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Author Topic: Building a mini Minig-Farm in Kazakhstan (while living in Germany)?  (Read 136 times)
kalov91 (OP)
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February 08, 2021, 08:49:45 AM
Last edit: February 09, 2021, 10:35:06 PM by frodocooper
 #1

Hello everybody.

I have been investing in Bitcoin for quite some time now. Since I live in Germany, I never thought about getting involved with mining. But a few days ago I read that Kazakhstan is a popular location for mining Bitcoin, because electricity is relatively cheap there. Immediately I had to think of my aunt who still lives in Kazakhstan and owns a factory site there with a nearly empty building. In my eyes a very good precondition to build up a small mining farm? Now I can't stop thinking about this idea. It bothers me that I can't easily be there myself, since I don't live there, but that doesn't have to be a show stopper?

Since I am still inexperienced with the subject, I am looking for advice here in the forum, because maybe I underestimate the risks and the requiered efforts, so it may be the case that it is not worth it at all.

I have a few questions:

1. Is there a current, particularly recommended startup guide I can use?

2. As soon as the miners are powered in Kazakhstan and connected to the router network/the internet via a LAN cable, I can do the configuration via e.g. Teamviewer from Germany, right?

3. As far as I know a strong internet is not necessary, but a stable one. But what if the connection is briefly interrupted? Does it reconnect automatically? Can I reconnect from Germany? Or does someone in Kazakhstan reconnect the Miners?

4. What if the power connection briefly breaks? I'm afraid that someone in Kazakhstan will then have to push a button to get the miners to restart?

5. It is very cold in Kazakhstan in the winter, but in the summer it can easily get up to 35°C. Is general cooling with fans enough, or do you need proper air conditioning?

6. Which miners are recommended? According to Alibaba.com, you can buy a supposedly new Antminer S9 for $78. The ratio between power consumption and hashrate isn't great, but at this low price, it will pay for itself very quickly. Or is it too old and better to buy an Antminer S17 pro or S19 pro?

7. How long is the average lifetime of a miner? Or are there no reliable figures? Is 2 years too optimistic?

8. How often and intensively is the necessary maintenance work during mining? Can the miners be left unattended for weeks or months as long as they are mining 24/7? Or should they be checked on daily?

Are there perhaps any other relevant things I need to urgently consider?

Thanks in advance for any helpful input!
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February 08, 2021, 01:27:51 PM
Last edit: February 09, 2021, 10:37:02 PM by frodocooper
 #2

Now I can't stop thinking about this idea. It bothers me that I can't easily be there myself, since I don't live there, but that doesn't have to be a show stopper?

It depends, to me, that would be a "show stopper", if you don't have physical access to the miners or/and have someone else who does, things won't be easy, you need someone who has basic IT knowledge to take care of the farm, while most operations can be handled online, physical attendance can't be avoided.

1. Is there a current, particularly recommended startup guide I can use?

Depending on the size of your farm, you might need to hire professionals to set-up the farm.

2. As soon as the miners are powered in Kazakhstan and connected to the router network/the internet via a LAN cable, I can do the configuration via e.g. Teamviewer from Germany, right?

Yes, you can do "most" of the operations online.

3. As far as I know a strong internet is not necessary, but a stable one. But what if the connection is briefly interrupted? Does it reconnect automatically? Can I reconnect from Germany? Or does someone in Kazakhstan reconnect the Miners?

It depends on the miner's firmware, some will auto-connect, others will need a reboot, both can be done online so in most cases there is no physical reboot needed.

4. What if the power connection briefly breaks? I'm afraid that someone in Kazakhstan will then have to push a button to get the miners to restart?

At its basics, yes. but there are some methods that involve the usage of some contactors/relays and other things that would minimize the need for someone to be there, but without a doubt, you can't completely eliminate the need for someone to be there when needs be.

5. It is very cold in Kazakhstan in the winter, but in the summer it can easily get up to 35°C. Is general cooling with fans enough, or do you need proper air conditioning?

You will need extra fans mounted in the farm walls, some for exhaust some for intake, again, depending on the size of your set-up you might need to hire a professional for the cooling system, no air cons are needed as long as you move enough air.

