Huge financial firm NCR to acquire BTC ATM operator and POS firm LibertyX

[OROBTC]

...

LibertyX is that company that struck a deal with CVS and 7-Eleven to allow buying BTC for cash.  They are apparently the largest BTM operator as well.  Link:

https://bitcoinmagazine.com/business/ncr-acquires-bitcoin-atm-provider-libertyx

[DaveF]

Looking at the map https://libertyx.com/a/buy-bitcoin/locations they do seem to have a lot of ATMs

Their machines are not listed on coinatmradar.com and other BTM locator sites.
However, some of their listed locations used to be with another company that WAS listed on locator sites BUT NO LONGER ARE.

So for whatever reason, they do not want to be listed.
Very strange. Wonder if that will change under the NCR.

-Dave

[SFR10]

In statements, NCR said it plans to offer LibertyX’s software solutions to banks, retailers and restaurants through the company’s existing software wallet and mobile applications.

CMIIW, but all of the current LibertyX's machines would remain unchanged, and the integration part would only be from NCR's side?

Their machines are not listed on coinatmradar.com and other BTM locator sites.
~Snippped~
So for whatever reason, they do not want to be listed.
Very strange. Wonder if that will change under the NCR.

You're right! I found a piece of "information" that suggests they were listed ^{[on coinatmradar]} in the past, but for some weird reasons, that's no longer the case.

[avikz]

...

LibertyX is that company that struck a deal with CVS and 7-Eleven to allow buying BTC for cash.  They are apparently the largest BTM operator as well.  Link:

https://bitcoinmagazine.com/business/ncr-acquires-bitcoin-atm-provider-libertyx

Well the bitcoin market is the best quality blueberry cheesecake and everyone wants a slice of it. This is the second news of today where corporates have shown interest into bitcoin market. First is Aramco's plan to mine bitcoin using their petroleum by-products and now this one!

But it's good that NCR is not participating in bitcoin network directly but they are into facilitation business. So it's a little less risky for the market to be honest!

[DaveF]

So I tried it and bought some BTC (all you can do where I am) expensive, but not horrible.
They overpaid on the network fee but that could just be a customer service thing. Even if the blocks are empty if you send at 5 sat/b you know that it will be in the next block.

Process was start buy on app, get price that is fixed for a couple of hours, go to machine, put in cash, get BTC.

Question is, if I am in an area that allows buy & sell can I sell, or does it go by where you live?
Will have to check it out when I am in a different area.

-Dave

[jackg]

... expensive ...

Did you manage to work out how much the markup was? I feel that anything around 2.5-10% might be considered reasonable, especially if they'll hold the rate for a few hours.

And if you're not paying for the fee (directly) then it might be best them sending one that's a bit high for current market conditions - especially since the fees were really high a few months ago.

Process was start buy on app, get price that is fixed for a couple of hours, go to machine, put in cash, get BTC.

Is it easy to cancel a trade? If there's a crash or a rise is there some protection on that (for both ends) or do you think they'll just hold the rate where it was and assume any losses that come from that?

But it's good that NCR is not participating in bitcoin network directly but they are into facilitation business. So it's a little less risky for the market to be honest!

Most companies seem to be attempting to start small if at all in crypto so it's probably a good place for them to start too - it'll give them their own insights and data too on the market.

[DaveF]

Did you manage to work out how much the markup was? I feel that anything around 2.5-10% might be considered reasonable, especially if they'll hold the rate for a few hours.

It's 8% at the local ATMs
There are some that are farther away that were less, but for a test to throw $50 in a machine it was not worth the gas & time.

They give you a choice of 2 fees fast or slow that YOU pay.
There is no medium option or showing of fees just the USD amount. Slow was the 5 sat/b but did not know that till I looked at the TX after the fact. All I saw was the USD amount.

It's a 2 hour hold on the BTC / amount and not 1 second more.
There is no cancel option. Just start another buy.
AND
You have to go to the ATM you picked out from the app.
That screwed me up as I had to go to a customer in the other direction the 1st time I tried so I went to a different ATM.

