Ledger Stax (Ledger's latest hardware wallet)

[Pmalek]

Is it normal for such display types to have a ghosting effect when it goes to another page or "this" is another one of Ledger's masterpieces?

That's normal for E Ink displays, and you can see that on some Kindles as well.

You guessed correctly: the effect is known as "ghosting". The way it's explained, is that E Ink displays are made up of black and white particles. Every time the screen changes, those particles get rearranged to create the next elements on screen. Unfortunately, it also happens that the previous elements don't change completely, so it looks like you can still see what was there before.

Those that are new to E Ink ebook readers like Kindles, Kobos and Nooks often ask if it’s normal to see faint text from previous pages on the background of the screen.

The effect is entirely normal with E Ink screens, to a certain extent, and it is often referred to as ghosting. E Ink displays are composed of tiny capsules of black and white particles that get rearranged every time the screen changes, and sometimes they don’t fully change.

Over the years E Ink has made an effort to speed up the refresh rate and minimize full screen flashes, but this results in more ghosting.

Ghosting is an afterimage that remains on the screen after the page has turned or anytime the screen changes.

The ghosting effect appears as a faintly visible grayed-out version of the previous page or image.

https://blog.the-ebook-reader.com/2019/10/28/seeing-faint-background-text-on-ebook-readers-is-normal/

[1714627777]

1714627777

[1714627777]

1714627777

[1714627777]

1714627777

[DireWolfM14]

<Snip>

If it's one thing I have learned in all my years (decades) interacting not only with crypto but technology in general is never to underestimate the potential of people to waste money on useless and unnecessary gadgets. This is just one of them. They certainly have the marketing budget to shill this one to the sky, and I am sure that's what they are going to do. I don't doubt we will also see a few celebrities advertising this thing as something you just have to own and those techniques will be enough. Don't forget that people are still camping outside of shops when a new model of their favorite item is ready to be officially unveiled. 

Unfortunately people are very impressionable by marketing and media, and critical thinking skills are becoming extinct.  Being skeptical is no longer taught in schools and those who follow the lemming mob off the cliff are commended and revered as "good citizens."

They don't even know if it is safe yet!

* Conditional sale

Please note that delivery of the product is conditional upon completion of the applicable product certification process.

Should the product certification not be obtained, Ledger will automatically issue the refund.
https://shop.ledger.com/products/ledger-stax

Lol, good catch.  I missed that when looking it over.  *Check out our awesome new hardware wallet, but it's not really a hardware wallet just yet!  

When are they going to know if it passes certification, who's certifying it, and who certifies the certifiers?

[bitmover]

They don't even know if it is safe yet!

* Conditional sale

Please note that delivery of the product is conditional upon completion of the applicable product certification process.

Should the product certification not be obtained, Ledger will automatically issue the refund.
https://shop.ledger.com/products/ledger-stax

Lol, good catch.  I missed that when looking it over.  *Check out our awesome new hardware wallet, but it's not really a hardware wallet just yet!  

When are they going to know if it passes certification, who's certifying it, and who certifies the certifiers?

It is a third-party who certificates

Ledger is the only hardware wallet ho has this certification  (I don't know how much good is it  anyway)

The Ledger Nano X receives CSPN (First Level Security Certificate) certification issued by ANSSI (National Agency for Information Systems Security).https://www.ledger.com/ledger-nano-x-recognized-as-certified-crypto-hardware-wallet/ 

[Pmalek]

Ledger is the only hardware wallet ho has this certification  (I don't know how much good is it  anyway)

The Ledger Nano X receives CSPN (First Level Security Certificate) certification issued by ANSSI (National Agency for Information Systems Security).https://www.ledger.com/ledger-nano-x-recognized-as-certified-crypto-hardware-wallet/ 

That's probably because Ledger is the only hardware wallet vendor that operates out of France. ANSSI is the French National Cybersecurity Agency. Other countries may or may not have their own laws, requirements, and standards that companies in those jurisdictions need to adhere to. When an ANSSI certified laboratory checks a product, they issue it a security visa. It's like a stamp or guarantee that is supposed to give customers and all other parties confidence that a national authority has inspected and verified the product.   

You can find more information about it here:
https://www.ssi.gouv.fr/en/actualite/the-anssi-security-visa-by-the-french-national-cybersecurity-agency/

[Husires]

It follows the methodology of what the market wants. In the end, Ledger is a company that focuses on profits. Enhancing privacy is a problem for customers, whenever it is profitable, they will focus on it.

When people come to cryptocurrency community, they remember the banking systems, where you open an account and get a card that you can spend from, this device is an application of AIO, you will get everything in one device.

Is it worth this price?

It's almost the price of an average phone, with no extra features, and they haven't even tried to attract privacy-conscious individuals with a small privacy-related version.

[Lucius]

It's almost the price of an average phone, with no extra features, and they haven't even tried to attract privacy-conscious individuals with a small privacy-related version.

