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[Leviathan.007]

I won't say bitcoin adaption is failed yet because some big like this will take some time, specially if it's coming up for the first time in the world but I think the reason of why that's not going fast and well as it should be is their government. Their government is somehow forced people to use and accept bitcoin which cannot have good effects

[Daltonik]

El Salvador, like bitcoin, has both many opponents and many supporters, a little more than a year has passed and opponents are rubbing their hands, citing as an example the figures of losses from the purchase of bitcoin and in this sense there is no escape from the facts.
There are a lot of problems in El Salvador both in the social sphere and in the economy, but how much did the state spend on the purchase of bitcoin ~ $105.6 million or 3.6% of its GDP, so far it has lost $40mn from these investments, but on the other hand, the flow of investments in Q2 2022 increased by $55.17million, while in Q4 2021 it fell by $80.6 million.
During the fall in the price of gold, you do not stop mining it, no, you just buy it back on the market, so you need to look at a longer period than the segment determined by 1 year.

[JayJuanGee]

It's just the beginning

Exactly this.
It is understandable to see some people talk about the "failure" just because bitcoin didn't moon since the day El Salvador adopted bitcoin we saw a lot of topics talking about how they are going to become "rich" from the "pump"! These are the same people who buy $10 worth of bitcoin and expect to become a millionaire in a week.

But the way the mainstream media has been attacking El Salvador because they only abandoned US dollar a tiny bit is pure propaganda. Adopting bitcoin was never supposed to perform miracles in this poor country but it was a great first step towards that over the long haul.

I agree with the bitcoin naysayers are either misleadingly asserting that El Salvador "abandoned" USD and/or suggesting that El Salvador is some kind of a reckless actor in its adoption of bitcoin, and the reality of the matter is similar to what you suggest pooya87.  The claims of abandonment are weak at best, since bitcoin merely provides another option and/or a parallel system that any country should perceive such parallel currency building action as prudent and/or responsible.

I will admit that Bukele's somewhat flamboyant approach in the beginning of the bitcoin adoption may have attracted more naysayers and haters than if he had taken a less flamboyant approach - yet there may also have had been some value in employing such flamboyance - so it is not any kind of obvious flaw.. it's discretionary whether or not to employ flamboyance in an approach, and leaders must go forward within their discretion regarding how one approach (such as flamboyance) versus another (such as less flamboyance) might play out.

I won't say bitcoin adaption is failed yet because some big like this will take some time, specially if it's coming up for the first time in the world but I think the reason of why that's not going fast and well as it should be is their government. Their government is somehow forced people to use and accept bitcoin which cannot have good effects

Bullshit.  That (bolded above) is an overly dramatized representation of what happened and/or what is happening.  For the most part, the law gives options to citizen's  to be able to use bitcoin.  If a business has the capabilities to accept BTC payments (such as the communication devices), then they must accept bitcoin as payment, but they do not have to keep their value in bitcoin.  It's an exaggeration to assert that the government is "forcing" people to use and accept bitcoin - even if there is some technical truth to what you are saying, but still disingenuine to be spreading as if it were some kind of a great injustice like the bitcoin naysayers/haters like to exaggerate those kinds of misleading talking points.

[Marvell1]

....

But the way the mainstream media has been attacking El Salvador because they only abandoned US dollar a tiny bit is pure propaganda. Adopting bitcoin was never supposed to perform miracles in this poor country but it was a great first step towards that over the long haul.

Before using bitcoin, El Salvador used USD and it did not make El Salvador better and even risked default. Accepting and using bitcoin in place of USD does not guarantee that they will become rich or become a great power but if they do not get rid of the dependence on USD, they will never get rid of the debt and oppression of the developed countries. El Salvador's bitcoin revolution may or may not succeed, but bitcoin is opening a path that USD has never offered to El Salvador. "If you work hard, there is no guarantee that you will succeed, but if you don't work hard, you will never succeed".

... because it's not issued or controlled by a central authority (eg: Banks, governments).

I think this is what President Nayibbukele sees from bitcoin, bitcoin is not owned by anyone and it is not controlled by any government. This will be better for his country than using USD manipulated and controlled by the US government.

[bbc.reporter]

We cannot tell everyone that El Salvador has failed yet in their plans for bitcoin's adoption in their country. However, what we are witnessing is that it is very difficult to adopt as a medium of exchange because of volatility.

