Plagiarism: Where Do We Draw the Line?

[Pokapoka124]

Plagiarism destroys one’s reputation, the penalty is an immediate ban of the user. IMHO many newbies tend to plagiarise because they don't read the rules and guidelines.
“No idea is completely new, only evolving” Many writers get ideas and inspiration from other writers, but you cannot copy a chunk of sentences from another writer word for word without being accused of plagiarism. Paraphrasing doesn't help either. Plagiarism can be accidental or intentional. Example of intentional plagiarism is when a post is written in one language is rewritten in another and posted in local board without citing the original poster. I don’t quite know where the forum stands on accidental plagiarism. When newbies ( I use newbies as a case study because I believe they are more likely to plagiarise although I do not have the stats to prove that) are interested in a particular topic they gather all sorts of information, this may eventually cause problems distinguishing between common knowledge, facts and information that needs citation.

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[jackg]

Accidental probably depends on a few things. Really, the translator should have asked the user or posted a link to the original topic but tbh it's potentially something someone could get away with - or could explain their way out of (especially if the information is deemed useful in an accusatory or appeal topic).

[Charles-Tim]

Paraphrasing doesn't help either.

This is the problem with many newbies, they are actually plagiarizing but rephrasing, thinking it will not be known. The advice is to write post all off hand, or if using a site, the link should be included.

I don’t quite know where the forum stands on accidental plagiarism.

It has to be indicated that it is translated from certain site with link(s) included, else it is plagiarism that supposed to result to ban.

[logfiles]

It's all in black and white. If someone knows that they are copy information from someone or somewhere else, then the link to the source of the information is a must, to show that you are not passing the information as your own. There's no in between if you don't want to get your account banned for plagiarism.

[PrimeNumber7]

Plagiarism destroys your reputation, the penalty is an immediate ban of the user. IMHO many newbies tend to plagiarise because they don't read the rules and guidelines.

There is no reason why someone should need a rule to tell them not to plagiarize. Your argument is akin to saying that people steal because they don't know it is against the law.

Many writers get ideas from other writers, but you cannot copy a chunk of sentences from another writer without being accused of plagiarism. Paraphrasing doesn't help either. Copy and paste isn't wrong but claiming work as your own is.

This is not a new concept. When writing a post if you are writing something that is not your original thoughts and words, you need to cite the author in some way. The forum does not require citations to be made in any specific way.

I don’t quite know where the forum stands on accidental plagiarism.

I would describe "accidental plagiarism" the same way I would describe someone who claims to have accidentally walked out of Target without paying for something: they did something wrong intentionally and claimed it was an accident when they were caught.

[crwth]

You know it's highly unethical trying to copy someone else's work and pass it as your own. No matter what industry you are in, whether you are in scientific research, agriculture, energy industry, or any kind of industry that users write a bunch of stuff. There's already a line and that's creating your own or copying one exact point on it. Unless you are going to point the credits or reference towards the original writer.

It's basically a form of theft. Is it ethical?

[SquirrelJulietGarden]

Plagiarism destroys your reputation, the penalty is an immediate ban of the user.

That rule is applied since 2016 and destroys many members or farms. It works. I don't think it should be changed to be softer.

I had the curiosity at some point last year as to how far back in people’s history did the rules apply (see A couple of quick questions related to forum rules). The answer was that there is no delimited timeframe for rules to apply.

If I recall correctly, my curiosity was aroused when I checked the forum rules to see when rule 33 had been written:

- It was present at round November 2016 (rule number 33): https://web.archive.org/web/20161121133329/https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=703657.0
- But not in May 2016: https://web.archive.org/web/20160506061123/https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=703657.0

Of course, these rules are basically a privately applied based guideline, and obviously can apply to whatever timeframe the Forum wishes, with disregard to the fact that the rule infringement may have been committed prior to the rule being stated.

The fact that the rule on plagiarism (for example) seems not to have been introduced until somewhere between May and November 2016 could be controversial with regards people being banned for plagiarism committed before that period. On the other hand, we could understand that all rules are fully retroactive and that’s it. I personally would prefer a 3 year timeframe or so, but that’s all it is, a personal preference. 

IMHO many newbies tend to plagiarise because they don't read the rules and guidelines.

If you join a forum, use a service, use an exchange, and don't read rules, Term of service, you are taking risk.

When you break rules, and restrictions drop on your account, you have to accept it.

[mk4]

Sort of "accidental" plagiarism should be really uncommon; especially if the statement was something really really common.

For example: "A hardware wallet is the best option for holding your cryptocurrencies long-term". While I literally just wrote that myself right now with no intent of copying anyone, I wouldn't be surprised if the same exact line was posted at least once in the past on some article or forum post. Obviously this shouldn't be bannable simply because it's very common information.

