Bitcoin usage in crime activity.

[Crypto_H]

Hello crypto bros.
Today I want to discuss a pretty big problem that bitcoin adoption is facing.
Bitcoin is great in means of anonymous transactions and getting away from the banks and government control, but the problem is, it's the exact problem why criminals are using it. And it's a pretty big one. I'm not saying that criminals use bitcoin more than fiat, but we all can see that illegal services are widely accepting bitcoin.

The problem here is that the system should have some way to fight these criminals because we don't want bitcoin to be associated with drugs and sex trafficking,  but the problem is, by solving these problems we should get rid of anonymity which is a pillar for the bitcoin technology, so it can't be done. And this problem might be a big obstacle in mass bitcoin adoption and regulations that are coming.

So I want to hear your opinion: how to make bitcoin technology "safer" so we could fight a crime committed with crypto and help with bitcoin adoption without taking away the main features of bitcoin like decentralization and anonymity?

It's up to law enforcement and the judicial system to identify and penalize these individuals. We, as Bitcoiners, don't have the power to prevent criminals from using Bitcoin.

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[1715087196]

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[Maslate]

When we talk about global adoption, that means Bitcoin is already regulated. Otherwise, it would be banned due to its association with illegal activities. As you may have noticed, there aren't many successful decentralized exchanges today because governments are making sure they regulate exchanges and ban those that aren't compliant.

As Bitcoin becomes more widely adopted, it will slowly lose its anonymity due to regulation. Speaking of regulation, that means KYC is mandatory, which requires you to provide your real identity to use exchange services.

This is the direction we're headed in, not the promises we heard during the early stages of crypto which is "pure anonymity".

[justdimin]

I really do not think it so. You see criminals always want a situation where by they would  commit a crime and go Scott free without any trace which was why the increase in digital or cyber crime became something else since bitcoin supports anonymous transaction. Now casinos back then wanted a way where by people could patronize them without any trace of their identity hence their resolve to accepting bitcoin which made it popular amongst the gamblers and there was the major breakthrough bitcoin got them and it started to blossom and gradually because the talk of time. See OP, I am meant to understand that there are some scenarios in life that is needed so as to facilitate a process. However, bitcoin was able to passthrough this process so as to get that popular amongst the gamblers and firm there it was well known amongst them.
See OP, I have come to realize that most times, there are some certain things that do not really scale through when things are done the right way or the right process to get things done but when it goes through the iron furnace, the heat of the fire makes that something get the relevant desires. I just assume this that it was that way.

First of all bitcoin doesn't support anonymous transaction, you can follow it, so if someone steals from somewhere, usually that's tracked, even through mixers if it's a bad mixer as well, so it's a trouble. I have to say that it's not going to be a bit of a simple situation, it's a big deal and I think it's obvious that fiat is used a lot more no matter what.

Even if you "think" crypto is better for criminals to use, that doesn't change the reality that fiat is used a lot more, and I mean thousands of times more. Which is why you can't, or anyone else can't attack bitcoin or any crypto because it can be used in crimes, since fiat has been used so far anyway.

[Iadegbola34]

The issue you've raised is indeed a complex one, as it touches on the tension between privacy and security, as well as the desire for greater adoption and regulation of Bitcoin. While it's true that criminals have been known to use Bitcoin for illegal purposes, it's also worth noting that traditional currencies are also used for criminal activities, and that Bitcoin can actually be more traceable than cash in certain circumstances.

One potential solution to this problem is to develop more sophisticated technologies that can track and monitor Bitcoin transactions, without compromising the anonymity of individual users. This could involve developing new types of blockchain analytics tools that can identify patterns of suspicious activity, as well as working with law enforcement agencies to develop more effective methods for tracking down and prosecuting cyber criminals.

[_BlackStar]

-snip-

Bitcoin just give advantage to those criminals to make their transaction easy but the same with other currency they are all use for any crimes. Its just we are following bitcoin and crypto that's why we always see a new regarding about bitcoin has been used on illegal activities. On regulation side maybe government need to take action with this so that they can easily combat frauds and can establish the real legitimate usage of bitcoin.

If you trust the government to solve this problem then you should be prepared to lose out on decentralization for bitcoin. What that means, the government simply does not want many anonymous users using bitcoin for any purpose, nor does the government want you to stay in its vicious cycle. While the government cannot blame bitcoin for any action regardless of scam, money laundering or other illegal acts.

[mv1986]

There are a couple of things that you seem to be confusing hereof not fully understand why Bitcoin is valuable. Any technology that reduces friction will be used by criminals and there is nothing you can do against it. Whenever something is useful for people, it will also be useful for those with bad intentions.

The good thing about Bitcoin is that the authority has an advantage on tracing these criminals.  Due to the blockchain transaction being transparent, authority can use enhanced tool in tracking illegal activities.  Just as the earlier reply stated, there is more chance of tracking illegal activities in Bitcoin than the traditional fiat.

I also doubt that it would have any influence on the overall amount of crime that is being committed. They have found ways ever since to commit crimes even before Bitcoin existed. How would you even go about it? If you change the codebase for Bitcoin, another crypto will pop up. Think about Monero. Whenever there is demand for something, someone will build it.

