How the Government made you fat

[Poker Player]

In the same line as my other thead about Vitamin D, today I am going to talk about something else that I don't believe about what the government and experts recommend us.

I will mainly follow the ideas presented in this video: How the Government Made You Fat which is not made by a kid streaming from his mum's basement but by Dr Bret Scher MD and that is in line with many others, perhaps the most notable being Dr Jason Fung. Some of his ideas will also appear in what I am about to discuss.

In 1977 the US Government first set dietary guidelines. The average american male weighed 170 pounds, he now weights 197 pounds, and it's similar for women and kids. The percentage of americans diagnosed with type-2 diabetes has risen from 2% 1977 to over 9% in 2015

How did this happen? It all started in the 1950s, Ancel Keys published a biased study: The Seven Countries Study that determined that saturated fats were the main cause of heart problems. At that time, not much importance was given to the problems that tobacco could cause on the cardiac system: Cigarettes were once ‘physician’ tested, approved.

So the conclusion was simple: lower your fat intake and you'll lower your heart disease risk.

But there was only one problem: Keys' study was bad science. The sample size was very small and he did cherry-picking, leaving out countries like France with high consumption of saturated fats and low rates of heart problems.

The food pyramid was created. As americans started eating less saturated fat, they in turn started eating more supposedly healthy grains, sugars, and most importantly, they started eating more frequently. Total calories consumption increased. Foods that are high in sugar stimulate the reward centers in the brains, making us want to eat more, unlike fats that stimulate the secretion of leptin, the satiety hormone, therefore making us eat less.

The result is a fatter population with greater and greater health issues.

As in the case of Vitamin D, where the experts' recommendation to hide from the sun was followed by a sustained increase in melanoma cases, the experts' nutritional recommendations were followed by a sustained increase in weight in the population and diseases derived from this weight increase.

The conclusion I reach is simple: don't rely on the government to take care of you. Take responsibility for your own health.

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[Gyfts]

Yeah, it's kinda like how way back all the nutritionists demonized fats but then the food companies started loading up on sugar, because "zero fat! was the eye catching headline. Then high fructose corn syrup became dirt cheap and they loaded up every food on the planet with sugary syrup. Even if you look towards government for nutritional advise (imagine doing that), how are they going control Americans from shoving burgers and chips down their gullet? Don't trust them for much.

[Natsuu]

I will mainly follow the ideas presented in this video: How the Government Made You Fat which is not made by a kid streaming from his mum's basement but by Dr Bret Scher MD.....

I Laugh hard at this lmao. Its like I already know who are you referring to exactly.

All jokes aside, I don't think the study matters right now as it is 44 years ago. The study is not even valid for references in recent studies for dietary purposes. But I do get the point that the stats really proves that it is not coincidence, but is correlational in which the study is directly correlated to the increase of diabetes diagnosed US citizen.

And I agree that, we should take care of our own health, Plus you can reference a lot of studies right now which have same results which validates their arguments.

[Charles-Tim]

I do not really understand this, but I do not know the dietary guildline set by United State...but with what has been researched about, too much fat consumption is not good for the body, while also too much protein.

The most potent nutrient in the body that can result to weight gain is sugar which mostly are the breakdown of starch in the diet, but it is not only glucose but others are also responsible, others primary sugar (fructose and galactose) which carbohydrates can be broken down into with the aid of gastrointestinal enzymes and are absorbed through the intestine into the blood stream then to be used to power (give energy to) the body and the remaining stored in the body, while many will undergo conversion process.

Aside that, body sugar can undergo the process of lipogenesis by converting into lipid and be stored in the body, also resulting to increase in body weight (this is the most common way people are increasing their body weight this day) including the conversion of carbohydrates also into protein for body buildup. Carbohydrates are more potent to even increase the body weight if compared to fat or protein, but a healthy diet must just still content 65% to 70% carbohydrates which I can not start to explain why than saying even too much fat (even healthy ones) will buildup bad cholesterol in the body which is the main cause of heart diseases and many other diseases, also too much protein will result to nitrogen buildup in the body that can result to untimely death.

The best is to eat balance diet, but also exercising your body for good health

The macronutrient balance diets are in this percentage

• Carbohydrates 65-70 percent
• Protein 15-20 percent
• Fat 10-15 percent

Foods that are high in sugar stimulate the reward centers in the brains, making us want to eat more, unlike fats that stimulate the secretion of leptin, the satiety hormone, therefore making us eat less.

I hope you see how carbohydrates is very important in diet, but I do not know what you understand by this so far you eat balance diet, ones your food is made up of little fat and protein, the satiety center in the brain will surely be stimulated in which the person will be full and not able to wish to eat until the food as been disgeted and absorbed to certain level.

