AirGap wallet- Self custody made simple and secure - Protect your crypto offline

[NotATether]

So if I set up a social recovery option, and then AirGap wallet with all its services ceases to exist 5-10 years from now,
~

How does that even affect funds recovery though, because the Airgap tools are open-source so there is no risk of them disappearing anywhere (as opposed to, say, an exchange or closed-source wallet).

[Pmalek]

How does that even affect funds recovery though, because the Airgap tools are open-source so there is no risk of them disappearing anywhere (as opposed to, say, an exchange or closed-source wallet).

I didn't mean disappear with your money and take it from the users. They said that their scheme and implementation isn't compatible with anything else. So if you set up a social recovery option on AirGap, Airgap is the only software that works with that system. Electrum is open-source, but you can no longer connect old versions to Electrum servers. It's for your own security, but I am just making a point.

My question is what is going to happen with a scheme that is incompatible with any software/hardware wallet we know today if tomorrow everybody at AirGap abandons ship and the wallet simply dies? I got the answer that someone would have to create their own software supporting the social recovery feature and hope it works. That's what I expected to hear as well. 

[AirGap_Wallet]

There are 2 reasons why we called the feature "Social Recovery" instead of "Shamir's Secret Sharing".

Both reasons you mentioned are proof that people should not use and trust any form of Shamir's Secret Sharing.
Lack is clear standards and confusion between different implementations are big disadvantages, and this was never widely accepted by bitcoin community.
Sure it can be better in some cases than holding simple paper with seed words, but this could be mitigated with one or more passphrases.
Adding extra complexity with obscure incompatible system is no go for me, and until I see compatibility with other wallets I don't think it's safe enough to use Airgap wallet social feature.

Lack of clear standards was indeed a problem. But the new SSKR standard is here to solve that. While it's currently not widely used, there are multiple implementations available in case one project shuts down. And adoption will probably improve over time (it's a very new standard).

The use cases for passphrases and Shamir's are very different. But even if you could somehow "replicate" some kind of social recovery feature by using passphrases, that wouldn't be a standard either, and you then have to make sure you remember how to recover it.

And you have to differentiate between not being able to recover your seed in case a project ceases to exist, and having to put some effort into recovering your seed. Our code is open source, so you will always be able to recover it, it's just not as easy as downloading a different app.

But as I said, we do want to build on standards, and now that there is one (SSKR), we'll add support for it in the near future.

[dkbit98]

Lack of clear standards was indeed a problem. But the new SSKR standard is here to solve that. While it's currently not widely used, there are multiple implementations available in case one project shuts down. And adoption will probably improve over time (it's a very new standard).

Trezor and some other wallets are using Secret Shamir Sharing for years but I don't see general acceptance from community like it happened with their BIP39 proposal.
I doubt this is going to popular with one universal standard, because there are clear flaws in this concept, so it's more likely we are going to see something totally new instead.

I prefer multisig setup, so my question is does Airgap wallet support multisig setup and can it be combined with Electrum and other hardware wallets for this?

[AirGap_Wallet]

Trezor and some other wallets are using Secret Shamir Sharing for years but I don't see general acceptance from community like it happened with their BIP39 proposal.
I doubt this is going to popular with one universal standard, because there are clear flaws in this concept, so it's more likely we are going to see something totally new instead.

Could you elaborate on the clear disadvantages of Shamir's Secret Sharing? The only downside I see is the complexity of the implementation, which leaves room for error and can decrease security if not implemented right. For this reason, we will also add other schemes like SeedXOR and Hamming Backups, which are much simpler and leave less room for error.

In my personal opinion, the reason that SLIP39 did not get a lot of traction was because it is not compatible with BIP39. What I mean by this is that it's not possible to take a BIP39 mnemonic, then split it up into SLIP39 shares and get back your BIP39 mnemonic (=> no "roundtrips" are possible). SSKR is compatible with BIP39 mnemonics. From a wallet developer perspective, adding SLIP39 is more work because it often isn't compatible with the existing architecture of the app. But SSKR can basically just be added as a small add-on, then once the BIP39 mnemonic is recovered, the app can be used as usual. But I guess only time will tell what happens around adoption of those standards.

