Rules of Taxes

[stompix]

Agrar fruit and crypto is not the same tax asset. Most of the cryptos are categorized in the same tax asset class as precious metals. The difference is, that you consume food fast, but precious metals is a long term trading value.

Nobody here is talking about crypto or crypto taxation, OP wanted a simple answer on taxation on agricultural products.
Do read the message to which I replied!

So you first point from the quote is right. Under a certain amount of selling profit you does not have to pay taxes. Above you have to pay taxes - But: If you hold that kind of assets 1 year, you also have not to pay taxes for the profits. / Except stable coins and staking (other tax classes).

Of course it's right because that's what we're talking about, taxation for a yearly activity with a determined revenue that comes falls into different categories, non-taxable, taxable under 10% here as additional revenue but still beyond a certain amount, or taxable at 25%.

I don't understand why you felt the need to bring crypto into this, might as well talk about tourism taxation or revenues from copyright as they have just as little in common with agricultural stuff as crypto.

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[Bialke]

Sir, first I read just what I want. This is more effective - and you would not believe how I can shape reallity.

And second,

if others say tax class I is different as tax class II, others say tax class I can be tax class II - with crypto solutions.

Tax is how I want tax to be. This is a great guideline.

[rat03gopoh]

And you must also be from Indonesia right? because you understand a little what I mean.

Yes, it is me.

is this fair for the tax rules?

Idk the exact calculation, but I think it's fair considering the type of income both of them have. Farmers are more volatility earners, their earnings figures are "likely" but not "always". Especially in certain seasons, they even earn minus.
On the implementation side, most of the farmers in our country lack administrative awareness, which means that taxation hasn't been fully effective in reaching actors in this sector. The profession of farming is involved in the older generation with low educational background.

[so98nn]

What you explaining is related to tax slabs. Basically tax slabs are done based on the income of person or entity. Irrespective of the profession, category of work and nature of work one can get benefited from the tax system only if they don’t fit in the tax slab.

For example, in my country around 10,000 USD per year is considered as low wagering and Non Taxed slab. However, single Penny above it Will be considered as tax slab of 5%.

This percent will increase based on the amount of income one individual is having. The maximum tax slab in my country is 30%. For businesses GST is another type of tax that needs to be paid monthly or quarterly.

[Casdinyard]

In my country, we pretty much have the same standard tax systems as you guys, with exception on the Sin Tax, coz here in the Philippines there's a high tariff placed over vices like drinking, and smoking, well those two only anyway. Before Sin Tax, a cigarette here costs less than a penny, you can literally buy a whole pack for a dollar and fifty. After Sin tax, prices soared and you're very lucky now if you could buy half a pack for the same aforementioned $1.50 price point. This Tax is well-meaning, as it aims to stop people from subscribing to these vices but it failed to consider the fact that once you picked up the habit, not even the price will really stop you. There's a reason why crackheads will literally sell their houses off brick by brick to get a fix.

[wiss19]

This is also true in my country. But I'm sure this kind of poor implementation is not as worse in many developed countries, or perhaps even non-existent.

Where I'm from, tax laws are not that effective also. And for a number of reasons. For one, there are many ways to be dishonest with your income and you will pay only a small amount or none at all. Or you don't declare anything at all and shirk tax responsibilities altogether. Or somebody will do the trimming of taxes for you. Or you're a rich and powerful person that even government authorities won't bother you about taxes. I'm not even saying all these are illegal. After all, tax avoidance is legal.

Indeed, those who are formally employed are the ones who cannot evade because taxes are automatically deducted from their salaries.

I wouldn't say it's poor implementation but I think that is only normal and you are right that others are worse because their rates for taxing are too high. They also demand high taxes on crypto transactions. You are lucky that you are not from a stricter country because people there can easily get away with their taxes but I think this isn't beneficial in the long run.

Maybe your country is still among those countries who are slow to improved. If we think we are earning enough then we must willingly pay our taxes to the government so that we will have a peace of mind and it does makes you feel good knowing that you are helping your country to recover or grow.

