Germany surprises everyone, the economy keeps growing

[stompix]

As always, your beloved stompix bringing you the good news that nobody wants to hear.
Keeping it up after my last one:
Eu gas and electricity prices drop 80% to 2021 level, another apocalypse averted
here is again, good news!

Europe’s top economy expanded by 0.3% in the third quarter
Archived since paywall!

Remember how Germany was supposed to plunge into recession, how according to some 60% (just lol) of the companies went bankrupt, how everything is shut down, how there is no more light, no more cars, how bla bla bla.
Well, again, completely defying propaganda Germany has managed to grow again, despite the highest energy prices ever encountered, and those are going down all the way in Q3, TTF day ahead spot prices crashing almost 10 times from the peak.

What's more interesting is that the whole EU economy still went up, and only one country posted you decline with 3 countries posting a previous trimester decline.

Of course, this doesn't mean everything is going perfectly, inflation was still up, but the ECB is finally starting to do its thing, and as I said a few months ago, doing it the right way, acting when it matters and with enough room left for more serious involvement, especially since one of the countries that posted surprising growth was Italy
Italy's economy grows stronger than expected 0.5% in Q3, easing pressure on new govt
and these numbers will help counter the fear of the consequences of further rate hikes.

Going back to Germany, there is the need to address one thing as I saw some quoting that large companies are fleeing to China and shutting down in Germany.
Of course, the usual crap, and the truth is completely different.

BASF planned to open a factory in China in 2019:
https://www.basf.com/cn/en/who-we-are/organization/key-production-sites/guangdong.html
BASF is a 80 billion a year in revenue company, with factories in 11 countries, investing 10 billion is nowhere near what a move would look like.

And furthermore, to counter all the doom and gloom and bankruptcy theories:
https://www.basf.com/global/en/media/news-releases/2022/10/p-22-381.html
BASF achieved solid EBIT before special items despite continued high raw materials and energy prices

Sales of €21.9 billion up 12 percent over prior-year quarter
Unchanged outlook for 2022: Expected sales of between €86 billion and €89 billion, EBIT before special items of between €6.8 billion and €7.2 billion

As I said above, this doesn't mean that the EU will avoid a technical recession completely, since Q4 is always a slowdown, taking into account inflation and demand destruction we might still see a recession, I'm actually convinced there will be one in Q1 2023, but every single analyst out there no matter how negativist he is about this has slashed the decline numbers, from the worse -1.2 were slowly hovering to an average between -0.6% and -0.2% and not a single source is mentioning a decline in the whole 2023, as overall the economy will reverse the start of the year trend and still grow. Not as fast as predicted at the start of this year but not doomsday either.

So everyone should be happy, another apocalypse is being avoided, the economy works, employment is at record levels, people still have money, and people still afford to buy bitcoins, what do you get if you preach all day long about collapses and recession and bankruptcy?

[Erumo]

Once again Germany is going to save Europe's ass. Not supporting Nazism stuff, but imagine what the world would be if they won WWII and keep on developing.

[Don Pedro Dinero]

As always, your beloved stompix bringing you the good news that nobody wants to hear.
Keeping it up after my last one:
Eu gas and electricity prices drop 80% to 2021 level, another apocalypse averted
here is again, good news!

<...>

So everyone should be happy, another apocalypse is being avoided, the economy works, employment is at record levels, people still have money, and people still afford to buy bitcoins, what do you get if you preach all day long about collapses and recession and bankruptcy?

I have been pessimistic but I want to hear news like that, and much better news in the future if possible. All we need now is for the war in Ukraine to end, not only because of the economic issue, but because of the human drama above all, but it is clear that it would also give a good boost to the economy.

Once again Germany is going to save Europe's ass.

Germany is known as the locomotive of Europe. A strong Germany is in the EU's interest.

