Bitcoin Legal Tender in Central African Republic

[SmartGold01]

Snip

Do we need to be proven first to know that the advent of bitcoin has really help people around their inhabitants?
Yes naturally bitcoin hasn't changed or stopped any economy crisis but I can say that since the introduction of bitcoin it has reduced the unemployment rate in most of the Africans countries especially "Nigeria" I can imagine series of men involving themselves into bitcoin trade, while some in one way involved themselves into freelancing jobs and they got paid through bitcoin or any other cryptocurrency out there.

There are some people who are opportunist, they ventured into bitcoin investment at the appropriate time and today they are one way or the other made, I think it's a good example to say introduction of bitcoin has really help in reducing and eradicating (eradicates) the unemployment rate in the globe especially those countries that is found fully involved in bitcoin usage ( these include: trading, investment, mining etc).

For bitcoin to be introduced as a local currency it would be something that is globally legalized as a means of payment and even as that I don't think that could easily eliminate fiat in their position rather it could be an additional payment options instead of replacing fiat entirely. Between I can't see any digital currency to be a competitor of fiat rather seem to act collectively to scale up the means of payment method as they works together as one currency.

ANY speculative business provides "new jobs". The problem is different - these jobs do not create the real sector of the economy, do not create added value. And if you also take into account the volatility of bitcoin - then answer this question: those some Nigerians who started making money by selling bitcoin to their fellow citizens for 60,000 dollars, what did they do with them? Honestly, without embellishments ? I am not going to give a graph of bitcoin value here, but whoever bought bitcoin "thanks" to these "working men" in November 2021 or April 2022 now have what ? That's right - half as much money. Understand - speculation brings income to some at the expense of losses of others. So the topic from one side is positive, but if you look from all sides - not everything is so positive ... If bitcoin is so good and gives easy to earn - why you do not deal only with it, and did not build your business empire ?

There's something that can never be argued because we know too well that the rise of bitcoin is gain or profits of another while the fall is lose to another but the tendency to utilize this opportunity then lies in the hands of the holder be it a trader or whatsoever.

Well I won't argue with you at some point because, any falling or fallen economy can never be built through bitcoin introduction, as I believe is left on the hands of their government to take appropriate care of their economy, I think bitcoin can only create additional opportunities to the inhabitants but as a means of restoring a fallen economy is something I can't say with all certainty.
You are absolutely correct!

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[JayJuanGee]

[edited out]

ANY speculative business provides "new jobs". The problem is different - these jobs do not create the real sector of the economy, do not create added value. And if you also take into account the volatility of bitcoin - then answer this question: those some Nigerians who started making money by selling bitcoin to their fellow citizens for 60,000 dollars, what did they do with them? Honestly, without embellishments ? I am not going to give a graph of bitcoin value here, but whoever bought bitcoin "thanks" to these "working men" in November 2021 or April 2022 now have what ? That's right - half as much money. Understand - speculation brings income to some at the expense of losses of others. So the topic from one side is positive, but if you look from all sides - not everything is so positive ... If bitcoin is so good and gives easy to earn - why you do not deal only with it, and did not build your business empire ?

You sound retarded... and as a disingenuine poster.

Everyone is responsible for their own timing in regards to when to get into bitcoin and how to get into bitcoin, and neither the seller nor the buyer is more able to predict the future, even if your assumption might be correct that the person holding BTC likely knows more about bitcoin than the person buying the BTC, especially if the buyer is a newbie and the seller happens to have been in bitcoin for several years, but even the asymmetric knowledge does not cause the transaction to be immoral or unethical or even unfair to the buyer.

I recall in about 2017, a person came to me, and he bought around $5k worth of bitcoin and the BTC price was then around $15k, so let's say that he got around 0.333 BTC for the amount that he gave me, and about 6 months later he came back to me, and the BTC price was around $6k, and he told me that he wanted to sell his BTC back to me. I told him that I thought that it was a bad idea.  I told him that if he had been in for the long term when he bought then he should either just wait it out or he should be buying more BTC and not selling BTC, yet he told me that he needed the money, and so I told him no problem.  I will buy back his BTC, so I ended up giving him right around $2k for the same BTC that he had bought for $5k...and I am not even sure what happened to him because I had ONLY met him for those two transactions and he is the one who would be responsible for his decisions regarding when to buy and when to sell, and I personally was an overall buyer, since any time that I sold bitcoin during those kinds of times, I would replace my bitcoin (buy and replace), so my selling and then subsequently buying bitcoin from him did not really make much of a difference to me in terms of my overall BTC balance at that time, except maybe I would have had skimmed a few percentage points off the top in order to accumulate a bit more BTC out of the deal.

[edited out]

I think bitcoin can only create additional opportunities to the inhabitants but as a means of restoring a fallen economy is something I can't say with all certainty.

It's quite probable that the invention and introduction of bitcoin results in an increasing of the size of the pie because more kinds of economic activities become possible and greater number of human activities and development are also made possible through several of the contributions of bitcoin into society.

You are absolutely correct!

You (SmartGold01) are likely being overly generous to be suggesting that DrBeer is actually correct about anything meaningful and/or materially relevant.. but hey you are free to come to your own conclusions regarding the arguable value, if any, of DrBeer's posts.

