Profits from gambling with crypto (UK tax question)

[pfhismgrpg]

Hi,

In the tax year just gone I have made around £40,000 via gambling on crypto betting websites. £30,000 of this I have converted into GBP and withdrawn from my crypto wallet to my bank account.

Two questions:

1) Do I need to pay any CGT on this (my profits from the general appreciation of crypto is minimal - less than £500)

2) If I don’t need to pay tax due it being gambling winnings rather than crypto profit, how do I prove this. A lot of my betting accounts have been closed (and therefore I cannot login to them) thus making it hard for me to prove to HMRC that my transactions have come from gambling winnings.

Thanks

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[mindrust]

I guess you can't ignore the whole situation since you have withdrawn the money to your bank account already. If they insist on learning the source of you income I guess you'll have to throw at them whatever you got. Send your transaction records on the block chain. You should have that much at least. I don't think they'll make it a big fuss since you are willingly reporting your income.

[DoublerHunter]

^ I dont know how the taxation rate in the UK since I did not live there but based on my small research there is a minimum amount before you will entitle to pay tax. Probably you need to read this and disregard it if this is not helpful to you. https://www.income-tax.co.uk/how-much-tax-do-you-pay-on-minimum-wage/. As said above, since you will withdraw from your bank account, you should pay taxes and there is nothing you can do with that since you are using a centralized gambling casino and you bind your bank account to them. That is why many people prefer to use gambling casinos that does not have KYC verification and they use cryptocurrency to bypass the tax.

[jcojci]

You should ask your local authority about profits from gambling with crypto. We could answer but still, we do not know which is right and it is better to ask your authority that knows the matter precisely.

[Agbe]

Hi,

In the tax year just gone I have made around £40,000 via gambling on crypto betting websites. £30,000 of this I have converted into GBP and withdrawn from my crypto wallet to my bank account.

Two questions:

1) Do I need to pay any CGT on this (my profits from the general appreciation of crypto is minimal - less than £500)

2) If I don’t need to pay tax due it being gambling winnings rather than crypto profit, how do I prove this. A lot of my betting accounts have been closed (and therefore I cannot login to them) thus making it hard for me to prove to HMRC that my transactions have come from gambling winnings.

Thanks

From your statement, you have already withdrawn 99% of wins or profits. It is only 1% that is left. You should thank God that the bank even allowed you to withdraw to that amount because must bank would not allow you to withdraw that percentage without collecting their share.  Though I can't make any reasonable contribution because I not your Country, and I don't know your Country's tax rate in a specific amount of money from withdrawing. But that not withstanding, for your first question, I will say yes. Because I believe your Country operates capitalism system, in which the bank is own by an individual, which the management would used the tax you paid to pay workers, maintenance and others expenses. As for the second question. In anything you do in life, there are terms and conditions. Probably you violated the terms and conditions in the sites that is why your account has been blocked. I believe your transactions are still in your phone or email. Both the ones transfer from your gambling accounts to your local accounts. Those are good proves.

[michellee]

Does the tax office in your country ask you to pay the taxes? If so, you can show that you got the money from gambling and explain that you can no longer log in to the site. If they do not ask anything, maybe you don't need to explain anything to them and wait for a call from your bank. They will call you if they want to ask for an explanation of the sources of the funds you receive.

If you don't have to pay taxes for it, you don't have to explain anything to your bank unless they ask you to. As long as your bank doesn't ask you anything about the source of your funds, you can stay silent. I do not know how the tax payment process is in your country.

[Eureka_07]

Hi,

In the tax year just gone I have made around £40,000 via gambling on crypto betting websites. £30,000 of this I have converted into GBP and withdrawn from my crypto wallet to my bank account.
<snip>

Hello,

I believe the taxation varies depending on your income and on what country you're at. I'm guessing that you're from UK since you said that you converted most of your winnings to GPB.
I'm not well knowledgeable about the laws and the taxation in your country, but I tried searching and found a guide: UK Crypto Tax Guide 2022 from coindesk article.