Maybe you can buy an average smartphone for about $300, but that phone is far from those premium devices that cost at least twice as much, but also justify the investment because they are reliable, comfortable to work with, due to powerful processors and at least 6 GB of working memory. For example, I invested more than $600 in a smartphone 3 years ago and it still works perfectly today as it did on the first day - and one of my friends who bought these a little cheaper has already changed 2 devices.

What I want to say is that I find it a little funny that people compare a hardware wallet with the price of something that has nothing to do with each other - I can also say that for that price you can buy an electric romobile that you can use to go to work and to the store every day and thus save a lot of money on fuel that you would spend if you used a car.

[dkbit98]

Ledger released this new wallet called Stax and I have to say it does look cool physically, but what I was researching is inside components.
Most of the components and secure elements are the same that are used in ledger nano S plus, but they also included battery in Stax and that is the thing that makes me think this device will have similar problems like model nano X.

For people who don't know there is still a lot of problems with quality and control of batteries put in nano X, and I still see a lot of complains on their reddit page.
There are other problems people report with screen for model S, or bricking device when updating new firmware, but that is different story.

Here is one guy saying recently that 3 of his 6 ledger devices are defective!
https://www.reddit.com/r/ledgerwallet/comments/103w9fb/3_of_my_6_ledger_devices_are_defective/

Different guy saying [Nano X] Not working when on battery. Ledger support not answering:
https://www.reddit.com/r/ledgerwallet/comments/103g7ez/nano_x_not_working_when_on_battery_ledger_support/

Few days ago, Ledger Nano X : Error Battery Cannot charge:
https://www.reddit.com/r/ledgerwallet/comments/zvrmsx/ledger_nano_x_error_battery_cannot_charge/

Stax is using rechargeable lithium-ion 200 mah battery, and model X is using lithium-ion 100mAh battery, so I think it's just difference in number of cells.
We still don't know if they are using same partners from China for batteries in model Stax, but if they are, I would stay far away this new ledger device.

[The Sceptical Chymist]

For me the old Nano S is still good enough and I agree that Ledger is again pursuing new directions - of course, they are supposed to bring more income - instead of fixing their actual (and old/known) problems that would keep their existing customers happy.

Yep, I agree.  For me there's no need for something really fancy when it comes to hardware wallets, and both the Nano S and X are easy to use and are small.  I don't know about anyone else, but bigger is not better with HW wallets IMO.

Should I add that it costs the same as a decent 2022 Android phone? I mean, come on...

I'd never pay $279 for a HW wallet.  Jesus, I think I've owned cars that cost less than that.

[jossiel]

I've visited Ledger's website and thought that it was just going to be a not so expensive new release. But yeah, that's a lot for pricing with a tag of $279 for this new release almost doubled with its older versions, it says free shipping.

But wise buyers will wait for those reviews from the early buyers and will ask what they think about it. Does the ledger's website says different shipping timeline? What's the earliest month it says it will be delivered based on your browsers? Mine says shipping will be around by April this year using a TOR browser.

[Lucius]

Does the ledger's website says different shipping timeline? What's the earliest month it says it will be delivered based on your browsers? Mine says shipping will be around by April this year using a TOR browser.

What does the type of browser have to do with the date when the new devices will start shipping? Everyone is shown the same date, because it would be really idiotic to prioritize some regions of the world over others. In addition, considering the price and the fact that this is a completely new device that can have various vulnerabilities, I do not believe that there will be much interest in its purchase.

Even if it costs $100, I personally wouldn't buy it because I don't trust that company after they showed how they handle their clients' data and how they tried to marginalize the whole thing.

[jossiel]

Does the ledger's website says different shipping timeline? What's the earliest month it says it will be delivered based on your browsers? Mine says shipping will be around by April this year using a TOR browser.

What does the type of browser have to do with the date when the new devices will start shipping? Everyone is shown the same date, because it would be really idiotic to prioritize some regions of the world over others. In addition, considering the price and the fact that this is a completely new device that can have various vulnerabilities, I do not believe that there will be much interest in its purchase.

It's because some companies prioritizes what's close to them and such releases are being done there first before the customers that are offshore. That's what I'm thinking of but if on this case and they're not like that then that's good. All of the releases from any place on Earth that orders this stax is by April.

Even if it costs $100, I personally wouldn't buy it because I don't trust that company after they showed how they handle their clients' data and how they tried to marginalize the whole thing.

That's okay, you really don't have to buy it if you don't like the stuff and the company.

[Lucius]

That's okay, you really don't have to buy it if you don't like the stuff and the company.

Even ignoring all the negative things that happened in the past, I don't see the point of such a device at such a price. I have their S and X models and personally I prefer that the HW is smaller and doesn't look like something like a smartphone or tablet. Maybe some people will be interested in such a concept because it will be easier for them to handle such a device - but older Ledger models have the possibility to be connected to smartphones anyway for those who want such an experience.