[Sayeds56]

I recall in about 2017, a person came to me, and he bought around $5k worth of bitcoin and the BTC price was then around $15k, so let's say that he got around 0.333 BTC for the amount that he gave me, and about 6 months later he came back to me, and the BTC price was around $6k, and he told me that he wanted to sell his BTC back to me. I told him that I thought that it was a bad idea.  I told him that if he had been in for the long term when he bought then he should either just wait it out or he should be buying more BTC and not selling BTC, yet he told me that he needed the money, and so I told him no problem.  I will buy back his BTC, so I ended up giving him right around $2k for the same BTC that he had bought for $5k...and I am not even sure what happened to him because I had ONLY met him for those two transactions and he is the one who would be responsible for his decisions regarding when to buy and when to sell, and I personally was an overall buyer, since any time that I sold bitcoin during those kinds of times, I would replace my bitcoin (buy and replace), so my selling and then subsequently buying bitcoin from him did not really make much of a difference to me in terms of my overall BTC balance at that time, except maybe I would have had skimmed a few percentage points off the top in order to accumulate a bit more BTC out of the deal.

It is a good example how individuals can be driven by financial constraints to book losses when they take entry in Bitcoin market with the sole intention to make quick profit without implementing any form of risk management strategy. Your decision to buy back Bitcoin at lower than your initial selling price was a well thought decision rooted in your long term strategy. This scenario underscores that inherent volatility of Bitcoin market is a gift for those who know how to effectively manage risk.

[DrBeer]

I recall in about 2017, a person came to me, and he bought around $5k worth of bitcoin and the BTC price was then around $15k, so let's say that he got around 0.333 BTC for the amount that he gave me, and about 6 months later he came back to me, and the BTC price was around $6k, and he told me that he wanted to sell his BTC back to me. I told him that I thought that it was a bad idea.  I told him that if he had been in for the long term when he bought then he should either just wait it out or he should be buying more BTC and not selling BTC, yet he told me that he needed the money, and so I told him no problem.  I will buy back his BTC, so I ended up giving him right around $2k for the same BTC that he had bought for $5k...and I am not even sure what happened to him because I had ONLY met him for those two transactions and he is the one who would be responsible for his decisions regarding when to buy and when to sell, and I personally was an overall buyer, since any time that I sold bitcoin during those kinds of times, I would replace my bitcoin (buy and replace), so my selling and then subsequently buying bitcoin from him did not really make much of a difference to me in terms of my overall BTC balance at that time, except maybe I would have had skimmed a few percentage points off the top in order to accumulate a bit more BTC out of the deal.

It is a good example how individuals can be driven by financial constraints to book losses when they take entry in Bitcoin market with the sole intention to make quick profit without implementing any form of risk management strategy. Your decision to buy back Bitcoin at lower than your initial selling price was a well thought decision rooted in your long term strategy. This scenario underscores that inherent volatility of Bitcoin market is a gift for those who know how to effectively manage risk.

This is the best example of cryptocurrency failing to positively impact the economy and the masses. 90% of the world's population doesn't even have a more or less significant "financial cushion", and most importantly, they have no financial education or idea how it all works. The almost total majority of "hamsters" (home users) who rushed to buy crypto in 2017-2021 - were focused on the fabulous prospects of getting rich "in a week". In the end - all of them suffered losses, as they were simply neither financially nor morally ready to invest for a long period of time.

And these 90% of the population have a need for money - daily. And here volatility plays a cruel joke with them - they go to buy their last 5000 dollars bitcoin, and a month later... sell it for 2000 dollars. And their life gets even worse. It will be the same with the economy, which someone will try to build in the current situation, on bitcoin. That's what we need to prove.)

That's why there is no positive answer to the simple answer - which country/economy bitcoin helped to improve the situation - no positive answer.....

[Dunamisx]

I recall in about 2017, a person came to me, and he bought around $5k worth of bitcoin and the BTC price was then around $15k, so let's say that he got around 0.333 BTC for the amount that he gave me, and about 6 months later he came back to me, and the BTC price was around $6k, and he told me that he wanted to sell his BTC back to me. I told him that I thought that it was a bad idea.  I told him that if he had been in for the long term when he bought then he should either just wait it out or he should be buying more BTC and not selling BTC, yet he told me that he needed the money, and so I told him no problem.  I will buy back his BTC, so I ended up giving him right around $2k for the same BTC that he had bought for $5k...and I am not even sure what happened to him because I had ONLY met him for those two transactions and he is the one who would be responsible for his decisions regarding when to buy and when to sell, and I personally was an overall buyer, since any time that I sold bitcoin during those kinds of times, I would replace my bitcoin (buy and replace), so my selling and then subsequently buying bitcoin from him did not really make much of a difference to me in terms of my overall BTC balance at that time, except maybe I would have had skimmed a few percentage points off the top in order to accumulate a bit more BTC out of the deal.

It is a good example how individuals can be driven by financial constraints to book losses when they take entry in Bitcoin market with the sole intention to make quick profit without implementing any form of risk management strategy. Your decision to buy back Bitcoin at lower than your initial selling price was a well thought decision rooted in your long term strategy. This scenario underscores that inherent volatility of Bitcoin market is a gift for those who know how to effectively manage risk.

Looking at the story he told as an example on a live experience with bitcoin price, buy and selling time, we should therefore embrace first the knowledge of knowing about how to buy, when to buy and why we should invest in bitcoin, base on the story and discussion, the buyer may only wsnted to buy and resell within a short time frame while within this same period was when the market price isn't favourable for a sell order, but in his case he can't keep continue to hold, this is one of the reasons we keep making this warning on every investors ear that bitcoin is not a get rich quick scheme, it's an investment that needs time to grow.