-Dave

[Slow death]

I wonder if these bitcoin ATMs are profitable or not and how many people a day use these bitcoin ATMs and it is not necessary for governments to approve the installation of these bitcoin ATMs? can someone answer these questions? in my country the central bank controls all ATMs and it is not possible to install an ATM without the approval and license of the central bank

Did you manage to work out how much the markup was? I feel that anything around 2.5-10% might be considered reasonable, especially if they'll hold the rate for a few hours.

It's 8% at the local ATMs
There are some that are farther away that were less, but for a test to throw $50 in a machine it was not worth the gas & time.

They give you a choice of 2 fees fast or slow that YOU pay.
There is no medium option or showing of fees just the USD amount. Slow was the 5 sat/b but did not know that till I looked at the TX after the fact. All I saw was the USD amount.

It's a 2 hour hold on the BTC / amount and not 1 second more.
There is no cancel option. Just start another buy.
AND
You have to go to the ATM you picked out from the app.
That screwed me up as I had to go to a customer in the other direction the 1st time I tried so I went to a different ATM.

-Dave

from what I see it seems more advantageous to withdraw money from cex.io to the bank as the money arrives in an instant than using these bitcoins ATM

[jackg]

I wonder if these bitcoin ATMs are profitable or not and how many people a day use these bitcoin ATMs and it is not necessary for governments to approve the installation of these bitcoin ATMs? can someone answer these questions? in my country the central bank controls all ATMs and it is not possible to install an ATM without the approval and license of the central bank

If they're just in a shop and no ones paying rent on them then they're probably quite profitible (if the main costs are electricity and holding cash/crypto).

In the UK private individuals/companies can own atms. Debit cards are controlled by government regulations as they set limits on how much you can withdraw at an ATM, pay via contactless and pay to use the atm (you can't be charged now).

Most large supermarkets in Europe have exchange machines in them too to convert currencies (often at least the Euro to the local currency) and I doubt they need a license.

from what I see it seems more advantageous to withdraw money from cex.io to the bank as the money arrives in an instant than using these bitcoins ATM

Yeah but there's probably a use for them in some places. I think bank transfers in some countries are still quite slow - if you don't already have money in your account which might be the case.

It's 8% at the local ATMs
There are some that are farther away that were less, but for a test to throw $50 in a machine it was not worth the gas & time.

I think 8% is alright for what it is. The fee suggestions do seem a bit high then but that might just be to save funds as they'll need less customer support if there's a lower chance of transactions not being confirmed.

[SFR10]

They overpaid on the network fee but that could just be a customer service thing.

Slow was the 5 sat/b but did not know that till I looked at the TX after the fact. All I saw was the USD amount.

Their slow option, overpaid by "only" a few sats ^{[per byte]} at the time?

Process was start buy on app, get price that is fixed for a couple of hours, go to machine, put in cash, get BTC.

You have to go to the ATM you picked out from the app.

It has a lot of steps in comparison to some of the BTMs I've seen ^{[a bit cumbersome]}.

from what I see it seems more advantageous to withdraw money from cex.io to the bank as the money arrives in an instant than using these bitcoins ATM

Just to be clear, does it mean CEX offers RTP for all of their customers?

[DaveF]

They overpaid on the network fee but that could just be a customer service thing.

Slow was the 5 sat/b but did not know that till I looked at the TX after the fact. All I saw was the USD amount.

Their slow option, overpaid by "only" a few sats ^{[per byte]} at the time?

Yes, but at that point 1 sat/b would have made it into the next block.
AS OF THIS POST 1 sat/b will make it into the next block.
They have the USD rates as slow $0.13 and fast $0.20
So neither is a big deal, but who knows what happens when the blockchain gets filled again.

Depending on my mood, and free time, and where I am in relation to one of their ATMs I may or may not do a test when fees are a bit higher to see where they wind up.

Process was start buy on app, get price that is fixed for a couple of hours, go to machine, put in cash, get BTC.

You have to go to the ATM you picked out from the app.

It has a lot of steps in comparison to some of the BTMs I've seen ^{[a bit cumbersome]}.

Yes, but they have a NY BitLicense and have done all the financial / legal / reporting things that a financial business has to do, so they are a bit more structured.
No idea if it's all necessary but it probably makes the lawyers happy.

-Dave