[Argoo]

That the countries of Europe without Russian gas and oil could freeze in the coming winter was propaganda by Russia, which sought to force the EU to lift or at least ease international sanctions in exchange for resuming supplies of its oil and gas. This blackmail and threats this time had no effect on the countries of Europe. Yes, long-running supply chains have broken down. But Europe is confidently overcoming this crisis and has already filled its storage facilities by more than 90 percent without Russian energy carriers. By the end of the year, Europe will completely abandon offshore supplies of Russian oil, and this will be a serious blow to the Russian economy. Russia is now losing on all fronts. The bet on force, blackmail and threats did not work this time. Hard times will come not in Europe, but in Russia.

[Smartprofit]

Once again Germany is going to save Europe's ass. Not supporting Nazism stuff, but imagine what the world would be if they won WWII and keep on developing.

In my opinion, just the fact that Germany lost the Second World War made her a strong state economically.

Militarism hinders the normal economic development of the country in the long run.  Germany was inoculated against fascism and militarism.  She learned to be friends and cooperate with other countries.  At the same time, the Germans have always been distinguished by diligence, education and discipline.  In the 19th century, almost all engineering textbooks were written in German. 

I am confident that Germany will continue to experience economic crises with less losses than other countries.

[Die_empty]

So everyone should be happy, another apocalypse is being avoided, the economy works, employment is at record levels, people still have money, and people still afford to buy bitcoins, what do you get if you preach all day long about collapses and recession and bankruptcy?

It is really hard to find any good economic news recently, thank you @stompix for sharing this good news.

I was thinking that European nations would soon go broke because of cost financing and supporting Ukraine. Another factor that always make the doomsday predictions real is the refusal of OPEC+ to increase the crude production because they want the price to keep increasing. There was even news of protests erupting in some parts of Europe because of high cost of gas and other essential commodities. There were predictions that these protests would soon spread to other parts of Europe thereby giving an opportunity for anarchy.

From this information it is clear that although Europe is not free from its economic challenges but there is a very bright light at the end of the tunnel.

[stompix]

I have been pessimistic but I want to hear news like that, and much better news in the future if possible.

There will be, but the good news doesn't make clickbait material, nobody is going to click a piece of news about being sunny while a million will rush to read that an asteroid has a 0.0000<50of 0> 1 % chance of hitting the earth in the next one million years. The world has been through a lot of shit, ww1 and 2, wave after wave of the financial crisis, covid and the Spanish flu , and we're still standing, I can remember how in 2009 everyone was seeing it as the end of the world.

I was thinking that European nations would soon go broke because of cost financing and supporting Ukraine.

Bruh, it's a 16 trillion economy + UK at 3T against one that doesn't have the GDP of Italy anymore and has a lower GDP per capita than the poorest of the EU.
It's insane to think the EU would go broke in an economic war with Russia.

There was even news of protests erupting in some parts of Europe because of high cost of gas and other essential commodities. There were predictions that these protests would soon spread to other parts of Europe thereby giving an opportunity for anarchy.

Protests happen in Europe all the time, we have this freedom of not getting shot like animals when we go protesting peacefully, and every party tries to get an advantage when they are not in power and organize this kind of protest to erode the government but it's still nothing, none of them had real magnitude and support for helping Ukraine is the same and growing. Some mistake protests in Europe with the anarchy in other countries, but it's not like that, Belgium went 600 days without a government, and the Netherlands did so for 9 months, it's not like everything will crash just because of a power change.

[avikz]

If I am not wrong, I believe Germany has recently announced a 200 billion subsidy for the electricity and gas pricing to give relief to the common people and to the industrial units. I am not sure how much true it is. But if this is the main reason why the energy prices are down in Germany, it will have a catastrophic effect on rest of EU countries.

A subsidy war will be started and since German companies will be able to keep their product prices low due to the subsidy, entire EU will be flooded by German goods because they will be cheaper than the locally produced goods. That's not good for EU as a whole.

[DaveF]

As was shown in this post https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5418267.0 the 'doom and gloom' is not as real as news wants us to believe.
Yes things are up, but not really that much. CNG is still fairly cheap, and so on.
But telling people that does not sell ad space.

I am still seeing some people complaining about 'shortages of things' but digging a bit deeper I see it's a mostly I can't get THIS brand that I like there are only these 4 other brands of the exact same things but I don't like those brands.