[JayJuanGee]

I recall in about 2017, a person came to me, and he bought around $5k worth of bitcoin and the BTC price was then around $15k, so let's say that he got around 0.333 BTC for the amount that he gave me, and about 6 months later he came back to me, and the BTC price was around $6k, and he told me that he wanted to sell his BTC back to me. I told him that I thought that it was a bad idea.  I told him that if he had been in for the long term when he bought then he should either just wait it out or he should be buying more BTC and not selling BTC, yet he told me that he needed the money, and so I told him no problem.  I will buy back his BTC, so I ended up giving him right around $2k for the same BTC that he had bought for $5k...and I am not even sure what happened to him because I had ONLY met him for those two transactions and he is the one who would be responsible for his decisions regarding when to buy and when to sell, and I personally was an overall buyer, since any time that I sold bitcoin during those kinds of times, I would replace my bitcoin (buy and replace), so my selling and then subsequently buying bitcoin from him did not really make much of a difference to me in terms of my overall BTC balance at that time, except maybe I would have had skimmed a few percentage points off the top in order to accumulate a bit more BTC out of the deal.

It is a good example how individuals can be driven by financial constraints to book losses when they take entry in Bitcoin market with the sole intention to make quick profit without implementing any form of risk management strategy. Your decision to buy back Bitcoin at lower than your initial selling price was a well thought decision rooted in your long term strategy. This scenario underscores that inherent volatility of Bitcoin market is a gift for those who know how to effectively manage risk.

Yes.. it is a kind of sign of failing to sufficiently plan, and not being prepared to continue to buy if the BTC price were to fall or at least to HODL through the BTC price drops, and yeah it could take 3-5 years or even more for some of our BTC purchases to get back into profits if the BTC had ended up going down after our purchase.. and one of my personal solutions had been to continue to buy BTC even when my average cost per BTC may have been higher than the current price, and so maybe it still takes a while to get into profits (and sure it is not guaranteed to get into profits), but when the average cost per BTC comes down, then the threshold for getting into profits becomes lower and lower, and with an asset like bitcoin, the odds seem pretty decent that the price trajectory is UP, even though there may well continue to be long periods of down and/or flat BTC prices along the way.

[edited out]

This is the best example of cryptocurrency failing to positively impact the economy and the masses.

You likely would not know a good example if it slapped you in the face.

Most likely you need to zoom out a bit, and if you were even attempting to be honest in your posts, you would be able to appreciate that bitcoin is amongst the best performing of broadly distributed assets of the past 10 years or so, and perhaps even the best.

Sure, there is no guarantee in regards to the future.. so position sizes should be adjusted in order to account for such lack of guarantee regarding where BTC might go in the future, even though its asymmetric UPside nature, likely suggest that it is good to have some stake in bitcoin, whether that is $100 or $1,000,000 or some amount that might be reasonable in regards to your budget.  In recent times, I have tended to recommend somewhere in the ballpark of 1% to 25% of any persons quasi-liquid investment portfolio, yet of course, people need to choose their own levels within that range or even outside of that range if they have some kind of a rationale for going outside of that range and at the same time, every person is responsible for his/her own allocation decision(s), including if their decisions happen to be NOT to invest at all into bitcoin, which is also a decision.

90% of the world's population doesn't even have a more or less significant "financial cushion"

Well if they have no discretionary budget, then they likely are not in a position to invest into anything, so it would be stupid to invest into something if there is no discretionary income.. as you suggest.

, and most importantly, they have no financial education or idea how it all works.

You sound a bit patronizing.. and presumptuous.  I would think that it is in the interest of every single person to figure out his/her budget and to figure out ways to either live within his/her means, and to also use debt (if s/he has any credit or ways to use debt) in ways that are wise and within the parameters of his/her personal cashflows.. and sometimes it is not prudent to even use debt if a person might not even have discretionary income, as you suggest.,. The use of debt is a more advance technique of building wealth that would only come after a person makes sure that s/he has his/her shit together in terms of personal finances and budgeting.

The almost total majority of "hamsters" (home users) who rushed to buy crypto in 2017-2021 - were focused on the fabulous prospects of getting rich "in a week". In the end - all of them suffered losses, as they were simply neither financially nor morally ready to invest for a long period of time.

If cannot figure out a long term way of investing into bitcoin, then maybe you deserve to get recked, and I would not blame bitcoin for the gambling mentality that is inculcated into people based on various broken fiat system incentives.

Yeah people feel like they have to gamble, so the approach a lot of things, including but not limited to bitcoin, with short-term thinking and short-term ways of considering getting in and out of their investments (which is most likely not investing but instead variations of gambling), and sometimes they might do o.k. with those in and out techniques, but it is likely that a majority of people getting in and out of something like bitcoin and failing/refusing to recognize bitcoin as a long term investment are not going to be able to advantage themselves by taking a more prudent/practical approach that might well be aggressive towards their bitcoin investment without crossing into overly aggressiveness.

So anyone who had been investing into bitcoin in a kind of solid way (such as using regular DCA buying) since early 2017 is likely doing quite well right now.  Take a person who had invested $100 per week since January 2017, by now such a person would have invested around $35k and would have accumulated right around 5.3 BTC, so surely not a bad place to be, even for someone who might have had some periods of high cost BTC and low cost BTC throughout that whole period.

