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Author Topic: Russia Was Prepared to Withstand Sanctions. Why Wasn't Europe Prepared to Impose  (Read 788 times)
Ultegra134
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April 01, 2022, 08:45:46 PM
 #21

The US and Eastern Europe has been criticizing the growing dependence on Russian fossil fuels for a long time. But Western Europe wanted to reduce American influence, and they believed that they can contain Russian aggression by being friendly. They miscalculated heavily, because Putin viewed friendliness as softness and invitation for more aggression.

I wouldn't say that Russia was fully prepared for sanctions. A significant part of their 600 billion reserves got frozen, because it was held in the west. Russia heavily relies on imported components for manufacturing nearly anything, so their military-industrial complex got hit very hard with sanctions.

Also, the full effect of sanctions will become clear in 1-2 years. But some of the Russian top officials already admitted that they didn't expect sanctions to be this harsh.
The point is that these sanctions are hurting the West too, I'm not sure if we could possibly compare which side had the largest losses, however, I could easily name a couple. Firstly, Europe will lose a significant amount of Russian tourists, here in Greece we had at least 250,000 cancellations, with more to come in the next upcoming months.

Moreover, the rising fueling costs are creating a vicious cycle of increased prices, in all kind of goods, which we'll be facing for the upcoming future.

R


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April 01, 2022, 09:12:54 PM
 #22

The Russia was the powerful country as like America, China. So other country was not starting war against this two. All the country including America, they just doing financial support to the war for Ukraine. But still Russia moving up with the strategies. And the people of many developing country was suffering a lot now.The reason for this was very simple.The oil price was keep on increasing in most developing countries

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April 01, 2022, 09:51:08 PM
 #23

Every governments just focused on their temporary goals and spend more time on how to keep their place in the next election meanwhile Putin had some long term goals and still doing it in the more effective ways that is why western countries still dependent on the Russia's oil while they may brought some alternative to that but now they will prepare for it but again it will take a decade until that Russia has the power.

You know there is a saying that when a man is over fed a child, there is high tendency they may misbehave at some point if you don't caution them. That's exactly the case of Russia and the rest of the world. He is not even afraid been involved in a war by putting innocent military who left children and wife's at home.
I really want to see him live the office by 2024 but seeing what he has started, he would want to stay another 6 years to continue his tyranny life and slavery. War ended before I was born, let's protect the Youngs ones the way we were shielded by our fathers.

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April 01, 2022, 10:38:46 PM
 #24

The Russia was the powerful country as like America, China. So other country was not starting war against this two. All the country including America, they just doing financial support to the war for Ukraine. But still Russia moving up with the strategies. And the people of many developing country was suffering a lot now.The reason for this was very simple.The oil price was keep on increasing in most developing countries
In this war, Russia and Ukraine were directly involved, but many people did not realize that behind the back there were several countries that were indirectly involved, namely those you have mentioned, both the United States and China.
indeed this war has an impact on many things, one of which is the most pronounced is the price of oil,
oil prices are really crazy and hope it can go down soon

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April 02, 2022, 05:38:30 AM
 #25

US national debt
https://www.usdebtclock.org/
America built the most powerful economy in the world because it bought resources and the best specialists in the world with printed dollars.
For many years, Russia was a colony that sold its resources cheaply, and now these sanctions hit the European economy even more painfully.


Not more painfully, might be equal at best. You under estimate how bad the Russian economy is doing, and they were already on track to default on any loans that were outstanding. The sanctions really just weaken USD as a global currency reserve, but that's been discussed a lot. Frankly, even without war the inflation rate would have caused it to sink so the sanctions could've been independent of it's decline.

