Master card, Paypal, America express suspending services to Russians

[_act_]

Because of the war going on in Ukraine as Russia invaded the country with the instruction from Russia's president, Vladimir Putin, US and EU have been sanctioning Russia in a way the country will not be able to fund the war as it continues. Payment companies in US are also going beyond business and they are suspending Russia because of the war it started. Master card, Paypal, America express are suspending services to Russian, Apple Pay and Google Pay have restricted services for some Russian also.

We all know that nothing can stop people from using bitcoin, all that is needed and difficult to be restricted or ban is p2p transaction which can be on decentralized or centralized exchanges. Some people are thinking this can be a way people will noticed p2p more and can be a way these U.S. credit card companies can be losing customers.

https://cointelegraph.com/news/no-credit-for-crypto-users-react-to-russia-issued-credit-card-ban

It is also suggested that this may later favour UnionPay which is a Chinese payment system. If Russia is getting less depending on US and EU, hope this will not later affect US and EU and be favoring China which is ready to make business deals with Russia? This is not about China but about how this will lot later affect US and EU.

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[paxmao]

Is great to know how these companies have decided to act. Many others will follow, as the outrage at the aggression in the West grows and firms are felling the pressure from the consumers.

Those that have publicly states that they will keep doing business in Putin's Russia (never let a few dead stop your profit), are now going to feel the wrath of the consumers. For example Japanese UNIQLO or even a global brand such as Danone. I think we should make them understand that you cannot do business with Putin and with the (reasonably) free world.

[24Kt]

Is great to know how these companies have decided to act. Many others will follow, as the outrage at the aggression in the West grows and firms are felling the pressure from the consumers.

Those that have publicly states that they will keep doing business in Putin's Russia (never let a few dead stop your profit), are now going to feel the wrath of the consumers. For example Japanese UNIQLO or even a global brand such as Danone. I think we should make them understand that you cannot do business with Putin and with the (reasonably) free world.

Yes, I read about the continuation of opening of UNIQLO stores in Russia, whereas, Zara and H&M already suspended its operation. However, the reasoning of Uniqlo is somewhat valid to me. As Russians should not be deprived of one of the basic needs, clothing. They are also humans to be treated fairly.

https://www.channelnewsasia.com/business/uniqlo-russia-stores-open-ukraine-invasion-clothes-2544661

I also believe that even if some of the big companies stop their operations in Russia, their leader, Putin, will not stop this destruction to Ukraine. So why deprive the innocent Russians to live with decency? Now, it is a matter of preferences here by the company how they will react on this invasion.

[KennyR]

It looks like Putin making plans to take control over the World, but things rivetted back. These large scale firms closing businesses on Russia greatly affects the common people and not Putin. Countries have begun to help Ukraine on humanitarian reasons, but there were no talks about Russia. To settle down it takes time, as more sanctions were imposed over Russia. What UNIQLO have done is something necessary for now. However without transaction support how things gonna workout even when stores open for business.

[verita1]

The war in Ukraine will affect us all, Europe will be the hardest hit.
It has already begun to be felt with the rise in oil prices, causing instability, there will be shortages and inflation will be just around the corner.
The strict measure of service suspension of Master Card, Visa and American Express has been necessary and more sanctions will come as pressure measures to weaken Putin's power.
We still don't know how this great attack on freedom will end.
Putin will continue to advance despite all the losses that the conflict entails.

[Darker45]

China has probably more important roles to play in the implication of this invasion than it may seem. While many think that China reaching out to Russia will not greatly diminish the effects of the sanctions imposed by the US, the EU, and their allies, it is clear how these sanctions are actually pushing Russia toward China for damage control. And China is more than willing to embrace Russia. China is clearly showing that she's on the side of the enemy.

There's the offer of UnionPay in lieu of Visa, Mastercard, and others. There's the CIPS system in lieu of SWIFT, although it might prove to be very challenging. There's the lifting on the restriction of Russian wheat imports. In line with this, there's the offer to import more wheat, barley, sunflower oil and other crops and agricultural products from Russia to counter the effects of the sanctions.

[iamsheikhadil]

I think it does more harm to US than Russia, these shut down of services doesn't really matter much in the greater context as these can but on a very small level can help on what is going on, there are so many alternatives of these services, and as you said, yeah, Chinese companies will get huge advantage by having their products and services in a large country like Russia. Hopefully everything settles down in a peaceful way!

[Retainly_Collie]

I think it does more harm to US than Russia, these shut down of services doesn't really matter much in the greater context as these can but on a very small level can help on what is going on, there are so many alternatives of these services, and as you said, yeah, Chinese companies will get huge advantage by having their products and services in a large country like Russia. Hopefully everything settles down in a peaceful way!

But the tension has only just begun, the way the economic sanctions sanctions go back and forth between the parties will increase the tension, I believe it will be difficult for a country to accept more losses in terms of benefits.
Perhaps the war will take a long time and we will still suffer many other damage effects. And perhaps with this event, it is undisputed to see that China will be the country that benefits a lot after this event.

