GPU price in China drop to their lowest level in history after the ethereu merge

[_act_]

This life is not balanced at all, but humans make it more to be not balanced. Humans can turn blind us on something and be full of blatant misconceptions. A good instance of this is the bitcoin proof of work (PoW). What did some people said about it? They said bitcoin mining should be banned. Bitcoin miner are working more to the side of using clean energy to mine bitcoin, like waste gasses of the by-product in crude oil refineries and the use of others like hydroelectric power generation and solar energy.

After the Ethereum merge from PoW to PoS, some organizations wanted bitcoin to change to PoS too, but that is never going to happen for now. Instead of people to focus more on how the world can stay away from the use of fossil fuels to generate energy, which are releasing high amount of carbon, all they know is to focus on bitcoin PoW. Is bitcoin PoW the problem? No. Most problem are the countries that have no other alternatives than to use fossil fuels to produce energy.

When crypto mining was banned in China, GPU price dropped significantly. Recently after Ethereum merge, the price of GPU has fallen again, but to its lowest in history.

GPU prices in China drop to their lowest levels in history after the ethereum merge

If no electricity is produced, no labour in electricity sector. The more electricity that is produced, more labour, more employment. Companies that are manufacturing GPU, ASIC and other miners are employing workers. It means more employment.

PoW has resulted to increase in employment, but people do not want to understand than saying it is deteriorating the environment. But the deterioratiion caused by PoW is far less than the one caused by other activities like gold and other mineral mining, other industrial activities and many others that is leading to global warming.

[mk4]

In a Bitcoiner's perspective, isn't Ethereum moving to PoS a good thing? Not sure about mining hardware compatibility, but wouldn't it be a safe assumption that some of the Ethereum PoW miners would transition to mining BTC? Bitcoin's mining hashrate is doing really well despite markets being quite bearish. https://coin.dance/blocks/hashrate

[crwth]

I imagine it like this: people who have already established where they are currently and what they know tend not to want to change anything with their current situation, so what I’m trying to say is that if people are used to using fossil fuels as their source of energy, then they wouldn’t want to change anything else because that’s what they already know. It’s the same for everything.

So the reasoning with PoW producing an increase in employment doesn’t make any sense because PoS could still have some monitoring and incentivize something like that. I think it’s still better to focus on the environment before anything else because that’s where we all live in.

[avikz]

That was well expected! Now the actual gamers will be able to get their hands on to the latest gaming GPUs at the market price and there will be availability in the market. A relief for gamers in true senses!

I truly believe ETH merge will help in the growth of it because now more people will be able to participate in ETH mining through pools. We talk about inclusion, ETH merge is likely to achieve it.

[jackg]

In a Bitcoiner's perspective, isn't Ethereum moving to PoS a good thing? Not sure about mining hardware compatibility, but wouldn't it be a safe assumption that some of the Ethereum PoW miners would transition to mining BTC? Bitcoin's mining hashrate is doing really well despite markets being quite bearish.

It's likely that a lot of miners (especially with cheap rates on electricity) will have moved to bitcoin and probably a good suggestion or reason the hashrate has increased since the market has been bearish.


Saying ASIC development lead to employment is a bit like saying it lead to the destruction of the environment - it's a bit wrong as a lot of that is automatic. The logical option for a lot of cities is to use fossil fuels, it wasn't in the past when production could be supported via renewables in some cases (like in factories). Though I'm pretty sure there's more dragging heals since countries have planned to move to renewables.

[Doan9269]

After the Ethereum merge from PoW to PoS, some organizations wanted bitcoin to change to PoS too, but that is never going to happen for now

Not only will this nit going to happen now, it will never happen as i strongly believe, if the reason for the advises change from PoW to Pos is because of the energy challenge in relation to environment then i think there's lot to serve as alternative to that we the whole mining process go green using a renewable energy source, but by then i think the government would have realized the big deals they would have missed from the benefits bitcoin mining is serving them through PoW energy use from their source

Instead of people to focus more on how the world can stay away from the use of fossil fuels to generate energy, which are releasing high amount of carbon, all they know is to focus on bitcoin PoW

They keep on arguing this because they are yet to get convinced that bitcoin mining is environmentally friendly and this has been spelt several times to their hearing, but they can't just but attack.

Is bitcoin PoW the problem? No. Most problem are the countries that have no other alternatives than to use fossil fuels to produce energy.

Yes, and the average miners who can't afford the capacity to set up an alternative energy source of which i even believe should be more cheaper than the one coming from the government.

[cabron]

^ As of now BTC is recognized by SEC as commodity. But once it becomes POS too. Gensler will laughing out loud for falling to this green energy because BTC will then be considered as security which they can now lay hold of.

