Bitcoin Forum
May 13, 2024, 06:50:28 PM *
News: Latest Bitcoin Core release: 27.0 [Torrent]
 
   Home   Help Search Login Register More  
Pages: « 1 [2]  All
  Print  
Author Topic: Ultra-Low-Voltage Energy-Efficient Bitcoin Mining ASIC from Intel (23 Feb 2022)  (Read 1177 times)
mikeywith
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2226
Merit: 6382


be constructive or S.T.F.U


View Profile
January 26, 2022, 12:25:11 AM
 #21

So I'd say Intel put Bitmain to shame, destroying their efficiency # at the same node size right out of the gate.

Bitmain has a working product that intel does not have yet, personally, I can't take the above table any seriously until there is a finished product all of this is unreal, the chip level is the most important but there are many other factors, the production capacity and final cost are two important things that we can't ignore.

█▀▀▀











█▄▄▄
▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀
e
▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄
█████████████
████████████▄███
██▐███████▄█████▀
█████████▄████▀
███▐████▄███▀
████▐██████▀
█████▀█████
███████████▄
████████████▄
██▄█████▀█████▄
▄█████████▀█████▀
███████████▀██▀
████▀█████████
▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀
c.h.
▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄
▀▀▀█











▄▄▄█
▄██████▄▄▄
█████████████▄▄
███████████████
███████████████
███████████████
███████████████
███░░█████████
███▌▐█████████
█████████████
███████████▀
██████████▀
████████▀
▀██▀▀
1715626228
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1715626228

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1715626228
Reply with quote  #2

1715626228
Report to moderator
1715626228
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1715626228

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1715626228
Reply with quote  #2

1715626228
Report to moderator
According to NIST and ECRYPT II, the cryptographic algorithms used in Bitcoin are expected to be strong until at least 2030. (After that, it will not be too difficult to transition to different algorithms.)
Advertised sites are not endorsed by the Bitcoin Forum. They may be unsafe, untrustworthy, or illegal in your jurisdiction.
1715626228
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1715626228

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1715626228
Reply with quote  #2

1715626228
Report to moderator
1715626228
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1715626228

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1715626228
Reply with quote  #2

1715626228
Report to moderator
1715626228
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1715626228

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1715626228
Reply with quote  #2

1715626228
Report to moderator
wndsnb
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 544
Merit: 589


View Profile
January 26, 2022, 11:45:17 AM
Merited by mikeywith (2)
 #22

I'm expecting and hoping their end product is the chip, not a full miner. Let multiple integrators compete in the marketplace to build the best miner. But I can't really imagine they'd do a worse job than current miners out there if they did decide to market the end product. The failure rate on new gen miners although better than the 17 series still seems pretty awful. And the firmware sucks. Really, I just don't see how Intel could possibly do worse.



Have some dead Bitmain 17 series hashboards or full miners?
I'll buy them ... send me a PM with what you have and I'll make you an offer!
mikeywith
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2226
Merit: 6382


be constructive or S.T.F.U


View Profile
January 26, 2022, 04:26:59 PM
 #23

The failure rate on new gen miners although better than the 17 series still seems pretty awful. And the firmware sucks. Really, I just don't see how Intel could possibly do worse.

With custom firmware the S19 pro can easily do below 20w/th according to one of the devs at vnish, so efficiency wise i highly doubt intel chips will beat that. So the cost of final products will be the judge.

As far as quality is concerned, I have to agree with you, although most issues are beyond the chip level, so we do not really need new chips to lower that failure rate, we just need better "everything else".

Microbt seems to be the only manufaturer with proper quality control, even the new Avalons have high failure rate, it is annoying given how expensive these gears sell for.

█▀▀▀











█▄▄▄
▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀
e
▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄
█████████████
████████████▄███
██▐███████▄█████▀
█████████▄████▀
███▐████▄███▀
████▐██████▀
█████▀█████
███████████▄
████████████▄
██▄█████▀█████▄
▄█████████▀█████▀
███████████▀██▀
████▀█████████
▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀
c.h.
▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄
▀▀▀█











▄▄▄█
▄██████▄▄▄
█████████████▄▄
███████████████
███████████████
███████████████
███████████████
███░░█████████
███▌▐█████████
█████████████
███████████▀
██████████▀
████████▀
▀██▀▀
wndsnb
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 544
Merit: 589


View Profile
January 29, 2022, 02:02:21 PM
Last edit: February 18, 2022, 06:03:08 PM by wndsnb
 #24

With custom firmware the S19 pro can easily do below 20w/th according to one of the devs at vnish, so efficiency wise i highly doubt intel chips will beat that. So the cost of final products will be the judge.