I am aware that it is arguable. But Bukele's excuse of not losing $50 million because he did not sell is a funny one because it appears he did with where the market price presently is. This is also the same excuse we say when we hold an asset below the purchase price. He has become one of us heheheheh.

Bukele's government has been buying Bitcoin regardless of its price in Fiat terms. Not a single coin has been sold so far, so El Salvador hasn't lost anything yet. I'd say this is a good strategy, because it could make the Latin-American country one of the richest (if not the richest) ones in the world after the crypto market turns bullish again. Bitcoin has been shown to reach a new All-time-high in price after every halving event, so it's likely the same will happen by 2024.

If Bitcoin becomes a huge success in El Salvador, then other countries won't think twice by making Bitcoin legal tender. Who knows if there's a very bright future ahead for long-time Bitcoin "hodlers" like us? Just my thoughts

My reply was supossed to be a joke if anyone did not get it. I was only laughing at Bukele's reasoning on why he did not lose money because it is very much a similar reaction to those retail investors who are losing money in their investments when the market is dumping hehehehe.

Again, your supposed "joke" is not funny because you are striving to make Bukele, El Salvador and/or any other investor appear as if they are dumb when they are down in their investment - as if they should have known in advance what you happen to have found out in retrospect when the BTC price ended up going down.  

It appears you never got the joke. It is very funny because this is the common reason that newbies and those investors who hold assets that are losing value always say. This also includes me and seeing that a president of a country is also saying the same excuses is, I reckon, very funny.

I do not disrespect Bukele. He also has arguments that I much agree with. The argument similar to this interview.

https://mobile.twitter.com/alexstanczyk/status/1587853770100445184

[JayJuanGee]

We cannot tell everyone that El Salvador has failed yet in their plans for bitcoin's adoption in their country. However, what we are witnessing is that it is very difficult to adopt as a medium of exchange because of volatility.

I am aware that it is arguable. But Bukele's excuse of not losing $50 million because he did not sell is a funny one because it appears he did with where the market price presently is. This is also the same excuse we say when we hold an asset below the purchase price. He has become one of us heheheheh.

Bukele's government has been buying Bitcoin regardless of its price in Fiat terms. Not a single coin has been sold so far, so El Salvador hasn't lost anything yet. I'd say this is a good strategy, because it could make the Latin-American country one of the richest (if not the richest) ones in the world after the crypto market turns bullish again. Bitcoin has been shown to reach a new All-time-high in price after every halving event, so it's likely the same will happen by 2024.

If Bitcoin becomes a huge success in El Salvador, then other countries won't think twice by making Bitcoin legal tender. Who knows if there's a very bright future ahead for long-time Bitcoin "hodlers" like us? Just my thoughts

My reply was supossed to be a joke if anyone did not get it. I was only laughing at Bukele's reasoning on why he did not lose money because it is very much a similar reaction to those retail investors who are losing money in their investments when the market is dumping hehehehe.

Again, your supposed "joke" is not funny because you are striving to make Bukele, El Salvador and/or any other investor appear as if they are dumb when they are down in their investment - as if they should have known in advance what you happen to have found out in retrospect when the BTC price ended up going down.  

It appears you never got the joke. It is very funny because this is the common reason that newbies and those investors who hold assets that are losing value always say. This also includes me and seeing that a president of a country is also saying the same excuses is, I reckon, very funny.

I do not disrespect Bukele. He also has arguments that I much agree with. The argument similar to this interview.
https://mobile.twitter.com/alexstanczyk/status/1587853770100445184

I doubt that I failed to get your attempt at a joke.. I just don't think that it is a very funny joke, for the reasons that I already attempted to outline in my earlier response.

Sure human behavior can be funny and ironic - but there is a certain amount of not-funniness when you are denigrating what seems to be pretty bold efforts of an underdog government official.. in terms of aspects of the true challenge that he is taking on to adopt bitcoin as one of the monetary options in El Salvador.  He still has not been killed, either.. even though we see that there is a lot of hatred and denigration of him that comes from status quo institutions that see his action as a threat to the system and too UPpity.. he doesn't sufficiently know his place... so in that sense, the joke is not funny.

If it turns out that Bukele attempts to run away with the money or engages in some similar kind of corruption in regards with the bitcoin in their treasury.. then I may well like to denigrate him too, but we do  not have any evidence that he is actually acting in bad faith in terms of the reasons that he seems to have expressed for getting involved in bitcoin in the various ways that he has and also in terms of including some aspect of the country's treasury in terms of buying some bitcoin, too.