[fuer44]

The outline of my question is whether in all countries, farmers, freelancers, or small micro-entrepreneurs who were not previously registered with the taxpayer have to report to the tax, or if they are not registered then they are not subject to the taxpayer?

There is no general rule for all countries.
I see another user saying you're from Indonesia, I don't speak the language, and I can't find anything on a simple search in google about how that works there but I can tell you how it works in my country, and this is not a general rule even for all the EU.

Any kind of farming you do which only involves utilizing the final crops for personal use, without you at any point engaging in other activity, like for example selling either the strawberries or the strawberry jam, it's not a taxable event and it doesn't need to be declared to the tax revenue services. But they are limits to what is considered personal usage, so you can't plant 2000 ha of corn and say it's for your morning cereals.

If you do sell your products to a third party, thus engaging in a taxable event, you are subject to taxation which works like this:
- your revenue is under a limit (depends on each country), you won't pay taxes but you need to declare the revenue
- your event is over the limit, you're treated like any business and you have to pay your taxes.

So basically, you plant a few melons and you eat yourself in your backyard you don't need to tell anyone, you plant a few and you sell them you need to register but you won't be taxed for 5 euros profit, you plant 100ha and sell them, you're a business and you need to register not only for tax but with the agricultural office also.

Again, and I must mention this, I don't know how the law woks in Indonesia, I'm just telling you from an EU citizen (who is has been for 20 years involved in agriculture) point of view.

Okay, I'm starting to understand this rule and have found a bright spot. from your explanation, it will depend on the area or number of crops, right? For example I plant tomatoes in the yard of the house then it will not be taxed, but if I plant 1 hectare of tomatoes, then I have to report it to the tax office, even though there was no bill before, right?

[fuer44]

And you must also be from Indonesia right? because you understand a little what I mean.

Yes, it is me.

is this fair for the tax rules?

Idk the exact calculation, but I think it's fair considering the type of income both of them have. Farmers are more volatility earners, their earnings figures are "likely" but not "always". Especially in certain seasons, they even earn minus.
On the implementation side, most of the farmers in our country lack administrative awareness, which means that taxation hasn't been fully effective in reaching actors in this sector. The profession of farming is involved in the older generation with low educational background.

Not only agriculture, but in my area there are also many farms such as laying hens, goats, ducks, there are also buffaloes, they all never get a tax bill for their business. But they get a tax bill for the "land" used for their business, where the taxpayer on this land's tax has been a definite rule from the government from the past.

[Darker45]

~snip~

I wouldn't say it's poor implementation...

I'm saying it's partly poor implementation because there are already tax laws. There are straightforward tax laws that have become inutile because they are not properly implemented. They're just there idle. At best, they're selectively implemented, usually targeting small fishes. The big ones are left alone.

One example is the issuance of official receipts. That's a very simple and straightforward legal requirement which is not respected by many businesses here. This should have been one of the bases for the government tax agency to know whether taxes are properly paid.

[Alphakilo]

This is an excellent observation. I never thought or believed that there are some exemption in tax paying. But when i saw this topic i went on research to find out more about farmers not paying tax. According to my findings, i realized that farmers in some countries like  India don't pay tax. And the mpt-agricultural-income-rich-farmers-india.html#:~:text=Taxes%20on%20agricultural%20income%20falls,to%20file%20income%20tax%20returns.]reason is that farmers who have no other source of income are not required to pay tax. Regardless of their income from the farm produce.

[Oneandpure]

In my country have several kinds of taxes but I really understand with income tax as worker have reached above 70 million each years, that mean income with amount $500 each months have to pay taxes. I am little disagree with rule taxes in my country because not transparent and most sadness the people in taxes working and their children have financial freedom live but we are the payer of taxes most sadness.

I don't trust yet what happen in my country taxes most terrible how much income each year and there are hidden access about where taxes spent. Need evaluate about taxes rule in my country actually with worker salary have to pay taxes with higher amount based on capital income in my country.