So yeah there are ways to describe people who were not consistent and who bought their BTC high and sold low, but those are likely not problems with BTC because you can tinker around with that same DCA website variables that I had linked in order to see that the longer that you are investing into BTC, then more likely it becomes that you are going to end up being in profits, and sure maybe the person who has been DCA investing into BTC for only 2-3 years (or who got into BTC when BTC prices were going above $30k in early 2021) might barely be at break even BTC costs per BTC as compared with BTC prices, and might not even be in profits after nearly 3 years in bitcoin. but still does not seem to be a bad place to be, even if we look at a person who might have started buying $100 worth of BTC since January 2021, and such a person may well have ended up putting close to $14k into BT and have right around 0.5 BTC right now.. so not quite in profits.. and barely break even if we get back up to $28k... but still does not seem to be a bad place to be in terms of having hedges and having options.

And these 90% of the population have a need for money - daily.

Well, sure people might well be living paycheck to paycheck, but people do not tend to get paid daily, so maybe they get paid weekly, monthly or twice a month, and so they have to budget for their expenses for the whole month. .in which they might have daily allowances and/or some ways of measuring their expenses in order to figure out how much they can spend based on how much they make.
 

And here volatility plays a cruel joke with them - they go to buy their last 5000 dollars bitcoin, and a month later... sell it for 2000 dollars. And their life gets even worse. It will be the same with the economy, which someone will try to build in the current situation, on bitcoin. That's what we need to prove.)

You did not even get my example correct.  I said that the guy had bought with $5k, and then around 6 months later, he came back and got around $2k for that, and it was a bit of a sad situation, but he has to take responsibility for his own finances, and if he did not have $5k to invest into bitcoin, then probably he should not have used that money, and maybe he would have been better off to buy BTC at $833 per month rather than $5k all at once, and maybe he should have ONLY been spending $500 per month ( which is the amount that he ended up losing, so we know that he could have afforded $500 per month since that is how much loss he ended up locking in). 

Maybe we can look at the DCA calculator in order to specifically look at his example.. and I had to go back, to the price charts for this.. so If he had bought $500 per month (or $116 per week) starting from January 15, 2018, then he would have accumulated a bit more than 0.36 BTC, which is actually more than he had bought for $5k at that same time in early January 2018.. so the amount of $3k that he ended up losing could have almost been like free BTC with a prudent, practical and ongoing BTC accumulation strategy that might involve something like DCA buying.

And yeah maybe he could have even invested his whole $5k over 6 months and he could have ended up getting more than 0.62 BTC and perhaps not panicking with the BTC price movements at that time which was around a 60% price drop at that time, and that we know ended up dropping even further for that period, since the BTC prices did end up going down to $3,124 in November 2018.. before returning back up and not returning to those sub $5k prices, except in the March 2020 crash event.

That's why there is no positive answer to the simple answer - which country/economy bitcoin helped to improve the situation - no positive answer.....

There's a positive answer if you are willing to open up your eyes and figure out to deal with volatility, since one of the most inevitable things in bitcoin is that it is going to continue to be volatile, and there are ways to deal with that in order to see the positivity of the matter both financially and psychologically.

[Sayeds56]

There's a positive answer if you are willing to open up your eyes and figure out to deal with volatility, since one of the most inevitable things in bitcoin is that it is going to continue to be volatile, and there are ways to deal with that in order to see the positivity of the matter both financially and psychologically.

Volatility is inherent feature of all risky assets markets, offering opportunities for investors to enter or adjust their positions. In the  case of Bitcoin, the intensity of price fluctuations is comparatively higher, making it a defining characteristics of this digital currency. While managing this high volatility can be a challenging task, there are ways to deal with it and find positivity in both financial and psychological perspectives. One effective approach involves adopting a long term investment mindset when dealing with Bitcoin.

[inthelongrun]

There's a positive answer if you are willing to open up your eyes and figure out to deal with volatility, since one of the most inevitable things in bitcoin is that it is going to continue to be volatile, and there are ways to deal with that in order to see the positivity of the matter both financially and psychologically.

Volatility is inherent feature of all risky assets markets, offering opportunities for investors to enter or adjust their positions. In the  case of Bitcoin, the intensity of price fluctuations is comparatively higher, making it a defining characteristics of this digital currency. While managing this high volatility can be a challenging task, there are ways to deal with it and find positivity in both financial and psychological perspectives. One effective approach involves adopting a long term investment mindset when dealing with Bitcoin.

What if you are appointed as a bitcoin investment manager by the Central African Republic? Would you consider the 4-year cycle of bitcoin? Will you buy and accumulate 2 years earlier until its next halving and then sell them after the halving year? I am not sure if the big financial institutions are doing this but more likely that some of them as already into this type of strategy.

The volatility of bitcoin will continue until it reaches its long-term potential. Maybe if the whole valuation of bitcoin reaches double digits in trillions of dollars its price will have difficulty making big waves. 

[DrBeer]

There's something that can never be argued because we know too well that the rise of bitcoin is gain or profits of another while the fall is lose to another but the tendency to utilize this opportunity then lies in the hands of the holder be it a trader or whatsoever.

Well I won't argue with you at some point because, any falling or fallen economy can never be built through bitcoin introduction, as I believe is left on the hands of their government to take appropriate care of their economy, I think bitcoin can only create additional opportunities to the inhabitants but as a means of restoring a fallen economy is something I can't say with all certainty.
You are absolutely correct!

Absolutely agree with you. To summarize, the situation will be like this:
1. Bitcoin will never save, any economy. For a simple reason - it cannot do it
2. Bitcoin is a good means to make money on speculative transactions. Yes, let me remind you again - cryptocurrency today is absolutely a speculative asset.  Well, or an opportunity to make money for not very honest people who can take advantage of the current problems of bitcoin owners and capitalize on them.

