The vaccination issue is not bipolar

[figliar0]

Many people died, but many people also hasn't any symptoms. Isn't it because of this general immunity?

This discussion point started on Jet Cash's assertion that vaccination was unnecessary. You are saying that some people have been exposed to Covid, and yet experienced no symptoms. Yes, agreed. You are also saying that many people have died from Covid. Yes, agreed. So why is vaccination unnecessary?

I want to say, that it is not true that generic immunity do not help for covid. The fact that some people died for covid doesn't mean that we should spend lots of money to vaccination for everybody, exactly like in the case of flu vaccines. There should be consideration of pros and cons.

What is the data supporting pro-waxers arguments? Those data comes from people directly motivated by finance income. Is those data reliable? Lets say it directly: politicians lied to us lots of time, how can I trust to them? So pro-vaxxers arguments are based on faith, that politicians do not lie.

The vast collection of data from ourworldindata is available for download here: https://github.com/owid/covid-19-data/tree/master/public/data
The list of sources is available here: https://github.com/CSSEGISandData/COVID-19
It is not a question of faith in politicians. I have zero faith in politicians, and I don't trust our government at all. My background and expertise is in science and data. I look at the data.

How can you know that science data is not fake? It happened lots of time in history, that science data was custom-made for political purpose. I worked ten years in public university, science is funded exclusively on the basis of nepotism. I don't want to say that the situation is everywhere the same, I just wondering, why politicians in our country still have to lie and scare, when they have clear science data to persuade people rationally.

pro-waxxers (or generally pro-gov-restrictions people) contribute to these issues by obeying government.

I started working from home and taking distancing precautions whilst our government (UK) was still insisting Covid wouldn't be a problem. The data from Italy and Spain were clear, yet the fools in charge don't understand (or willfully misunderstand) the data.
Similarly I still wear a mask when I'm out, but our government have said they're no longer needed.
It is not a question of pro-vaxxers blindly trusting government.

So you are going above the scope of restrictions. Don't you mind that these restrictions caused collapsed economy? Don't you feel little bit guilty that you participate to cropper bussiness of some people?

Is your issue with the Covid vaccines in particular, or with the concept of vaccination in general? Historical data for smallpox and polio as two examples from many, are perfectly clear.

I am not anti-waxxer in general. I am just actual situation anti-waxer, because of:

• politicians abused whole covid situation to tighten their power over people;
• politicians abused whole covid situation to steal public money;
• I don't think covid vaccine will help (much), just like in case of flu;
• covid vaccine is not well tested compared to other vaccine, testers should get paid for this;
• covid is not so deadly big deal, making expensive show is not worth of it.

[Cnut237]

I want to say, that it is not true that generic immunity do not help for covid. The fact that some people died for covid doesn't mean that we should spend lots of money to vaccination for everybody, exactly like in the case of flu vaccines. There should be consideration of pros and cons.

Pro: 4.5 million people have died from Covid so far. A vaccine might be a good idea.

How can you know that science data is not fake? It happened lots of time in history, that science data was custom-made for political purpose. I worked ten years in public university, science is funded exclusively on the basis of nepotism. I don't want to say that the situation is everywhere the same, I just wondering, why politicians in our country still have to lie and scare, when they have clear science data to persuade people rationally.

We are not talking about an individual paper or data report here. There are huge, independent datasets from most countries in the world. And not just from governments, but also from universities and professional bodies. Do you really think this is all fake? Why would it be?

So you are going above the scope of restrictions. Don't you mind that these restrictions caused collapsed economy? Don't you feel little bit guilty that you participate to cropper bussiness of some people?

This question makes me angry. I'm unable to respond without detailing how I feel about anti-vaxxers and their behaviour, which would create a lot of tension in this thread, and likely end the discussion.

• politicians abused whole covid situation to tighten their power over people;
• politicians abused whole covid situation to steal public money;

Politicians will likely try to exploit any situation to their own advantage. Doesn't mean the underlying situation isn't real.

• I don't think covid vaccine will help (much), just like in case of flu;

Which data are you basing this opinion on?

That is not TRUE. and it is documented in medical paper.

Well, that's conclusive evidence, thanks. I've changed my position entirely as a result of your devastatingly insightful and painstakingly detailed arguments. 