I prefer multisig setup, so my question is does Airgap wallet support multisig setup and can it be combined with Electrum and other hardware wallets for this?

Multisig has advantages over Shamirs', the most important is that there is no one "single point of failure", because the keys can be distributed while signing. The one important downside in this context is that multisig isn't chain agnostic. Bitcoin supports multisig "natively", but for most other chains, smart contracts have to be used for multisig. So it's not possible to have a generic multisig implementation, but it is possible with Shamirs' because it works on a mnemonic level.

AirGap Vault does support multisig because it supports signing PSBTs. To do this, you'll have to use it with a watch-only wallet like Sparrow, Specter or BlueWallet. Please note that we didn't officially announce the support for multisig just yet, because we would like to add some additional functionality to make it more secure (eg. being able to register co-signers in the Vault to verify change addresses, which currently can't be done). This is on our roadmap and will hopefully come sometime in Q1.

[dkbit98]

Could you elaborate on the clear disadvantages of Shamir's Secret Sharing? The only downside I see is the complexity of the implementation, which leaves room for error and can decrease security if not implemented right. For this reason, we will also add other schemes like SeedXOR and Hamming Backups, which are much simpler and leave less room for error.

Yes I can, and I wrote more about it one of my topics called Multisig VS Shamir Secret Sharing, so I don't want to repeat myself.
You can clearly see the pros and cons for both of them, and I provided links for reference, but I also listened to comments of some crypto security experts about this subject.

AirGap Vault does support multisig because it supports signing PSBTs. To do this, you'll have to use it with a watch-only wallet like Sparrow, Specter or BlueWallet. Please note that we didn't officially announce the support for multisig just yet, because we would like to add some additional functionality to make it more secure (eg. being able to register co-signers in the Vault to verify change addresses, which currently can't be done). This is on our roadmap and will hopefully come sometime in Q1.

OK good to hear, maybe you should write more about it when it's ready.
There is general lack of mobile wallets that support multisig, and I constantly see people are asking for this.
Can you post link or screenshot for AirGap roadmap?

[Pearson12]

Catch up with what we did at AirGap in 2022

[Pearson12]

Check out the new AirGap Crypto Shop

Visit AirGap Shop

[SFR10]

https://i.ibb.co/Gxvs488/0-d5-RGr-Dsm1xjbp2r-G.png

Check out the new AirGap Crypto Shop

The starter kit comes at a very attractive price, but if I were you, I would've sent a sample to "Jameson Lopp" for performing various stress tests and publishing the results ^{[might come in handy in attracting customers]}: Metal Bitcoin Seed Storage Reviews

[dkbit98]

Check out the new AirGap Crypto Shop

This is is great price for two stainless steel plates and engraving pen in starter kit, but I am interested to see how durable would engraving hold compared to all other stainless steal plates.
I would support suggestion from SFR10 and you should really send your plates to Jameson Lopp who is testing them all the time, and maybe he finds some weak spots.
My favorite backup solution is stainless steal washers that are cheap and durable, but I think AirGap Recovery Plate can easily compete with competition.

[Pmalek]

<Snip>

$25 is a good price for two metal seed plates especially if they pass all the durability testing with flying colors. Free shipping worldwide is a highly commendable option you have given your customers. I am not sure about the t-shirts though. I don't see a big market for that.

Your shop accepts payments via credit cards and a stablecoin I have never heard of called uUSD. Do you have any plans to support bitcoin or some of the more popular altcoins? PayPal would also be a good option for those not comfortable entering their credit card details in a random website.

On a different note, the link in your post doesn't take us to the shop. It takes us to your Twitter page announcing the shop, and from there we get the link to the shop. Maybe it would be better if the link took us to the AirGap shop directly.

[Pearson12]

AirGap add support for Sapling on Tezos mainnet

Your shop accepts payments via credit cards and a stablecoin I have never heard of called uUSD. Do you have any plans to support bitcoin or some of the more popular altcoins? PayPal would also be a good option for those not comfortable entering their credit card details in a random website.

uUSD is a stable coin issued on the Tezos blockchain. YOU can learn more here: Youves
Bitcoin and other altcoins are possible. I will forward this suggestion to our devs.