Well, like you said previously, there isn't a full product out, or even a commercially available chip with specs published, so it's all just speculation at this point.

I don't doubt that below 20w/th is possible with the S19pro, but not every S19pro. Could be only one out of 10 can achieve that. Same for S17pros hitting 30w/th.





Our blockchain accelerator will ship later this year. We are engaged directly with customers that share our sustainability goals. Argo Blockchain, BLOCK (formerly known as Square) and GRIID Infrastructure are among our first customers for this upcoming product. This architecture is implemented on a tiny piece of silicon so that it has minimal impact to the supply of current products.


A couple of interesting tidbits of info in there. They've created a whole new group for doing projects like this.

Have some dead Bitmain 17 series hashboards or full miners?
I'll buy them ... send me a PM with what you have and I'll make you an offer!
NotFuzzyWarm
Legendary
*
Online Online

Activity: 3626
Merit: 2544


Evil beware: We have waffles!


View Profile
February 20, 2022, 01:16:34 AM
Last edit: March 26, 2022, 11:38:28 PM by NotFuzzyWarm
 #25

Folks here should realize that Intel is talking about Blockchain Technology in it's myriad of current and possible applications - NOT just Bitcoin.
From the news release:
Quote
We expect that our circuit innovations will deliver a blockchain accelerator that has over 1000x better performance per watt than mainstream GPUs for SHA-256 based mining.
GPU arrays are of course not used to mine BTC but they are used in blockchain-based logistics tracking applications, large scale Public Utility assets tracking, etc. that use blockchain tech for the records keeping.

- For bitcoin to succeed the community must police itself -    My info useful? Donations welcome! 1FuzzyWc2J8TMqeUQZ8yjE43Rwr7K3cxs9
 -Sole remaining active developer of cgminer, Kano's repo is here
-Support Sidehacks miner development. Donations to:   1BURGERAXHH6Yi6LRybRJK7ybEm5m5HwTr
HagssFIN
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2436
Merit: 1706


Electrical engineer. Mining since 2014.


View Profile WWW
February 20, 2022, 01:44:16 AM
 #26

Umm.. but as far as I've read,
BMZ1 and BMZ2 are confirmed as btc (sha-256) asics.

I heard that this info leaked a bit earlier than Intel intended,
and that they would have official launch this month (which means next week ?).

Usual order quantities are said to be in thousands (I don't know exact numbers, e.g. for MOQ ).

NotFuzzyWarm
Legendary
*
Online Online

Activity: 3626
Merit: 2544


Evil beware: We have waffles!


View Profile
February 20, 2022, 03:34:43 PM
Merited by vapourminer (1)
 #27

Umm.. but as far as I've read,
BMZ1 and BMZ2 are confirmed as btc (sha-256) asics.
...
Being sha-256 chips does not lock them into being for BTC. Most of the logistics tracking blockchain applications I've seen from IBM are all using sha-256.

That said they can certainly be used for mining BTC but until specs are released we have no way of knowing how they compare to existing chips from Bitmain, Canaan, et al. So far all Intel is saying is that "they are 1000x more efficient than GPU's"

- For bitcoin to succeed the community must police itself -    My info useful? Donations welcome! 1FuzzyWc2J8TMqeUQZ8yjE43Rwr7K3cxs9
 -Sole remaining active developer of cgminer, Kano's repo is here
-Support Sidehacks miner development. Donations to:   1BURGERAXHH6Yi6LRybRJK7ybEm5m5HwTr
DaveF
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 3472
Merit: 6271


Crypto Swap Exchange


View Profile WWW
February 21, 2022, 01:06:00 PM
 #28

Toms Hardware has a write up:
https://www.tomshardware.com/news/intel-details-its-bitcoin-mining-bonanza-mine-chips-and-systems

The 1st gen are essentially useless unless they are so dirt cheap as not to matter. If you can get the miner cheap enough then it might be worth it.

