Can you ask for a refund of the money deposited in FTX from your bank ?

[krishnaverma]

I saw a post regarding this which stated that consumers can ask for refund from their bank if they made a deposit in the FTX recently. The person who made the post gave this link as reference which is applicable is USA :

https://www.consumerfinance.gov/rules-policy/final-rules/code-federal-regulations/

Do you think this is possible ? Personally I do not think that bank will refund in this case. If this was true people will claim refunds even for the money deposited in casinos which they loose in bets and games. Bank is not responsible for such losses. Only case bank will refund the payment is when the fund has been transferred by error. Like some hacker does an unauthorized transfer from your bank account with online banking. In this case, bank might be held responsible as they failed to protect the account of their account holder.

[pooya87]

One of the characteristics of the centralized banking system is its reversibility (which bitcoin solves by having irreversible transactions!), but you should contact your bank and ask them whether they offer this option for this particular case and what steps you should take to reverse that payment. It would possibly fall under fraud category.

[krishnaverma]

but you should contact your bank and ask them whether they offer this option for this particular case

It is very important to confirm this with bank first. This is because all these crypto and bank related regulations are something that not many people have complete knowledge about. If you do the request for reversal in bank without confirming the applicable laws , bank might charge some fee for wrong reversal. Or even if the money is reversed, it is possible that FTX lawyers will send you a notice for wire fraud. It has happened in case of  Voyager customers who did ACH reversal. They were communicated with threatening mails for potential lawsuits.

[DaveF]

Could you? Yes.
Will the bank agree / try? Who knows.
Does it open you up to liability? Possibly.

This is assuming you had funds pulled from a checking / savings account.

If you put in money via credit card, then it's a different thing. You probably could open up a dispute. You 'bought' BTC or whatever and it was never delivered.

With that being said, I am not a lawyer so you might be opening yourself up for some form of claw-back later along with other things.

-Dave

[joniboini]

I think the keyword is "recently". This is vague, and who knows when the policy will change so better ask asap. That being said, you should not deposit to FTX in the first place. If you really don't know after so many news outlets and social media are reporting about it, maybe you should change the way you follow the market updates. It is terrible to rely on a third party to secure your money, even if it is your bank.

[BlackHatCoiner]

But how's this suitable for the technical support board?

I saw a post regarding this which stated that consumers can ask for refund from their bank if they made a deposit in the FTX recently.

They can ask, but I'm not sure what the bank will request later. People's bank accounts get hacked all the time, but money don't necessarily return unless you're paying for security.

[jackg]

If you put in money via credit card, then it's a different thing. You probably could open up a dispute. You 'bought' BTC or whatever and it was never delivered.

This probably depends on how long ago it was too.

If you bought something online and walked over the parcel for 60 days on your doorstep, you're probably less likely to get a refund - I think the same would probably be the case here.

If there's a genuine reason though that you couldn't send funds from the exchange (such as buying funds before work the day ftx blocked withdrawals and coming home to realise they were blocked) then I think that'd amount to a reasonable case for claiming the chargeback.

Internationally this changes too, in the UK debit cards have the same 120-360 day payment reversal proceedings - a bank could and might hold onto your funds for those entire 360 days too and I think it's likely they would to confirm ftx is definitely bankrupt and definitely in breach of contract.

How much do the terms of service come into play here? I'm not sure the "we accept no liability for your funds going astray" is actually a legally accepted clause (UK/EU specific - in the US it probably is) or something that can be relied upon (especially given how far down it is in agreements normally).

[o_e_l_e_o]

Yeah, this is fraud. The errors covered by the linked regulations are for unauthorized transfers, incorrect transfer to the wrong entity or of the wrong amount, a bank teller or ATM handing over the wrong amount of money, that kind of thing. It does not cover you being stupid enough to send your money to a scammer/centralized exchange (those terms are pretty much synonymous at this point).

Although it does reveal something about the financial literacy of people who leave funds on centralized exchanges that they would misunderstand legal documents and be suggesting that people commit fraud to try to get their money back. Perhaps if they had bothered to read the exchange's legal documents which says they will give your money to anyone who asks for it, they wouldn't have used the exchange in the first place. Also somewhat ironic that they harp on about dEfI but then try to use the centralized banking sector to fix their own stupidity.

[Ultegra134]

You could perhaps open a claim to attempt a transaction reversal if you've made a deposit through a credit or debit card since it's covered by fraud, as others have already mentioned. Although from what I've heard on Reddit or other forums, it mostly covers fraud from unauthorized transactions, wrong deposits, etc. I'm not sure if bank transfers are covered and can be chargebacked with the same ease. To conclude, for the reasons mentioned before and by user o_e_l_e_o, I'm not sure if the bank is able to retrieve the funds you eagerly deposited to a centralized exchange, which till now was considered reliable. There was no error in the transaction itself.

[AverageGlabella]

If you have been keeping your btc on the exchange for a long time and not just after the initial buy you prolly do not stand a chance but if you bought in the days leading up to the funds being moved and you never received any amount you prolly do have a case that a bank would find hard to refuse but that is the minority and it depends on the country you live in. Western countries do have more protection for customers when it comes to fraud.

[seoincorporation]

The users can claim he has been a victim of carding, and say hi didn't made that transaction, that's the fastest way to recover your money, because if you tell to your bank that you made that transaction, and explain how it was a mistake because FTX was a scam, then the bank can discourse with you because you did it with an investment intentions, and if you lose your money with that investment, that isn't the bank fault.

Some banks with give the money back, but most of them will try to convince you it was your fault.

[Pmalek]

The users can claim he has been a victim of carding, and say hi didn't made that transaction...

It surely isn't that easy, and the bank would have to confirm that information with your credit card issuer. I am not sure what data about credit card transactions gets logged in their systems, but IP addresses and digital fingerprints are probably part of the log. One could scream they were a victim of carding if suspicious card activity was recorded on the different side of the globe with a completely new device. But if it's the same IP range that's been used for years and from the same devices, they will find out you are lying.

[LoyceV]

The users can claim he has been a victim of carding, and say hi didn't made that transaction,

That would be fraud, because it's not true. Where I live, you can only "undo" Direct Debit transactions. When depositing to an exchange, I have to make the transaction myself, and there's no way back. There are some exceptions if you accidentally transfer money to the wrong account, but without their cooperation, it's still not easy to get it back.
So you can ask for a refund, but you won't legally get it.

[o_e_l_e_o]

The users can claim he has been a victim of carding, and say hi didn't made that transaction, that's the fastest way to recover your money

As I said above, this is fraud. Try it if you want, but be prepared for your bank to close your account, trash your credit score, seize your money, and potentially file criminal charges against you.

What would you say anyway? "The transaction is fraudulent but I didn't think to do anything about it for a month or two but now FTX has collapsed I'm taking action"?

If you give your coins to scammers, expect to be scammed, and coming crying to fiat banks to save you isn't going to work.

[LoyceV]

crying to fiat banks to save you isn't going to work.

Just a thought: FTX was operating illegally in my country, because they didn't have a permit from DNB (Dutch National Bank). It's probably not going to change anything, because banks won't do a refund unless they can recover it from the exchange's bank account, but it may give you a stronger argument.

[hugeblack]

You should deal with caution with any advice that comes regarding  to FTX, the platform has filed for bankruptcy and the judicial authorities will start to move, so "what happened is done" and everyone who claims that they can help you is either a fraud or is trying to defraud you.
All things legal or illegal were possible once rumors spread and before bankruptcy was declared.

Remember: your money in your bank acc is not yours, and therefore an attempt to defraud or provide false information may lead to the freezing and confiscation of your money.