Europe's issue is with their energy policy, and the radicals there would rather implement green technology (largely inefficient) instead of looking towards other sources. Sanction Russian energy, where else do they get heat for their homes?
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April 02, 2022, 11:27:22 AM
Merited by Darker45 (1)
 #26

The Russia was the powerful country as like America, China. So other country was not starting war against this two. All the country including America, they just doing financial support to the war for Ukraine. But still Russia moving up with the strategies. And the people of many developing country was suffering a lot now.The reason for this was very simple.The oil price was keep on increasing in most developing countries
In this war, Russia and Ukraine were directly involved, but many people did not realize that behind the back there were several countries that were indirectly involved, namely those you have mentioned, both the United States and China.
indeed this war has an impact on many things, one of which is the most pronounced is the price of oil,
oil prices are really crazy and hope it can go down soon

I'm ready to disappoint you .. China, the USA, it's all "far-fetched", or is the result of what started not a month ago. I am a citizen of Ukraine, and for many years, since 2000, I worked in a company whose office was in Donetsk. So I inform you - since 2000 (and possibly earlier), Russia has been actively promoting the idea of ​​a "Russian world" in Ukraine, especially in regions where most of the population was once resettled from the RSFSR on the territory of Ukraine, where before that, Soviet power destroyed the local population. Yes, you guessed it - these are today's territories where the virtual states of the DPR / LPR have been created. I am sure that the same work was carried out in Belarus, and possibly in other countries that were once part of the USSR. And all why? Because the insane Kremlin dwarf suddenly decided that he is the messiah, and must collect back all "the republics of the USSR and recreate it anew!". Those. revive the corpse, and create, from the forcibly assembled "republics" of a sort of Frankenstein monster. You laugh in vain! There was no USA and China, there was and is a crazy aging under-alpha male, with complexes not even of Napoleon, but of God! And all these "official" reasons for starting a new round of war against Ukraine, like joining NATO or threatening Russia, are bluff and fakes!


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April 02, 2022, 04:37:47 PM
 #27

I'm ready to disappoint you .. China, the USA, it's all "far-fetched", or is the result of what started not a month ago. I am a citizen of Ukraine, and for many years, since 2000, I worked in a company whose office was in Donetsk. So I inform you - since 2000 (and possibly earlier), Russia has been actively promoting the idea of ​​a "Russian world" in Ukraine, especially in regions where most of the population was once resettled from the RSFSR on the territory of Ukraine, where before that, Soviet power destroyed the local population. Yes, you guessed it - these are today's territories where the virtual states of the DPR / LPR have been created. I am sure that the same work was carried out in Belarus, and possibly in other countries that were once part of the USSR.
I do not know what he meant, but I can tell you that there is a "hidden" involvement as in when the west sanctions Russia because of what they did, and china helping Russia economically. So, it is not like other nations caused the war (or maybe they did, I wouldn't know) but more mainly it is about how nations took sides when this war started.

We are all standing with you, we believe you are the innocent party and Russia (well mainly Putin) needs to be though a lesson and I am sure that you will win this one, I really pray to god every day that you guys come out safe and as little death as possible. This means I support you, this also means my nation does as well, and few other nations, that is what people mean when indirect involvement.

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April 02, 2022, 05:31:16 PM
 #28

The pandemic is one of the primary reasons why most people didn't expect Russia to launch this war against Ukraine in my opinion. Their economy got screwed too just like the rest of the world which is why Putin doing this when their economy is in recovery mode is bizarre.

All blame should only be directed at pathetic Putin instead of pointing fingers at each other which is exactly what he wants.

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April 02, 2022, 06:12:48 PM
 #29

Op's right that Russians are quite ready for material deprivation, so they can keep surviving and even possibly supporting the war while being under sanctions. However, that doesn't apply to all of them, as quite a few, who live in big cities, are accustomed to using smartphones and PCs, buying good Western clothes, occasionally travelling abroad etc., and they'll probably become increasingly more unhappy. As for European countries, it's unfortunately true that they made themselves more dependent on Russia instead of doing the opposite. But Lithuania today demonstrated very bravely that it's abandoning Russian gas, even though it highly depends on it. If more EU countries demonstrate such strength, this can truly cripple the Russian economy, not really leaving money for the costly war. It's a risk, it's a gamble, but the EU won't freeze to death, and there's half a year ahead to figure out potential heating solutions, as well as bring about the end of the war which can be followed, after Russia fully withdraws troops and agrees to pay heavy reparations, by lifting embargoes.