The 2nd gen looks like it might be a competitive product since there are big names buying it, but until more info is released it's all a guess.

-Dave


█▀▀▀











█▄▄▄
▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀
e
▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄
█████████████
████████████▄███
██▐███████▄█████▀
█████████▄████▀
███▐████▄███▀
████▐██████▀
█████▀█████
███████████▄
████████████▄
██▄█████▀█████▄
▄█████████▀█████▀
███████████▀██▀
████▀█████████
▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀
c.h.
▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄
▀▀▀█











▄▄▄█
▄██████▄▄▄
█████████████▄▄
███████████████
███████████████
███████████████
███████████████
███░░█████████
███▌▐█████████
█████████████
███████████▀
██████████▀
████████▀
▀██▀▀
mineozzie
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 5
Merit: 1


View Profile
February 26, 2022, 06:03:27 PM
Merited by vapourminer (1)
 #29

Some more details on the chip and it seems the Bonanza2 is behind S19 XP. Good news for existing miners!

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/intels-second-gen-bitcoin-miners-performance-and-pricing-listed
DaveF
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 3472
Merit: 6271


Crypto Swap Exchange


View Profile WWW
February 26, 2022, 09:15:02 PM
 #30

Some more details on the chip and it seems the Bonanza2 is behind S19 XP. Good news for existing miners!

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/intels-second-gen-bitcoin-miners-performance-and-pricing-listed

Just saw that. A bit less efficient then the S19j XP BUT if they are true to the marketing and the chips and miner are 1/2 the price then who cares.
And it's Intel. Might not be the best at all times, but their chips and miners are probably a lot better then everyone else.
Lets see how long till they come to market and we can actually buy them.

-Dave

█▀▀▀











█▄▄▄
▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀
e
▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄
█████████████
████████████▄███
██▐███████▄█████▀
█████████▄████▀
███▐████▄███▀
████▐██████▀
█████▀█████
███████████▄
████████████▄
██▄█████▀█████▄
▄█████████▀█████▀
███████████▀██▀
████▀█████████
▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀
c.h.
▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄
▀▀▀█











▄▄▄█
▄██████▄▄▄
█████████████▄▄
███████████████
███████████████
███████████████
███████████████
███░░█████████
███▌▐█████████
█████████████
███████████▀
██████████▀
████████▀
▀██▀▀
Larson311
Jr. Member
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 41
Merit: 2


View Profile
March 06, 2022, 09:11:41 AM
 #31

Do we know when those Intel miners gonna be available for sale?
HagssFIN
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2436
Merit: 1706


Electrical engineer. Mining since 2014.


View Profile WWW
March 06, 2022, 03:07:01 PM
 #32

I've not seen any exact release dates and possible distributor partners...

DaveF
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 3472
Merit: 6271


Crypto Swap Exchange


View Profile WWW
March 06, 2022, 03:32:27 PM
Merited by HagssFIN (2), mikeywith (2)
 #33

Not for a while. From what was discussed elsewhere, they are going to the big buyers 1st then to the smaller bulk then to distributors.
Till they trickle down to us will probably be months.
It's probably a smart move on their part. 1000s and 1000s of end users can be a nightmare to support, putting them in the hands of professionals 1st to find issues that can be dealt with in a data center environment with full time support engineers is probably better.

Unlike other manufacturers that let us do the beta testing of the products.

-Dave

█▀▀▀











█▄▄▄
▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀
e
▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄
█████████████
████████████▄███
██▐███████▄█████▀
█████████▄████▀
███▐████▄███▀
████▐██████▀
█████▀█████
███████████▄
████████████▄
██▄█████▀█████▄
▄█████████▀█████▀
███████████▀██▀
████▀█████████
▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀
c.h.
▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄
▀▀▀█











▄▄▄█
▄██████▄▄▄
█████████████▄▄
███████████████
███████████████
███████████████
███████████████
███░░█████████
███▌▐█████████
█████████████
███████████▀
██████████▀
████████▀
▀██▀▀
kano
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 4494
Merit: 1808


Linux since 1997 RedHat 4


View Profile
March 21, 2022, 08:32:32 AM
Merited by vapourminer (1)
 #34

...
It's probably a smart move on their part. 1000s and 1000s of end users can be a nightmare to support, putting them in the hands of professionals 1st to find issues that can be dealt with in a data center environment with full time support engineers is probably better.

