Global adoption — A ridiculous term

[buwaytress]

Just one of scores of ridiculous terms used in practically every manifesto and "white paper" since Bitcoin. Pretty certain most people using them know the ridiculousness of them.

Mass adoption. Global adoption. Decentralization. Critical mass. Internet of value. Disruptive tech. Democratized money. Sovereign finance.

The shit remarkably devoid from the 9 pages actually describing Bitcoin.

[Sterbens]

Global adoption is just a term that comes out of its users. I prefer to call it ambition to fulfill satisfaction and display the wealth of Bitcoin.
fulfillment of commercial needs and it only gives a high desire value for the social status that he wants to be considered as a rich person.
Bitcoin has been a means of multiplying finances from one decade to another. but in the end if it continues, then gradually Bitcoin is just like a stopover and will be abandoned forever.
On the other hand, we don't think so, because our ambition is not just to fulfill our needs. we still want Bitcoin to exist as a function of paper money. and make it a global transaction tool.

[teosanru]

An excellent point and very well written. Global Adoption can be from two standpoints, one is regulatory adoption that all countries or at least most of the countries decide to use cryptos as the only legal tender and they decide to forgo their traditional fiats, this option seems unlikely as no country would want to lose power by themselves, a few friendly countries might do it but no way the big guns are going to scrap their own fiats, but yes they might allow cryptos to coexist which too to me looks unlikely.

The second meaning of global adoption is from a personal perspective. Basically, every person on Earth or at least most of them thinks of Bitcoin as a valuable thing something like Gold. Not talking about its investment value but if tomorrow there is an apocalypse, chances are only people holding gold would be able to buy anything. Bitcoin has to reach up to this level, which too seems unlikely at least in the next 30-40 years.

But the catch now is what I have written in a lot of posts before too. That if everyone starts considering bitcoin merely as a store of value and something to Invest, it will lose the utility it was made for which means it's value is a hoax, whereas if a person starts to spend their bitcoin the price cannot go up for an infinite time It eventually will plateau at a point.

[famososMuertos]

Well, you're trying to cross the street and you think it's the right thing to do because you just need to get to the other side.

That is, you will have your reasons for crossing, no one criticizes them but not everyone can follow you, at least not everyone. And those who stay don't have to be fools, maybe those fools are watching fools cross.

Making it clear from the above that there are no absolute points of view as to what adoption is, I can tell you and I have mentioned it before, adoption is coming late for ordinary people, but because of their ignorance or their little ability to access goods / assets that by culture they do not manage at their disposal but do so by imposition.

The above is just a part of what adoption really means, we must add the judicial, governmental, etc. and perhaps the most difficult the ideological level.

Now the reality of the large bitcoin holders cannot be covered with a finger, but the same happens with the Fiat or to give it a name the $ for example.

With bitcoin if you want to have more depends on you, with the $ that there are many millionaires has never implied that new ones arise, in fact, of the list of the 500 richest in the United States at least half started with a minimum capital.

[o_e_l_e_o]

one is regulatory adoption that all countries or at least most of the countries decide to use cryptos as the only legal tender and they decide to forgo their traditional fiats, this option seems unlikely as no country would want to lose power by themselves

Funny you should mention that, with the news coming out a few hours ago of El Salvador being the first country in the world to propose to recognize bitcoin as legal tender. I agree very few countries, if any, will give up their fiat monetary system, but that's not to say bitcoin cannot also be accepted as legal tender in all these countries, especially given that bitcoin is already being accepted by traders and merchants in these countries.

Not talking about its investment value but if tomorrow there is an apocalypse, chances are only people holding gold would be able to buy anything.

No chance. In an apocalyptic event such as a meteor strike, nuclear war, massive solar flare, etc., then all monetary systems will be worthless. People will barter for food, clean water, shelter, medicines, fuel, and weapons primarily. Fiat, bitcoin, precious metals, etc., will all be equally worthless.