[Poker Player]

I do not really understand this,

You don't need to swear that. You are basically repeating the nutritional guidelines even though you recognize how carbohydrates are fattening:

The best is to eat balance diet, but also exercising your body for good health

The macronutrient balance diets are in this percentage

• Carbohydrates 65-70 percent
• Protein 15-20 percent
• Fat 10-15 percent

LOL

I hope you see how carbohydrates is very important in diet, but I do not know what you understand by this so far you eat balance diet, ones your food is made up of little fat and protein, the satiety center in the brain will surely be stimulated in which the person will be full and not able to wish to eat until the food as been disgeted and absorbed to certain level.

Not really. You eat the supposedly healthy cereal with skim milk for breakfast and after 2 hours you are hungry. You have fried eggs with bacon for breakfast and you last until noon

It should be noted that all fats are not equal, tran-hydrogenated fats, omega 6 are fats to be avoided.

[Charles-Tim]

It should be noted that all fats are not equal, tran-hydrogenated fats, omega 6 are fats to be avoided.

I am not implying all fats are equal, saturated fats are fats that do freeze, while unsaturated fats will become hard to freeze and it will not freeze at room temperature (25 degree celcius) like saturated ones. There are bad fats and good ones, the best are the unsaturated ones, that is why I like sesame seed oil and others like olive. There is also much to comment about this as unsaturated fats are better than one another.

About omega 6 fatty acids, I think you should read this:

Omega-6 fatty acids are used for reducing the risk of heart disease, lowering total cholesterol levels, lowering "bad" (LDL) cholesterol levels, raising "good" (HDL) cholesterol levels, and reducing cancer risk.

But the reason it is said not be be eating is maybe because it is present in food than omega 3, but yet very important in the body.

[Mauser]

Two more points I would add to become fat recently. The first is the pandemic, in my country all gyms where closed for a year, there was completely no indoor sport solution. The only chance you had was going running on the park, or riding a bike. I used to play football and tennis and go climbing from time to time. All this stopped overnight and I gained 10 kg since the start of the pandemic. The second point is the cheap foot in the super market with a lot of fat and carbs.

[Similificator]

With all the knowledge being easily accessible nowadays, a little confirmation of sources can give a lot of people benefits. And with all of these, it becomes quite easy to build dietary plans on whatever body type you have. Now we all know that too much of anything is never good which is why dozens of studies promote a balanced diet. If people only rely on information being fed to them without even doing their own research, then that would be their problem. They are basically letting big businesses take advantage of their gullibility at the expense of their health. These type of people are pitiful.

[Cnut237]

bad science.

This is certainly a part of the problem. Considered generally (regardless of this specific instance), there is a lot of political lobbying by companies that push unhealthy foods, and there are also plenty of studies that are funded by these companies. Studies that are funded by, or that have links to, individuals and companies that have a vested interest in obtaining a specific outcome are of course not to be trusted.

Foods that are high in sugar stimulate the reward centers in the brains, making us want to eat more, unlike fats that stimulate the secretion of leptin, the satiety hormone, therefore making us eat less.

Separate from my point above, it's worth considering sugar from the perspective of evolutionary biology. Sugar gives you energy. Fructose encourages the body to build fat. And, crucially, sugar was comparatively rare. Those of the ancient humans who had a strong preference for sugar (presumably, although I'm not an expert, this is where the reward-centre-stimulation comes in) could build more fat, and were more able to survive the leaner times. Sugar preference conferred an advantage in natural selection. Slowly, sugar preference spread through the gene pool.
So nowadays, after untold generations of evolution and selection, we very abruptly reach the modern age, where there is a superabundance of all types of food. We have evolved to prefer sugar. But it is no longer scarce, so we tend to eat more of it than is good for us.

I certainly believe that governments and companies could do more to encourage healthy eating, but even if we were somehow able to make free choices without any outside influences, we'd still tend to over-consume sugar.

[jrrsparkles]

Behind all these things the medicine manufacturing companies are there and made different changes in different countries which will favour for them in the future that is what exactly we are facing after the 50 years. Every human spend huge part of their income to their medical expenses or atleast to their family member medical reason on the other side we taught to be slim and fit for that to take lot of medical supplements.

[suchmoon]

As much as I would like to blame the government for making me fat, it's quite obvious by now that eating too much shit (well, not literally) and not exercising enough is the reason, not what the government may or may not say. If you want the real culprit, juicy burger ads probably do more damage but in the grand scheme of things -  personal responsibility FTW.

[Poker Player]

As much as I would like to blame the government for making me fat, it's quite obvious by now that eating too much shit (well, not literally) and not exercising enough is the reason, not what the government may or may not say. If you want the real culprit, juicy burger ads probably do more damage but in the grand scheme of things -  personal responsibility FTW.

Precisely what you express is the mentality of the government. No wonder you don't blame them.

