me where Apple could make such large and efficient factories where a worker has an average salary of $300?

It is possible, however, that Biden will put more pressure on the Chinese through diplomatic methods rather than open trade wars, which actually hurt the whole world in the sense that the US has put great pressure on its strategic partners to implement the same measures against China.

[hatshepsut93]

Perhaps this could influence china into taking a less harsh stance on crypto exchanges and mining in the country. If Trump bans all of china's fiat apps then bitcoin and crypto would be the only things they had left?

What do you mean "only things they have left"? It's not like Trump is erasing those apps from existence, he merely bans them in the US, and it's hardly a big deal, cause Americans are using their own appls like Venmo or Cash App. And those Chinese apps are mostly used in China, they wouldn't really care even if whole world banned them. And Americans can still buy stuff from Aliexpress via Visa/Mastercard, just like they did before.

[virasog]

Not certain how long these bans will remain in effect. Biden could overturn these executive orders the second he assumes office?

Perhaps this could influence china into taking a less harsh stance on crypto exchanges and mining in the country. If Trump bans all of china's fiat apps then bitcoin and crypto would be the only things they had left?

China has announced bans on cryptocurrency exchanges and cryptocurrency mining in the past. With mixed enforcement and results.

Trump orders can be changed once Biden take over but i don't see that happening. The decisions of the USA government is not taken by a single person. The policies of the USA more or less remain the same with the change of the president. Secondly china is not dependent upon the USA as much as other countries are dependent and it does not impact them much.

[jaberwock]

There is reason to adopt a very cautious or even a suspicious approach in terms of Chinese apps and companies. And even if I am not a fan of Trump, I am certainly in support of his courageous decisions against these Chinese companies.

Everybody knows there is no freedom nor independence in China. If an ordinary individual is not free to speak up whatever it is in his/her mind, how much more to a company which is trying to do business and profit? The Chinese government is the almighty. It is the be-all and end-all of everything Chinese. It can handily use people as well as companies to meet their objectives.

I agree with this statement. I mean I hate Trump as much as the next guy, it has been a nightmare 5 years with him BUT when it comes to Chinese apps and companies, I do not trust them at all. One thing you need to know about Chinese companies is the fact that Chinese government owns them all, it may "look" like someone owns it, but the reality is that Chinese government is behind it.

You can start any type of company you want in China but at the end of the day if you ever succeed and become global, they will take over, if they want to they will kick you out and put another CEO in charge as well. Look at what happened to Jack Ma recently, dude was one of the richest ever in the world and he said one bad thing about government and China made him disappear. So long story short we are talking about evil vs evil here and I am fine with it.

[Husires]

I do not think that the new administration will cancel these decisions from the first day, they can be used to make better negotiation with China in the event that there is a need for more negotiation, but I do not think that Biden would go in this way.

The decisions represent a serious voice regarding the expansion of China in many technical, and few Americans use it.

[Kakmakr]

These executive orders will all be nullified when Biden comes into power, because he will over turn most of these ridiculous decisions that Trump has made. Yes, Trump pushed the agenda to "Put America first" ....but some of the restrictions are causing more damage.. than good and Biden will overturn that.  

The Chinese in turn will ban or block American social media companies and it will just cancel out the banning of Chinese payment platforms. The same thing happened with the trade restrictions and many American companies suffered as a result of that.  

[el kaka22]

Perhaps this could influence china into taking a less harsh stance on crypto exchanges and mining in the country. If Trump bans all of china's fiat apps then bitcoin and crypto would be the only things they had left?

What do you mean "only things they have left"? It's not like Trump is erasing those apps from existence, he merely bans them in the US, and it's hardly a big deal, cause Americans are using their own appls like Venmo or Cash App. And those Chinese apps are mostly used in China, they wouldn't really care even if whole world banned them. And Americans can still buy stuff from Aliexpress via Visa/Mastercard, just like they did before.

Do not underestimate the power of USA in the world economic stage. Sure americans use their own systems and there is no doubt about that, but it is not like there is zero amount used neither, there are still some people who use it, plus the more you do business with China the more you get used to their apps as well, they are that kind of people who try to "suggest" you by giving you incentives and then you get hooked on it as well.

Simply look at TikTok, why did they suddenly created this HUGE problem out of being banned from USA? Because even though it is a chinese app, they are taking tens of billions of information points from all americans while making insane returns of profit as well, being banned from USA would mean China would lose insane amount of money and information from USA. Which is why chinese apps want to be in USA, so they can make great returns, Chinese people do not have that much money, americans do.

[wxxyrqa]

These executive orders will all be nullified when Biden comes into power, because he will over turn most of these ridiculous decisions that Trump has made. Yes, Trump pushed the agenda to "Put America first" ....but some of the restrictions are causing more damage.. than good and Biden will overturn that.  

The Chinese in turn will ban or block American social media companies and it will just cancel out the banning of Chinese payment platforms. The same thing happened with the trade restrictions and many American companies suffered as a result of that.  

Biden will undoubtedly have to fix a lot of what Trump did. Today, many expect various changes from the government of the country by Biden, but I also think it is necessary to take into account that almost all politicians have a slightly different pre-election rhetoric and the rhetoric after the inauguration. We need to wait a little longer and we will see what will be Biden's policy towards China.

[romero121]

This started with India, because it is the first Country to make bans over large number of Chinese applications under use. Following India's decision USA made its ban list for Chinese applications. It counts more number of popular applications, and the same has made the Chinese information technology market got a big blow.

Now Trump has made it an order to be executed. However the new government might have different plans. Upon that the ban list can increase or else the ban will be taken by the new government.

[eaLiTy]

Not certain how long these bans will remain in effect. Biden could overturn these executive orders the second he assumes office?
Perhaps this could influence china into taking a less harsh stance on crypto exchanges and mining in the country. If Trump bans all of china's fiat apps then bitcoin and crypto would be the only things they had left?

India already banned over 50 Chinese application in the past few months and it was expected other countries to follow suit because the reason they said about the ban is security reasons. To be frank taking strict action on cryptocurrency exchanges will not help anyone as the business is run by their citizen which will help in providing more jobs and the crypto space has nothing to do with any specific country.