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April 02, 2022, 08:51:39 PM
 #30

I don't think Europe actually envisage this war and the dimension it's taking, otherwise they would have longed source for alternative energy from Russia. Putin knew directly fighting him would mean hell, he knew it would be economic war, so he was better prepared.

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April 03, 2022, 05:09:20 PM
Merited by The Sceptical Chymist (5), Darker45 (1), 1miau (1)
 #31

I'm ready to disappoint you .. China, the USA, it's all "far-fetched", or is the result of what started not a month ago. I am a citizen of Ukraine, and for many years, since 2000, I worked in a company whose office was in Donetsk. So I inform you - since 2000 (and possibly earlier), Russia has been actively promoting the idea of ​​a "Russian world" in Ukraine, especially in regions where most of the population was once resettled from the RSFSR on the territory of Ukraine, where before that, Soviet power destroyed the local population. Yes, you guessed it - these are today's territories where the virtual states of the DPR / LPR have been created. I am sure that the same work was carried out in Belarus, and possibly in other countries that were once part of the USSR.
I do not know what he meant, but I can tell you that there is a "hidden" involvement as in when the west sanctions Russia because of what they did, and china helping Russia economically. So, it is not like other nations caused the war (or maybe they did, I wouldn't know) but more mainly it is about how nations took sides when this war started.

We are all standing with you, we believe you are the innocent party and Russia (well mainly Putin) needs to be though a lesson and I am sure that you will win this one, I really pray to god every day that you guys come out safe and as little death as possible. This means I support you, this also means my nation does as well, and few other nations, that is what people mean when indirect involvement.

First of all, thank you so much for your words of support! For us it is very important and expensive !!!
Well, everything else - yes, I agree that the world is now much more multipolar than it was before. In addition, it seems to me that the world has lost, or greatly reduced moral and ethical standards. Now any idiot who owns nuclear weapons can blackmail and demand from the whole world whatever he wants. Others can support criminal regimes under the guise of "their interests". You can list many more "oddities of the modern world" ... And it seems to me that if the situation is not changed, there will be no change of leaders, there will be a total destruction of the world as such.
Now we stood, or are still standing, on the threshold of a great world war. So far, Ukraine is holding back the crazy killer from the borders of the EU, paying for it all with tens of thousands of lives of its citizens. I really believe that we will be able to stop this horde and win the war. But I would really like for all this to become a lesson for the rest of the world, so that countries, rulers, peoples draw the appropriate conclusions and change.
I wish you all peace, prosperity and tranquility!

...AoBT...
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yawars20
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April 03, 2022, 06:53:08 PM
 #32

From the last cold war Russia was always ready to take aggressive actions and Ukraine was one f victims to Russian aggression.
Now from last few months the aggression toward Ukraine from Russian forces now show clear perspective of  Russia.
Its not first time when a superior country invade there neighbor country over territory issue or any other in past we say many other countries do the same.
If westerns country try to impose any sanctions to Russia over this, they also have to take action against other countries doing the same. I can't understand there hypocrisy level.
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April 03, 2022, 07:45:04 PM
 #33

The author of this piece goes on to criticize europe for not greening its economy to become less reliant on russian oil. I myself am not a fan of these bold criticisms, unless they come before hindsight being 20/20.
I'm going to play devil's advocate here and ask this: Could you think of a better time to criticize Europe for not lessening its dependence on Russian oil?  Had the author written that prior to the current invasion (and I'm not even sure he didn't), what impact do you suppose it would have had?  None as far as I would predict, because as you pointed out, hindsight is indeed 20/20--and in addition to that, the criticism would probably just come off as inflammatory rhetoric against Russia.