RTX 3080 for $1,140 is a sweet deal for someone eyeing to try mining. I am able to afford it today but I'm sure it will also go up when they see ETHpow price surge. Its below $1000 in newegg.

[Flexystar]

In a Bitcoiner's perspective, isn't Ethereum moving to PoS a good thing? Not sure about mining hardware compatibility, but wouldn't it be a safe assumption that some of the Ethereum PoW miners would transition to mining BTC? Bitcoin's mining hashrate is doing really well despite markets being quite bearish. https://coin.dance/blocks/hashrate

I’m not sure how you saying this one, but isn’t GPU no longer mines the bitcoin? We can not just go away with the investment they had into their mining farms. Some went so crazy that they have set ups across the border on Greenland and other icy islands. Imagine the cost to build them over there and getting the GPU there with additional custom duties and shit.

Let’s assume they have reached their BEP, but what about the profits? Or let’s assume some of them might have reached to profits too but what about the hardwares now? Just sell them into market where nobody wants it since ETH isn’t mineable anymore?

This is really hard patch for these miners. It’s not easy to switch between ETH to BTC mining. They will need entirely new machine for that. All they have right now is machines which may mine other coins with low profitability and high cost of maintaining.  

[Fortify]

This life is not balanced at all, but humans make it more to be not balanced. Humans can turn blind us on something and be full of blatant misconceptions. A good instance of this is the bitcoin proof of work (PoW). What did some people said about it? They said bitcoin mining should be banned. Bitcoin miner are working more to the side of using clean energy to mine bitcoin, like waste gasses of the by-product in crude oil refineries and the use of others like hydroelectric power generation and solar energy.

After the Ethereum merge from PoW to PoS, some organizations wanted bitcoin to change to PoS too, but that is never going to happen for now. Instead of people to focus more on how the world can stay away from the use of fossil fuels to generate energy, which are releasing high amount of carbon, all they know is to focus on bitcoin PoW. Is bitcoin PoW the problem? No. Most problem are the countries that have no other alternatives than to use fossil fuels to produce energy.

When crypto mining was banned in China, GPU price dropped significantly. Recently after Ethereum merge, the price of GPU has fallen again, but to its lowest in history.

GPU prices in China drop to their lowest levels in history after the ethereum merge

If no electricity is produced, no labour in electricity sector. The more electricity that is produced, more labour, more employment. Companies that are manufacturing GPU, ASIC and other miners are employing workers. It means more employment.

PoW has resulted to increase in employment, but people do not want to understand than saying it is deteriorating the environment. But the deterioratiion caused by PoW is far less than the one caused by other activities like gold and other mineral mining, other industrial activities and many others that is leading to global warming.

You have some weird thought processes and come to some very strange conclusions. Taking your electricity "argument" nonsense for example, that's simply not how it works. An efficient market works on supply and demand - if miners were the productive source of revenue generation that you suggest, then they would still be using and driving up energy prices. However they are simply not profitable any more, so any potential addition to the electricity grid that was spurred by the cryptocurrency trend will either be utilized by other industry or retired if it is not economical. The labor market is changing constantly, but you seem to suggest that electricity has no demand just because a few miners drop out, it's simply untrue.

[Silberman]

That was well expected! Now the actual gamers will be able to get their hands on to the latest gaming GPUs at the market price and there will be availability in the market. A relief for gamers in true senses!

I truly believe ETH merge will help in the growth of it because now more people will be able to participate in ETH mining through pools. We talk about inclusion, ETH merge is likely to achieve it.

I was thinking precisely about this as well, one of the big winners are the gamers, finding graphic cards which were new or even secondhand at a good price was basically impossible no matter where you looked, now that the ethereum developers finally made the transition to a proof of stake model then this is going to benefit them, I am not too much of a gamer but I am actually thinking about buying a decent graphic card myself because who knows for how long those low prices could last.

[_act_]

In a Bitcoiner's perspective, isn't Ethereum moving to PoS a good thing? Not sure about mining hardware compatibility, but wouldn't it be a safe assumption that some of the Ethereum PoW miners would transition to mining BTC? Bitcoin's mining hashrate is doing really well despite markets being quite bearish. https://coin.dance/blocks/hashrate

I am not talking about PoS, I am talking about how people are criticizing PoW while it is also helping people and economy, that people are looking into just one thing about PoW and criticizing it while not looking about the means electricity is generated and how PoW is helping people and economy. Electricity generation in the sense that miners can use clean electricity.

So the reasoning with PoW producing an increase in employment doesn’t make any sense because PoS could still have some monitoring and incentivize something like that. I think it’s still better to focus on the environment before anything else because that’s where we all live in.

