{INFO} SO, YOU WANNA GENERATE YOUR OWN KEYS FOR PHYSICAL BITCOIN ITEMS?

[krogothmanhattan]

Ok...so every so often as we can see from this thread here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5416349.0 new collectors or seasoned alike stop by and ask what is the safest or what is the way we seasoned collectors have generated our keys etc etc etc. SO I figure lets make a thread for anyone to share their way of doing it in the hope others learn a safe way on generating their keys.

   
      This is the Cypher Hodl way of doing it...


      Air Gapped computer

         Buy a new laptop...remove the wifi card...disable Bluetooth and any access to any internet connection.. ports.etc etc.etc... place on airplane mode.




       Key Generation

        I use a Mycelium Entropy device for all of my items.

          https://mycelium.com/mycelium-entropy.html

       

        If you cannot find one....and they are impossible to find...do the following...

        Use a Trezor. Reset the device....get a new seed created and use that to place under the Holo and use the corresponding public address for the loading part.

       You can then reset and do as many times as needed to get as many new addresses as you want made.

     



      Printer

         I bought a laserprinter to use for printing these keys and nothing else. DO NOT CONNECT THE WIFI..or even better a printer with no wifi.


   
       Paper 

   I use Terra water proof paper for all my private keys and as you can see from this test I have three different products and so far all three have withstood the test of time

   https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5296179.0

   

   
    Just keep in mind their are malware/virus/programs out there seeking our keys and seeds ready to swoop in and sweep your precious satoshi away
     

    I also recommend if you use any other device instead of just a qr code for priv key also print a second one with the alphanumeric key as well. Just my two Satoshi...that's what i always do anyway.

    Hope that helps.

   I am sure their are other who have their way of doing things that kind post as well.


   As for being a physical bitcoin maker...not only will  you need to generate your keys the safeway you will also need to be your trust.....our hobby is all built on how trustworthy the physical bitcoin maker is at the end of the day. So that is also a very big factor in the equation.

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Information threads made by
KrogothManhattan

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[krogothmanhattan]

And never ever use any website that generates your keys as you can read from the following it can be devastating!

And definitely DO NOT USE www.bitcoinpaperwallet.com

https://www.coindesk.com/tech/2021/02/24/bitcoinpaperwallet-back-door-responsible-for-millions-in-missing-funds-research-suggests/?outputType=amp

   It was great when Canton owned it...but he sodl it years ago and it looks like people lost BTC under the new owners

  I used the program years ago when I bought from Canton the CD to run on my airgapped computer and my BTC was never compromised.

  This BIP38 digital stamp has been online since 2017 and the 0.02 BTC has never been compromised or swept...so the code I bought was genuine back then

http://www.crypto-stamps.com/private3.html

[MoparMiningLLC]

Very nice write up krogoth!

Personally, I would recommend the QT wallets over any physical device as nearly every coin out there has a QT wallet so this also reduces the cost and reduces the amount of devices you have to manage.  It can be a pita to update them, but I do so via throw away usb sticks that are fairly cheap.

I second the paper as well Terraslate is great, I personally use Revlar which is waterproof, tear-proof, grease-resistant, washable / cleanable, fade-resistant and recyclable.

And if you can find a printer that has no memory buffer or at least a buffer you can clear. And if you do get one with wifi/bluetooth, remove the modules (would do that on the airgapped system as well) - there are ways of connecting to them directly vs having them connect to something. Couple that with a memory store on the printer and the keys are at risk.

All in all - you can be careful as you want and there is still always a risk.

[Hookzup1]

Awesome write up thank you I really wish I had merit to offer 😉

[KrispyKrypto]

Thanks for creating this thread. The forum needed one .

[Mbitr]

Great work  Hopefully this can be used as a standard for all new loaded collectibles.

[NeuroticFish]

Use a Trezor. Reset the device....get a new seed created and use that to place under the Holo and use the corresponding public address for the loading part.

You can then reset and do as many times as needed to get as many new addresses as you want made.

I think that you can add Ledger too to the list. It has same property: enter wrong PIN 3 times in a row and you can generate a new seed.
Plus this can go in other places too, not only collectibles, since people still want to create their own paper wallets in a way or another.

I would add a live OS stick (Tails?) too as an option for easy setup, since the computer setup you wrote can be tricky, traces/files will remain there for when one restarts WiFi / network.


However, great initiative and nice tutorial!

[krogothmanhattan]

Use a Trezor. Reset the device....get a new seed created and use that to place under the Holo and use the corresponding public address for the loading part.

You can then reset and do as many times as needed to get as many new addresses as you want made.