I made a post a few years ago that is still somewhat active in P&S about a pair of gas stations across the street from each other and one of them had prices that were stupid high compared to the other: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5254433.0

From the last time a took a picture and posted in early September it's gotten worse Diesel at the cheap station went from $4.89 / gallon to $5.49 the expensive went from $6.99 to wait for it $7.99
So looking at 1 location you can easily say diesel fuel is $7.99 a gallon on Long Island. And it is....there. Every other station for MILES and MILES around is $5.79 or less.

I was listening to someone say how expensive the local pizza place has become for their lunch special. Guess what, 2 slices and a drink have been $8.00 there SINCE 2018. The other place down the road that went out of business (owner died nothing to do with economy) WAS MORE. But, he remembers the good old days or something.

-Dave

[arallmuus]

Remember how Germany was supposed to plunge into recession, how according to some 60% (just lol) of the companies went bankrupt, how everything is shut down, how there is no more light, no more cars, how bla bla bla.

Despite all those issue with the gas supply from Russia being cut or whatsoever that circles within that, it seems Germany paved their own way back. Well its Germany of course, the other countries could have been doomed by now if their gas supplies was cut

what do you get if you preach all day long about collapses and recession and bankruptcy?

About this, I've seen alot of this so called individuals on alot of platform that keep on preaching this recession issue. Im not sure with what their goal is but by preaching it every single day, they are actually encouraging this thing to actually happen. Probably they are trying to sell their 'investment course' or whatsoever but these people are actually disgusting in a way

[omone1]

Germany has always been a great nation with innovative people. they have been saving EU and keep doing that. There is something unique about the Germans that every other EU member nations should learn from. They have one of the greatest brand in the world and they do not go about making noise but keeps building.

[bittraffic]

Once again Germany is going to save Europe's ass. Not supporting Nazism stuff, but imagine what the world would be if they won WWII and keep on developing.

Good for them to finally wake up and run thier economy otherwise they'd be doomed.

That's why Germany needs saving right? Because it's diving into a deep well. They'd have to activate powerplants coal plants and nuclear plants back up again. They have condoned these powerplants before because they wanna lead the renewable energy. Poland is the biggest promoter of this renewable energy but is now thier source of gas and oil through the Poland gas pipeline.

[stompix]

And the good news keep on coming

Germany Industrial Production Rebounds In September
https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/interestrates/germany-industrial-production-rebounds-in-september-1031880990

Germany industrial production rebounded more than expected in September despite delivery bottlenecks, official data showed Monday.
Industrial production grew 0.6 percent month-on-month in September, reversing a revised 1.2 percent fall in August, Destatis said. This was also faster than economists' forecast of +0.2 percent.

Anmd the thing is even more surprising since everyone was expecting a contraction:

Eurozone’s economic powerhouse’s Industrial Output jumped by 0.6% MoM, the federal statistics authority Destatis said in figures adjusted for seasonal and calendar effects, vs. a -0.8% expected and -1.2% prior.

Seems like they interviewed a lot of Russian puppets instead of experts, so not only did it not go under but it grew both on MoM and both on the annual average, keeping 2022 2.6% higher than 2021. And with both gas and electricity prices falling on the spot market between 5-10x times since the peak, pretty obvious, another apocalypse is done for.

[Obari]

It is good as a country to maintain good status
The Germans are people with positive mindset and are willing to let go of corruption and grow there countryside despite the challenges that the whole world is going through
Germany has always been a country of everyone dreams due to there level of operations they maintain there economy standard and also partake in all forms of trade there interest is on growth and change which is supposed to be every countries priority

[royalfestus]

Germany is a country that holds a special place in my heart as my dream destination. However, my enthusiasm is dampened by concerns about racism. Despite its impressive economic standing as one of the top 5 largest economies in the world, trailing only behind the United States, China, and Japan, and being the largest economy in Europe for many years.
Germany has earned its reputation as a global powerhouse with a thriving economy. Boasting a diverse economy with a strong emphasis on the service sector, which contributes a significant 70% to its GDP, the country's economic prowess is undeniable. Moreover, Germany has shown astute leadership and a strategic position in world politics to safeguard its trade relationships with other nations.