[Argoo]

It looks like Putin making plans to take control over the World, but things rivetted back. These large scale firms closing businesses on Russia greatly affects the common people and not Putin. Countries have begun to help Ukraine on humanitarian reasons, but there were no talks about Russia. To settle down it takes time, as more sanctions were imposed over Russia. What UNIQLO have done is something necessary for now. However without transaction support how things gonna workout even when stores open for business.

It is very difficult for the civilized world to directly influence Putin, who is in his bunker in the Urals. The applied sanctions should fully affect all the processes taking place in the state, including the citizens of Russia. The sanctions should have a significant impact on the citizens of Russia themselves, so that they stop supporting him and overthrow their dictator themselves. Other states cannot interfere in the internal affairs of the Russian Federation, and the people of Russia, according to the Constitution, are the bearer of power. The President of the country is only an official who must perform his functions within the framework of the powers granted to him by the people. If something is wrong with the president of a country, the people of that country should bear responsibility first of all.

[so98nn]

Well one thing can stop bitcoin from being traded in the Russia. It’s p2p failure when Russian people will start trading person to person because they won’t be having anyone within Russia to do as they all have their fiat options turned off. No cards, wallets and bank restrictions etc oh man they are screwed right there.

Plus if they start p2p overseas then that is also not useful because if major companies are taking such bold steps by blocking them then it can’t be done with other peeps too.

So for example I won’t be helping them in rage of war and won’t accept the p2p trade. Not sure what happens now, they can’t do cryptos as well.

[Lucius]

The EU depends (currently) on Russian gas more than anyone else and, despite sanctions, still buys gas from Russia and directly finances the war against Ukraine. That will change with the arrival of warmer weather, but winter is still present and the EU has no choice but to be in this situation.

Another thing is the EU's exports to Russia, which in 2020 amounted to $89.75 billion, which is the lowest since 2016, and far less than in 2012 or 2013. From this point of view, we can see that exports from the EU have decreased significantly (around 50%) in the past 10 years.

It should be emphasized that Russia is a market of only 150 million people, which is more than twice less than the US (330 million) or the EU, which has about 500 million people, so I think that Russia is losing much more in the current situation than EU&US. All these companies that withdraw from the Russian market will undoubtedly lose part of their profits, but data from 2018 say that about 40% of Russians live in poverty (data from 2018), so most people are poor and live on very little money - while on the other hand, a small percentage of people enjoy immense wealth.

How poor is Russia? According to Rosstat, 18.1 million Russians or 12.3% of the population were living in poverty in 2019. That at least is the national average, but the poverty level varies widely across the 85 federal subjects – between 5.6% and 34.7%. The ‘poor’ are defined as those who live in households in which total income is less than the legal minimum subsistence level that constitutes the lower threshold of what is considered essential for physical survival. In 2021, the country’s monthly subsistence minimum is set at 11,653 roubles (approximately US$157 as of 1 January 2021)...Taking this subjective subsistence minimum as the baseline, almost 40% of all people in Russia lived in poverty in 2018.

[oHnK]

Because of the war going on in Ukraine as Russia invaded the country with the instruction from Russia's president, Vladimir Putin, US and EU have been sanctioning Russia in a way the country will not be able to fund the war as it continues. Payment companies in US are also going beyond business and they are suspending Russia because of the war it started. Master card, Paypal, America express are suspending services to Russian, Apple Pay and Google Pay have restricted services for some Russian also.

We all know that nothing can stop people from using bitcoin, all that is needed and difficult to be restricted or ban is p2p transaction which can be on decentralized or centralized exchanges. Some people are thinking this can be a way people will noticed p2p more and can be a way these U.S. credit card companies can be losing customers.

https://cointelegraph.com/news/no-credit-for-crypto-users-react-to-russia-issued-credit-card-ban

It is also suggested that this may later favour UnionPay which is a Chinese payment system. If Russia is getting less depending on US and EU, hope this will not later affect US and EU and be favoring China which is ready to make business deals with Russia? This is not about China but about how this will lot later affect US and EU.

The sanction will not affect for Russia because before the president decided to invade Ukraine, They have mitigate all of the worst possibilities which can happen in their country. Even before the war is begun, Russia has been restricted or banned in several economic regulations. This is not the new thing for their government, They will continue invade until Ukraine feel give up.

[paxmao]

Is great to know how these companies have decided to act. Many others will follow, as the outrage at the aggression in the West grows and firms are felling the pressure from the consumers.

Those that have publicly states that they will keep doing business in Putin's Russia (never let a few dead stop your profit), are now going to feel the wrath of the consumers. For example Japanese UNIQLO or even a global brand such as Danone. I think we should make them understand that you cannot do business with Putin and with the (reasonably) free world.

