Bitcoin developer @lukedashjr's wallet was hacked

[takuma sato]

It's safe to assume that using Monero (or any other "anonymous" coin) would indeed put you on a list of someone that is interested in obfuscating their finances for whatever reason. This isn't 2015 anymore guys, governments aren't dumb, anyone that is crazy enough to send Monero to an exchange without at least using some precautionary measures is asking for it.

If you're cashing out a significant sum of XMR through a KYC exchange for fiat, then yes, you want to have a legal reason for doing so. However, there are tons of alternatives these days. You can even buy gift cards with it now. If privacy is your goal, BTC doesn't hold a candle to XMR. There's a reason why the largest darknet markets don't support BTC as a payment option anymore.

Anyway, anyone got any news? last I've heard is hackers were chipmixing the stuff:
https://twitter.com/ErgoBTC/status/1611169585457238018

What's even crazier than using Monero is using a mixer. My bet is all mixing processes will be totally deanonymize-able before the year's end.

It is also somewhat remarkable that ChipMixer has still managed to evade sanctions.

The fact that you have to resort to gift cards and so on just shows that the niche cases for XMR are very limited to small amounts basically. So if you are XMR rich... then what? you cannot improve your life quality. You have valuable 0's and 1's, but that's about it. You need a friendly jurisdiction to convert this into tangible things without ending up in jail.

Bitcoin provides a lot more leverage with governments since it's not "anonymous by default". And thats for now. I wonder what governments will think of Bitcoin in 10 years. If they end up banning it all, there will probably be an huge black market that has replaced the ban on physical cash, as well as some land distant jurisdictions in which you can fly and establish your finances which will be wiling to operate with BTC derived fortunes. Other than that, I think all cryptos are going to be in trouble in most mainstream countries in the future.

As far as Chipmixer, not sure who runs the service but probably everything is hosted somewhere safe from regulations that could have an impact on it and he remains anonymous. If he has everything set on point it will be difficult for them to get it done. Max they could do right now is probably block it ISP wise but anyone that uses Chipmixer already uses Tor/VPN by default so no one will even notice.

It's safe to assume that using Monero (or any other "anonymous" coin) would indeed put you on a list of someone that is interested in obfuscating their finances for whatever reason.

Maybe that implies for anything privacy respecting nowadays. If you're caught to using Tor Browser, you're put to the "weirdos" list. If you're caught to install Tails, you're suspicious. If you're caught to use protonmail instead of gmail, weirdo! LineageOS, or any other privacy focused mobile OS instead of iOS / android, real freak.

If you're caught to selling XMR to a KYC-ed exchange, you need an unusual reason as justification, because it sounds really dumb.

Agreed, but using protonmail, Tor or even Tails, is not at the same level as using XMR. At the end of the day, the number 1 target for governments is tax evaders, this seems clear to me and I think to anyone that has some life experience. They want their cut and that's how it is. If you go into an exchange and do some crypto stuff that has XMR in the mix to boot, this will raise more alarms than the other examples you provided.

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[nutildah]

The fact that you have to resort to gift cards and so on just shows that the niche cases for XMR are very limited to small amounts basically.

That's not at all what I said. You don't "have to resort to gift cards" with XMR but as with BTC and every other major cryptocurrency that option is a great way to make real-life use of it. The fee for services like Bitrefill is often 0%. Gift cards is one of the best ways to use crypto to pay for something in a pretty direct manner.

So if you are XMR rich... then what? you cannot improve your life quality. You have valuable 0's and 1's, but that's about it. You need a friendly jurisdiction to convert this into tangible things without ending up in jail.

There's a ton of KYC-free exchanges and swapping services for XMR that makes cashing out BTC relatively painless but if you're not interested in looking for them, you'll never find them.

[BlackHatCoiner]

bitcoin 2014-now has more legislative rules. which is where people are now hating all the crap about CEX monitoring users

then use a DEX. or don't use crypto? just stick with fiat.