[fuer44]

This is an excellent observation. I never thought or believed that there are some exemption in tax paying. But when i saw this topic i went on research to find out more about farmers not paying tax. According to my findings, i realized that farmers in some countries like  India don't pay tax. And the mpt-agricultural-income-rich-farmers-india.html#:~:text=Taxes%20on%20agricultural%20income%20falls,to%20file%20income%20tax%20returns.]reason is that farmers who have no other source of income are not required to pay tax. Regardless of their income from the farm produce.

It means the same in my country. If our observations regarding taxes especially agriculture and in some countries the rules are almost the same, it means that we have almost reached the most appropriate answer. Because in European Union countries as discussed earlier, farms with large fields must report their yields to the taxpayer while those with small fields are not required to report. the point is for farmers, they are not obligated beforehand, except if the yield is large then he must report to the taxpayer.

[fuer44]

In my country have several kinds of taxes but I really understand with income tax as worker have reached above 70 million each years, that mean income with amount $500 each months have to pay taxes. I am little disagree with rule taxes in my country because not transparent and most sadness the people in taxes working and their children have financial freedom live but we are the payer of taxes most sadness.

I don't trust yet what happen in my country taxes most terrible how much income each year and there are hidden access about where taxes spent. Need evaluate about taxes rule in my country actually with worker salary have to pay taxes with higher amount based on capital income in my country.

Have tax officers never reported in 1 year tax income in your country? Then where is the tax budget used? If it's not transparent and you see the tax official and his family living in luxury whereas if you see in the law that the salary of a tax official is......... It means the same, in my country it's like that too. Even at the village government level it is no longer transparent, where the funds from taxes, from the central government are used.

[fuer44]

This is also true in my country. But I'm sure this kind of poor implementation is not as worse in many developed countries, or perhaps even non-existent.

Where I'm from, tax laws are not that effective also. And for a number of reasons. For one, there are many ways to be dishonest with your income and you will pay only a small amount or none at all. Or you don't declare anything at all and shirk tax responsibilities altogether. Or somebody will do the trimming of taxes for you. Or you're a rich and powerful person that even government authorities won't bother you about taxes. I'm not even saying all these are illegal. After all, tax avoidance is legal.

Indeed, those who are formally employed are the ones who cannot evade because taxes are automatically deducted from their salaries.

I wouldn't say it's poor implementation but I think that is only normal and you are right that others are worse because their rates for taxing are too high. They also demand high taxes on crypto transactions. You are lucky that you are not from a stricter country because people there can easily get away with their taxes but I think this isn't beneficial in the long run.

Maybe your country is still among those countries who are slow to improved. If we think we are earning enough then we must willingly pay our taxes to the government so that we will have a peace of mind and it does makes you feel good knowing that you are helping your country to recover or grow.

That's the difference, in my country there are still many unemployed whether they graduate from school, university, or even don't graduate at all. Factories are also still limited in terms of hiring employees and the minimum salary for employees is also said to be still low when you see the prices of basic necessities and fuel which are now expensive. So, it can be said that the tax issue has not effectively reached all levels of society, only certain, as I said earlier, such as employees of government agencies, large entrepreneurs who have registered their businesses.

When talking about farmers or freelancers, in reality they are not prosecuted at all even though their income can be said to be high too. Maybe if the work system with a minimum wage for employees is evenly distributed in all regions and in all factories (because sometimes it is different for each factory or region), and the unemployment rate can also be suppressed properly then tax rules for all levels of society including farmers and freelancers, I'm sure they don't mind because this country is already an industrialized country.

[Alpha Marine]

I think generally if you don't report your income then you are breaking the law. That is "tax evasion. Tax evasion is when you do not report all or some of your income. I don't know how it works in your country but people who do not report their income are committing an illegal act and can be prosecuted. There are ways to reduce your tax legally and that is tax avoidance.