On a different note, the link in your post doesn't take us to the shop. It takes us to your Twitter page announcing the shop, and from there we get the link to the shop. Maybe it would be better if the link took us to the AirGap shop directly.

Thanks. I added an extra link to the post.

[Pearson12]

AirGap adds support for the Internet Computer Protocol

[Pearson12]

We just launched AirGap Knox: AirGap Knox is the final piece of the puzzle for AirGap Vault

[Pmalek]

<Snip>

Does Airgap Knox keep the phone permanently in offline mode with no option for the user to bypass it and turn connectivity on again? Or can I simply turn it off with a click of a button and connect my phone to the internet if I please? As I understood, Knox is a device manager, but a closed-source one, which might not suite many people. Has anyone tested and verified the safety and authenticity of the software?

[so98nn]

I have literally had one device of the ledger and another wallet installed on my phone for a very long time. I never stumbled upon your thread or was not around this section a lot to know this one. I will surely use this software to turn my old device into a hardware wallet. My method of doing it air-gapped is very simple, you turn it off and don't turn it on until you want the funds out of it. Lolz. Very poor method to work with it but so far it's far better than my ledger. I lost the ledger once and also found it but obviously one could not forget the big old mobile device laying around which just lost.

I will graciously download the AirGap Knox on my device which I have dedicated for the same purpose mentioned. I will try to turn it into a hardware wallet with your guide and hopefully will write down a review here or in the new thread itself. Thanks for this.

[Pmalek]

I will surely use this software to turn my old device into a hardware wallet. My method of doing it air-gapped is very simple, you turn it off and don't turn it on until you want the funds out of it.

That's not how airgapping works, and your phone won't be airgapped just because you turned off the internet and other connectivity. You have to wipe the system first and reset it to factory settings. After that, you install this Knoq solution while configuring your phone, and you never go on the Internet again.

Very poor method to work with it but so far it's far better than my ledger. I lost the ledger once and also found it but obviously one could not forget the big old mobile device laying around which just lost.

You losing your stuff isn't a measure of the quality of those items. You can rightly argue you don't like Ledger for their closed-source nature, poor built quality, the database hacks, etc. But they have nothing to do with you misplacing the device.

It's like saying my new Nike sneakers are awful because they fell off my balcony. I don't like them anymore.

[Pearson12]

Does Airgap Knox keep the phone permanently in offline mode with no option for the user to bypass it and turn connectivity on again? Or can I simply turn it off with a click of a button and connect my phone to the internet if I please? As I understood, Knox is a device manager, but a closed-source one, which might not suite many people. Has anyone tested and verified the safety and authenticity of the software?

Knox is a device manager built on Android Enterprise. It disables all forms of connectivity on an OS level ( this is what you don't get by turning your network off & on). so when using Knox you do not have to worry about those kinds of stuff getting on by mistake, in fact, with knox, you only have access to AirGap Vault on your device.

Here are other videos/blog that better explain how to set up knox and what it is.

How to setup AirGap knox: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SB4Rq6RlaIs

How AirGap knox looks and feels: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0NL5W_gqy8

https://medium.com/airgap-it/airgaps-newest-product-airgap-knox-3dbf7592533f

[Pearson12]

I will graciously download the AirGap Knox on my device which I have dedicated for the same purpose mentioned. I will try to turn it into a hardware wallet with your guide and hopefully will write down a review here or in the new thread itself. Thanks for this.

Thanks, man, we are looking forward to your review of the entire AirGap solution. Just to clarify, Knox is a device manager, while the AirGap Vault is the center of the AirGap solution that keeps your funds offline. BTW, Knox only works with AirGap Vault.

[dkbit98]

We just launched AirGap Knox: AirGap Knox is the final piece of the puzzle for AirGap Vault

This looks interesting, and I would consider testing how this works with another older smartphone device I have, but than I saw this should be paid $35.90 and I am not sure if source code can be verified.

Can AirGap Knox be installed on any Android devices, included devices with custom ROM's or Pixel phones that operate with GrapheneOS (not that I would do that), or stock Android must be used?
Correct me if I am wrong but I think we can achieve something similar to disable everything on software level, and for little more money we can already buy brand new hardware wallets.
One more question... can AirGap Knox be removed from device and how?