Using a DEX doesn't mean you don't follow legislation. It only means you avoid KYC and giving up self-custody.

If they end up banning it all

Governments, even of the most oppressive regimes, have tried to ban it and did little.

As far as Chipmixer, not sure who runs the service but probably everything is hosted somewhere safe from regulations that could have an impact on it and he remains anonymous.

I think there are two possible scenarios to explain how it's still up.

• ChipMixer is operating in a nearly completely anonymous background. They must be doing everything behind Tor in a manner the feds can't de-anonymize.
• ChipMixer is the feds.

The former looks more likely to me.

[franky1]

if using DEX to do silly day trading of btc to stable.. you can stay off the radar

if using DEX to do wire transfers.. then obviously your bank and the other persons bank is watching the wire transfers.

so dont be complacent thinking you are hiding 100% perfectly
and if not operating through a business account but doing many wires you will hit a threshold where banks will start to think your doing too many wires to be a "personal use" and start asking questions

alot of people thought that banks were just anti-bitcoin, truth WAS half that but now mostly its these things:
a. the sender sends fiat. then pretends their bank account was hacked and they want a charge-back/refund. which means receiver has to legitimise his receipt of fiat by revealing what was purchased.

b. sender innocently sending funds to lots of people on a personal account makes banks question the purpose of all these funds movements. treats sender as a business offering a service, thus questions the purpose

these usually mean situations evolve where DEX frequent swappers need to start keeping records like KYC to prove the person at the keyboard of the other side, was the account holder (asks for id and a selfie)
ends up needing to have a business account and register as a MSB aswell or have account closed

many dont see it happen straight away because if unpopular, unregular, insignificant amount/value of wire transfers stay under a threshold.. but when they get popular or people get too comfortable/complacent by doing regular trades on DEX , the flags add up

other flags like someone on a menial income suddenly having a massive $3m deposit or lots of multiple deposits that add up way beyond a salary.. raises some flags

[JayJuanGee]

It appears that yesterday hodlonaut had some back and forth with LukeDasher via twitter to assert that LukeDasher was misleading people and claiming that there were no ways to keep bitcoin secure

Hodlonaut says:

>>> According to
@LukeDashjr
 there is no way to prevent your bitcoin from being stolen. No safe way to store bitcoin.

Reckless misinformation/FUD, and a huge 🚩
<<<<<

https://twitter.com/hodlonaut/status/1615033789956202496

[NotATether]

It appears that yesterday hodlonaut had some back and forth with LukeDasher via twitter to assert that LukeDasher was misleading people and claiming that there were no ways to keep bitcoin secure

Hodlonaut says:

>>> According to
@LukeDashjr
 there is no way to prevent your bitcoin from being stolen. No safe way to store bitcoin.

Reckless misinformation/FUD, and a huge 🚩
<<<<<

https://twitter.com/hodlonaut/status/1615033789956202496

That sounds quite BS coming from a Bitcoin Core developer, to be honest, considering that he neither used a seed phrase nor a hardware wallet to store his 200 bitcoins. But I also think Hodlonaut is jumping the gun here and exaggerating a bit, as the screenshots he posted are not words to that effect.

[franky1]

in that tweet debate just posted.
luke said how his private keys were not compromised to an internet using PC..

luke however did expose his wallet to the internet back in september because we can see he was spending funds in september and sending them to a change address he had in said wallet..
. he also had a wave of hacks happening throughout november-december. and knew the hacker was tailoring the attacks specifically for lukes systems

luke also had to rebuild-recompile a new version of knots because that got compromised too meaning he knows he was compromised.

i understand humans make mistakes, but to say bitcoin is insecure rather then admit he is human.. doesnt play well with me either
he would rather pretend he is the infallible god and bitcoin is broke. pfft.