[DrBeer]

.....

In fact, there is nothing surprising in this news.
The German economy is indeed one of the largest. Very self-sufficient and low-dependent.. Although no - until recently it was highly dependent on gas, on a monopoly supplier. Yes, covid19 has led to noticeable difficulties, just like the whole world without exception... Plus economic terror in 2022 with gas. But Germany and Germany for that - did not succumb to provocations and attempts to sabotage the country's economy .. Now a REALLY strong economy is being restored - factories, factories, everything works ... Although someone here on the forum "sang songs" about the total closure of all business and the collapse of the economy Germany and a completely frozen population, without ... Oh well The decision turned out to be not difficult - the choice in favor of stable and adequate gas suppliers and the diversification of energy supplies, which was already on fire in the EU, but was held back by Frau Merkel and other EU saboteurs .. .
Believe me - 1-2 years, and the German economy will simply forget about the problems at all.

[Vishnu.Reang]

The German economy managed to hold its ground despite difficult framework conditions of the global economy with continuing COVID-19 pandemic, supply chain interruptions, rising prices, and the war in Ukraine. The economy of Germany is a highly developed social market economy. It has the largest national economy in Europe, the largest by normal GDP.

[Fortify]

As I said above, this doesn't mean that the EU will avoid a technical recession completely, since Q4 is always a slowdown, taking into account inflation and demand destruction we might still see a recession, I'm actually convinced there will be one in Q1 2023, but every single analyst out there no matter how negativist he is about this has slashed the decline numbers, from the worse -1.2 were slowly hovering to an average between -0.6% and -0.2% and not a single source is mentioning a decline in the whole 2023, as overall the economy will reverse the start of the year trend and still grow. Not as fast as predicted at the start of this year but not doomsday either.

So everyone should be happy, another apocalypse is being avoided, the economy works, employment is at record levels, people still have money, and people still afford to buy bitcoins, what do you get if you preach all day long about collapses and recession and bankruptcy?

Germany has always been the powerhouse of Europe when it comes to manufacturing so it's understandable they would be doing well now after COVID and resource issues from Russia's war on Ukraine. The gas and oil situation has stabilized and means they are able to focus on the economy again. They do have a very efficient, resourceful and innovative way of thinking plus the whole economic framework to back it up. It's good because they can help pull the rest of Europe along in improving, some countries in the group do slack off a bit or have possibly too generous social programs.

[Wind_FURY]

That the countries of Europe without Russian gas and oil could freeze in the coming winter was propaganda by Russia, which sought to force the EU to lift or at least ease international sanctions in exchange for resuming supplies of its oil and gas. This blackmail and threats this time had no effect on the countries of Europe. Yes, long-running supply chains have broken down. But Europe is confidently overcoming this crisis and has already filled its storage facilities by more than 90 percent without Russian energy carriers. By the end of the year, Europe will completely abandon offshore supplies of Russian oil, and this will be a serious blow to the Russian economy. Russia is now losing on all fronts. The bet on force, blackmail and threats did not work this time. Hard times will come not in Europe, but in Russia.

It might all be propaganda, but to reduce their dependency on Russian Gas, Germany reacted by putting coal as their top source for energy production, which is stupid for their "green energy policy" because it's the dirtiest means of energy production. This stupidity started when their government started to approve shutting down their nuclear power plants and replacing them with unstable energy sources like solar and wind, while also importing Russian Gas that started the dependency. I believe all 17 of they're nuclear power plants are now not operating.

[Lucius]

Germany is a country that holds a special place in my heart as my dream destination. However, my enthusiasm is dampened by concerns about racism.
~snip~

If that's the only problem for you, then you don't need to worry too much, because most Germans are tolerant people and don't have a bad attitude towards foreigners who are extremely important for their economy. In my opinion, the problem is much bigger in that those who came to Germany actually behave in a very inappropriate way and do not respect people or their culture, which is in a way racist.

You only need to look at the data on the increase in crime, attacks, especially rape in Germany after 2016, so don't be surprised that part of the German public has completely legitimate defensive attitudes.