Everything else is fairy tales and dreams

[Die_empty]

What if you are appointed as a bitcoin investment manager by the Central African Republic? Would you consider the 4-year cycle of bitcoin? Will you buy and accumulate 2 years earlier until its next halving and then sell them after the halving year? I am not sure if the big financial institutions are doing this but more likely that some of them as already into this type of strategy.

The volatility of bitcoin will continue until it reaches its long-term potential. Maybe if the whole valuation of bitcoin reaches double digits in trillions of dollars its price will have difficulty making big waves. 

For a nation to get the best out of bitcoin, a two or four-year plan will not be appropriate. The country should have a long-term term strategy. This is because using the four-year cycle doesn't guarantee profitability. Central African Republic lacks the political will to pursue and remain on track in the bitcoin race. The nation's lofty vision was not backed with the needed actions and external influence was too much for them to bear making them prematurely abandon the project. However the failure of CAR has not deterred Africans from embracing Bitcoin, and its adoption is spreading like wild fire in Africa.

[SmartGold01]

[edited out]

ANY speculative business provides "new jobs". The problem is different - these jobs do not create the real sector of the economy, do not create added value. And if you also take into account the volatility of bitcoin - then answer this question: those some Nigerians who started making money by selling bitcoin to their fellow citizens for 60,000 dollars, what did they do with them? Honestly, without embellishments ? I am not going to give a graph of bitcoin value here, but whoever bought bitcoin "thanks" to these "working men" in November 2021 or April 2022 now have what ? That's right - half as much money. Understand - speculation brings income to some at the expense of losses of others. So the topic from one side is positive, but if you look from all sides - not everything is so positive ... If bitcoin is so good and gives easy to earn - why you do not deal only with it, and did not build your business empire ?

You sound retarded... and as a disingenuine poster.

Everyone is responsible for their own timing in regards to when to get into bitcoin and how to get into bitcoin, and neither the seller nor the buyer is more able to predict the future, even if your assumption might be correct that the person holding BTC likely knows more about bitcoin than the person buying the BTC, especially if the buyer is a newbie and the seller happens to have been in bitcoin for several years, but even the asymmetric knowledge does not cause the transaction to be immoral or unethical or even unfair to the buyer.

I recall in about 2017, a person came to me, and he bought around $5k worth of bitcoin and the BTC price was then around $15k, so let's say that he got around 0.333 BTC for the amount that he gave me, and about 6 months later he came back to me, and the BTC price was around $6k, and he told me that he wanted to sell his BTC back to me. I told him that I thought that it was a bad idea.  I told him that if he had been in for the long term when he bought then he should either just wait it out or he should be buying more BTC and not selling BTC, yet he told me that he needed the money, and so I told him no problem.  I will buy back his BTC, so I ended up giving him right around $2k for the same BTC that he had bought for $5k...and I am not even sure what happened to him because I had ONLY met him for those two transactions and he is the one who would be responsible for his decisions regarding when to buy and when to sell, and I personally was an overall buyer, since any time that I sold bitcoin during those kinds of times, I would replace my bitcoin (buy and replace), so my selling and then subsequently buying bitcoin from him did not really make much of a difference to me in terms of my overall BTC balance at that time, except maybe I would have had skimmed a few percentage points off the top in order to accumulate a bit more BTC out of the deal.

[edited out]

I think bitcoin can only create additional opportunities to the inhabitants but as a means of restoring a fallen economy is something I can't say with all certainty.

It's quite probable that the invention and introduction of bitcoin results in an increasing of the size of the pie because more kinds of economic activities become possible and greater number of human activities and development are also made possible through several of the contributions of bitcoin into society.

You are absolutely correct!

You (SmartGold01) are likely being overly generous to be suggesting that DrBeer is actually correct about anything meaningful and/or materially relevant.. but hey you are free to come to your own conclusions regarding the arguable value, if any, of DrBeer's posts.

We are all human with sense of reasoning, I mean with various ways judging and analyzing topics and issues at hand. From my own little ways of understanding although I can never be as you or even haven to compared and equates myself to your standards but only responding according to my own capacity and knowledge.
If actually what you sees as something not worthy to be agreed on then you should only see it as within my limits, which in time to come I may get to such level of understanding to realise worth I do see and take to be good is actually not worthy of being as good as I think, so pardon me for that and this doesn't mean I won't upgrade my wisdom bank because already I have also factored out my lapses and come to understand and that things aren't that correct in the eyes of everyone depending on the areas of view and perspection.

However, the truth must always remained the same it's a matter being rational towards a simple discussion or ( must say that what we all discussed must be as no can say something else) we are all of different version of knowledge which yours can't be quantified as ours (or lemme say of me than any other) but I must thank you for the great input towards this whole discuss, though I can see to be little disagreement btw you and DrBeer but that doesn't mean we shouldn't give that honor to say you are right.

[DrBeer]

.....

We started the conversation with "bitcoin will save the world and countries and economies", in the end, expectedly came to the fact that:
- it will help those who have sufficient funds
- who understands volatility and knows how to capitalize on it.
- all residents should have knowledge of financial literacy and "hygiene".
- It is necessary to invest in the long term
- ...

Total set of rules for a financially literate, wealthy player in the crypto market
I.e. it is not a panacea, but a tool that you still need to learn how to use, and to use it you need to have certain characteristics.

