Bitcoin assets cannot be blocked - is that helping terrorists?

[zanezane]

What can we do, we wanted a decentralized platform and the people that have malicious intent find a way to use it tho their malicious purposes. But for some terrorists, I don't think that they'll be using it though, bitcoin is easily traced if you have the manpower and equipment and dedication.

[kryptqnick]

The fact that funds can't be blocked in a way that banks accounts can be frozen is potentially helping terrorists, but as others mentioned in this thread, there are things to take into account here (the need to exchange fiat for BTC to actually use it most of the time; private keys). Also, if using Bitcoin were so simple and so much more convenient, wouldn't all terrorists prefer Bitcoin by now? Apart from that, even if it makes things easier for terrorists, it's not a good enough reason to abandon cryptos altogether, IMO.

[Leviathan.007]

That's the reason for some governments and organizations to stay against bitcoin. the whole point is the paper money can be used by terrorists too. they were using paper money before 2009 and none said paper money is the tool for terrorists, they even used oil and gold for the large trades and none said anything negative regarding these famous assets. Bitcoin is an asset and a tool and can be used by different people for different things sometimes there are millions of dollars of anonymous donations by bitcoin to a charity and sometimes there is a transaction done by the terrorists by bitcoin.

[geegaw]

What can we do, we wanted a decentralized platform and the people that have malicious intent find a way to use it tho their malicious purposes. But for some terrorists, I don't think that they'll be using it though, bitcoin is easily traced if you have the manpower and equipment and dedication.

The government is where the manpower is but their search also seems to be fruitless for the scammers, quite a few crypto lawsuits have been stored in police offices under the directory name of pending, I think the most recent victims have also been powerless before their lawsuits, looking for the police is just to sow hope and scare some scammers. But most terrorists probably give up this technology option, they direct the funds directly to their accounts under the security policies of international banks, a legitimate account is better than collecting and swapping bitcoin

[agg2702]

That's the reason for some governments and organizations to stay against bitcoin. the whole point is the paper money can be used by terrorists too. they were using paper money before 2009 and none said paper money is the tool for terrorists, they even used oil and gold for the large trades and none said anything negative regarding these famous assets. Bitcoin is an asset and a tool and can be used by different people for different things sometimes there are millions of dollars of anonymous donations by bitcoin to a charity and sometimes there is a transaction done by the terrorists by bitcoin.

because this is a platform that can be accessed by everyone whether it's ordinary people, influential people such as influencers, people involved in politics and even terrorists. bitcoin can be done and accessed by everyone because here there are no restrictions or prohibitions for certain people (except government policies that prohibit).
but with your thread I just realized with this why paper money, gold and oil are also not applied the same thing as bitcoin (a tool for terrorists) even though it is true that this is also used for terrorists and even fighting for oil in Arab countries is still has something to do with terrorists, then why not say the same thing as they say that bitcoin is access to make it easier for terrorists? I just realized this.

[qwertyup23]

While most of the illegal activities in the world take place in USD and I am far from saying that bitcoin is actually worse than any other asset on that regard, I have read many news about the American withdrawal from Afghanistan and how the US government froze some billions of USD belonging to the previous government or perhaps (debatable) to the country itself. Obviously, this could not have happened if those assets were held in bitcoin or other crypto. It seems that not everything is good in self-sovereignty?

BTW, this is not a statement saying that Taliban are terrorist, just wondering about some other cases in which states were clearly linked to terror.

While I do understand that BTCs were somehow linked or associated in the past as an avenue to purchase prohibited or contraband items, I think this is not the case this time in Afghanistan. With the country being somehow frozen with their assets, they lack the necessary stronghold and infrastructure to support a widespread implementation of BTCs on their country.

Money is indeed power- one with the most resources can definitely take the tide of the battle. But in this case where the Taliban has control of the country, their problem would be funding (though China has expressed their terms into helping them).

[Coyster]

That's the reason for some governments and organizations to stay against bitcoin.

It is a reason, but it is not a valid one by the stretch of any imagination, it's just a means or an excuse rather for the government to continue it's hostility towards Bitcoin, if we're to be honest here, the only problem the government have with Bitcoin is that they cannot control it, they can't print it how they like, or freeze it's users account, or generally do all they can with their fiat currencies, that's just what the problem is, it's not cause "terrorists can possibly use it freely" or all other conspiracy theories they come up with.

I think the government need to understand something and that is the fact that Bitcoin is a currency and there is no way to stop whoever wants to use it from doing so, neither does it make it a currency that we should do away with, if we're to look at it that way, the use of Fiat should also be stopped considering all the atrocious activities that has been carried out with it. Bitcoin isn't helping terrorists per se, it's a decentralized currency that helps individuals to maintain their privacy and be free from government controlling their finances arbitrarily.