I think that you can add Ledger too to the list. It has same property: enter wrong PIN 3 times in a row and you can generate a new seed.
Plus this can go in other places too, not only collectibles, since people still want to create their own paper wallets in a way or another.

I would add a live OS stick (Tails?) too as an option for easy setup, since the computer setup you wrote can be tricky, traces/files will remain there for when one restarts WiFi / network.


However, great initiative and nice tutorial!

  Thanks for the feedback all.

   I posted what I use and recommend...and am expecting others to chip in what they use.

   And the air gapped computer will never ever go online...when the day comes that I do not use for the key generation...I will be destroying the hard drive and all parts of the laptop. So I am not worried about any wifi network restart...thats why it has to be dedicated striclty for this without the thought of using it online down the line

   Ans yes a ledger can be used the same way as a Trezor, I just love my Trezors and use them exclusively even though I do have ledgers which I keep as part of my Bitcoin collection only never to load in any way.

[Steeley]

Hey, this thread is a foundational one here on the forum. It's been almost 4 years since the last posts. Have there been any developments or advancements relevant to key generation?

[MoparMiningLLC]

I dont use any hardware to generate keys outside the airgapped pc itself

- no usb devices
- no trezor or any hardware wallet.

The airgapped system I use has the SAMR7 vanitygen (it can create non-vanity as well as vanity) and a bitcoin core QT client which can generate address/key pairs as well. But it does create wallet.dat files so those I have to delete - I do not prefer this method as it requires that I delete the files. With the SAMR7 its all in a console window that is gone once I close the window.  I still periodically remove the hard drive - drill and burn the old drive and install a new drive.

I still use the same paper and offline laser printer.

One can also use a raspberry pi that stores the keys generated in RAM so that once printed and you shut off the pi the keys are gone. there is no retrieving them.

[bestcoin_59]

I still periodically remove the hard drive - drill and burn the old drive and install a new drive.

I still use the same paper and offline laser printer.

One can also use a raspberry pi that stores the keys generated in RAM so that once printed and you shut off the pi the keys are gone. there is no retrieving them.

Yeah, perhaps it is even easier to use a Ubuntu LIVE session...Just my 2 cents...

[Bitgoat65]

Thanks for the info and update, Mopar. Curious what people think about the newer forks, like vanitygen-plusplus. Do they offer any real advantages on newer PCs, or is sticking with the older SAMR7 version still the better route since it’s more proven?

[MoparMiningLLC]

I still periodically remove the hard drive - drill and burn the old drive and install a new drive.

I still use the same paper and offline laser printer.

One can also use a raspberry pi that stores the keys generated in RAM so that once printed and you shut off the pi the keys are gone. there is no retrieving them.

Yeah, perhaps it is even easier to use a Ubuntu LIVE session...Just my 2 cents...

I do have a pi system that is running linux - not sure what a "live" session is. but the pi generates the pairs, I print, I turn it off all the data is gone - it was in ram.

Thanks for the info and update, Mopar. Curious what people think about the newer forks, like vanitygen-plusplus. Do they offer any real advantages on newer PCs, or is sticking with the older SAMR7 version still the better route since it’s more proven?

i have not used any of the new ones so cannot speak to whether it is "better" or not. but SAMR7 works exactly as it should so not sure what any new program could offer that would make it better.

The main thing is to  run on airgapped. you run it on an online pc you might as well use a web generator.

[bestcoin_59]

I still periodically remove the hard drive - drill and burn the old drive and install a new drive.

I still use the same paper and offline laser printer.

One can also use a raspberry pi that stores the keys generated in RAM so that once printed and you shut off the pi the keys are gone. there is no retrieving them.

Yeah, perhaps it is even easier to use a Ubuntu LIVE session...Just my 2 cents...

Yes, with a Ubuntu Live session everything is compute in RAM. Once turn off all the data are gone. That way no need to drill or burnt HDD.
https://ubuntu.com/desktop/docs/en/latest/how-to/create-a-bootable-usb-stick/

[bestcoin_59]

@krogo,
Although i would love to get a copy of Mycelium Entropy device as a collector, i wouldn't use it for serious purpose.
Indeed, i think the source of entropy is too limited:
https://medium.com/@wendellmouzaliruiz/a-critical-review-of-seed-entropy-in-computational-environments-129da05defb2
and
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5527126.0

[krogoth]

@krogo,
Although i would love to get a copy of Mycelium Entropy device as a collector, i wouldn't use it for serious purpose.
Indeed, i think the source of entropy is too limited:
https://medium.com/@wendellmouzaliruiz/a-critical-review-of-seed-entropy-in-computational-environments-129da05defb2

  Thanks for the great article.

[bestcoin_59]

Thanks for the great article.

Thanks:)
I edited my post and added an other link.