[lixer]

What I want to mean in this topic is that the problem doesn't come from the fact that the majority sees it as an investment. The issue becomes clear if you notice its hierarchical structure. I'll quote myself to prevent re-writing a childish example:

Yup, no doubts I do have the same thoughts as you, and I feel that it is not going to be completely adopted by everyone. We are still have going to have the conventional currencies, the USD, Euro, Pounds and the rest of them are going to be there as the base currency we use. Then we will also have bitcoin, which will be widely adopted for sure. There are going to be more stores in future that will be accepting bitcoin more than they have now. So that’s a plus, but it’s not going to be the only thing we will have. And there are even going to be lots of altcoins that will come out by then that will be really good enough.

[sapnu]

It might be considered ridiculous not only because it is not yet possible but also because it is almost trying to remove the essence of bitcoin. Privacy and decentralization of the coin might get removed or disregarded as the global adoption takes place. Indeed some may benefit but generally, all of us will suffer if ever that happens. Maybe we could not stop it someday as technology continues to improve but still for now, let us stop pushing it through as the solution the world needs. There are still a lot of ways for the world to keep on surviving without asking for the help of a digital currency.

[Ozero]

one is regulatory adoption that all countries or at least most of the countries decide to use cryptos as the only legal tender and they decide to forgo their traditional fiats, this option seems unlikely as no country would want to lose power by themselves

Funny you should mention that, with the news coming out a few hours ago of El Salvador being the first country in the world to propose to recognize bitcoin as legal tender. I agree very few countries, if any, will give up their fiat monetary system, but that's not to say bitcoin cannot also be accepted as legal tender in all these countries, especially given that bitcoin is already being accepted by traders and merchants in these countries.

Not talking about its investment value but if tomorrow there is an apocalypse, chances are only people holding gold would be able to buy anything.

No chance. In an apocalyptic event such as a meteor strike, nuclear war, massive solar flare, etc., then all monetary systems will be worthless. People will barter for food, clean water, shelter, medicines, fuel, and weapons primarily. Fiat, bitcoin, precious metals, etc., will all be equally worthless.

It is unlikely that we will ever wait for the global adoption of cryptocurrency by states and their bodies. Most likely, a decentralized cryptocurrency will be the lot of ordinary people and partly of business structures. Governments will use their central bank stablecoins instead of cryptocurrencies.
El Salvador does not have its own currency. The dollar is used there as money. Therefore, they can use Bitcoin without any problems. However, almost all full-fledged states have their own currency and they will never give up on it. At the same time, cryptocurrency may well walk in society along with the currency of states.

[dkbit98]

It is unlikely that we will ever wait for the global adoption of cryptocurrency by states and their bodies.

You can see what happened with El Salvador could happen with many more countries around the world, and there is nothing ridiculous about that adoption, but Bitcoin is all about separation of money from state.
Why not having more than one currency in country and you let the citizens decide what they want to use legaly, not charging them ridiculously high taxes like now.
Let's see what country will accept Bitcoin as legal tender next and then we can talk more about global adoption.

[BlackHatCoiner]

Why not having more than one currency in country and you let the citizens decide what they want to use legaly, not charging them ridiculously high taxes like now.

Because they cannot control it. It's that simple. Are you sure that every other country will behave same like El Salvador did?

I hope they all adopt it and maximize this global adoption, because I have bitcoins.

Let's see what country will accept Bitcoin as legal tender next and then we can talk more about global adoption.

There's a difference between adopting Bitcoin and legalizing it. Yes, you can make it legal to use Bitcoin, but will there be places to use it, you know like... locally? It could surely provide a great way to purchase from the other side of the Earth, but locally, it'd be better to use your nation currency. It's faster, it costs less to make a transaction, you don't have to dedicate some hundreds of hours understanding how it works and it'd be better for you to spend it now, rather than keep it.

[pooya87]

I don't claim, no one knows for sure, but I can make my own assumptions. Although, I have to tell you that if you believe in the depths of Bitcoin as a currency, you should wish that the speculators are more than the users. If these fluctuations happened and the investors were the minority, imagine how fluctuating it'd be oppositely.