The way I see it is that it's the big global oil companies that are standing in the way of greener energy consumption, and until their stranglehold over car manufacturers and every other industry that currently relies on oil and oil byproducts is loosened, we're never going to see cities powered by solar energy and roads filled with nothing but electric cars.  And none of that is Russia's fault alone, of course.  There's a hell of a lot of blame to go around, and you don't even have to look that far to find the culprits.


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April 03, 2022, 10:43:06 PM
 #34

I don't think Europe actually envisage this war and the dimension it's taking, otherwise they would have longed source for alternative energy from Russia. Putin knew directly fighting him would mean hell, he knew it would be economic war, so he was better prepared.

Putin is only priding himself on the Oil and gas that he is supplying to Europe and what happens if at the time of this heat of war, they get another supplier, Russia will be subjected to more sanctions and the experience wi!l be very bad for the Russian economy and people. Europe actually didn't see that it will get into this and that Russia won't have to cut off supply from them.
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April 03, 2022, 10:54:23 PM
Last edit: April 04, 2022, 02:44:41 AM by coupable
 #35

The war has gone into it second month and yet no solution is coming to resolve the war for peace and stability to return into the area and production of Oil and gas to be restored. Prices are going high and people are suffering. They are discussing to evaquate civilians and that suppose to mean more fight ? This is alarming, refugees are created and destabilizing the other countries that are neighbours. Russia is showing EU that it is more prepared for the war but this has to stop.

This explains that the war from the beginning was not of a military nature and that Russia has been preparing for almost the past decade to confront the West in an attempt to expand its influence, similar to what the Soviet Union was in the past.
Economic war in the form of mutual sanctions directly affects all economies of the world, which have become closely related to each other. Note that the most profited country in the actual economic situation is China by its power to not enforce sanctions against Russia as the world can't apply other sanctions to China due to their vital needs from China .
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April 03, 2022, 11:17:08 PM
 #36

I don't think Europe actually envisage this war and the dimension it's taking, otherwise they would have longed source for alternative energy from Russia. Putin knew directly fighting him would mean hell, he knew it would be economic war, so he was better prepared.

Putin is only priding himself on the Oil and gas that he is supplying to Europe and what happens if at the time of this heat of war, they get another supplier, Russia will be subjected to more sanctions and the experience wi!l be very bad for the Russian economy and people. Europe actually didn't see that it will get into this and that Russia won't have to cut off supply from them.
Things are unpredictable with them, but now that Russia is backing out in some parts of Ukraine, I believe the sanctions can be lessen now and reconciliation are more possible to happen. Russia have a huge natural sources that EU countries need, but of course other supplies can still be get from other country its just that they have to adjust for the cost of it and deal with it. This is the consequences of many greedy countries, at the expense of ordinary people.
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April 03, 2022, 11:25:18 PM
Merited by Darker45 (1)
 #37

and the winner will be China 🇨🇳

If Putin survives he will be China’s big bitch and North Korea 🇰🇵 will remain China’s little bitch.

I give  a China Russia North Korea axis of power about a 90% shot of happening.

Putting pressure on Japan,South Korea and Taiwan


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April 04, 2022, 02:15:06 AM
 #38

I agree that the western countries and their allies were caught unprepared. And it's primarily because they probably thought it was unimaginable for Russia to invade Ukraine. To take a contested territory would be possible but to invade the entire country was perhaps out of their minds. This is the modern era, after all. They probably failed in their assessment of Putin. They simply underestimated his madness.

On Russia's side, however, I also don't think they were prepared. They definitely underestimated Ukraine and its defense capabilities. They overestimated their troops' capabilities. They underestimated the allies' reaction. If they were preparing for this war for the last decade or so, they should have pulled out their huge sums of money from European banks prior to the attack. They should already have detached themselves from SWIFT. They should have established much stronger markets outside the enemies' territories. Their oligarchs should have already been warned earlier of the possible sanctions.