Yes, that is true, I will assume that PoS would also reward people, but not like PoW. I see PoS reward not to be more than the mining reward, but PoW is more than that. But you people are getting me wrong, do not see the OP as a means of attacking PoS. No one says PoS is not good, but how if all crypto move to PoS, that it may not favour in some ways.

You have some weird thought processes and come to some very strange conclusions. Taking your electricity "argument" nonsense for example, that's simply not how it works. An efficient market works on supply and demand - if miners were the productive source of revenue generation that you suggest, then they would still be using and driving up energy prices. However they are simply not profitable any more, so any potential addition to the electricity grid that was spurred by the cryptocurrency trend will either be utilized by other industry or retired if it is not economical. The labor market is changing constantly, but you seem to suggest that electricity has no demand just because a few miners drop out, it's simply untrue.

Weird thought like? Do not change this forum into a place of abuses by trying to add up to your weekly posts. Who is arguing? Did you see me posting yet after the opening post? Probably you are out of your substance while posting this. The last part of your post let me understood that you do not get me rightly and just want to argue, read the OP very well without rushing it the way you did.

[dothebeats]

I wasn't surprised at all. Most of the GPU sales in the past few years were motivated by crypto mining, mostly for ETH. Finally it alleviated the pressure on GPU manufacturers and finally other sectors can already enjoy buying GPUs at lower prices. The ETH merge may have been extremely shaky, but it sure does benefit some other sectors even though there are still frsgments of PoW believers that are still clinging to their GPUs to mine their forked coins.

I expect a flood of used GPUs in the market in the next month. Those miners can try to use it on other coins but for sure they'd just use the proceeds to buy more coins for staking ETH.

[livingfree]

Just because we've seen ETH transitioned from PoW to PoS, there are now people that wanted bitcoin to do the same thing. They're nuts, it's not, never going to happen.

I've seen that a lot of small time miners that have complained on how little to nothing they're earning right now and many have stopped their operations because there's no profitable coin to mine such as ethereum. Now, they're like added to the unemployed people but that won't stop them to pursue doing something related to crypto.

Well, as for the flooding of GPUs in the market again. This has to be expected when it's reported that Ethereum will become PoS. Many have already planned about selling their used GPU once it happens.

[Kakmakr]

Well, to be honest ... most people were mining Ethereum and some other Alt coins with their GPU cards... so it is just natural that the demand for these GPU cards will decline, if PoW are replaced by PoS.

I found that most of the miners that were mining Ethereum, just switched to other Alt coins that still use PoW, so there will be a lot of people still mining with GPU cards. 

The hype of the whole Ethereum merge will blow over soon ....and people will realize that other Alt coins are still profitable. 

[mu_enrico]

GPU mining is the worst invention in human history lol, this f*ck fest made many gamers rekt including me. I haven't bought any GPU since 2018 because the price is so inflated. If you think the GPU price can go down quickly, you are wrong! People are used to experiencing inflation, so the price is never going back to pre-ETH or pre-BTC when it's mineable with GPU. The lowest level by what standard? Remember when a $150-$250 card was considered high-end? Back when I was in school, a $600 PC build was considered high-end! Now I have to spend $1200 to get a mainstream build.

[stompix]

Remember when a $150-$250 card was considered high-end? Back when I was in school, a $600 PC build was considered high-end! Now I have to spend $1200 to get a mainstream build.

What were your video cards at that point capable of? Watching a 720p stream witouht overheating?
Compare the 250$ card that you bought then with the price of a card with the same specs now, you will definitely find one 10 times more powerful for 100$. It's like comparing how expensive a 5 series is compared to 50 years ago when the first generation E12 didn't have abs, no power steering no airbag, and the clime comfort was a manual window.

I wasn't surprised at all. Most of the GPU sales in the past few years were motivated by crypto mining, mostly for ETH.

At the peak and excluding ASICs that were mining too, you could have the entire hash rate of ETH with 6 million 3xxx, Nvidia alone has sold around 40 million graphic cards a year, so no, mining was still not the main focus of any video card maker.

It's likely that a lot of miners (especially with cheap rates on electricity) will have moved to bitcoin and probably a good suggestion or reason the hashrate has increased since the market has been bearish.

I was just talking with the others in the mining speculation thread and we kind of came to the same conclusion Bitmain is slashing prices (5x) year to date because there is zero demand for new miners. I doubt too many home GPU mines will be able to switch to sha256 ASICs, the power consumption requires a different setup and not your ordinary apartment socket, then the heat, and the noise, you could sleep in a room with 2-3 videocards running, but I doubt you would be able to sleep with a tings that makes as much noise as a Karcher vacuum cleaner.