Yes, I read about the continuation of opening of UNIQLO stores in Russia, whereas, Zara and H&M already suspended its operation. However, the reasoning of Uniqlo is somewhat valid to me. As Russians should not be deprived of one of the basic needs, clothing. They are also humans to be treated fairly.

...
I also believe that even if some of the big companies stop their operations in Russia, their leader, Putin, will not stop this destruction to Ukraine. So why deprive the innocent Russians to live with decency? Now, it is a matter of preferences here by the company how they will react on this invasion.

UNIQLO does not sell first necessity items at all. Putin's citizens will certainly have their own Russian brands that can perfectly serve those basic needs. This is not about depriving the Russians from anything, they are not at risk of being "underdressed", it is about not doing business whose taxes are paying for Putin's wars.

The two I have mentioned have entered my black list forever, not only for their decisions, but for their cynic arguments and for considering me stupid.

I am particularly surprised by UNIQLO since a Japanese brand should much better understand what is to have Russia nearby..

[adaseb]

A lot of these companies are doing these sanctions because if they don’t they get very bad press. Look at what happened with McDonalds, CocaCola and Pepsi last week. They were petitions to boycott these companies because they still did business in Russia. So eventually they finally decided to stop operations.

Mcdonalds I think closed all the corporate locations and is still paying the workers even though they are still closed which is nice. However now there are talks that all these companies that leave will become nationalized and reopen. Which seems like a very risky move on their part.

[Wexnident]

Not unexpected, more companies would probably follow the same moves if the issue persists much longer. The bigger they are, the bigger the backlash they could receive if they continued on ignoring the issue right now, they at least have to show some bit of action towards supporting Ukraine. The current thing is Russia is kind of trying to stand with China to create a power to combat the US, and China right now is letting things happen so that Russia has no way but to come to them at the end, which is what they wanted, but with this, it's like they're the dominant power in the relationship.

[fiulpro]

Since the suspension of the services there have been huge probelms for the people who are residing in Russia. From the big line at the train stations to them not being able to use international transactions, it's making so much worse for people who are living there and with Russia planning to go whole North Korea, the government might not even let the Russians use any international softwares or any sort that is exactly why, many Russians are fleeing the country as well.

People are using bitcoins and other cryptocurrencies to tackle with this situation as well, the government said there is no expiration date on the sanctions against Russia which does mean that it can make things even worse for the economy and the people.

Companies have to look for local options and at th same time make things easier for their own economy.

They have to develop their own software, but I do not have extra apathy for Russian people since am from Ukraine and 75% of them voted that Russia should attack Ukranine, still kudos to the ones who are trying to be the voice of ukranians.

[hatshepsut93]

Visa and Mastercard don't process international payments with Russia, but they still process domestic payments, so it's not as devastating as it may seem. There are so many payment methods in the world, that I'm sure those in Russia who are motivated enough will find ways to send and receive money abroad.

[Kakmakr]

I am not really worried about the US (Credit card companies) losing their Russian customers, because that is the price you have to pay when you chose sides. You can either make huge profits from the Russians and lose the respect of your other customers world wide and then lose them... or you can cut your losses from the Russians and keep the rest.

So.... their hands are forced.... it is a business decision and not a moral decision. That is why Bitcoin is not pulled into a decision making position.. because there are not a centralized organization that are forced to make these decisions.  

[livingfree]

Visa and Mastercard don't process international payments with Russia, but they still process domestic payments, so it's not as devastating as it may seem. There are so many payment methods in the world, that I'm sure those in Russia who are motivated enough will find ways to send and receive money abroad.

They have already found one through China's Union Pay.

https://www.businessinsider.com/russian-banks-could-tap-unionpay-to-reconnect-payments-ecosystem-2022-3

https://www.protocol.com/newsletters/protocol-fintech/unionpay-russia

That's even all of those payment methods suspend all of their services to Russia, still, Russia will find another company that's willing to cater those suspended service that has cut their operation on their country.

[AmoreJaz]

Visa and Mastercard don't process international payments with Russia, but they still process domestic payments, so it's not as devastating as it may seem. There are so many payment methods in the world, that I'm sure those in Russia who are motivated enough will find ways to send and receive money abroad.

They have already found one through China's Union Pay.

https://www.businessinsider.com/russian-banks-could-tap-unionpay-to-reconnect-payments-ecosystem-2022-3

https://www.protocol.com/newsletters/protocol-fintech/unionpay-russia

That's even all of those payment methods suspend all of their services to Russia, still, Russia will find another company that's willing to cater those suspended service that has cut their operation on their country.

i read also that a lot of Russians are now requesting to open Chinese bank accounts. this war seems to be promoting the chinese yuan and Chinese for sure welcome this kind of development. they are benefitting from this situation.
and yes, some of these international payment methods may stop operations in Russia but they will always find another alternative to cater their needs. it is not a dead end here. though it may have an immediate impact but sooner or later, they will adopt to this change.