Dr. Jason Fung: "We Give This Horrific Advice to Eat Less & Move More. When They Fail, We Blame Them"

By the way, Dr. Fung is: "a kidney specialist in Toronto. He is currently the site chief of medicine at Scarborough General Hospital and the scientific editor of the Journal of Insulin Resistance." he is not a ridiculous conspiracy theorist like BADecker. He has several articles published in Pubmed on the subject.

[suchmoon]

Precisely what you express is the mentality of the government. No wonder you don't blame them.

Let me put it this way: I don't ever recall paying attention to what the government tells me to eat (if it ever did) and blaming it won't make me lose weight. Diet and exercise works fine for me.

Even your "Dr. Jason Fung" seems to advocate "intermittent fasting", but overall he sounds too much like one of those "my diet is the best" windbags. I doubt his method works perfectly for everyone.

[Charles-Tim]

As much as I would like to blame the government for making me fat, it's quite obvious by now that eating too much shit (well, not literally) and not exercising enough is the reason, not what the government may or may not say. If you want the real culprit, juicy burger ads probably do more damage but in the grand scheme of things -  personal responsibility FTW.

You have commented rightly more about this. Like I implied already in my previous post, exercise is needed also, we can not expect someone with sedentary job not to exercise and not becoming obessed, exercise is very important for normal healthily body function and to also still reduce the bad cholesterol in the body (the low density lipoproteins). According to scientific researches, it is clear that intake of sugar (carbohydrates generally) can make someone obessed, even it is one of the dietary nutrient that many fatty people reduce in their diet. But for normal healthy diet, it must contain at least 65-70% carbohydrates which is very important for the glycolytic process and bodily energy generation, while some are stored in liver and muscles. But the excess will be converted into fat and amino acids which may result to obesity. But someone that is exercising oneself will not be obessed as many of the sugar will be converted into pyruvate which will be used in the energy generation process, while many lactic acid generated also from sugar will be use in muscle buildup rather than lipogenesis (fat build up) and also amino acid generation which can later resulting to obesity.

[Gyfts]

As much as I would like to blame the government for making me fat, it's quite obvious by now that eating too much shit (well, not literally) and not exercising enough is the reason, not what the government may or may not say. If you want the real culprit, juicy burger ads probably do more damage but in the grand scheme of things -  personal responsibility FTW.

You have commented rightly more about this. Like I implied already in my previous post, exercise is needed also, we can not expect someone with sedentary job not to exercise and not becoming obessed, exercise is very important for normal healthily body function and to also still reduce the bad cholesterol in the body (the low density lipoproteins). According to scientific researches, it is clear that intake of sugar (carbohydrates generally) can make someone obessed, even it is one of the dietary nutrient that many fatty people reduce in their diet. But for normal healthy diet, it must contain at least 65-70% carbohydrates which is very important for the glycolytic process and bodily energy generation, while some are stored in liver and muscles. But the excess will be converted into fat and amino acids which may result to obesity. But someone that is exercising oneself will not be obessed as many of the sugar will be converted into pyruvate which will be used in the energy generation process, while many lactic acid generated also from sugar will be use in muscle buildup rather than lipogenesis (fat build up) and also amino acid generation which can later resulting to obesity.

Trust me when I say there isn't a human in the first world that has any problem getting carbohydrates for glycolysis. Carbs are so abundant that we have such a tough time keeping them away, and seeing that just about every food is loaded with sugars or sugary syrups (high fructose corn syrup), you can't avoid it. You don't even need to exercise, just keep away sugars, get in a lot of protein (protein has a high satiety value, in fact, carbs on the other hand don't make you feel full, yet they're high in kcals).

Ketosis works as well (keto diet, low carb), metabolically all the fats you eat get broken down into fatty acids and then thrown into a catabolic pathway, but you need to watch for your cholesterol. 

[Charles-Tim]

Carbs are so abundant that we have such a tough time keeping them away, and seeing that just about every food is loaded with sugars or sugary syrups (high fructose corn syrup), you can't avoid it.

The sugar that has really side effect is table suggar (sucrose) which which is broken down into glucose and fructose. I have seen nothing wrong with the most abundant in diet which is starch which is broken down into only glucose which is very important for cell functioning.

get in a lot of protein (protein has a high satiety value,

I have read a news of a woman in my country that is obessed, eating less amount of carbo, but more amount of protein intake. She suddenly died in her house one day. Doctor linked her death to nitrogen buildup in her blood body.

in fact, carbs on the other hand don't make you feel full, yet they're high in kcals).

Less than that of fat

1 gram of carbohydrates will produce 4 calories of energy
1 gram of protein will produce 4 calories of energy
1 gram of fat will produce 9 calories of energy

Ketosis works as well (keto diet, low carb), metabolically all the fats you eat get broken down into fatty acids and then thrown into a catabolic pathway, but you need to watch for your cholesterol.