[JayJuanGee]

It appears that yesterday hodlonaut had some back and forth with LukeDasher via twitter to assert that LukeDasher was misleading people and claiming that there were no ways to keep bitcoin secure

Hodlonaut says:

>>> According to
@LukeDashjr
 there is no way to prevent your bitcoin from being stolen. No safe way to store bitcoin.

Reckless misinformation/FUD, and a huge 🚩
<<<<<

https://twitter.com/hodlonaut/status/1615033789956202496

That sounds quite BS coming from a Bitcoin Core developer, to be honest, considering that he neither used a seed phrase nor a hardware wallet to store his 200 bitcoins. But I also think Hodlonaut is jumping the gun here and exaggerating a bit, as the screenshots he posted are not words to that effect.

Yes, I was thinking something similar to you NotATether in terms of hodlonaut putting words into LukeDasher's mouth, but then I see Luke's responses and he kind of just goes along with those characterizations.. so yeah, sometimes the fights and the characterizations of the position of the other person are not really fair.... yet it is was interesting to see that back and forth including that AdamBack jumped in to defend aspects of Luke's eccentricities.

[larry_vw_1955]

bitcoin 2014-now has more legislative rules. which is where people are now hating all the crap about CEX monitoring users

then use a DEX. or don't use crypto? just stick with fiat.

Using a DEX doesn't mean you don't follow legislation. It only means you avoid KYC and giving up self-custody.

that's why you use a DEX because you don't like dealing with Centralized Exchanges. doesn't mean you're an outlaw. i thought that was understood though.

[stompix]

It appears that yesterday hodlonaut had some back and forth with LukeDasher via twitter to assert that LukeDasher was misleading people and claiming that there were no ways to keep bitcoin secure

Luke is one of those guys that won't back down even if deep down he knows he is wrong about something, I've seen enough of his ideas that he clings so desperately and won't accept any criticisms over it so I wouldn't be surprised for him to shift the blame but saying that nothing can be done when you're targeted that's beyond going overboard!  As if wasn't bad enough that a core developer has lost his bitcoins in the hack, now the same developer hinting nobody can be really safe it's just too much!

The only good thing is that the media hasn't cached up with this or it's not paying attention at all, and hopefully it never does as it will turn into a real shitshow.

[s2]

Has it actually been confirmed that Luke had his money moved yet and that it isn't just his PGP key and twitter are compromised?

I'm somewhat surprised he hasn't already posted here to give a bit of an update as to what may have happened so people can help figure it out.

Luke, care to share any update please?

[mvdheuvel1983]

I am thinking of two possible explanations for this - either he was targeted by some group or maybe he is just pretending that his BTC was stolen because he wants to anticipate possible moves from governments which will ban "unhosted" wallets.
Two years ago, governments around the world have expressed concern about the risks of illicit financial activities such as money laundering, terrorist financing, and the evasion of international sanctions arising from the use of “unhosted” wallets—software applications that allow users to conduct pseudonymous, personal transactions in crypto assets over the internet without the use of a financial intermediary. I wouldn't rule this out.

[bbc.reporter]

It appears that yesterday hodlonaut had some back and forth with LukeDasher via twitter to assert that LukeDasher was misleading people and claiming that there were no ways to keep bitcoin secure

Hodlonaut says:

>>> According to
@LukeDashjr
 there is no way to prevent your bitcoin from being stolen. No safe way to store bitcoin.

Reckless misinformation/FUD, and a huge 🚩
<<<<<

https://twitter.com/hodlonaut/status/1615033789956202496

That sounds quite BS coming from a Bitcoin Core developer, to be honest, considering that he neither used a seed phrase nor a hardware wallet to store his 200 bitcoins. But I also think Hodlonaut is jumping the gun here and exaggerating a bit, as the screenshots he posted are not words to that effect.