[teosanru]

While most of the illegal activities in the world take place in USD and I am far from saying that bitcoin is actually worse than any other asset on that regard, I have read many news about the American withdrawal from Afghanistan and how the US government froze some billions of USD belonging to the previous government or perhaps (debatable) to the country itself. Obviously, this could not have happened if those assets were held in bitcoin or other crypto. It seems that not everything is good in self-sovereignty?

BTW, this is not a statement saying that Taliban are terrorist, just wondering about some other cases in which states were clearly linked to terror.

There are even concrete evidence that suggest the USA themselves have funded the Mujahids in Afghanistan to fight against rising Soviet power, if there was bitcoin at that point in time, things would have come out more easily as a clear trail could be established of where the money goes, It's quite easy to say that Terrorists are using cryptocurrencies to make transactions but the thing is money has to originate from someplace or the other, Terrorists would use cash if not bitcoin, that is even difficult to trace or establish any trails, In fact cryptocurrencies would help in finding the root of this money because it's clearly not impossible to trace out the person from the address.

[Gyfts]

Generally, yes. Although, there are videos circulating around with the Taliban with stacks of USD filling up entire rooms because the military left it all behind. Think the Taliban is going to be using that instead of Bitcoin. So fiat currencies and traditional banking institutions can help terrorist networks too, but there is never really too much talk about that. Bad actors will and can take advantage of decentralization, that doesn't negative crypto because it literally applies to any fiat based currency.

[jaysabi]

While most of the illegal activities in the world take place in USD and I am far from saying that bitcoin is actually worse than any other asset on that regard, I have read many news about the American withdrawal from Afghanistan and how the US government froze some billions of USD belonging to the previous government or perhaps (debatable) to the country itself. Obviously, this could not have happened if those assets were held in bitcoin or other crypto. It seems that not everything is good in self-sovereignty?

BTW, this is not a statement saying that Taliban are terrorist, just wondering about some other cases in which states were clearly linked to terror.

Yes, obviously and unequivocally any financial system that cannot be blocked or sanctioned provides safe haven for terrorists and other bad actors to facilitate their illegal and harmful actions. There are people on these boards who instead of acknowledging reality get angry when you state this obvious fact. The inability to acknowledge reality disqualifies all their other opinions, as they’ve proven themselves too partisan and to irrational to be taken seriously.

And no need to equivocate. The Taliban is 100% a terrorist organization, as much now as it was before they were overthrown by the western allies.

[Wakate]

Remember that the motive of creating Bitcoin by Satoshi Nakamoto is to make transactions less stressful and easier by avoiding exorbitant fees being charged by third parties service providers. It will be difficult for government to get hold of money in form of Bitcoin than just using ordinary Fiat.

Everything that has advantages also have it's own disadvantages which is the reason why many persons are still castigating the use of Bitcoin as a method of payment because of people are using it to scam innocent persons violating the objects of it's development.

[Sithara007]

While most of the illegal activities in the world take place in USD and I am far from saying that bitcoin is actually worse than any other asset on that regard, I have read many news about the American withdrawal from Afghanistan and how the US government froze some billions of USD belonging to the previous government or perhaps (debatable) to the country itself. Obviously, this could not have happened if those assets were held in bitcoin or other crypto. It seems that not everything is good in self-sovereignty?

BTW, this is not a statement saying that Taliban are terrorist, just wondering about some other cases in which states were clearly linked to terror.

Yes, obviously and unequivocally any financial system that cannot be blocked or sanctioned provides safe haven for terrorists and other bad actors to facilitate their illegal and harmful actions. There are people on these boards who instead of acknowledging reality get angry when you state this obvious fact. The inability to acknowledge reality disqualifies all their other opinions, as they’ve proven themselves too partisan and to irrational to be taken seriously.

And no need to equivocate. The Taliban is 100% a terrorist organization, as much now as it was before they were overthrown by the western allies.

I am not surprised by the rants from left-wing that government should control all the financial activities and there should be no anonymity. The argument is that anonymous modes of payments are being used for terror financing, and for criminal activities. But apart from these "assumptions", I am 100% sure that you don't have any concrete proof with you to link Bitcoin with Taliban. To date, there hasn't been a single incident which links the Taliban to cryptocurrency. Your argument is based on just assumptions and not real data. Taliban gets close to 100% of their funds in the form of fiat. But obviously, you don't want to focus on that part.

[jaysabi]

While most of the illegal activities in the world take place in USD and I am far from saying that bitcoin is actually worse than any other asset on that regard, I have read many news about the American withdrawal from Afghanistan and how the US government froze some billions of USD belonging to the previous government or perhaps (debatable) to the country itself. Obviously, this could not have happened if those assets were held in bitcoin or other crypto. It seems that not everything is good in self-sovereignty?