6. Which miners are recommended? According to Alibaba.com, you can buy a supposedly new Antminer S9 for $78. The ratio between power consumption and hashrate isn't great, but at this low price, it will pay for itself very quickly. Or is it too old and better to buy an Antminer S17 pro or S19 pro?

1-Do not buy from Alibaba,
2- There is no easy answer to this question, you need to do more research on your own, it all depends on the power cost there, if it's pretty low, you want to focus on cost per terahash, if not, then efficiency will be as important as the cost per terahash.

7. How long is the average lifetime of a miner? Or are there no reliable figures? Is 2 years too optimistic?

It depends on the gear, your luck, temps, and many other factors, it can be 4 years or 4 weeks, nobody has a definite answer, but it's safe to assume that if you don't ROI the miner in 6-8 months, it will be a bit hard to ROI, all the way to 1 year is somehow manageable, past 1 year and you are going to need a lot of luck.

8. How often and intensively is the necessary maintenance work during mining? Can the miners be left unattended for weeks or months as long as they are mining 24/7? Or should they be checked on daily?

If everything is perfectly set-up you might need to visit the farm for months or even years, but issues do happen, you also need to do some cleaning once a while, this could range from once a week to once a year depending on the location, filtration and all that.

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kalov91 (OP)
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February 08, 2021, 04:53:01 PM
Last edit: February 09, 2021, 10:38:20 PM by frodocooper
 #3

Thank you very much for your quick response!!!! Smiley

It depends, to me, that would be a "show stopper", if you don't have physical access to the miners or/and have someone else who does, things won't be easy, you need someone who has basic IT knowledge to take care of the farm, while most operations can be handled online, physical attendance can't be avoided.

Having no real "IT-guy" in Kazakhstan is really a weak point. But I hope that it's really just basic IT knowledge which is required.

Depending on the size of your farm, you might need to hire professionals to set-up the farm.

It really will be just a small farm. Maybe 3 to 5 Miner, nothing big. I want to start slowly, maybe by testing things out with just one and than expand to 5 Miners or even more, if things run good. Thought about buying a cheap Antminer S9 for testing things out and then buying some S17 Pro odre S19 Pro.

You will need extra fans mounted in the farm walls, some for exhaust some for intake, again, depending on the size of your set-up you might need to hire a professional for the cooling system, no air cons are needed as long as you move enough air.

Are extra fans mounted in the farm walls really necessary, when its just 3~5 Miners in a Room?

1-Do not buy from Alibaba,
2- There is no easy answer to this question, you need to do more research on your own, it all depends on the power cost there, if it's pretty low, you want to focus on cost per terahash, if not, then efficiency will be as important as the cost per terahash.

The power cost is 0,04$ per kW... But why not buying from Alibaba? Is it nearly always a scam? And where else can I buy a good miner? Everything on bitmain is sold out.
NotFuzzyWarm
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February 08, 2021, 05:50:35 PM
 #4

If your power is cheap, look at Canaan's A12 series. Next batch ships in March.

- For bitcoin to succeed the community must police itself -    My info useful? Donations welcome! 1FuzzyWc2J8TMqeUQZ8yjE43Rwr7K3cxs9
 -Sole remaining active developer of cgminer, Kano's repo is here
-Support Sidehacks miner development. Donations to:   1BURGERAXHH6Yi6LRybRJK7ybEm5m5HwTr
kalov91 (OP)
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February 08, 2021, 06:59:01 PM
 #5

If your power is cheap, look at Canaan's A12 series. Next batch ships in March.

Thanks for the tip! But why not the MicroBT M30S?

[Link removed]
NotFuzzyWarm
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February 08, 2021, 07:01:43 PM
 #6

It's all about when you can get them. If available then yes the M30S is also good.