Agreed, which causes my thoughts to return to my skeptical me speculation that @NeuroticFish very much liked hehe.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5432665.msg61540539#msg61540539

My prediction, on 2025 lukedashjr will announce that he will quit from the development team. He might have already sold all his bitcoin before this announcement hehe. Also, @nutlidah's skepticism on why lukedashjr mixed his coins instead of using Monero. This might be because lukedashjr wants to sell his bitcoin as bitcoin without conversions.

[nutildah]

Also, @nutlidah's skepticism on why lukedashjr mixed his coins instead of using Monero. This might be because lukedashjr wants to sell his bitcoin as bitcoin without conversions.

Oh.. for this to be true you are assuming he still has control of his coins, which is one theory. I was referring to the alleged "hacker" as being the party who sent the coins to a well-surveilled mixer. Its an extremely clunky method of trying to break blockchain links in your coins these days and my main point was that several more effective alternatives now exist. One of which is swapping to XMR, which can always be swapped back to BTC. A lot of the privacy created as a result is only as good as the owner's future movement of their "clean" coins, of course.

[franky1]

to move to altcoin especially when handling more then grocery bag amounts(daily spend) is hard to do in DEX/defi without some large player on the other side of the swap to receive said swap. (and or more time consuming to churn through many small allotments)
trying to do it on a CEX without KYC is few and far between opportunities too

if you treat bitcoin mixer vs XMR swapping as a rated number of 'suspect/weirdo' number. xmr has a higher 'weirdo/suspect' level. so more reason why XMR swaps can lead to more notability

sometimes trying to hide behind walls and bushes when walking around in public, makes more people see your attempts of trying to hide.. and call you a weirdo or suspect.

trying to move lumps of $22k(1btc) is not easy in of itself and is another noticeable factor when using defi/dex
most people only wanna grab small petty amounts of fiat or swaps when using DEX/de-fi platforms
so seeing multiple attempts to move multiple $22k or $2.2k also becomes noticeable spam compared to just moving larger lumps legitimately/unnoticeably via other means

[nutildah]

trying to do it on a CEX without KYC is few and far between opportunities too

Not true. You just need to want to find them. If you don't, you won't.

[takuma sato]

Apparently Luke said somewhere that he used Bitcoin Knots wallet as his wallet to both store and transact, and that he kept it on the same laptop or in a computer that was connected to the internet during the transaction (he didn't craft the transaction in an offline computer that's airgapped and then broadcasted this into a node). Why? This would explain a point of failure, because I don't see how you can get hacked as long as the private keys were always in an airgapped environment (beside physical intervention but apparently this isn't the case here)

[larry_vw_1955]

Apparently Luke said somewhere that he used Bitcoin Knots wallet as his wallet to both store and transact, and that he kept it on the same laptop or in a computer that was connected to the internet during the transaction (he didn't craft the transaction in an offline computer that's airgapped and then broadcasted this into a node). Why?

because probably 99% of bitcoin users don't "craft the transaction in an offline computer that's airgapped and then broadcasted this into a node" and luke falls into that category?

This would explain a point of failure, because I don't see how you can get hacked as long as the private keys were always in an airgapped environment (beside physical intervention but apparently this isn't the case here)

it's still possible but the exploit is different. 

[odolvlobo]

Apparently Luke said somewhere that he used Bitcoin Knots wallet as his wallet to both store and transact, and that he kept it on the same laptop or in a computer that was connected to the internet during the transaction (he didn't craft the transaction in an offline computer that's airgapped and then broadcasted this into a node). Why?

because probably 99% of bitcoin users don't "craft the transaction in an offline computer that's airgapped and then broadcasted this into a node" and luke falls into that category?

There is always a tradeoff between security and convenience. Having a wallet on an air-gapped computer is certainly more secure, but it is also a lot more inconvenient.

As everyone should know, a hardware wallet goes a long way in increasing convenience without sacrificing much security.

[larry_vw_1955]

As everyone should know, a hardware wallet goes a long way in increasing convenience without sacrificing much security.

imagine having 200 bitcoins or even 100 and not knowing that.   well i guess he knew but he didn't do anything about it...