BTW, this is not a statement saying that Taliban are terrorist, just wondering about some other cases in which states were clearly linked to terror.

Yes, obviously and unequivocally any financial system that cannot be blocked or sanctioned provides safe haven for terrorists and other bad actors to facilitate their illegal and harmful actions. There are people on these boards who instead of acknowledging reality get angry when you state this obvious fact. The inability to acknowledge reality disqualifies all their other opinions, as they’ve proven themselves too partisan and to irrational to be taken seriously.

And no need to equivocate. The Taliban is 100% a terrorist organization, as much now as it was before they were overthrown by the western allies.

I am not surprised by the rants from left-wing that government should control all the financial activities and there should be no anonymity. The argument is that anonymous modes of payments are being used for terror financing, and for criminal activities. But apart from these "assumptions", I am 100% sure that you don't have any concrete proof with you to link Bitcoin with Taliban. To date, there hasn't been a single incident which links the Taliban to cryptocurrency. Your argument is based on just assumptions and not real data. Taliban gets close to 100% of their funds in the form of fiat. But obviously, you don't want to focus on that part.

Maybe calm down, take a deep breath, then re-read my post in full and make a special point to read for comprehension this time.  When you do, take particular note that I didn't say anything about the Taliban using bitcoin.  I'm addressing two separate points in the OP, which is easy to tell because I separated the two points into two separate paragraphs.  You worked yourself into a tizzy for no reason.  Next time you respond to something I write, make sure it's actually on topic.

[SquallLeonhart]

That's the reason for some governments and organizations to stay against bitcoin. the whole point is the paper money can be used by terrorists too. they were using paper money before 2009 and none said paper money is the tool for terrorists, they even used oil and gold for the large trades and none said anything negative regarding these famous assets. Bitcoin is an asset and a tool and can be used by different people for different things sometimes there are millions of dollars of anonymous donations by bitcoin to a charity and sometimes there is a transaction done by the terrorists by bitcoin.

That's the best part about bitcoin that people miss. They talk about how terrorists use it like there were no terrorists before 2009, they talk about criminals using it and there were criminals before 2009, they talk about money laundering, blackmailing, hacking, many bad things all acting like it wasn't a thing before 2009. Honestly crypto has been around for years and it has been accused of all these things forever when in reality fiat has been the main thing for that in a long time.

There was a gossip (not sure if it is real) about how most 20 dollar bills have cocaine trace in them, think about how much that money actually is and you will realize how much dark money is in fiat as well. Long story short bitcoin is not the main source of problems governments are having and it is not the only thing that bad people use, even if bitcoin stop existing today, bad people will find another way anyway.

[Wawa2013]

That's the reason for some governments and organizations to stay against bitcoin. the whole point is the paper money can be used by terrorists too. they were using paper money before 2009 and none said paper money is the tool for terrorists, they even used oil and gold for the large trades and none said anything negative regarding these famous assets. Bitcoin is an asset and a tool and can be used by different people for different things sometimes there are millions of dollars of anonymous donations by bitcoin to a charity and sometimes there is a transaction done by the terrorists by bitcoin.

That's the best part about bitcoin that people miss. They talk about how terrorists use it like there were no terrorists before 2009, they talk about criminals using it and there were criminals before 2009, they talk about money laundering, blackmailing, hacking, many bad things all acting like it wasn't a thing before 2009. Honestly crypto has been around for years and it has been accused of all these things forever when in reality fiat has been the main thing for that in a long time.

There was a gossip (not sure if it is real) about how most 20 dollar bills have cocaine trace in them, think about how much that money actually is and you will realize how much dark money is in fiat as well. Long story short bitcoin is not the main source of problems governments are having and it is not the only thing that bad people use, even if bitcoin stop existing today, bad people will find another way anyway.

This is how smart Bitcoin haters are, they provide inaccurate information and mislead a lot of people. Bitcoin will always get accused of helping
terrorists, maybe because Bitcoin is decentralized and the government can't control it, then raise the accusation that Bitcoin is widely used for
illegal activities. Though if we do the research properly, and get information from reliable sources, will find the fact that the number of terrorists
who use fiat far more. Because terrorists existed before 2009, when there was no Bitcoin, that many terrorists use to carry out illegal activities is fiat.
So it's actually not true with the information that says Bitcoin helps terrorists. There are indeed some terrorists who use Bitcoin, but very few of
them. Many terrorists until now use fiat more for their illegal activities.

[Vishnu.Reang]

~
Terrorists prefer to use cash instead of using Bitcoin, they don't like complicated and complicated affairs, terrorists prefer simple, real and accurate, that's my thought.