From this article you it says that you can get taxed from these different scenarios:

• Buying and selling crypto
• When you’re paid in crypto
• Mining and validating
• Airdrops
• Crypto you inherit
• DeFi protocols

However, it still depends solely on how much you've profited for you to be taxed from it.

I believe this is the official site where you can see the manual/document about the crypto taxation in UK.
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/tax-on-cryptoassets

<snip>
2) If I don’t need to pay tax due it being gambling winnings rather than crypto profit, how do I prove this. A lot of my betting accounts have been closed (and therefore I cannot login to them) thus making it hard for me to prove to HMRC that my transactions have come from gambling winnings.

Is it possible to contact and have a discussion to the casinos supports/admin/owners about that? If so, then that can be resolved. OR probably, you can just use the blockchain transactions as your proof.

[zidanw]

It mainly depends on what kind of site you are active on. If you have a site in the UK where you have to provide all the details, you could run into problems with this tax. But if you are playing on a crypto site without KYC and with a different license, then it might seem wiser to me not to give up at all. Unless all earnings are legal and you don't mind paying taxes. I've also read that there are countries where you don't have to pay taxes if you win money there.

[ajochems]

The crypto profit in gambling is ever unstoppable.Because all you need is two things,One is knowledge on crypto currency.Secondly the process of luck.If both the things sync to you,you will be the next millionaire in the crypto currency.You need to find the correct crypto currency gambling betting website.If you wrongly selected the website,then it may force you to lose some money.

[goaldigger]

I’ve heard a recent news about tax updates in UK, and since OP did a transactions thru his bank I think he is only subjected for income tax since the bank can’t tell if its from your gambling activities assuming you did withdraw from your own crypto wallet and not directly from your gambling account.

Honestly, its better to consult a professional with regards to this one, try to ask who are good in taxation in your place so you can get the right answer mate.

[Yogee]

UK doesn't tax income from online gambling if I am not mistaken but that probably applies only to UK regulated casinos so you'll have to ask your tax man for clarity on that. Providing proof of the source looks like a pain now that they've banned you. I don't know if it will work but have you contacted these platforms to at least give a letter that the sending address belongs to them?

[magneto]

Hi,

In the tax year just gone I have made around £40,000 via gambling on crypto betting websites. £30,000 of this I have converted into GBP and withdrawn from my crypto wallet to my bank account.

Two questions:

1) Do I need to pay any CGT on this (my profits from the general appreciation of crypto is minimal - less than £500)

2) If I don’t need to pay tax due it being gambling winnings rather than crypto profit, how do I prove this. A lot of my betting accounts have been closed (and therefore I cannot login to them) thus making it hard for me to prove to HMRC that my transactions have come from gambling winnings.

Thanks

I'm guessing that you would need to declare the CGT from any appreciation of the crypto/forex.

I do not believe that you would need to pay any tax on the winnings themselves.

Either way, asking for tax advice on a community forum is probably a dumb thing to do. Congratulations on your wins, and I think that the size of them should warrant you a good tax accountant to work with to sort this out proper.

[jossiel]

I guess it's explanatory with your 2nd statement.

You just have to explain to them well and clearly what has happened. If they insist on asking for that information, then there's nothing much that you can do.

Since you've explained everything that they need to know honestly, there's nothing that would help it and they have to look for other alternative that might be connected to your gambling/crypto profits.

[Eternad]

Hi,

In the tax year just gone I have made around £40,000 via gambling on crypto betting websites. £30,000 of this I have converted into GBP and withdrawn from my crypto wallet to my bank account.

Two questions:

1) Do I need to pay any CGT on this (my profits from the general appreciation of crypto is minimal - less than £500)

2) If I don’t need to pay tax due it being gambling winnings rather than crypto profit, how do I prove this. A lot of my betting accounts have been closed (and therefore I cannot login to them) thus making it hard for me to prove to HMRC that my transactions have come from gambling winnings.

Thanks

I’m sure you have email receipt of your gambling withdrawal because casino has this feature if you have extra security setup on your Casino since you are gambling with huge money. In case you really can’t recover your gambling receipt, You are forced to make a proof of source of that funds or else you will be in trouble on audit.

