Is crypto just a joke now?

[thirdprize]

So it wasn't chinese miners controlling the system, it was Elon Musk tweeting memes all along.  Regardless of whether you are making money from it, if the system is that easy to game then who will take it seriously?  What is to stop Elon pumping and dumping any coin he likes?  They are not Tesla shares so he is totally allowed to.  I just remember 5 years ago when bitcoin had a meaning and could  have been taken seriously.  Now its original purpose just seems a very distant memory.

[Lucius]

To be honest, I personally don't like that one person can have such a big impact on something that should be decentralized, but Bitcoin is not closed under some glass lid under which only the chosen ones can be. We went a long way from "money for the people" to "toys for the rich", but sooner or later it had to happen - with one important difference, this time ordinary people had more than 10 years to accumulate something in what Musk or Michael Saylor didn't believe it until a few months ago.

If they want an entrance ticket for our party, rest assured they will pay dearly for it. In fact, with their actions, they clearly show that it is not a joke - because all those who told you and me 5 years ago that we are fools because we invested in BTC now actually turn out to be real fools.

[philipma1957]

So it wasn't chinese miners controlling the system, it was Elon Musk tweeting memes all along.  Regardless of whether you are making money from it, if the system is that easy to game then who will take it seriously?  What is to stop Elon pumping and dumping any coin he likes?  They are not Tesla shares so he is totally allowed to.  I just remember 5 years ago when bitcoin had a meaning and could  have been taken seriously.  Now its original purpose just seems a very distant memory.

This is a good question.

I believe he set the doge rally up 🆙.

He simply purchased billions of doge from Jan 2019 to Nov 2020.

the cost in that time was 0.001976 to 0.002850 comes out to about 0.00235 usd a coin.

so 10 billion coins would have been 23.5 million




at the moment doge is 0.0800 over 30x jump.


if he purchased 10 billion and staggered sales at 6,7,8,9,10 cents

2 billion at each level  he sold off 6 billion at a 7 cent average.

or 420 million and he still has 4 billion coins left.

a 400 million profit.

he can easily put that into btc which means the 1.5 billion he put in is more like 1.1 billion

[TryNinja]

if he purchased 10 billion and staggered sales at 6,7,8,9,10 cents

2 billion at each level  he sold off 6 billion at a 7 cent average.

or 420 million and he still has 4 billion coins left.

a 400 million profit.

he can easily put that into btc which means the 1.5 billion he put in is more like 1.1 billion

Do you guys really think Doge is that liquid? lol

OP, we are still VERY early. Of course the richest man on earth can pump the price with tweets and $1,5 bi purchases.

[HOT_HEAD]

I've been following crypto news since 2014 and lately, with huge influx of people and companies, it looks like people think it's nothing else but a invest and get rich quick scheme.

[thirdprize]

I've been following crypto news since 2014 and lately, with huge influx of people and companies, it looks like people think it's nothing else but a invest and get rich quick scheme.

I suppose I will get what I can out of the current boom but mark my words.  With the amount of money thats been invested, when it collapses it is going to be a bloodbath.

[Porfirii]

So, when MtGox, China ban or Covid itself made the price dump like there was no tomorrow, it was not a joke.

But if the wealthiest man in the world vouches for it and the price goes up, then it is manipulation and a toy for the rich?

Are you listening to yourselves? Crypto is extremely volatile, you should know that already after so many years it's its main risk, and it's main opportunity.

[Lucius]

But if the wealthiest man in the world vouches for it and the price goes up, then it is manipulation and a toy for the rich?

Since you are partly referring to my post then I will answer you what I meant by "toy for the rich". Tell me how many people 10 years ago could afford to buy 1 BTC? Probably anyone on this planet who was working and receiving a salary at the time. Let's ask the same question for 5 years after that, so in 2015 - who could afford to buy 1 BTC which then cost about $200? The percentage of people who have already dropped out of the game at that time is significant, because some people have a salary of only a few tens of dollars a month.

And finally came 2021, the price of 1 BTC is now almost $50 000 - who can afford to buy 1 BTC today, or maybe 0.5 BTC? Just the ones buying today, rich guys like Musk or Saylor. After them come even richer people, so don't think that I used that term for no reason - Musk may be the richest man in the world publicly known, but there are rich people from the shadows who acquire their wealth for generations and have trillions of dollars or euros.

https://www.cheatsheet.com/money-career/real-richest-man-world-other-secret-billionaires.html/

[philipma1957]

But if the wealthiest man in the world vouches for it and the price goes up, then it is manipulation and a toy for the rich?

Since you are partly referring to my post then I will answer you what I meant by "toy for the rich". Tell me how many people 10 years ago could afford to buy 1 BTC? Probably anyone on this planet who was working and receiving a salary at the time. Let's ask the same question for 5 years after that, so in 2015 - who could afford to buy 1 BTC which then cost about $200? The percentage of people who have already dropped out of the game at that time is significant, because some people have a salary of only a few tens of dollars a month.