[Dickiy]

This will be my concern this time, whether all countries treat the same rules or not, I want to hear from all of you.
Income tax in my country in general will be very effective for employees of government agencies, offices and entrepreneurs. Let's say this, everyone earns whether it's from farming, freelancing, or any kind of work that isn't recorded at the tax office, if they don't report it to the tax authorities then they are exempt from tax. However, there is a provision that if someone has ever borrowed a large amount of money from a bank, even though the borrower was not notified by the taxpayer at first, in the end he was exposed to the taxpayer's accumulation of taxes over the years and he didn't know.

I mean this tax regulation seems uneven and it seems that people who have to pay taxes are people who deal with large amounts of money. Let's say a farmer in 1 harvest (3-4 month) earns $2000, he will remain tax free if not registered or he doesn't register it whereas an employee from the start is already registered with the taxpayer even though their monthly salary is $300. What do you think? I'm a little confused with this tax rule.

Yes, that's quite strange, but it seems that every economic act in a profession has its own criteria so that it is considered not fulfilling the requirements to pay taxes.
It is a natural thing that taxation does not detect because maybe the name and status of the person who manages the big money is not on the tax list, just like in the past in my country when there was no taxation on crypto trading and as we know the exchange and its traders have a sizable circulation of money in the crypto market but not paying taxes. It could be like that.
Yes, be aware in the first case, because the person who borrowed the large amount of money did not carry out financial procedures such as paying taxes, because he did not know about it while the regulations seemed to already exist so he had to pay taxes.

[zasad@]

I think generally if you don't report your income then you are breaking the law. That is "tax evasion. Tax evasion is when you do not report all or some of your income. I don't know how it works in your country but people who do not report their income are committing an illegal act and can be prosecuted. There are ways to reduce your tax legally and that is tax avoidance.

Any way to reduce tax legally tends to be like breaking the law. Therefore, someone said a very good opinion: "You need to pay taxes, but at the same time do not feel like an idiot" (C)
For example, in Russia, if I want to officially pay an employee $1,000, then I have to pay him $1,140. I have to take 140 dollars as income tax (13%) and I also have to pay +36% of 1140 dollars of various social taxes. In total, an employer pays $550 in taxes for $1,000 of an official salary, which is why there are a lot of shadow wages in Russia. 200 officially, the rest is not declared.

[woez]

 What do you think? I'm a little confused with this tax rule.

Tax regulations can indeed seem complicated and sometimes unbalanced. Tax regulations can vary widely depending on the country and the specific circumstances of an individual or business. In many cases, small businesses and individuals with lower incomes may qualify for special tax breaks or exemptions, while those with greater incomes may be subject to higher tax rates and this may be relevant to what you are stating.

I think the goal of tax laws is to ensure that everyone makes a fair contribution to society, while also providing support to those who need it most. While the system may not always appear fair or equitable, it is important to remember that taxes play a critical role in funding important social programs and services that benefit all of us.

[Wong Gendheng]

Tax regulations throughout the world are certainly different and in my country income tax is annoying, those who do not have large income but work are obliged to report wealth, in my opinion this is not effective and wasted time, income tax is indeed easy to apply for them Those who have large income or government employees, while private workers certainly do not need to report because they do not get facilities from the state.

[CarnagexD]

Tax regulations throughout the world are certainly different and in my country income tax is annoying, those who do not have large income but work are obliged to report wealth, in my opinion this is not effective and wasted time, income tax is indeed easy to apply for them Those who have large income or government employees, while private workers certainly do not need to report because they do not get facilities from the state.

This is the first time I heard of this kind of tax regulation. I believe it would be more efficient if territories would consider the ability to pay of the tax payers wherein those who earn more should pay more. That's why there is progressive tax rate where rate increases variably with income. With regards to the use of facilities from the state, it is not limited to buildings or infrastructure, I think everyone benefits with the where the taxes used, if used properly, so it is right that everyone should contribute through paying appropriate tax.