- For bitcoin to succeed the community must police itself -    My info useful? Donations welcome! 1FuzzyWc2J8TMqeUQZ8yjE43Rwr7K3cxs9
 -Sole remaining active developer of cgminer, Kano's repo is here
-Support Sidehacks miner development. Donations to:   1BURGERAXHH6Yi6LRybRJK7ybEm5m5HwTr
kalov91 (OP)
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February 08, 2021, 07:05:14 PM
 #7

Ok, good to know. I thought that Antminer is kind of a "golden standard", so I wanted to buy one from AliBaba, but know I am not sure, because mikeywith advises me against it...
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February 08, 2021, 07:08:08 PM
 #8

@kalov91
That site you linked is a scam!
Please remove it.

NotFuzzyWarm
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February 08, 2021, 07:10:07 PM
 #9

@kalov91
That site you linked is a scam!
Please remove it.
Correct!
The REAL site for whatminer sales is https://whatsminer.net/
The Whatsminers are made by https://www.microbt.com/?locale=en
For ANY miner, only trust distributors listed on the manufacturers websites or at least vetted by folks here.

- For bitcoin to succeed the community must police itself -    My info useful? Donations welcome! 1FuzzyWc2J8TMqeUQZ8yjE43Rwr7K3cxs9
 -Sole remaining active developer of cgminer, Kano's repo is here
-Support Sidehacks miner development. Donations to:   1BURGERAXHH6Yi6LRybRJK7ybEm5m5HwTr
kalov91 (OP)
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February 08, 2021, 07:11:40 PM
Last edit: February 09, 2021, 10:39:24 PM by frodocooper
 #10

@kalov91
That site you linked is a scam!
Please remove it.

Done. Sorry, didn't really analysed it... Scary, because at first sight it looked not like a scam   Undecided

If your power is cheap, look at Canaan's A12 series. Next batch ships in March.

Well... There is no price shown and when I try to get more Info I get an error. I guess it's harder than I thought to even buy a miner, if AliBaba is no option...  Embarrassed
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February 08, 2021, 07:36:35 PM
 #11

https://www.eastshore.xyz/ is a reputable distributor for Ants & whatsminers but looks like they are out of stock. Trying to think of who was Canaan's EU distributor... In the US it is Blokforge.com

- For bitcoin to succeed the community must police itself -    My info useful? Donations welcome! 1FuzzyWc2J8TMqeUQZ8yjE43Rwr7K3cxs9
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-Support Sidehacks miner development. Donations to:   1BURGERAXHH6Yi6LRybRJK7ybEm5m5HwTr
HagssFIN
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February 08, 2021, 07:43:51 PM
 #12

I've bought gear few times from Eastshore without issues.

The Canaan distributor in Europe is Cryptouniverse from Vienna, Austria. www.cryptouniverse.at
But I'm not sure if they still sell gear. Or if they just havent updated the website for a while.
I've bought gear from them as well and it went smooth.

kalov91 (OP)
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February 08, 2021, 07:45:48 PM
Last edit: February 09, 2021, 10:40:04 PM by frodocooper
 #13

Thanks for the Links, but shouldn't it be an Asian distributor since I need it to be shipped to Kazakhstan?
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February 08, 2021, 07:47:40 PM
 #14

Have you considered reaching Canaan directly?
https://canaan.io/product/a1246
Their sales email: sales@canaan.io

EDIT: Woop woop, this is my 3500th post.  Grin

kalov91 (OP)
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February 08, 2021, 09:14:20 PM
Last edit: February 09, 2021, 10:40:29 PM by frodocooper
 #15

Congratulations! Smiley

That's a good idead, so I should try. But I don't think it will work, since I can't afford to buy a lot of miners.
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February 09, 2021, 05:31:50 AM
Last edit: February 09, 2021, 10:42:41 PM by frodocooper
 #16

Having no real "IT-guy" in Kazakhstan is really a weak point. But I hope that it's really just basic IT knowledge which is required.

Very basic knowledge is enough, someone who knows how to use the browser, log in to the router, and find an IP address of a machine should be enough.

It really will be just a small farm. Maybe 3 to 5 Miner, nothing big. I want to start slowly, maybe by testing things out with just one and than expand to 5 Miners or even more, if things run good. Thought about buying a cheap Antminer S9 for testing things out and then buying some S17 Pro odre S19 Pro.

In that case, you can do it alone, just use the correct wire/breaker size and you should be good to go.