Unlike other manufacturers that let us do the beta testing of the products.

-Dave

Alas from my (limited) experience, Intel is no better at this.
I've bought the parts and built myself, 2 servers - all up about $40k - (all intel: MB, CPU, Case, PSU but other party RAM) and had some interesting problems with them.
Specifically, the Intel motherboards:

First one the base firmware didn't spin the fans - at all - lots of overheating and hard shutdowns.
After discussing with them online for a while, it was indeed the MB needed a software update to fix it.
So while you could say it's my fault for not having done that at the start, I will point out that they had known about it for over a year, but they still didn't update the MB at the factory to fix this rather serious problem.

Second one couple years later, I bought the R version of the same MB due to getting a Xeon Gold 6258R (equivalent fastest 2nd gen CPU they sell)
Oddly enough though, it did not work at all.
It gave some weird light code that no one on the Intel board could identify (and not in the PDF manual)
Turns out that the firmware in the R version of the MB (that exists purely to support the 2nd gen R CPUs) didn't support the top of the line 6258R.
So since I fortunately had 2 Xeon Gold 6148 in the other MB, I took one out, put it in the new MB, booted fine, updated the MB, and now it works with the 6258R.
Had I not had a non R CPU on hand to update the MB, I would have been screwed and had to send it back to Intel to update it as it should have been to start with.

So, yeah, don't expect much from Intel either.
They do quite literally expect people to update faulty firmware themselves, and not ship it updated even if they know its a major problem.

Pool: https://kano.is - low 0.5% fee PPLNS 3 Days - Most reliable Solo with ONLY 0.5% fee   Bitcointalk thread: Forum
Discord support invite at https://kano.is/ Majority developer of the ckpool code - k for kano
The ONLY active original developer of cgminer. Original master git: https://github.com/kanoi/cgminer
a1 Hashrate LLC2022
Member
**
Offline Offline

Activity: 112
Merit: 83


View Profile
June 25, 2022, 02:00:14 PM
 #35

...
It's probably a smart move on their part. 1000s and 1000s of end users can be a nightmare to support, putting them in the hands of professionals 1st to find issues that can be dealt with in a data center environment with full time support engineers is probably better.

Unlike other manufacturers that let us do the beta testing of the products.

-Dave

Alas from my (limited) experience, Intel is no better at this.
I've bought the parts and built myself, 2 servers - all up about $40k - (all intel: MB, CPU, Case, PSU but other party RAM) and had some interesting problems with them.
Specifically, the Intel motherboards:

First one the base firmware didn't spin the fans - at all - lots of overheating and hard shutdowns.
After discussing with them online for a while, it was indeed the MB needed a software update to fix it.
So while you could say it's my fault for not having done that at the start, I will point out that they had known about it for over a year, but they still didn't update the MB at the factory to fix this rather serious problem.

Second one couple years later, I bought the R version of the same MB due to getting a Xeon Gold 6258R (equivalent fastest 2nd gen CPU they sell)
Oddly enough though, it did not work at all.
It gave some weird light code that no one on the Intel board could identify (and not in the PDF manual)
Turns out that the firmware in the R version of the MB (that exists purely to support the 2nd gen R CPUs) didn't support the top of the line 6258R.
So since I fortunately had 2 Xeon Gold 6148 in the other MB, I took one out, put it in the new MB, booted fine, updated the MB, and now it works with the 6258R.
Had I not had a non R CPU on hand to update the MB, I would have been screwed and had to send it back to Intel to update it as it should have been to start with.


So, yeah, don't expect much from Intel either.
They do quite literally expect people to update faulty firmware themselves, and not ship it updated even if they know its a major problem.

Yes more than one time with intel based gear I have had to have extra gear to update gear they sent with old firmware.

They had an issue with eth ports that was really hard to fix.

I have had issues where I had to use old keyboard with old wire designs . ie ps/2 port to alter firmware to allow for usb key boards.
Pages: « 1 [2]  All
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!