I actually think that people in both groups (people who see bitcoin as a currency vs those seeing it as an investment) are growing at all times but the ratio differs based on when in the 4-year cycle we are in.
If we consider the cycle to start from the bubble burst, first year is the big drop and a long bear market, second year is accumulation and small rises, third year is bigger rises and build up of momentum, and forth year is the massive rises and the eventual bubble.
In year 1 and 4 we have more speculators due to the high volatility but in year 2 and 3 due to most stability (less profit to be made by traders) we have the least number of speculators and more "believers".

[AicecreaME]

Global adoption is the common term used by the users not because it will be literally used by everyone, but because it will be available to the most part of the world. Global adoption has its pros and cons. Bitcoin's adoption would lead to bigger community that will benefit most users because there will be more investors pumping the market. On the other hand, this may also cause to a situation wherein the government would try their chance to regulate it.

Personally, I want bitcoin to be mass adopted so that many people can be aware and benefit. You see, bitcoin has so many features that central banks don't have such as having decentralize nature, anonymity, high security, and so on. In addition, it is a good investment vehicle and a medium of exchange as well. I want other people to experience what I enjoy, but of course, only if they want to.

Regarding the issue about those people pushing global adoption for additional wealth, I just want to say that not everyone is like that. Sure, there are people using the opportunity of pushing bitcoin's adoption for their own benefit, but it shouldn't bother you much. It's not as if they are stealing something. They are just promoting and utilizing their resources. I think it's a win-win scenario as long as they're transparent to the future users (that will be generated from global adoption) about the risks. After all, it's not always about the money alone.

[Shenzou]

I think that global adoptation and mainstream use of the bitcoin as a day to day currency is hard to achieve, and that is due to the fact of  it being decentrelized and uncontroled meaing that the price will always be constantly changing at any time, so a guy who owns a shop could sell a product that is worth 10$ and the next week finds himself with only 5$, for somone who is earning more than enough and wants to invest in bitcoin he could start accepting as a apyment method in his business but from somone who his trying to make a living it would hard, at least this early.

[Yatsan]

Global adaption will be a really hard thing to be achieved since not all can acquire or can be able to use the full functionality of Bitcoin to become part of their daily lives. It seems to be a near to impossibility term for the adaption of Bitcoin. It can be at least be alter into "massive adaption" since it seems to fit the reality that not all can adapt into using it but many can be able to still do it.

[o_e_l_e_o]

On the other hand, this may also cause to a situation wherein the government would try their chance to regulate it.

That ship has sailed. Governments around the world are already trying to regulate it, force more invasive KYC on bitcoin users than on fiat users, tax it more aggressively than fiat, demand exchanges hand over customer data, employ blockchain analysis companies to track you, and so on.

so a guy who owns a shop could sell a product that is worth 10$ and the next week finds himself with only 5$

If bitcoin did reach global adoption, then any price swings would be minimal. With such a huge amount of liquidity, anyone could dump a huge amount of coin on the market without dropping the price, and with billions of users then the small number of idiots who listen to tweets from the likes of Elon Musk would be very much in the minority. And at least with bitcoin you know at some point the value will almost certainly go up again, as opposed to accepting fiat where you know it will only ever go down.

[dkbit98]

Are you sure that every other country will behave same like El Salvador did?

I am not sure in anything but what I can see is that other countries from South America like Panama, Brasil, Nicaragua, Paraguay and Mexico, are following exactly what El Salvador did, and more countries from other parts of the world will follow.
People don't understand that global adoption doesn't mean that you will be able to buy coffee or beer with Bitcoin, but you will use as back up especially when current fiat currencies crash and burn in near future.

There's a difference between adopting Bitcoin and legalizing it. Yes, you can make it legal to use Bitcoin, but will there be places to use it, you know like... locally? It could surely provide a great way to purchase from the other side of the Earth, but locally, it'd be better to use your nation currency. It's faster, it costs less to make a transaction, you don't have to dedicate some hundreds of hours understanding how it works and it'd be better for you to spend it now, rather than keep it.