[jossiel]

That's okay, you really don't have to buy it if you don't like the stuff and the company.

Even ignoring all the negative things that happened in the past, I don't see the point of such a device at such a price. I have their S and X models and personally I prefer that the HW is smaller and doesn't look like something like a smartphone or tablet. Maybe some people will be interested in such a concept because it will be easier for them to handle such a device - but older Ledger models have the possibility to be connected to smartphones anyway for those who want such an experience.

I have the S version and I'm good with its design as its handy. We've got the same thoughts and likes about an HW that's too big, I don't like that as well.

They're designing and probably still on the phase of monitoring if the sales will surge with the new design, yeah for sure there will be buyers and even those that have got the older versions are likely to purchase it because it's "new".

[dkbit98]

There is one nice review video released for Ledger Stax and I think it will clear things up for many people who are thinking of buying on of this devices.
I won't say any spoilers but I have to give credits to Adam Venture for spotting something I missed, how misleading ledger website can be sometimes.
Ledger Stax is using magnets, that can be used for connecting multiple devices, but they are saying that this somehow magically creates the sound of security, while it has no connection with security whatsoever.
Customers can get the wrong impression that Stax is somehow safer than other hardware wallets, when in reality it has the same tech like older models.


https://shop.ledger.com/products/ledger-stax
Review: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OUmNHHBHEP8

[SFR10]

Ledger Stax is using magnets, that can be used for connecting multiple devices,

And speaking of magnets, I was wondering if they could damage some of the internal components in the long run ^{[I'm getting mixed results/answers from Google/Youtube and AFAIK, they (Ledger) haven't mentioned what kind of magnets are being used or how strong they are]}?

[Pmalek]

It's not the sound of security. It's the sound of bullshit and a marketing campaign. Not that I am interested in the device, but I will check out the video review just to see what he thinks of it.

And speaking of magnets, I was wondering if they could damage some of the internal components in the long run ^{[I'm getting mixed results/answers from Google/Youtube and AFAIK, they (Ledger) haven't mentioned what kind of magnets are being used or how strong they are]}?

It has to be a really strong magnet for it to cause any damage to the electronics inside the device. That's surely not the case here. I have a shaker that I sometimes take to the gym. It's equipped with two magnets so you can stick it to metal objects like the machines you train on. The other side of the shaker has a magnet that can hold your phone if you want. I have used it a few times and there were no problems at all.

[dkbit98]

And speaking of magnets, I was wondering if they could damage some of the internal components in the long run ^{[I'm getting mixed results/answers from Google/Youtube and AFAIK, they (Ledger) haven't mentioned what kind of magnets are being used or how strong they are]}?

I don't think this magnets are strong enough to damage anything, except maybe the brains of people who blindly trust this ledger propaganda.
Oh it must be great device that was designer by iOS designer and he added that special secure click sound feature
Another stupid suggestion is that Stax is somehow family friendly device, so you would use this magnets to connect all family wallet, that one of the more stupid things I heard in a while.

[Pmalek]

Adam Venture also mentioned something that I thought about the first time I read about the features of the Ledger Stax. I am talking about the screen that can always stay on to display your NFT collection and the likes. Who keeps their hardware wallets out in the open to enjoy their NFTs? Is this HW supposed to be by your side when you are working so you can occasionally glance at your NFTs and be happy about having them? When you go out for dinner, are you going to put it on the table next to your plate to enjoy your digital monkey and banana collections? I also don't see a future where people go out clubbing with their Stax's in one hand and a drink in the other. Maybe Ledger thinks that will happen.

[o_e_l_e_o]

Review: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OUmNHHBHEP8

God damn I hate like 99% of YouTube. 2:20 in to the video before he actually said anything useful.

But he does (eventually) touch on what I've said already in this thread - the stack feature makes absolutely no sense. Including it as a second thought would be strange enough, but naming the device after it as a flagship feature is just completely bizarre. 99% of user will not own more than one device, especially not at $280. For the tiny minority of users who do own more than one device, encouraging them to stack them together and therefore store them in the exact same place is the opposite of security. Why would you want all your wallets in the same location, all subject to the same risk of loss or theft?

The fact that apparently an entire team of people at Ledger thought this was a good idea really makes me question what other stuff goes on behind the scenes there that we are unaware of.

[dkbit98]

Why would you want all your wallets in the same location, all subject to the same risk of loss or theft?

Nobody is doing that, and ledger just pay their marketing team to invent bunch of fantasy features that sound cool but in reality they don't have any usability.
My joke suggestion is that shitconers can use separate Stax wallets for each of their shitcoin and nft junk they own.
And if people want to waste money on this thing, go ahead and stack them together with magic magnets 

The fact that apparently an entire team of people at Ledger thought this was a good idea really makes me question what other stuff goes on behind the scenes there that we are unaware of.

Most of the ledger devs are clowns like their co-owner aka reddit mod btchip, and I am patiently waiting to hear first complains about battery and other hidden issues this device have.