Nice interview clip that you linked.  Bukele's interview with Peter McCormick from 6 months ago or so too was a very good depiction of Bukele's seeming attempts to be genuine about these bitcoin matters and also his abilities to attempt to talk about contradictions in some of the western systems.

[Daltonik]

Of course, the adoption of bitcoin by Salvador in order to attract advanced technologies and companies to the country that Bukele was counting on could not but face pressure, but I think Bukele did not expect such a large amount of fud. Of course, what he did by filling the parliament with people loyal to him from his "New Ideas" party to start transformations may lead to a dictatorship in the future and this is frightening, the best option in my opinion would be, for example, Bukele's statement that after the reforms he will leave, while there is no such fear is fully justified, and these are the main negative moments casting a shadow on.

[bbc.reporter]

Nice interview clip that you linked.  Bukele's interview with Peter McCormick from 6 months ago or so too was a very good depiction of Bukele's seeming attempts to be genuine about these bitcoin matters and also his abilities to attempt to talk about contradictions in some of the western systems.

Agreed but what I did not like in that interview was Peter McCormick's clothes. He was wearing tattered jeans and a tshirt. This is very disprespectful to the president of a country, I reckon.

In any case, as a real person he might not be that bad and he appears to have a similar attitude as many of us in concerns on society, economics and politics. However, politics is politics and he might be forced to make the difficult decisions that might be unpopular for the many to not provoke those few people behind him.

[famososMuertos]

Of course, the adoption of bitcoin by Salvador in order to attract advanced technologies and companies to the country that Bukele was counting on could not but face pressure, but I think Bukele did not expect such a large amount of fud. Of course, what he did by filling the parliament with people loyal to him from his "New Ideas" party to start transformations may lead to a dictatorship in the future and this is frightening, the best option in my opinion would be, for example, Bukele's statement that after the reforms he will leave, while there is no such fear is fully justified, and these are the main negative moments casting a shadow on.

The continuity of Bukele does not have to be seen as a dictatorship, in fact there are dictatorships disguised as democracies all over the world, I do not want to go into details but Bukele should continue for at least 10 years more than enough time to be able to develop the whole of ideas.

 Bitcoin has been only a part of the complex process that El Salvador is experiencing, the security issue has had a complex framework that it decided to face with a complex social nuance.

 Things like knocking down tombs, of antisocials who were worshiping or altars, for example, there is a level of detail that must be looked at in the complexity of a country that requires continuity of leadership.

So mentioning the issue of dictatorship only borders on ignoring the situation from a more objective point of view.

That is one of the reasons that the title of this post does not consider and that in the misinterpretation of the question it is presented as a new question assuming that the adoption failed, based on merely standardized terms that in this case end up biased.

[Beparanf]

I won't say bitcoin adaption is failed yet because some big like this will take some time, specially if it's coming up for the first time in the world but I think the reason of why that's not going fast and well as it should be is their government. Their government is somehow forced people to use and accept bitcoin which cannot have good effects

Bitcoin adaption is a lengthy process which will certainly take many more years as it is not easy to convene people to stop using fiat currencies which has been used since centuries. I fully agree with you that Bitcoin adaption is not failed but it was not adapted at a fast pace  many crypto community had expected it because of number of reason and I think the major one is consistent bear run in crypto market since past almost one year.

I agree that he rushed things not by totally implementing Bitcoin as legal tender but the time when he enter on Bitcoin without even considering hedging his funds while Bitcoin price is on the new territory above old all time high price. I believe his people will be easily convinced if they enter slowly right after the price hype and not during the hype.

If only he decided to enter now and not on his original entry point. He might gain the support of his people since they will create a huge trend on this uncertain market. His people is angry because they are losing big time on the things they don't want the risk.

[jokers10]

Bitcoin adaption is a lengthy process which will certainly take many more years as it is not easy to convene people to stop using fiat currencies which has been used since centuries. I fully agree with you that Bitcoin adaption is not failed but it was not adapted at a fast pace  many crypto community had expected it because of number of reason and I think the major one is consistent bear run in crypto market since past almost one year.

If to expect when Bitcoin will totally replace fiat currencies then it will probably never done. But is it what we really need? I don't think so, Bitcoin gives alternative opportunities and if people got such opportunities then Bitcoin adoption didn't fail already. Even those who don't use Bitcoin at the moment can get some benefits from is as bank system having a strong competitor is much more motivated to provide better and cheaper service. May be we all want more but I'd say that what we have is already valuable.