Better ask Venezuela, Nigeria and other countries that had hyperinflation can they buy something with their local currencies, they are faster and you can use them to warm up if you are freezing in winter.
Bitcoin will never be used as main currency in any country, just like you are not using gold or silver to buy anything (you could do it unofficially) but they still value more than fiat and paper money.

[ShowOff]

If bitcoin did reach global adoption, then any price swings would be minimal. With such a huge amount of liquidity, anyone could dump a huge amount of coin on the market without dropping the price,

Sorry @o_e_l_e_o, I don't really understand how bitcoin will have a relatively stable price/ the price drop to a minimum when it reach global adoption while we know that bitcoin price is quite volatile long ago. So far I only know that every bitcoin sold in large quantities will affect the price quickly and the price will drop temporarily.

Bitcoin will never be used as main currency in any country, just like you are not using gold or silver to buy anything (you could do it unofficially) but they still value more than fiat and paper money.

In my opinion, this opinion may be quite relevant to the condition and habit of the people who use the payment system. Even though bitcoin is legalized, it will not be the main mean of payment/ currency used by people anywhere and can be equated with gold or other valuable that have been legalized as a mean of payment before.

[BlackHatCoiner]

People don't understand that global adoption doesn't mean that you will be able to buy coffee or beer with Bitcoin, but you will use as back up especially when current fiat currencies crash and burn in near future.

This is what I explain in the first sentence of the OP. There's no standard definition for global adoption; anyone can assume their own.

Better ask Venezuela, Nigeria and other countries that had hyperinflation can they buy something with their local currencies, they are faster and you can use them to warm up if you are freezing in winter.

Look, I get you, I'm just not quite convinced that a digital commodity with a hierarchical structure and with a very volatile market price can be used as a medium of exchange. I find LN really cool as a solution to the scaling issue, but there are lots of people believing that due to its existence, it can be globally adopted as a medium of exchange.

Then, there are people like you and me who see it more as a long-term store of value.

Sorry @o_e_l_e_o, I don't really understand how bitcoin will have a relatively stable price/ the price drop to a minimum when it reach global adoption while we know that bitcoin price is quite volatile long ago. So far I only know that every bitcoin sold in large quantities will affect the price quickly and the price will drop temporarily.

o_e_l_e_o probably takes it for granted that the island will someday stop having newcomers. In that case, it'd surely be less volatile.

[o_e_l_e_o]

Sorry @o_e_l_e_o, I don't really understand how bitcoin will have a relatively stable price/ the price drop to a minimum when it reach global adoption while we know that bitcoin price is quite volatile long ago. So far I only know that every bitcoin sold in large quantities will affect the price quickly and the price will drop temporarily.

The bitcoin market is still relatively tiny, and smaller markets are more volatile. At present, a single large investor can move the price enough to trigger a bunch of stop losses and set off a large cascade resulting in a significant price shift. If we ever reach the point where a majority of people in the world are using bitcoin, then the relative power of any single user falls enough that this is no longer possible. Sure, we will still have price fluctuations, but a fluctuation of $100 a day when the price is $100,000 doesn't really matter compared to the same fluctuation at the price of $1000. Plus if we ever reach the point that bitcoin is the dominant global currency, then people will stop thinking of bitcoin in terms of how much fiat it is worth and simply think of 1 BTC = 1 BTC.

There's a great discussion from Andreas Antonopoulos about this in 2 minutes starting here: https://youtu.be/6IDzpvmGzxo?t=2520

o_e_l_e_o probably takes it for granted that the island will someday stop having newcomers. In that case, it'd surely be less volatile.

Not necessarily. If you have 1000 people using bitcoin and 1000 more arrive, then that is a huge shock to the system. If you have a billion people using bitcoin and 1000 more arrive, it makes no difference at all.

[topbitcoin]

From what i see, some people always think global adoption is bitcoin be used as payment. We can see if a person create thread about it, it always directly to aim about it and maybe bitcoin replace fiat. Global adoption, is only when people know and use bitcoin no matter what it will be used. As investment for example, it is already considered global adoption because people all over the world can use bitcoin as much as they want.