I can tell you, in the same format, that the world and the economy of any country will be saved .... tomatoes ! The matter is small - you just need to have land, equipment, planting material, market, fertilizers, hired workers, long-term supply contracts - any economy and any person is saved, if you just do:))

In general, what I was talking about above?
1. Bitcoin/cryptocurrency will not save the economy/state.
2. Bitcoin/cryptocurrency is a tool to make money for a small group of people.

I perfectly understand that after the hype of 2017, people have another "pink dream" - to get rich quickly on the crypt ... But it will not happen. Everyone will not earn, EVERYONE will not get rich. Few of the dreamers will get the real result. But you have to be realistic!

[MarjorieZimmermanGinger]

It is good to attempt to develop bitcoin related skills that might go beyond merely buying bitcoin, and it may not even be necessary to develop any bitcoin related skills beyond merely making sure that you don't lose your coins.

In other words buy and hold bitcoins, so you don't have to think too much about any fears associated with loss. There is no need for very good skills, as long as we know that bitcoin can provide a signal for financial freedom and all we need to do is be calm and don't need to panic. Isn't that expressing what we should have heard and there are previous examples that we can refer to as the basis for his beliefs.

Otherwise getting involved in bitcoin may well be bonus skills  -that may additionally help out people who learn those skills, but again there is likely going to continue to be a lot of individual variation regarding the extent to which bitcoin skills are developed beyond merely buying and holding bitcoin...there is also risk that comes from engaging in businesses that could cause someone who might have otherwise been bitcoin profitable to not be profitable because of engaging in a business... and I am not necessarily not to engage in those kinds of activities, because engaging in bitcoin related businesses, may well end up contributing towards compounding of the returns..

The only thing I think about using bitcoin skills other than buying and selling is applied to business. But let's ignore for a moment about certain countries that don't legalize bitcoin as a means of payment, because maybe we need to talk further about what might happen in the future. The point is there are a lot of people who get involved in bitcoin just looking for the end of a profit and I don't think anyone needs to deny that. Though worst case scenario in the next 10-20 years bitcoin is no longer priceless and that's another issue that probably no one cares about can predict it.

I myself don't think too much about the long term regarding whether the Bitcoin price will be at its lowest point or rise significantly because so far we have a four-year cycle to increase the capital we have placed. So if doubts about the future of bitcoin will disappear then withdraw the initial capital and roll back the profits for further investment. That's how I use it and I don't know whether this pattern is considered right or wrong by other people because for me the path to financial freedom is not far from the extent to which we are able to take risks and most importantly be responsible.

[Sayeds56]

What if you are appointed as a bitcoin investment manager by the Central African Republic? Would you consider the 4-year cycle of bitcoin? Will you buy and accumulate 2 years earlier until its next halving and then sell them after the halving year? I am not sure if the big financial institutions are doing this but more likely that some of them as already into this type of strategy.

The volatility of bitcoin will continue until it reaches its long-term potential. Maybe if the whole valuation of bitcoin reaches double digits in trillions of dollars its price will have difficulty making big waves.  

If I were given the opportunity to work as Bitcoin Investment Manager by the central African republic, I would certainly adopt Dollar cost averaging strategy (DCA) ,for purchasing Bitcoin. My approach would involve acquiring Bitcoin at regular intervals while taking advantage of major price dips. This strategy is preferable to simply buying two years before the halving event. The aim of this approach is to maintain lower average cost of investment overtime.

It is also important to prioritize responsible risk management, a long term perspective and compliance with regulations, while managing investment in Bitcoin.

[JayJuanGee]

There's something that can never be argued because we know too well that the rise of bitcoin is gain or profits of another while the fall is lose to another but the tendency to utilize this opportunity then lies in the hands of the holder be it a trader or whatsoever.

Well I won't argue with you at some point because, any falling or fallen economy can never be built through bitcoin introduction, as I believe is left on the hands of their government to take appropriate care of their economy, I think bitcoin can only create additional opportunities to the inhabitants but as a means of restoring a fallen economy is something I can't say with all certainty.
You are absolutely correct!

Absolutely agree with you. To summarize, the situation will be like this:
1. Bitcoin will never save, any economy. For a simple reason - it cannot do it
2. Bitcoin is a good means to make money on speculative transactions. Yes, let me remind you again - cryptocurrency today is absolutely a speculative asset.  Well, or an opportunity to make money for not very honest people who can take advantage of the current problems of bitcoin owners and capitalize on them.

Everything else is fairy tales and dreams

I agree with two of your points which are:
1)  you and your ideas are fairy tales and dreams.
and
2) cryptocurrencies (not talking about bitcoin) are speculative to such an extent that the vast majority of them are some form of scam in terms of printing money and/or affinity scams upon bitcooin trying to seem like or to be like bitcoin.

Your point about bitcoin not being able to fix countries is lame, and surely improvements to any situation is likely a product of multiple things going on, and bitcoin would not be the ONLY thing that is going on but within a package of other things in which it may or may not be able to take credit for its "on the margin" kinds of contributions in any situation, whether personal investment, institutions and/or governments.  It is easier to look at the situations of individuals, so if you attempt to apply bitcoin systems to institutions and/or governments, then more complexities come into place, but a lot of the same individual are still going to apply to the more complex systems of institutions and governments, but there are just more things going on with institutions and governments as compared with individuals.

[edited out]

We are all human with sense of reasoning, I mean with various ways judging and analyzing topics and issues at hand. From my own little ways of understanding although I can never be as you or even haven to compared and equates myself to your standards but only responding according to my own capacity and knowledge.
If actually what you sees as something not worthy to be agreed on then you should only see it as within my limits, which in time to come I may get to such level of understanding to realise worth I do see and take to be good is actually not worthy of being as good as I think, so pardon me for that and this doesn't mean I won't upgrade my wisdom bank because already I have also factored out my lapses and come to understand and that things aren't that correct in the eyes of everyone depending on the areas of view and perspection.