Agree with this. Because even when Islamic State was at it's peak dominance in Iraq/Syria, there were zero reports of them using cryptocurrency. It is no secret that Bitcoin is used (to some extent) in drugs trade (especially using dark markets). But terrorists using Bitcoin is just another fairytale being spread by the lefties who want to destroy the cryptocurrency sector. And if by any chance the terrorists are using Bitcoin, then it is the fault of the government. Bitcoin was not specifically designed to help terrorists or criminals.

[SquallLeonhart]

This is how smart Bitcoin haters are, they provide inaccurate information and mislead a lot of people. Bitcoin will always get accused of helping terrorists, maybe because Bitcoin is decentralized and the government can't control it, then raise the accusation that Bitcoin is widely used for illegal activities. Though if we do the research properly, and get information from reliable sources, will find the fact that the number of terrorists who use fiat far more. Because terrorists existed before 2009, when there was no Bitcoin, that many terrorists use to carry out illegal activities is fiat.
So it's actually not true with the information that says Bitcoin helps terrorists. There are indeed some terrorists who use Bitcoin, but very few of them. Many terrorists until now use fiat more for their illegal activities.

It is so much more in fiat then bitcoin, that's true. Bad people use tons more in fiat then they use in bitcoin, bitcoin is probably just the low level drug dealer that sells weed on darknet and that's about it, the transaction is done in bitcoin or some other coin like monero, and then they send the product after the buyer sends the coins, then dealer sends the drugs and it's done.

This is a very very small time amount compared to all the bad people out there dealing in millions of dollars every day, there are billionaire bad people in the world, none of them uses crypto. Long story short they should fix the fiat world helping the criminals before they start to bark about how crypto helps the criminals or gives them a way out, because even though it is anonymous it is not untraceable and that means if there is a bad guy eventually you will catch them.

[Sithara007]

Maybe calm down, take a deep breath, then re-read my post in full and make a special point to read for comprehension this time.  When you do, take particular note that I didn't say anything about the Taliban using bitcoin.  I'm addressing two separate points in the OP, which is easy to tell because I separated the two points into two separate paragraphs.  You worked yourself into a tizzy for no reason.  Next time you respond to something I write, make sure it's actually on topic.

OK.. let me analyze your post once again, but I really doubt I would ever agree to your views.

Yes, obviously and unequivocally any financial system that cannot be blocked or sanctioned provides safe haven for terrorists and other bad actors to facilitate their illegal and harmful actions. There are people on these boards who instead of acknowledging reality get angry when you state this obvious fact. The inability to acknowledge reality disqualifies all their other opinions, as they’ve proven themselves too partisan and to irrational to be taken seriously.

You want a financial system that can be blocked and sanctioned. Essentially you want a centralized system, which can be abused by the government for whatever way they want. Such a system have failed in the past.  And although it is the ultimate wet dream of every socialist, I can't agree to such a system.

Just because 0.1% of the Bitcoin transactions are used by criminals, it is ridiculous to blame the entire cryptocurrency community for that. For criminals, the preferred mode of payment is fiat currency and despite the fact that fiat transactions can be "blocked" and "sanctioned", the usage of fiat for such operations is growing with every passing year. So what does this mean?

The solution is not to use a system that is completely under the control of the government, but to increase the efficiency of the law enforcement department. They are just giving out excuses, to hide their own failure.

[Betwrong]

~
This is a very very small time amount compared to all the bad people out there dealing in millions of dollars every day, there are billionaire bad people in the world, none of them uses crypto. Long story short they should fix the fiat world helping the criminals before they start to bark about how crypto helps the criminals or gives them a way out, because even though it is anonymous it is not untraceable and that means if there is a bad guy eventually you will catch them.

That's true, and I'm sure sooner or later we will not hear this "crypto helping terrorists" nonsense in the most countries. In fact, Bitcoin is surely more convenient for the law enforcement agencies for tracing terrorists than fiat with their sophisticated schemes evolved like deadly viruses with time. Bitcoin was created as an alternative currency, but also a better one in many aspects, including tracing terrorists, corrupt high level officials, and other scoundrels.

[dezoel]

Just like you have said nothing can be 100% perfect. When there is an advantage to something there is always going to be a disadvantage to it as well. Bitcoin is good and we all like it because of the privacy it gives to us and also the control over our  wealth. Now as far as there are people who wants to make use of Bitcoin just for the good of it, There is also going to be those who wants to make use of it the wrong way. So the question is, are we going to get rid of it just because it has a disadvantage? or do we find a solution to it?

This is something that has been discussed a lot of times and that’s also been one of the points that is used by some economists against Bitcoin; they believe that there is going to be terrorists who are making use of Bitcoin as a mode of transaction, although there haven’t been much cases like this, and we wish not to see it happen.