And finally came 2021, the price of 1 BTC is now almost $50 000 - who can afford to buy 1 BTC today, or maybe 0.5 BTC? Just the ones buying today, rich guys like Musk or Saylor. After them come even richer people, so don't think that I used that term for no reason - Musk may be the richest man in the world publicly known, but there are rich people from the shadows who acquire their wealth for generations and have trillions of dollars or euros.

https://www.cheatsheet.com/money-career/real-richest-man-world-other-secret-billionaires.html/

This is perfectly true.

And it is why bitcoin maximumilist  are practicing a doomed belief system.

We are going to have to deal with other coins and rathe than say they are all shit coins  we need to sort them out and rank them better.

Doge may or may not be super liquid but there are 130 billion coins out there price is low and network is well back be ASICs .
Has a place as does LTC thousands of other coins are garbage.

If the coin does not have proper iron (miners) backing it value is not so good.

Any one can play with doge. Own a lot of coins.

Not so with BTC as owning a lot of coins is not easy

[jrrsparkles]

so don't think that I used that term for no reason - Musk may be the richest man in the world publicly known, but there are rich people from the shadows who acquire their wealth for generations and have trillions of dollars or euros.

https://www.cheatsheet.com/money-career/real-richest-man-world-other-secret-billionaires.html/

Elon Musk or Jeff Bezos or anyone in the top richest person list are not actually rich because the term rich person used to calculate in terms of Networth not woth the actual asset value so these people only exists on paper and documents while the actual rich people are holding Bitcoin and other liquidation assets for very long time.

[franky1]

elon bought $1.5bill btc at ~$30k/btc (guess:50,000btc)

if sold today thats $2.25bill
a nice 0.75bill profit for 2 months(50%)

..
that said people really need to understand bitcoins value vs bitcoins price are 2 separate things
                                                              (asset value)      (net worth)

i try to make it simple.
whatever the lowest price in the last 6 months is. in combination to how close it is to mining cost. is the true value line of bitcoin (the base value) as this is seen as the lowest price people are willing to sell for before they break even. and most will never sell at a loss. thus a strong indicator or best value

the current price or recent ATH is the speculative bubble price. .. not the base value

if you can work out the base value. and then compare that to the current price or recent high. you can work out how much "bubble" is occuring right now.

if the price and value are close then its a good buy. if the price is double+ the value. then its a bubble that can burst and correct back down

elon and other influencers can affect the speculative price(spot price) but its the fundamentals of bitcoin utility that help set the base value.

in short. never just look at a 'price' chart with one measure.
golds 'spot' price that people pay/get paid at a 'cash for gold' is not the same as the underlying gold value

(hint: bitcoin 3 month value=~$21k)

[20kevin20]

What Musk has done is a double-edged sword tbh. The only thing is, I really thought he was only memeing Doge but then I noticed he got as greedy and hypocrite as McAfee has been back in the alt season days.

I've always been saying that our markets are still too immature, which makes it an even better opportunity for us as investors. It's the early days or crypto and we have to accept that someone with an influence as large as Musk's could push a bull or a bear run easily into the market by only mentioning a few words.

But as I said before, this entire GME and DOGE thing looks to me like it's all about the rich planning to just screw us up even more than ever before. Haven't asked anyone else about this, but all my friends who've invested in GME and DOGE in the past month have ended up losing a lot of money. It is the rich vs the poor, but the rich are in a large advantage & profit in this war.

On the other hand though, I think what Musk has done attracted a very large number of people to crypto and although most of them have been in the game just for the meme, even if 5-10% stay in the industry it's still worth it. But then, when you think about it, in a matter of time when DOGE falls, it's gonna be the entire damn mainstream media speaking about how dangerous cryptos are.

I think that while it's being taken right now as a joke, in a matter of years (probably up to a decade) it won't be anymore. We have to acknowledge that we are still witnessing the early days of crypto..

[thirdprize]

Musk is only in it as he can manipulate the market without getting told off.  Remember when he said something that made Tesla share jump and he got banned from twitter for a while.  Anything he says will indirectly pump his company.

My other gripe is that all this makes any further Btc or Eth development redundant.  People talk about layer 2 and sharding but does the world really care at this point?  All btis is happening when the coins are not really usable as coins.  Btc is too slow and Eth is too expensive in gas.  You can't/won't buy a coffee with gold so why should you with either coin?

It is all just fucked and heading for a big crash.

[CryptocurencyKing]

Crypto has never been a joke, there are just more than one element to move the market in either way based on individual perceptions. Elon Musk as a crypto fan, CEO at Tesla and the world richest man happens to be in recent time a looked up to fellow for crypto anchorage just as most presidents of nations do for their country and as Trump did for forex. Where a single tweet is all that was needed to make the difference but, its always based on how the message is received. It could always go the other way too. His critic or positive attribute to the system would mean a lot for a time and then, would reduce as to effect much later.

[Vod]

So it wasn't chinese miners controlling the system, it was Elon Musk tweeting memes all along. 

Read up on Richard_Whitney who did the same thing in 1929.  Like OgNasty, he was eventually convicted of embezzlement, and his meak attempt to reinforce the bubble was useless.