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April 04, 2022, 09:20:10 AM
 #39

I agree that the western countries and their allies were caught unprepared. And it's primarily because they probably thought it was unimaginable for Russia to invade Ukraine. To take a contested territory would be possible but to invade the entire country was perhaps out of their minds. This is the modern era, after all. They probably failed in their assessment of Putin. They simply underestimated his madness.

On Russia's side, however, I also don't think they were prepared. They definitely underestimated Ukraine and its defense capabilities. They overestimated their troops' capabilities. They underestimated the allies' reaction. If they were preparing for this war for the last decade or so, they should have pulled out their huge sums of money from European banks prior to the attack. They should already have detached themselves from SWIFT. They should have established much stronger markets outside the enemies' territories. Their oligarchs should have already been warned earlier of the possible sanctions.

Russia has lost its adviser to you. Only you could tell her what she should have done and what she shouldn't have done. And Putin, whom you think is crazy, has put Europe in an uncomfortable position today. Although grain supplies will also run out soon, which will make you think a little differently since I think that the lack of gas does not reflect on you.
Did you hear Biden let it slip? Not? He advised everyone not to worry, that any military situation is always in America's interest. But what about Europe, everyone will ask? Biden doesn't care. America supports war always only in its own interests.
Therefore, one should not consider people who lead countries as idiots, everything was calculated long ago, since these disagreements were not born a month ago. Russia knew what to expect and from whom, and as you can see, it was ready for anything.

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April 04, 2022, 01:53:01 PM
 #40

I agree that the western countries and their allies were caught unprepared. And it's primarily because they probably thought it was unimaginable for Russia to invade Ukraine. To take a contested territory would be possible but to invade the entire country was perhaps out of their minds. This is the modern era, after all. They probably failed in their assessment of Putin. They simply underestimated his madness.

On Russia's side, however, I also don't think they were prepared. They definitely underestimated Ukraine and its defense capabilities. They overestimated their troops' capabilities. They underestimated the allies' reaction. If they were preparing for this war for the last decade or so, they should have pulled out their huge sums of money from European banks prior to the attack. They should already have detached themselves from SWIFT. They should have established much stronger markets outside the enemies' territories. Their oligarchs should have already been warned earlier of the possible sanctions.

Russia has lost its adviser to you. Only you could tell her what she should have done and what she shouldn't have done. And Putin, whom you think is crazy, has put Europe in an uncomfortable position today. Although grain supplies will also run out soon, which will make you think a little differently since I think that the lack of gas does not reflect on you.
Did you hear Biden let it slip? Not? He advised everyone not to worry, that any military situation is always in America's interest. But what about Europe, everyone will ask? Biden doesn't care. America supports war always only in its own interests.
Therefore, one should not consider people who lead countries as idiots, everything was calculated long ago, since these disagreements were not born a month ago. Russia knew what to expect and from whom, and as you can see, it was ready for anything.

Sanctions can only do so much. We all know that. I doubt it can fully convert a country. Heavily-sanctioned countries like North Korea, Venezuela, Cuba, Iran, and others are still standing on their feet. Russia is apparently richer than these countries so we won't be expecting it to bow down either. However, this doesn't mean that they're ready or have prepared for it. It's just that crazy leaders like Kim Jong Un and Putin couldn't care less about sanctions. These sanctions are not taking any luxury or power from them. Neither Kim nor Maduro nor Putin is deprived of a sumptuous meal because of their madness. But their people are.

More than a month since the invasion, instead of successfully taking over Ukraine, setbacks are now seen. I am certain that even with another month of extension in this foolishness, Russia will not be able to take Ukraine despite all the propaganda that they have calculated and are ready for everything. And I am very much willing to put my money where my mouth is. I am willing to bet for this. Are you?

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