[EdgeoftheContinent]

El Salvador has about 2% of their reserves in bitcoin. It isn't very much in the big picture. El Salvador had the USD imposed on them and it wasn't popular when that happened, bitcoin seems to be following the same path. Using and understanding bitcoin takes time and not a lot of it has passed

[Aanuoluwatofunmi]

Nayib Bukele is ay it again with another episode of an interesting interview with the fox news where he make a good presentation you wouldn't want to miss out on what he offered during the interview with Tucker Carlson, go through this for more details https://twitter.com/BTC_Archive/status/1589735056007843840?t=xdAWV5LAuZKWeSp_hEiJwg&s=19 El-Savador is just beginning its journey with bitcoin adoption and nothing is failing yet, you could see the whole expression from the president on the state of affairs.

[Tallupooh]

9 out of 10 Salvadorans don't know what bitcoin is. Then 8 out of 10 claimed to have little faith in digital money, some even stated that they did not believe in it at all.

Bitcoin will definitely have an effect on society. If people don't know about bitcoin, then bitcoin adoption will fail. Because people's knowledge of bitcoin must also be needed.

On the other hand, if the Society knows about bitcoin, it will definitely not fail.

https://inet.detik.com/cyberlife/d-5909396/nekat-adopsi-bitcoin-negara-ini-jadi-amburadul/amp

[JayJuanGee]

9 out of 10 Salvadorans don't know what bitcoin is. Then 8 out of 10 claimed to have little faith in digital money, some even stated that they did not believe in it at all.

Bitcoin will definitely have an effect on society. If people don't know about bitcoin, then bitcoin adoption will fail. Because people's knowledge of bitcoin must also be needed.

On the other hand, if the Society knows about bitcoin, it will definitely not fail.

https://inet.detik.com/cyberlife/d-5909396/nekat-adopsi-bitcoin-negara-ini-jadi-amburadul/amp

Bitcoin has about 1% world-wide adoption, so 99/100 people in the world don't know what the fuck bitcoin is; however, personally, I will proclaim that bitcoin is already a success - even though it still has relatively low levels of adoption, and arguably even lower levels of awareness than the El Salvador population in which you are proclaiming that only 90% don't know what bitcoin is.. even though I question your rendition of supposed "awareness levels" of El Salvadoreans... as you are parroting such assertions from that article that you linked, unless we are just supposed to believe any kind of bullshit, merely because it is asserted within a linked article?  Is your source credible Tallupooh?  Maybe you should explain why you believe your source to be credible, and even elaborate on your own assertions regarding how even if the statistics were true how they support your conclusion that Bitcoin has failed in El Salvador.

[yazher]

9 out of 10 Salvadorans don't know what bitcoin is. Then 8 out of 10 claimed to have little faith in digital money, some even stated that they did not believe in it at all.
Bitcoin will definitely have an effect on society. If people don't know about bitcoin, then bitcoin adoption will fail. Because people's knowledge of bitcoin must also be needed.
On the other hand, if the Society knows about bitcoin, it will definitely not fail.
https://inet.detik.com/cyberlife/d-5909396/nekat-adopsi-bitcoin-negara-ini-jadi-amburadul/amp

They've just done some advanced implementation where they haven't educated their people about bitcoins before implementing it and when they are done so, the things to do for them is to conduct some seminars about bitcoins and make their people understand the importance of using it. Well! they haven't seemed to know about it at least a high percentage of their people but I'm sure, as time goes by, the adoptions will be positively improving when they increased their effort to promote the use of bitcoins.

[jokers10]

9 out of 10 Salvadorans don't know what bitcoin is. Then 8 out of 10 claimed to have little faith in digital money, some even stated that they did not believe in it at all.

Bitcoin will definitely have an effect on society. If people don't know about bitcoin, then bitcoin adoption will fail. Because people's knowledge of bitcoin must also be needed.

On the other hand, if the Society knows about bitcoin, it will definitely not fail.

https://inet.detik.com/cyberlife/d-5909396/nekat-adopsi-bitcoin-negara-ini-jadi-amburadul/amp

Strange statistics, looks like fake as all other say that Bitcoin payments are still not very popular in the country but if to talk to Salvadorians they in general know about Bitcoin and about that it is an official currency in their country. National Bureau of Economic Research says that little less than a half Salvadorians can use Chivo Wallet, about 20% used it more than just to get $30 bonus. Reuters is not complimentary to El Salvador's government's decision with Bitcoin, but also says that 20% of Salvadorians do use Chivo after $30 drop and 20% of business of the country accepts Bitcoin. So I'm sure that some knowledge about Bitcoin have much more than 10% of Salvadorians.