[The Sceptical Chymist]

Plagiarism can be accidental or intentional. Example of intentional plagiarism is when a post is written in one language is rewritten in another and posted in local board without citing the original poster.

And blah blah blah.  OP, are you trying to get merits here?  All I'm seeing is a bloated post that's going over everything most members of the forum know about, especially those who read threads in Meta.  In addition to that, it'd be better if newbies just read the rules before making their first post.

Why didn't you post this in Beginners & Help?  It would seem more appropriate in that section if you're trying to warn newcomers, but my guess is that your signature campaign doesn't pay for posts in B&H (though I could be wrong).

In any case, pretty much everyone knows what stealing someone else's words means, whether it's paraphrasing, using a text spinner, or doing a simple copy/paste.  There's no need for a thread like this.

[Pokapoka124]

And blah blah blah.  OP, are you trying to get merits here?  All I'm seeing is a bloated post that's going over everything most members of the forum know about, especially those who read threads in Meta.  In addition to that, it'd be better if newbies just read the rules before making their first post.

It would be easier if newbies read the rules before posting but they don't obviously. Its like buying a device and not reading the manual. Mistakes are bound to happen. Same users do not read the terms and conditions before signing up

Why didn't you post this in Beginners & Help?  It would seem more appropriate in that section if you're trying to warn newcomers, but my guess is that your signature campaign doesn't pay for posts in B&H (though I could be wrong).

Thanks! Maybe B&H would be more suitable for this kind of discussion. And yes you're wrong the purpose of this post wasn't to complete post quota.

In any case, pretty much everyone knows what stealing someone else's words means, whether it's paraphrasing, using a text spinner, or doing a simple copy/paste.  There's no need for a thread like this.

Then how do you explain the cases of users getting banned. If you strongly believe the thread is useless you could simply just ignore. No need to bump it further

[Pmalek]

"A hardware wallet is the best option for holding your cryptocurrencies long-term".

Obviously this shouldn't be bannable simply because it's very common information.

That's debatable to some point. What could be common knowledge to you, could be brand-new information to someone else.

Imagine this scenario:
A newbie registers a new account on Bitcointalk and starts a thread asking what bitcoin is and what it is good for? That's his first post. In his second post, he writes that same statement you did. The chances of him knowing about hardware wallets and best methods for long-term storage don't look so good if he is struggling with understanding what bitcoin is. It's not impossible that he heard about hardware wallets from some article or a video he saw and he remembers someone say something like that.

If that is the case, did he try to plagiarize and get away with it? Was it maybe unintentional? Is he trying to make it seem like the statement is originally his or does he just have a good memory and remembered the words with no intention to plagiarize? I wouldn't want to be the one making the final decision. 

[DdmrDdmr]

Plagiarism destroys your reputation, the penalty is an immediate ban of the user.

More than reputation, it’s one’s stay on the forum, once he is actually discovered, which could even be months or years down the road to the plagiarist’s dismay.

IMHO many newbies tend to plagiarise because they don't read the rules and guidelines.

They tend to plagiarize in order to cut corners for one reason or another. Most will likely do it deliberately in order to pass the text as theirs, possibly not aware of the penalty on the forum, but likely with the said intent. There may be others that post something believing that they are being informative, not being aware thay they need to cite the source here.

Perhaps though, there is wiggle room to make it manifestly clear, by including a clear reminder when creating a new post (something along the line of what is mentioned in rule 33 + the example, and emphasizing on referencing the source). This has been commented before on multiple occasions, is seemingly easy to do, and shows some good will to trim the number of cases we recurrently see. Nobody would be able to claim ignorance from there on, which is what we often read.

[FIFA worldcup]

And blah blah blah.  OP, are you trying to get merits here?  All I'm seeing is a bloated post that's going over everything most members of the forum know about, especially those who read threads in Meta.  In addition to that, it'd be better if newbies just read the rules before making their first post.

It would be easier if newbies read the rules before posting but they don't obviously. Its like buying a device and not reading the manual. Mistakes are bound to happen. Same users do not read the terms and conditions before signing up

Why didn't you post this in Beginners & Help?  It would seem more appropriate in that section if you're trying to warn newcomers, but my guess is that your signature campaign doesn't pay for posts in B&H (though I could be wrong).

Thanks! Maybe B&H would be more suitable for this kind of discussion. And yes you're wrong the purpose of this post wasn't to complete post quota.

In any case, pretty much everyone knows what stealing someone else's words means, whether it's paraphrasing, using a text spinner, or doing a simple copy/paste.  There's no need for a thread like this.

Then how do you explain the cases of users getting banned. If you strongly believe the thread is useless you could simply just ignore. No need to bump it further

Many new people come to the forum every day and this information might be useful for them. It does not matter if we know it already, there might be someone who does not know it and it helps. Even if this OP post, help one person, its useful. 