[tvbcof]

I want to say, that it is not true that generic immunity do not help for covid. The fact that some people died for covid doesn't mean that we should spend lots of money to vaccination for everybody, exactly like in the case of flu vaccines. There should be consideration of pros and cons.

Pro: 4.5 million people have died from Covid so far. A vaccine might be a good idea.
...

Something like 96% of the U.S. figures died of something like massive head trauma from a motorcycle accident, or a corpse from the hospice system which was tested positive in after-death PCR tests.  Tests which are themselves designed to give false positives and not fixed in almost 2 years now.

So, by order-of-magnitude sanity-checking, (4.5x10^6/.04) X 8x10^9 is around 0.0000225 or 0.002% of the worlds population succumbed to the 'deadliest pandemic in a century' in the last couple years.  And that's even before correcting for a lot of the obvious fraud.

See; even the official number pumped out by the perps don't make anything to panic about.  It also aligns well with what I am seeing.  Basically nobody I know has had any 'covid-19' problems in over a year, but around 20 people I know of within a couple degrees word of mouth have died within a week of the injection.

Again, please take note that anyone who dies within about 5 or 6 weeks from the injection will be labeled 'unvaccinated' in most places.  Also, in at least some places, people who die three or more months after their last injection.  We only know this because the criteria for labeling was accidentally leaked to the public.  It's since been memory-holed, but sharp people back up information like this when they spot it, and it's still not an smooth path to get things deleted off archive.org (but it is happening more and more...starting right after I made the mistake of making a relatively significant donation to them...Arg!)

[Cnut237]

Something like 96% of the U.S. figures died of something like massive head trauma from a motorcycle accident, or a corpse from the hospice system which was tested positive in after-death PCR tests.

I appreciate that, unlike some anti-vaxxers, you do attempt to present a decent argument. However the problem here is that you are making a statement that is entirely unsupported by evidence. Do you just pull '96%' out of the air?
Regardless of official reason for death, it is quite clear from data made available from around the world (not just a single source), that there has been a huge increase in deaths from any reason recently, and that this coincides exactly with the Covid pandemic. We can't attribute this to motorcycles or to something strange happening in hospices.


https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-mortality-p-scores-projected-baseline?tab=table

[tvbcof]

Something like 96% of the U.S. figures died of something like massive head trauma from a motorcycle accident, or a corpse from the hospice system which was tested positive in after-death PCR tests.

I appreciate that, unlike some anti-vaxxers, you do attempt to present a decent argument. However the problem here is that you are making a statement that is entirely unsupported by evidence. Do you just pull '96%' out of the air?

https://nbc-2.com/news/2020/08/31/cdc-report-shows-94-of-covid-19-deaths-in-u-s-had-contributing-conditions/

It's hard to argue that corp/gov tried any less hard to depserately keep the plandemic panic going since that time, so going with a 95%-ish number would produce a workable estimator for order-of-mag work.  And, due to the figures you snipped, even if you are going to take corp/gov estimates at face value, the number changes from 0.00002 to 0.0002 and the arg remains the same.

Regardless of official reason for death, it is quite clear from data made available from around the world (not just a single source), that there has been a huge increase in deaths from any reason recently, and that this coincides exactly with the Covid pandemic. We can't attribute this to motorcycles or to something strange happening in hospices.

[_img]https://i.imgur.com/jHpmJi6.jpg[/img]
https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-mortality-p-scores-projected-baseline?tab=table

I live in a certain English speaking SE Asian country, and the tricks they pull to pad the numbers are completely shameless.  There are fewer people here with the sophistication to spot the fraud so it seems, or if they do, they tend to keep their mouths shut about it.  Reminds me of the American War in Vietnam where someone tallied up the number of 'dinks' killed while 'our boys' were out on patrol, and it exceeded the population of the country.

I don't trust the data and definitions 'ourworldindata' uses.  They have all this 'sustainability' crap meaning they are great-reset fruadsters, and the funding demonstrates this too.

Grants

Our World in Data is supported by grants from the Quadrature Climate Foundation, the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, and a grant from the German entrepreneur, businesswoman and philanthropist Susanne Klatten.

In the past we have also received grants from the World Health Organization, the Department of Health and Social Care in the United Kingdom, the Centre for Effective Altruism – Effective Altruism Meta Fund, and the Nuffield Foundation.