[Die_empty]

9 out of 10 Salvadorans don't know what bitcoin is. Then 8 out of 10 claimed to have little faith in digital money, some even stated that they did not believe in it at all.

Bitcoin will definitely have an effect on society. If people don't know about bitcoin, then bitcoin adoption will fail. Because people's knowledge of bitcoin must also be needed.

On the other hand, if the Society knows about bitcoin, it will definitely not fail.

https://inet.detik.com/cyberlife/d-5909396/nekat-adopsi-bitcoin-negara-ini-jadi-amburadul/amp

These statistics would only be true if 9 out of 10 El Salvadorians are illiterate. The bitcoin policy is a national policy that has received vast publicity in that nation. The use of bitcoin is not by force, it's an optional form of payment. Only those that have understands the opportunities that bitcoin offers would embrace this policy, others might decide to be onlookers.

It is also important to state that bitcoin education is still going on in this country which means awareness would keep improving daily. El Salvador's bitcoin experience might not have reached the expected end but I am sure it is on its way to success.

[JayJuanGee]

9 out of 10 Salvadorans don't know what bitcoin is. Then 8 out of 10 claimed to have little faith in digital money, some even stated that they did not believe in it at all.

Bitcoin will definitely have an effect on society. If people don't know about bitcoin, then bitcoin adoption will fail. Because people's knowledge of bitcoin must also be needed.

On the other hand, if the Society knows about bitcoin, it will definitely not fail.
https://inet.detik.com/cyberlife/d-5909396/nekat-adopsi-bitcoin-negara-ini-jadi-amburadul/amp

These statistics would only be true if 9 out of 10 El Salvadorians are illiterate. The bitcoin policy is a national policy that has received vast publicity in that nation. The use of bitcoin is not by force, it's an optional form of payment. Only those that have understands the opportunities that bitcoin offers would embrace this policy, others might decide to be onlookers.

It is also important to state that bitcoin education is still going on in this country which means awareness would keep improving daily. El Salvador's bitcoin experience might not have reached the expected end but I am sure it is on its way to success.

Exactly, if we want to assume that an overwhelming majority of El Salvadorians are either without any kind of media - or they live in caves within the country, then that statistic of 9/10 not knowing what bitcoin may well be true.... at least to have a bit of an idea regarding what bitcoin is.  I do agree with the idea that about 99% of the world does not know what bitcoin is, otherwise we would have greater than 1% of the world's adoption of bitcoin.. but that's another story that goes to the fact that even a decently large number of people who buy bitcoin don't really know what it is... so we are still early days in terms of both figuring out what bitcoin is and what are some of the purposes that bitcoin is capable of serving within society.. world-wide or even more locally for many folks.. local may well be more important (and concrete) rather than thinking/pondering globally (or global impacts/effects/use cases).

[Tallupooh]

9 out of 10 Salvadorans don't know what bitcoin is. Then 8 out of 10 claimed to have little faith in digital money, some even stated that they did not believe in it at all.


Bitcoin will definitely have an effect on society. If people don't know about bitcoin, then bitcoin adoption will fail. Because people's knowledge of bitcoin must also be needed.

On the other hand, if the Society knows about bitcoin, it will definitely not fail.

https://inet.detik.com/cyberlife/d-5909396/nekat-adopsi-bitcoin-negara-ini-jadi-amburadul/amp

Bitcoin has about 1% world-wide adoption, so 99/100 people in the world don't know what the fuck bitcoin is; however, personally, I will proclaim that bitcoin is already a success - even though it still has relatively low levels of adoption, and arguably even lower levels of awareness than the El Salvador population in which you are proclaiming that only 90% don't know what bitcoin is.. even though I question your rendition of supposed "awareness levels" of El Salvadoreans... as you are parroting such assertions from that article that you linked, unless we are just supposed to believe any kind of bullshit, merely because it is asserted within a linked article?  Is your source credible Tallupooh?  Maybe you should explain why you believe your source to be credible, and even elaborate on your own assertions regarding how even if the statistics were true how they support your conclusion that Bitcoin has failed in El Salvador.

To be honest, I actually only believed the articles I read. because I think the article makes a lot of sense about the failure of bitcoin adoption in El Salvador. Of course, I also read other articles to increase my knowledge. I'm sure people have different opinions and have their own beliefs.