[mk4]

That's debatable to some point. What could be common knowledge to you, could be brand-new information to someone else.

Imagine this scenario:
A newbie registers a new account on Bitcointalk and starts a thread asking what bitcoin is and what it is good for? That's his first post. In his second post, he writes that same statement you did. The chances of him knowing about hardware wallets and best methods for long-term storage don't look so good if he is struggling with understanding what bitcoin is. It's not impossible that he heard about hardware wallets from some article or a video he saw and he remembers someone say something like that.

If that is the case, did he try to plagiarize and get away with it? Was it maybe unintentional? Is he trying to make it seem like the statement is originally his or does he just have a good memory and remembered the words with no intention to plagiarize? I wouldn't want to be the one making the final decision. 

While it's quite weird for a newbie to ask a super beginner question and then making statements on secure hardware wallets, yes, things like this will almost always be debatable. And it will always be up to the moderator/admin to make the judgement. I assume most of the plagiarism bans are those who pretty much copy-paste a full article anyway, rather than these potentially-unintentional cases.

Fortunately, people can create a temporary alt account for an appeal, and if he/she posted it publicly, I guess people could also state their opinions.

[Pmalek]

Perhaps though, there is wiggle room to make it manifestly clear, by including a clear reminder when creating a new post (something along the line of what is mentioned in rule 33 + the example, and emphasizing on referencing the source). This has been commented before on multiple occasions, is seemingly easy to do, and shows some good will to trim the number of cases we recurrently see. Nobody would be able to claim ignorance from there on, which is what we often read.

Any kind of welcome message would be better than nothing at all. If it were up to me, I would display a notification whenever brand-new and newbie accounts try to post something. That should inform them about two things: plagiarism and spamming. That notification should be visible for either a set number of days or until they reach Jr. Member rank for example.

[virasog]

Perhaps though, there is wiggle room to make it manifestly clear, by including a clear reminder when creating a new post (something along the line of what is mentioned in rule 33 + the example, and emphasizing on referencing the source). This has been commented before on multiple occasions, is seemingly easy to do, and shows some good will to trim the number of cases we recurrently see. Nobody would be able to claim ignorance from there on, which is what we often read.

Any kind of welcome message would be better than nothing at all. If it were up to me, I would display a notification whenever brand-new and newbie accounts try to post something. That should inform them about two things: plagiarism and spamming. That notification should be visible for either a set number of days or until they reach Jr. Member rank for example.

Nice suggestion. It may not 100% eliminate Plagiarism but still it will give a message to the one who are ignorant.

By the way do we have any data that newbie are the ones who do Plagiarism or higher members of the forum also do the same mistake also ?

[GeorgeJohn]

Plagiarism is totally a copy and paste of already existing work which everyone is aware of, so members or users that are into plagiarism only think of their upliftment or benefit alone, the reason while majority of them associate into altitude of yours its because they need to be mentioned, known and also make their work to be perfect, so narrating or using it via bitcointalk community here, the objective of uses who indulged in such is to earn a huge merits that will elevate them. So not knowing that plagiarism is not a work of initiative, right now a plagiarism can be called a setback from my principles of understanding of plagiarism.

[mk4]

Any kind of welcome message would be better than nothing at all. If it were up to me, I would display a notification whenever brand-new and newbie accounts try to post something. That should inform them about two things: plagiarism and spamming. That notification should be visible for either a set number of days or until they reach Jr. Member rank for example.

I'm not 100% sure, but I'm really certain that I and a good number of people have made this suggestion already far back in the past. I mean, it really wouldn't hurt to display a small modal with links concerning the rules and plagiarism after a user just created a new account.

[kxwhalexk]

There are plagiarism problems in every forum, but the rules and censorship of each forum are different.
bitcointalk is the toughest forum I have ever met，Even so, I don’t think the punishment for plagiarism should be reduced

If a person wants to learn from bitcointalk, then even if they are not familiar with the rules, they are blocked because of plagiarism.they can still read posts without registering an account

If they just want to cheat some merits for bounty, then they should be banned

[DdmrDdmr]

<…> By the way do we have any data that newbie are the ones who do Plagiarism or higher members of the forum also do the same mistake also ?

Not really, at least it’s not available publicly. Reports are not typified, so even quantifying by categorization involves a lot of manual work, which I doubt is going to be performed.

There is an old thread on ban appeals (see https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5144410.0) which shows many cases appealing due to plagiarism, but the view is completely skewed, since normally only accounts with a certain rank appeal and have an option to reverse the situation (very thin though, it at all).

Bear in mind that plagiarism could crop up at any time, so a Legendary, for example, could be banned now for what he did as a Newbie, if caught.