To we who study this stuff, these are exactly the people implementing and funding the plandemic in order to usher in the Great Reset or 'Fourth Industrial Revolution.'  It's the same people who got their positions of unimaginable wealth and power during the last few monetary systems, and they want to hold onto what they got, or preferably use the monetary system collapse to get a lot more.  Classic 'order out of chaos'.  These 'altruistic foundations' are just their ways of enjoying their hobbies (usually eugenics) tax-free.

The web entity is probably partially about data fishing on user actions to a degree, and the graphs that are generated are usually incomplete and skewed by the algorithms (or simply crappy coding at best.)

[goldkingcoiner]

While I am strongly for vaccinations, I cannot condone forcing people to take a vaccination that was created on an asap basis with no long term studies. As long as you waiver your right to a hospital spot in the worst case scenario, whether or not you catch the disease should be left up to you. That is what I believe. Forcing people to take a medication is just plain wrong. And it goes against the democratic principle. We don't all live in communist China!

[tvbcof]

While I am strongly for vaccinations, I cannot condone forcing people to take a vaccination that was created on an asap basis with no long term studies. As long as you waiver your right to a hospital spot in the worst case scenario, whether or not you catch the disease should be left up to you. That is what I believe. Forcing people to take a medication is just plain wrong. And it goes against the democratic principle. We don't all live in communist China!

As do the people who took the experimental gene therapy under EUA.  Some of them still get to go to the hospital, but usually get kicked right out onto the curb when it becomes clear that there problems are a gene therapy injection adverse effect.

---

I really hope that what comes out of this mess is 'private' member-only certifying authorities for doctors and other health professionals so that the AMA has some competition.  Badecker talks about this in his soveign-citizen-ish way.  PMA I think he calls it, and there could be something to it.

It's a stone-cold fact that I select doctors specifically because they were kicked out of the corp/gov sponsored medical organizations (or will be when I need one.)  I simply would not trust any doctor who practiced in such a manner so as to maintain membership.  Or at least my trust would be greatly diminished.

A big problem is that the racketeering is such that one cannot write prescriptions without being a member of the racket.  Hopefully that will change.  A silver lining to the 'new normal' is that rich and connected people will have the same needs as I do, so maybe there is a chance to unroll some of the elements of the racket just enough so that they get what they want/need and I can tag along.  The AMA and other socialized medicine can then just manages the eugenic program swamp-doctors.

[Cnut237]

a 95%-ish number would produce a workable estimator for order-of-mag work.  And, due to the figures you snipped, even if you are going to take corp/gov estimates at face value, the number changes from 0.00002 to 0.0002 and the arg remains the same.

There is still the fact that millions more people than normal have been dying of something during the last 18 months, with a spike coinciding with the start of the pandemic.

I live in a certain English speaking SE Asian country, and the tricks they pull to pad the numbers are completely shameless.

I can't really comment on the specifics of a country I know nothing about. But these data are coming out of almost every country, with the same pattern again and again. Quite apart from anything else, I doubt that politicians are sufficiently competent to devise and maintain a cover-up on this scale, particularly one involving countries that are mutual antagonists.

the people implementing and funding the plandemic in order to usher in the Great Reset or 'Fourth Industrial Revolution.'  It's the same people who got their positions of unimaginable wealth and power during the last few monetary systems, and they want to hold onto what they got, or preferably use the monetary system collapse to get a lot more.  Classic 'order out of chaos'. 

I agree that the system is set up to favour the established elite, and to enrich and empower them at the expense of everyone else. They would have no reason to sabotage a system that is working perfectly for them, that has been fine-tuned over centuries. If a system is stable, established, and working exactly as you want it to, then you have no incentive to sabotage it by gambling that you can replace it with something even better. And even if a couple of people wanted to risk that, could you really imagine them obtaining a consensus, swearing everyone to secrecy, and this plan actually all holding together?

[Vatimins]

     Being in a small city where the cases have been surging, I can testify how important it is to get vaccinated and to follow the health protocols along with all the other preventive measures. Of course I can sympathize on how much of a hassle it is to actually do and abide to all of the preventive measures but still, it is harder to be hospitalised and suffer severe effects of covid, specially in place such as here where the resources are limited. People are dying on the road outside hospitals and on its hallways. Still, I cannot persuade everyone but if at least I can save some by sharing my experiences, I'd be satisfied. Hope everyone is safe and healthy.