[justdimin]

Well, to be honest ... most people were mining Ethereum and some other Alt coins with their GPU cards... so it is just natural that the demand for these GPU cards will decline, if PoW are replaced by PoS.

I found that most of the miners that were mining Ethereum, just switched to other Alt coins that still use PoW, so there will be a lot of people still mining with GPU cards. 

The hype of the whole Ethereum merge will blow over soon ....and people will realize that other Alt coins are still profitable. 

Other altcoins are still profitable but we are talking about the most profitable one, and the one that could eat up so much hashrate and still end up doing well enough that it didn't disturb anyone. If we start to put all of that hashrate on something else then we are going to put it somewhere that doesn't need so much and it would be useless.

So, we need to spread it around and that means we are going to have a bunch of altcoins that fight for the right of being at the top. That is why we are going to end up with something a bit lower, not going to be that much of a problem for ALL gpu owners, but we are going to see many of them selling, dropping the price.

[DrBeer]

The change in mining technology in the crypto world is an expected step. The stupid burning of gigawatts of electricity is not the most logical behavior in today's situation. Moreover, this is a real stupid burning of electricity without getting any effective work for humanity, just because "we have a lot of video cards and ASICs."

[Hydrogen]

Does anyone anticipate market prices of GPUs rising due to semiconductor shortages? Or is the pure computational and data center segment of the market polarized enough to be isolated from rising demand of more general purpose chips?

It is possible GPU price declines will be temporary. Due to crypto miners panic dumping mining units. Once the excess supply is exhausted, prices could return to normal levels.

Considering recent stories of manufacturers purchasing brand new appliances to cannibalize the semiconductors in them to meet manufacturing component quotas. I feel tempted to call a bottom on GPU prices. Inflation could also contribute to current prices being the lowest we'll see within the short term. Possibly even the long term.

[jackg]

It's likely that a lot of miners (especially with cheap rates on electricity) will have moved to bitcoin and probably a good suggestion or reason the hashrate has increased since the market has been bearish.

I was just talking with the others in the mining speculation thread and we kind of came to the same conclusion Bitmain is slashing prices (5x) year to date because there is zero demand for new miners. I doubt too many home GPU mines will be able to switch to sha256 ASICs, the power consumption requires a different setup and not your ordinary apartment socket, then the heat, and the noise, you could sleep in a room with 2-3 videocards running, but I doubt you would be able to sleep with a tings that makes as much noise as a Karcher vacuum cleaner.

I was considering places like Russia and China to be able to sell cheap electricity to industries which might be able to facilitate mining too (a lot of places too probably have better rates if you can guarantee the exact amount of energy you'll use or the energy you use doesn't change much - and is a lot).

UK plug sockets are able to handle up to 3000W (electric kettles use about that much). But yes it will have moved some miners with GPUs to other things - obviously there's no chance you'd want an Antminer in a studio flat, I noticed Bybit had an offer on GPU mining software they claim to be good - this was via email so I don't have a reference link - (I'd guess nicehash does too but I'm not sure if there's any additional competition there).

Does anyone anticipate market prices of GPUs rising due to semiconductor shortages? Or is the pure computational and data center segment of the market polarized enough to be isolated from rising demand of more general purpose chips?

I think the pricing of GPUs has already been manipulated quite a bit due to a lack of competition (with nearly all coming from AMD and Nvidia).
There's a chance control units other parts that need to be printed especially will still be expensive (especially if they use cpu parts that are scarce.

It is possible GPU price declines will be temporary. Due to crypto miners panic dumping mining units. Once the excess supply is exhausted, prices could return to normal levels.

Considering recent stories of manufacturers purchasing brand new appliances to cannibalize the semiconductors in them to meet manufacturing component quotas. I feel tempted to call a bottom on GPU prices. Inflation could also contribute to current prices being the lowest we'll see within the short term. Possibly even the long term.

There are still incentives to make games a lot more compatible now with standard laptops/computers but GPUs will still be sought after by a lot of gamers wanting better graphics and lower lag. I think GPUs are still required in data mining though (and things like password cracking/forensics) so I think there'll still be a big market for them - ethereum mining also seemed to force them to become more cross compatible too (so gpus could be used on linux) which might give them an additional market to exploit still.

I don't quite know whether pillages will be done as much as finding ways to encorporate a GPU into a system if it means keeping the costs down (especially if something a gpu has can be used by multiple parts of a system (like power controllers). There might be driverless vehicles and other innovations soon that may be buying up gpus now to be used in their future systems