However, the truth must always remained the same it's a matter being rational towards a simple discussion or ( must say that what we all discussed must be as no can say something else) we are all of different version of knowledge which yours can't be quantified as ours (or lemme say of me than any other) but I must thank you for the great input towards this whole discuss, though I can see to be little disagreement btw you and DrBeer but that doesn't mean we shouldn't give that honor to say you are right.

For sure, I am not trying to stop you or anyone else from making their points, including if they are disagreeable and wrong, and in my own case, even though sometimes I might direct my response towards you and or towards DrBeer, I am not necessarily intending my comment to be personal... but instead directed towards the substance.

There are some posters who do seem more disingenuine than others, so in that regard, we cannot necessarily presume that every member is either acting in good faith arguments or even trying to be genuine.  So sometimes the seeming personal attacks might end up going towards the angle that some posters will repeat nonsense over and over and over, and perhaps we give them the benefit of the doubt a few times, but after a while a pattern might be noticed in which it can be seen that they are really not setting forth genuine facts, logic and/or conclusions... but instead purposefully spreading counter points for the mere sake of muddying and/or confusing the discussion.

By the way, some of the worst and disingenuine of forum trolls / shills and/or disingenuine posters sometimes will make valid points, and sure it can be questionable (or a matter of discretion) the extent to which there is any value in attempting to respond to them or to clarify some of their misinformation/disinformation.

I am not even proclaiming that I am always right, either.. I have had plenty of times that I have been wrong entirely or I end up being wrong in some of the understanding of the facts, logic and/or coming to bad conclusions and/or maybe prematurely attacking another member or using denigrating and/or patronizing tones when it might not be warranted.

So some of us are more human than others, and sometimes it can even be difficult to admit mistakes and sometimes it might not even be necessary to admit mistakes, just move onto the next topic... and let the back and forth comments stand for what they are... and let the reader figure out on which side they lean.

By the way, another difficult area is level of knowledge and/or abilities to express oneself well in English, and it can be quite difficult to know if some member might be adding value or not, but it seems that any time that any of us is bringing in some of our own experiences into the conversation, it can be a lot harder for me to suggest that you have not contributed some value, even if I might come to differing conclusions in regards to how I interpret the personal experiences that you end up describing.

.....

We started the conversation with "bitcoin will save the world and countries and economies", in the end, expectedly came to the fact that:
- it will help those who have sufficient funds
- who understands volatility and knows how to capitalize on it.
- all residents should have knowledge of financial literacy and "hygiene".
- It is necessary to invest in the long term
- ...

Ok. that seems to be a mostly fair list.

Total set of rules for a financially literate, wealthy player in the crypto market
I.e. it is not a panacea, but a tool that you still need to learn how to use, and to use it you need to have certain characteristics.

Ok.  some people are more advantaged than others, but anyone can benefit from bitcoin.. and I could give less than two shits in regards to talking about crypto and the various nonsense that it related to that.. even though surely we should realize that CAR's approach was not very bitcoin focused, as compared with El Salvador that has been trying to stay more bitcoin focused.. at least so far and the last more than two years that El Salvador has been pushing pro-bitcoin ideas (and by the way, today is the two year anniversary of El Salvador's implementation of its bitcoin legal tender law).

Anyhow, back to the point about how individuals' might use bitcoin, yes they might need to learn some skills, and surely one of the skills is already in their interest and abilities which is learning their own personal finances and balancing their own personal finances and their psychological and financial interests.. so every individual is capable of working these kinds of learnings into their approaches to their lives, whether they choose to do it or not and whether they are successful or not have a lot of factors, but if any government gives opportunities in which they are not going to prosecute you for learning about bitcoin and using bitcoin, then it seems to me that your individual options are increased, which should be considered a good thing.

So there is the individual level of learning about and adopting some bitcoin practices, and governments sometimes might not act within the interests of their people, so governments are going to vary in terms of their own ways of representing the interest of their people and they will frequently have a certain amount of power to act within the interest of their people whether they employ good tactics and/or judgement or not and whether they act in good faith or not.

I can tell you, in the same format, that the world and the economy of any country will be saved .... tomatoes ! The matter is small - you just need to have land, equipment, planting material, market, fertilizers, hired workers, long-term supply contracts - any economy and any person is saved, if you just do:))

In general, what I was talking about above?
1. Bitcoin/cryptocurrency will not save the economy/state.
2. Bitcoin/cryptocurrency is a tool to make money for a small group of people.

I perfectly understand that after the hype of 2017, people have another "pink dream" - to get rich quickly on the crypt ... But it will not happen. Everyone will not earn, EVERYONE will not get rich. Few of the dreamers will get the real result. But you have to be realistic!

Bitcoin is available for everyone, so each person can decide his/her strategy, approach and way of investing into it, if s/he chooses to invest into it. 

For sure, there are no guarantees, and there are people who find ways to lose money, even with an asset like bitcoin that so far in its history has tended to go up... and yeah, there are no guarantees that it will continue to go up, but bitcoin does continue to seem to be one of the best (if not the best) of asymmetric bets that are currently wide-spreadedly available.