[ferrisbullish]

Lol Masks work, eh? Document this https://www.bitchute.com/video/rlWESmrijl8Q/.

Then document the dozens of of videos here https://www.bitchute.com/channel/okiFK5CwQrZS/ that show what's really going on with masks.

And if you want to see the danger of masks... https://www.bitchute.com/video/ypLjmXQoLygi/.

WOW you really know good scientific sources! Nature? naaaah! "bitchute"    

ROFL

[tvbcof]

Lol Masks work, eh? Document this https://www.bitchute.com/video/rlWESmrijl8Q/.

Then document the dozens of of videos here https://www.bitchute.com/channel/okiFK5CwQrZS/ that show what's really going on with masks.

And if you want to see the danger of masks... https://www.bitchute.com/video/ypLjmXQoLygi/.

WOW you really know good scientific sources! Nature? naaaah! "bitchute"    

ROFL

Bitchute is just a generic video hosting platform which doesn't censor material as much some of the others.  Youtube, Facebook, etc don't allow material which could cause 'vaccine hesitance'.  For instance, you cannot report that a family member died following injection.  The validity or accuracy of the material in the vid is not a factor.

Many people, and especially people who have something to say which is unpopular with the current power structure, use multiple of these smaller hosting services.  Roll around n the floor laughing all you like, but the joke is kind of on you if you cannot get the concept here.

[figliar0]

I want to say, that it is not true that generic immunity do not help for covid. The fact that some people died for covid doesn't mean that we should spend lots of money to vaccination for everybody, exactly like in the case of flu vaccines. There should be consideration of pros and cons.

Pro: 4.5 million people have died from Covid so far. A vaccine might be a good idea.

How much is it in relative %? Not much, hm? A vaccine might not be a good idea, when we consider all cons, including fact, that nobody knows if it will work just a bit to future mutations.

How can you know that science data is not fake? It happened lots of time in history, that science data was custom-made for political purpose. I worked ten years in public university, science is funded exclusively on the basis of nepotism. I don't want to say that the situation is everywhere the same, I just wondering, why politicians in our country still have to lie and scare, when they have clear science data to persuade people rationally.

We are not talking about an individual paper or data report here. There are huge, independent datasets from most countries in the world. And not just from governments, but also from universities and professional bodies. Do you really think this is all fake? Why would it be?

Because of money and power like always.

So you are going above the scope of restrictions. Don't you mind that these restrictions caused collapsed economy? Don't you feel little bit guilty that you participate to cropper bussiness of some people?

This question makes me angry. I'm unable to respond without detailing how I feel about anti-vaxxers and their behaviour, which would create a lot of tension in this thread, and likely end the discussion.

So you are angry? I am so sorry for that - it must be very depressing, when someone shoot with your own weapon, isn't it? Let me show you some of your posts from another similar topic.

BTW... Vaccination is not a freedom issue. You are not free to stand in a public place with a gun and shoot down random passersby. Similarly, you should not be free to stand in a public place and cough potentially lethal virus onto people.

The reason that we still have restrictions is that the virus is still circulating, with a high R-value. And the main reason for this is that we haven't quite achieved herd immunity, because not enough people have taken the vaccine. It is anti-vaxxers who are causing the restrictions, which is strange as they are the ones responsible.

But it's not a freedom issue unless the consequences of both action and inaction affect only you. With the Covid vaccine, your action of taking the vaccine may give you side effects, so affects only you, but your inaction in refusing to take it affects others, because you increase the chances of them contracting the virus.

So you see it yourself. You are talking about consequences of inaction for anti-waxers, considering them as responsible, but you are angry when someone talk about consequences of action for pro-waxers and you considere discussion as finished. Isn't this behaviour strange? Doesn't we call it hypocritical? Do you even try to thing how could other people who lost their jobs and bussiness feel and live because of your action?

• politicians abused whole covid situation to tighten their power over people;
• politicians abused whole covid situation to steal public money;

Politicians will likely try to exploit any situation to their own advantage. Doesn't mean the underlying situation isn't real.

Yes of course. But it doesn't mean that it is enough to consider just one aspect of whole situation. And it doesn't matter that we have to participate on the political game.

• I don't think covid vaccine will help (much), just like in case of flu;

Which data are you basing this opinion on?