To avoid stroke, myocardiac infarction, kidney failure, angina and many other high blood pressure (hypertensive) related diseases, fat should be the lowest consumed.
Even, if you check the traditional food intake, carbohydrates are more while protein and fat are also necessary but less taken in than carbohydrates. Although, African, Asian and American countries food intake slightly differs in this macro nutrients, but carbo are yet still more in the three. I am certain it will also still be more in European countries and Australia.

[Gyfts]

...

See here for satiety values - https://www.diabetesnet.com/food-diabetes/satiety-index/

Satiety values are not about calories, it just means how different foods will make you feel full. So carbohydrates (breads and pastas) are all empty calories that have don't make you feel satisfied, so you eat more and more. Leaner proteins, fish definitely, makes you feel full and the kcals aren't bad either. I haven't heard of elevated nitrogen levels just by eating a high protein diet, so that lady might've had other health conditions going for her. Plenty of people do high protein low carb diets with no problem.

[Charles-Tim]

There are two centers located in the hypothalamus of the brain that is responsible for food intake and satiation:

• feeding center
• satiety center

I do not have to talk in details about this centers as I believe you know about it already, but we should talk more about how the centers are regulated with food intake mechanism. In normal physiological condition, appetite, taken in of food and satiation are well balanced and are regulated by the following mechanism:

1. Glucostatic: The glucostatic cells of the satiety center are stimulated by glucose (increase in blood glucose level), which activates the satiety center which later makes the continuation of food intake result to feeling of fullness in which the feeding center is inhibited leading to someone no to be able to take in food. After some times, the blood glucose level will decrease, the satiety center will become inactive, so the feeding center will not longer be inhibited.

2. Lipostatic: a peptide secreted from fat cell (adipocyte) called leptin also have roles it plays by inhibiting the feeding center, this leads to loss of appetite, this is the only what you are emphasizing on.

3. Peptide: the by-products of protein. Some inhibit or stimulate the feeding centers. So it depends.

The body is so complicated than to just conclude that carbohydrates makes people to be hungry, if you have a balance diet of:
Carbohydrates 65-70 percent
Protein 15-20 percent
Fat 10-15 percent

you will be full and it will take time before the next hunger will set. Also making sure you are eating different varieties of foods and fruits that contain this macronutrients is very important.
Have you even heard of anabolic diet before? This is only recommended for people involved in sport and for muscle building for peak performance, not usual diet recommended for normal people.

And also ketogenic diet which is used in form of a treatment, especially use for certain type of epileptic treatment in children. This is not also usual diet that people should eat.

[Poker Player]

Let me put it this way: I don't ever recall paying attention to what the government tells me to eat (if it ever did) and blaming it won't make me lose weight. Diet and exercise works fine for me.

You can put it the way you want. This is not about what you recall or not , this is about facts.

Even your "Dr. Jason Fung" seems to advocate "intermittent fasting", but overall he sounds too much like one of those "my diet is the best" windbags. I doubt his method works perfectly for everyone.

What Dr. Fung says is that he started out telling people to eat less and move more, which is advice that does not work in more than 90% of cases. I would explain why but with that attitude you have of thinking you are right and that's it instead of being open to new ideas, I'm not going to waste my time.

Then he discovered fasting, which at first he thought was nonsense and low carbohydrate diets, which not only work much better than the garbage advice you and the government give, but has given spectacular results curing type 2 diabetes.

It's funny that you call him a windbag, which is an ad hominem that shows that you have no weighty arguments to refute what he says.

[Charles-Tim]

You can put it the way you want. This is not about what you recall or not , this is about facts.

Normally, is it the government only that will tell you everything? But I will never advice people for high fat diet. I just watch the video today, while the second link in the second paragraph was http and also unable to work. Did you know that according to scientific research, that eating cholesterol does not contribute to plasma cholesterol level in the body, it is fat intake that is resulting to high cholesterol level.

<...>

Obesity can not just be focused only on dietary intake, there are many other factors responsible for obesity

• gene
• process foods
• junk foods
• certain type of medication
• sedentary work and no exercise
• overeating
• eating too much of simple sugar, but I still recommend what I posted above but which focus more on complex sugar (starch)
• not exercising the body

You can not limit it to just eating of carbohydrates, it is also clear how fasting can help, some people will have to fast during certain period of the week which is helping.

There are different types of carbohydrates (primary, secondary and complex sugar), complex sugar like starch not does have much significant effects like you are thinking. Most foods Americans are eating today are processed foods which have highest calories and simple sugars. The recommended simple sugars are the ones contained in fruits (not processed foods) which have a unique way it combines and that will be helpful for the body.

You are talking about diabetes, you did not talk about how the world are not eating natural foods unlike before, now they are eating factory processed foods while many are made up of simple sugar.

You did not also talk about how our forefathers were active unlike the sedentary jobs of today.