[TheSpiral]

Volatility is inherent feature of all risky assets markets, offering opportunities for investors to enter or adjust their positions. In the  case of Bitcoin, the intensity of price fluctuations is comparatively higher, making it a defining characteristics of this digital currency. While managing this high volatility can be a challenging task, there are ways to deal with it and find positivity in both financial and psychological perspectives. One effective approach involves adopting a long term investment mindset when dealing with Bitcoin.

Volatility is very higher but more there is a Volatility in bitcoin more it is possible to give profit to its holders. embracing the risk will help you to move forward and if you are afraid of doing something then success will be onerous to obtain as hard path lead to a successful destination.

I know its not as easy as we are talking but if we enters the market then it can be easy for us because everything seems difficult before examining.

 Long term investment will be suitable option for those who don't know about market so in the timing of their holding they will be involved in operation of market too without risking their asset because their holding will be for prolong timing and in that duration they will be able to learn well.

[coupable]

Long term investment will be suitable option for those who don't know about market so in the timing of their holding they will be involved in operation of market too without risking their asset because their holding will be for prolong timing and in that duration they will be able to learn well.

This will not be possible in an economically backward country, and there will be no benefit in launching projects in this regard. Citizens in Central Africa suffer from great problems due to the spread of illiteracy and early dropout from school. How do you expect them to know how to take investment precautions?
The poverty of the infrastructure makes the project of adopting bitcoin as an official currency like giving a gun to a primitive person, you cannot expect what he might do with it and the closest that he will harm himself.

[JayJuanGee]

Long term investment will be suitable option for those who don't know about market so in the timing of their holding they will be involved in operation of market too without risking their asset because their holding will be for prolong timing and in that duration they will be able to learn well.

This will not be possible in an economically backward country, and there will be no benefit in launching projects in this regard. Citizens in Central Africa suffer from great problems due to the spread of illiteracy and early dropout from school. How do you expect them to know how to take investment precautions?
The poverty of the infrastructure makes the project of adopting bitcoin as an official currency like giving a gun to a primitive person, you cannot expect what he might do with it and the closest that he will harm himself.

You seem to be referring to position size @coupable rather than not doing it, even though your conclusion is that CAR should not do it rather than figuring out a way to employ a small position size that might be 1% rather than 5% to 25% for a more healthy economy / country / government... and maybe they are in a position that even 1% might be too high, I am not going to proclaim to know their specifics, even though I know that a lot of countries have pretty screwed up economics and varying levels of irresponsibilities in terms of how far they place themselves into debt in comparison to the amount of income that they are able to produce in the country including being able to tax such income if the enterprises are not directly government owned....

[coupable]

Long term investment will be suitable option for those who don't know about market so in the timing of their holding they will be involved in operation of market too without risking their asset because their holding will be for prolong timing and in that duration they will be able to learn well.

This will not be possible in an economically backward country, and there will be no benefit in launching projects in this regard. Citizens in Central Africa suffer from great problems due to the spread of illiteracy and early dropout from school. How do you expect them to know how to take investment precautions?
The poverty of the infrastructure makes the project of adopting bitcoin as an official currency like giving a gun to a primitive person, you cannot expect what he might do with it and the closest that he will harm himself.

You seem to be referring to position size @coupable rather than not doing it, even though your conclusion is that CAR should not do it rather than figuring out a way to employ a small position size that might be 1% rather than 5% to 25% for a more healthy economy / country / government... and maybe they are in a position that even 1% might be too high, I am not going to proclaim to know their specifics, even though I know that a lot of countries have pretty screwed up economics and varying levels of irresponsibilities in terms of how far they place themselves into debt in comparison to the amount of income that they are able to produce in the country including being able to tax such income if the enterprises are not directly government owned....

What CAR has done can be considered an experiment to overcome economic difficulties, in an area whose effectiveness no one knows yet. CAR is a country that cannot issue a private currency because France imposed the use of the CFA franc on the entire group of West and Central African countries. The loss of confidence in the local currency makes it difficult to establish a financial system in accordance with known standards, since the CAR does not even have the right to hold reserves in international currencies or gold.
This makes the experiment a kind of risk, and most likely it was destined to fail from the beginning, especially since France did not express any objection to the experiment, although its success meant a loss for it.

[Aanuoluwatofunmi]

What if you are appointed as a bitcoin investment manager by the Central African Republic? Would you consider the 4-year cycle of bitcoin? Will you buy and accumulate 2 years earlier until its next halving and then sell them after the halving year? I am not sure if the big financial institutions are doing this but more likely that some of them as already into this type of strategy.

The volatility of bitcoin will continue until it reaches its long-term potential. Maybe if the whole valuation of bitcoin reaches double digits in trillions of dollars its price will have difficulty making big waves. 

For a nation to get the best out of bitcoin, a two or four-year plan will not be appropriate. The country should have a long-term term strategy. This is because using the four-year cycle doesn't guarantee profitability. Central African Republic lacks the political will to pursue and remain on track in the bitcoin race. The nation's lofty vision was not backed with the needed actions and external influence was too much for them to bear making them prematurely abandon the project. However the failure of CAR has not deterred Africans from embracing Bitcoin, and its adoption is spreading like wild fire in Africa.

Central African Republic bitcoin was initially a good lay they embarked on and the entire world started to celebrate along with them on the occassion of adopting bitcoin as a legal tender, but what i see here is a stringe diversion of the the country major target from bitcoin to altcoins, this comes along when they introduced a Sango token to serve as alternative digital token the people can use without knowing that they gave already diverted the concentration ought to be on bitcoin alone to the altcoin introduced, also we can see that there's more of distractions from them in terms of being focused on bitcoin to see it maximum output felt on the people before doing concentrating on others.