On the fact that vaccine just cannot have job done on fast mutating RNA virus just like in the case of flu (similar virus). I have no data, because I didn't do any research - I am not scientist.


Thank you tvbcof for very good posts. I do not have any smerits to tell this right way.

[Cnut237]

4.5 million people have died from Covid so far. A vaccine might be a good idea.

How much is it in relative %? Not much, hm?

The maths is quite straightforward. If you're incapable of calculating, it's about 1 in 1,750 people globally. And rising.

A vaccine might not be a good idea, when we consider all cons, including fact, that nobody knows if it will work just a bit to future mutations.

This thing solves our current problem. But it might not solve future problems, so let's do nothing instead. Brilliant. 

it must be very depressing, when someone shoot with your own weapon, isn't it?

Are you suggesting that you've won some argument? I can't see that you've even managed to make a valid point yet.

anti-waxers, considering them as responsible

Anti-vaxxers contribute to the spread of the virus, help to keep it in circulation, and help to create new variants. Yes, of course. This is not controversial.

but you are angry when someone talk about consequences of action for pro-waxers and you considere discussion as finished. Isn't this behaviour strange? Doesn't we call it hypocritical? Do you even try to thing how could other people who lost their jobs and bussiness feel and live because of your action?

I'm irritated with you because I find your position morally indefensible. 4.5 million people have died, and this number would be far higher without lockdowns, and of course without vaccination. How many people have died because their business lost some profit? No need for exact figures, just give the answer to the nearest million.

There are huge, independent datasets from most countries in the world. And not just from governments, but also from universities and professional bodies. Do you really think this is all fake? Why would it be?

Because of money and power like always.

You are outraged not that millions have died, but that some people have lost profit. And yet you won't accept data from anywhere, because you think it's all motivated by money. "Doesn't we call it hypocritical?"

I have no data, because I didn't do any research

Really? Because that's not coming across at all. 

[figliar0]

4.5 million people have died from Covid so far. A vaccine might be a good idea.

How much is it in relative %? Not much, hm?

The maths is quite straightforward. If you're incapable of calculating, it's about 1 in 1,750 people globally. And rising.

Yes, math is simple, and tvbcof did the calculations for us - so don't fear and say that percentage number and think about it. And of course, Mr Obvious - number of died would always be higher and higher - I am sure you understand why.

A vaccine might not be a good idea, when we consider all cons, including fact, that nobody knows if it will work just a bit to future mutations.

This thing solves our current problem. But it might not solve future problems, so let's do nothing instead. Brilliant.  

This maybe solves our current problem in short-time and brings lots of more problems in the future. Just say it whole. But from some reason you cannot or don't want to see that.

it must be very depressing, when someone shoot with your own weapon, isn't it?

Are you suggesting that you've won some argument? I can't see that you've even managed to make a valid point yet.

No. I am suggesting that you are prejudiced, using dogmatic view on situation and do not accept that there are other issues then death, which are getting worse with restrictions.

anti-waxers, considering them as responsible

Anti-vaxxers contribute to the spread of the virus, help to keep it in circulation, and help to create new variants. Yes, of course. This is not controversial.

Pro-vaxxers contribute to economical issues (not only to individuals but to whole nations), tightening political power, destroying psychological health and social coexistence. And (because they still can catch covid) they help to create new variants. These issues will exists for tens years with us. And yes, this is considered as controversial, but sad true.

but you are angry when someone talk about consequences of action for pro-waxers and you considere discussion as finished. Isn't this behaviour strange? Doesn't we call it hypocritical? Do you even try to thing how could other people who lost their jobs and bussiness feel and live because of your action?

I'm irritated with you because I find your position morally indefensible. 4.5 million people have died, and this number would be far higher without lockdowns, and of course without vaccination. How many people have died because their business lost some profit? No need for exact figures, just give the answer to the nearest million.

Morally indefensible? Really? Some extremely low percent of population died and you stoically say that you do not care about:

• private bussiness which support living of families
• psychological health
• education
• healthcare

And of course not just today but tens of years in the future? You want to speak about morality? You don't care about others lives and you have some requirements to them? And of course I am sure that you have some data about that number which would be far higher without lockdowns. How can you know? You think or believe?

There are huge, independent datasets from most countries in the world. And not just from governments, but also from universities and professional bodies. Do you really think this is all fake? Why would it be?