Are extra fans mounted in the farm walls really necessary, when its just 3~5 Miners in a Room?

It depends on the size of the building, but with 3-5 miners and assuming they would be facing a window and the hot air can escape from there, you won't need any extra ventilation.

The power cost is 0,04$ per kW...

S9 makes a small profit at 4 cents Khw now, but that won't last long, so eventually, you want better gears, the 17 series of Bitmain are terrible and they have a high failure rate, S19 pro is super expensive, honestly, now isn't the best time to be buying a mining gear, but maybe get 1-2 S9s to start with, this mining mania should be over in a few months and then you can get S19s or M30s at reasonable prices.

But why not buying from Alibaba? Is it nearly always a scam?

Most of the time, it's either they send you a dead machine or nothing at all, and most of the prices there are outdated, so the legit guys will give you the new price which is above $200 for S9 in China.

And where else can I buy a good miner? Everything on bitmain is sold out.

Check the market place in this forum, Miner Experts aka Grace is a good seller based in China, Scott and Kaboom are solid sellers based in the U.S, alternatively, you could try to find them locally in Kazhaztan, do a bit of googling and make a "Want to buy" topic in the Hardware Market place, you might get lucky.

** Regarding the sellers make sure you are talking to the right person and not an imposter.

@NotFuzzyWarm, the retail price for Avalon 1246 March batch in China is $4100.  Cry Cry

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kalov91 (OP)
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February 09, 2021, 06:49:10 PM
Last edit: February 09, 2021, 10:43:41 PM by frodocooper
 #17

S9 makes a small profit at 4 cents Khw now, but that won't last long, so eventually, you want better gears, the 17 series of Bitmain are terrible and they have a high failure rate, S19 pro is super expensive, honestly, now isn't the best time to be buying a mining gear, but maybe get 1-2 S9s to start with, this mining mania should be over in a few months and then you can get S19s or M30s at reasonable prices.

Yes, S19 Pro is way to expensive... But how about S9 i/j/k? Arent't these kind of newer models?

Most of the time, it's either they send you a dead machine or nothing at all, and most of the prices there are outdated, so the legit guys will give you the new price which is above $200 for S9 in China.

Valuable advice, thank you! Saves me certainly unnecessary frustration.

Check the market place in this forum, Miner Experts aka Grace is a good seller based in China, Scott and Kaboom are solid sellers based in the U.S, alternatively, you could try to find them locally in Kazhaztan, do a bit of googling and make a "Want to buy" topic in the Hardware Market place, you might get lucky.

You mean buying here from a member of the forum? I must admit I am a skeptical person, but a private purchase here is probably more trustworthy than a purchase on AliBaba.
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February 10, 2021, 09:34:03 AM
 #18

When I say S9 I always mean S9, S9i, and S9j, I believe this is what most people mean when they say S9, those 3 gears are almost identical, and they are solid gears. The I and J are slightly more efficient than the classic S9, but not by a lot, the S9k and S9se are the newest set of S9, you should avoid buying those gears as they are some of the most terrible gears, especially the S9k, it's a nightmare.

Between S9i, S9j, and S9, the J version seems to be the most reliable (not by a lot, since the other two are indeed solid), the problem with S9j however is that it has the same tube size as the old S9, so many resellers cheat by changing the sticker from S9 to S9j but they can't do that with the S9i because it's a bit different and easy to spot, they do change the sticker because S9 is cheaper than the other two versions since it is the oldest gear and thus, in theory, has the lowest lifespan when bought used, this leads to one conclusion: Always try to get the S9i version of S9 whenever possible.

If the seller is someone you trust, go for J version, if the S9 is a lot cheaper, I'd go for it as well.

Quote
You mean buying here from a member of the forum? I must admit I am a skeptical person, but a private purchase here is probably more trustworthy than a purchase on AliBaba.

You have to be skeptical, but trading here is kind of easy, you post a WTB topic, you either ask the seller for a face-to-face meeting or use forum escrow, by doing so you are more likely going to have a happy ending, most scammers will refuse to use trusted escrow or meet you in person.

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