Sell your crypto face to face or consult a lawyer on how you will pay the tax for yournmoney to save you from trouble.

[swogerino]

Hi,

In the tax year just gone I have made around £40,000 via gambling on crypto betting websites. £30,000 of this I have converted into GBP and withdrawn from my crypto wallet to my bank account.

Two questions:

1) Do I need to pay any CGT on this (my profits from the general appreciation of crypto is minimal - less than £500)

2) If I don’t need to pay tax due it being gambling winnings rather than crypto profit, how do I prove this. A lot of my betting accounts have been closed (and therefore I cannot login to them) thus making it hard for me to prove to HMRC that my transactions have come from gambling winnings.

Thanks

That is the mistake there in your first sentence.You have withdrawn from your crypto wallet to your bank account and didn't use an exchange for that so you would only transfer FIAT money to your bank account.I live in a country with really strong restriction to taxes from everywhere to everything but up until now they have not thought of taxing exchange withdrawals.As far as I know there is Cex.io which is a UK based exchange and you can easily use that to change your crypto to FIAT money before sending them to your bank account.This way only if your bank account becomes picky to ask you the source of such funds as you are already told there is nothing you can do.

Personally when I withdraw directly from a crypto wallet to my bank account I am taxed 15% here where I am but so far the bank never bothered to ask me where did I get the funds that I send to my VISA cards when I withdraw from the Cex exchange.It only says in the statement "Cex.io VISA refund money".

But probably if you send to your bank account that much of an amount it is a clear indication that you should at least provide evidence of the source of income,this rule is not only in UK but in most of the Western world.

[Poker Player]

... or consult a lawyer on how you will pay the tax for yournmoney to save you from trouble.

OP, this is the best advice you've ever been given. It is good to come to the forum to gather opinions and see if there are people who have been in a similar situation to yours, but at the end of the day, I have seen several threads of this style, and in the end it is best to consult with a lawyer who is a specialist in crypto taxation. With the money you have withdrawn, you have enough pay him for a consultation or even have him prepare your tax return for you. Think of the money you pay him as an investment.

[ipanks]

I wonder what the answer to two questions from him. Does he already solve his problem and need to pay tax? Or does he not have to pay tax at all? If he can come back here and explain to us what he did after he made his thread, we can know the situations in the UK related to crypto gambling. It will help other players from the UK that are playing crypto gambling and they will know what to do.

[zidanw]

If you have won a lot of money with crypto, then I think it is asking for trouble when you pay tax. perhaps it is better to indicate that you have made an investment in bitcoins and then pay tax based on that model (if mandatory)? I am still curious on which site(s) you have won so much, because 40k is a huge amount.

[Cling18]

... or consult a lawyer on how you will pay the tax for yournmoney to save you from trouble.

OP, this is the best advice you've ever been given. It is good to come to the forum to gather opinions and see if there are people who have been in a similar situation to yours, but at the end of the day, I have seen several threads of this style, and in the end it is best to consult with a lawyer who is a specialist in crypto taxation. With the money you have withdrawn, you have enough pay him for a consultation or even have him prepare your tax return for you. Think of the money you pay him as an investment.

I certainly agree with this as well. A lawyer from your country would help because we have different taxation laws in each country. Some of us are obliged to pay taxes from gambling profit and some are not unless we declare our winnings. You better ask for professional help from a lawyer so you'll be able to take legal and wise action regarding your situation.

[kaya11]

UK doesn't tax income from online gambling if I am not mistaken but that probably applies only to UK regulated casinos so you'll have to ask your tax man for clarity on that. Providing proof of the source looks like a pain now that they've banned you. I don't know if it will work but have you contacted these platforms to at least give a letter that the sending address belongs to them?

If the platforms are good enough to give you of their time giving you records however it won't be that easy. One reason is that the accounts had already deleted and no records that can prove that he really played on their casino. It is the best solution to throw whatever reason he got and show his blockchain records.