Because of money and power like always.

You are outraged not that millions have died, but that some people have lost profit. And yet you won't accept data from anywhere, because you think it's all motivated by money. "Doesn't we call it hypocritical?"

Oh please, just wake up from that dream you are living. You just don't accept any other issues linked to restrictions. Just go get shopping, maybe you will see how higher is the price of food in compare to last year. How should someone who lost bussiness do feed children without profit? You don't care? He/she doesn't care about gov restrictions. But of course they have to support these restrictions by paying taxes.

I have no data, because I didn't do any research

Really? Because that's not coming across at all. 

You find some data on the net a decided to believe. I decided to not believe. Neither of us has proof that data is not fake. Try to think about that. And thanks again to tvbcof who did the job and looked what sort of data sources you are using.

[Cnut237]

~

I don't see any point in extending this discussion; we're not getting anywhere, and are unlikely to reach consensus on even the tiniest detail. When I read your posts, I just see misguided nonsense or outright idiocy, and I'm sure you feel the same way about facts mine.

[goldkingcoiner]

it's really scary to read something like this in 2021.

I believed the antivax discussion had been dropped in the early or mid 20th century.

After eradicating polio measles and so many other stupid diseases that used to kill people...

but nowadays they even believe in flat Earth, don't they?  

Thats quite a silly thing to say. Just because vaccinations have been successful in the past does not mean that vaccinations based on new, genetic technologies against novel viruses that have never existed before, are anywhere near safe. You can't blame people for being afraid of something that is completely new. And we should become test subjects for what? A virus which is about 2-3x deadlier than the common flu? Do you take flue shots every year? If the answer is no, then youre a hypocrite.

[Jet Cash]

Most of you guys are missing the point of this thread. My postulation is that refusal to allow vaccination during a pandemic is not anti-vaccination, but it is simply a reluctance to support the misuse of vaccination. The Covid vaccination mania has probably done considerable damage to the future use of vaccines, as more and more evidence appears to confirm that it is not protecting most people. Vaccines should be used to prevent infection, and not as a cure. Using them in a pandemic without checking to see if the are needed just creates variants, but, of course, that means that Pharma companies can continue to push"booster shots" to protect people from last year's virus.

You may also like to reflect on the reasons for withholding information on the need to aspirate when vaccinating. This is such a simple process, and would probably prevent many of the vaccine induced heart problems.

[Cnut237]

Vaccines should be used to prevent infection, and not as a cure.

That's what they're used for, yes. They're preventative. It's even in the official guidance: "Do not attend your vaccine appointment if you feel unwell with symptoms of coronavirus."

more and more evidence appears to confirm that it is not protecting most people.

Where is this evidence, though?
The vaccines aren't 100% effective, and protection wanes over time... neither of these things are in dispute. But I've not seen any evidence that the vaccines don't protect most people. You need to give sources and numbers, otherwise it may as well be a BADecker post.

[BADecker]

Vaccines should be used to prevent infection, and not as a cure.

That's what they're used for, yes. They're preventative. It's even in the official guidance: "Do not attend your vaccine appointment if you feel unwell with symptoms of coronavirus."

more and more evidence appears to confirm that it is not protecting most people.

Where is this evidence, though?
The vaccines aren't 100% effective, and protection wanes over time... neither of these things are in dispute. But I've not seen any evidence that the vaccines don't protect most people. You need to give sources and numbers, otherwise it may as well be a BADecker post.

The vaccines are highly effective.


The DEVOLUTION of covid vaccine efficacy - https://www.brighteon.com/3ea4b0ea-be58-405e-ba9b-1c684d97b5d8


Short video, 2 minutes 11 seconds. Hint: Slow it down as you are watching.

[yhiaali3]

Personally, I prefer nature over anything else, I prefer leaving my body to carry out its defensive tasks by strengthening the immune system naturally without taking the vaccine or other medications, the problem is not in the effectiveness of the vaccine against the Corona virus or not, but in the side effects that it can cause to the human body after a while. I do not know if this is true, but there are many who say that this vaccine causes other diseases that are no less dangerous than Corona disease, so they refuse to take it.
I'm with the natural methods in everything and I'm sure the human body has the credentials to defend itself with some natural help but if the vaccine is forcibly imposed by the government I'll have to take it.