In essence you are intending to turn Bitcoin into something that people don't want. Imagine how many technologies can be used for evil and we still use them.

As far as I understand, Bitcoin had its own anti-fraud system, it is also one of the reason why blockchain transactions is available to the public.  If only authority can take advantage of this opportunity and learn how to use it in tracing illegal activities, Bitcoin natural feature will greatly reduce AML and other illegal activities that appears in the Bitcoin ecosystem.

That definitely depends on the person using the network. All too often those people who want to stay anonymous for whatever reason either make mistakes or don't know how to exactly go about it. It also depends on what kind of crime it is all about. I guess if someone pays for weed then law enforcement is probably not even interested in the person buying it.

I think authorities are on top of their game by now and it is not as easy to use Bitcoin for legal stuff as OP suggested. Most probably freaks who are into child abuse and what not are likely using Monero anyway. That is what I mean. Let's assume Monero would one day be cracked, well, there is still demand for an anonymous currency and someone would try to build it.

When forum members talk about the $5 wrench attack when it comes to crypto, sure that can happen anytime. But that can also happen when people know that you are storing gold bars in your basement or expensive art. In the end all these criminals usually look for an off-ramp and that is where it becomes difficult I think.

[Desmong]

Everything we are doing have both advantage and disadvantage and that will not make us to stop using Bitcoin because of what we had been seeing and hearing from people. There is nothing we can do about this, even with the fiat that we had been making use of for a long time now, scammers and Fraudsters had been using it to wicked the innocent ones.

[bkelly13]

... we don't want bitcoin to be associated with drugs and sex trafficking,  ...

The U.S. Dollar is probably the worlds most used currency for drugs, sex trafficking, and other illegal behaviors.  Yes, those bills in your wallet have probably been in the hands of people behaving in illegal and immoral activities.  I do mean, take a $1, $5, or $20 out of your wallet and I am talking about that particular bill.

So, if you are worried about BTC being used for those purposes, what do you suggest be done about that currency in your hand?

[serjent05]

Well, even criminals are using FIAT but unfortunately the media always targeting only Bitcoin in a negative way, that’s the difference. In fact, it is always safer to use Bitcoin or in general cryptocurrencies than FIAT . However, there is a minority who using them in criminal or illegal activities like, drugs and arms trade… etc
That’s the negative aspect of Bitcoin due to it is untraceable, They can know only your address but not your personal information and location.

It is obvious that some group don't want Bitcoin to be adopted so they are creating issues with the use of BTC.  The point fingers on Bitcoin being used in illegal activity while keeping blind that the fiat currency cases of being used illegally is far more worst than Bitcoin.

In addition to that, the governments been looking for way to track Bitcoin since 2009 but they never achieved it.  Otherwise, we cannot end the criminal activities in the world but we can reduce the rate if we find a way to track criminals and improve the security . In fact, it not only related to Bitcoin but FIAT.

Bitcoin transactions are traceable, I think they had been longed achieved it since the implementation of centralized exchanges.  Any address that is linked to centralized exchanges can be traced by the government, though the mixer makes their task to trace people harder that is why the government is somehow hostile on mixing services.

[Hamza2424]

For the first point, I can assure you that it's not like what you think of, anonymous haha it exposes everything for a normal on-chain user yeah from government-controlled policies you can say that it helps to get rid of. Still, I can say that the transparency of the Blockchain is its core beauty yeah if you are a person who likes to stay hidden due to some reasons you can try mixers to avoid regular problems faced by the users of that domain. Anyway, Adoption is not dependent on any type of circumstances its up to the law enforcement interests whenever they would think that ohhh now is the time to shock the market they will haha. Because currently opposing time to time is disturbing and getting more interesting for the profit makers.

There will be no War haha except for the Bitcoin war in the digital world from that I am pointing out 2 major stakeholder of the market Aisa and West. Both follow each other timely one attacks other defends and again one attacks and the other defends haha kid of a volleyball game. I am the one who is on the back of both because whoever did the goal its indirectly beneficial for us.

[CODE200]

These type of talks only benefit the people who dislike bitcoin and doesn't help us at all. Sure it might have been used in crime activity before, and maybe it will be again in the future as well. But that doesn't change the fact that fiat is used for it as well and has been used for it for a long time as well. Which is why I believe that we shouldn't really be considering that as a negative for crypto and move on. Try not to look at the negative of crypto that is not negative for you, like this one is not a negative to you, so ignore it, because its still by far better than fiat and that is why it is better to have than any other currency.

I doubt it. Those people who believe right away with misconceptions are the ones losing something, not bitcoin. Having talks like these increase awareness on how we can be careful with our asset and how we can build a better bitcoin community. Also, it is the negative feedbacks that made Bitcoin grow up to this date, the users and bitcoin itself were able to prove those misconceptions wrong and improve the network.

And when the community we have built tries to use bitcoin for good things and never talks about bad things and it has grown out there, maybe people out there won't talk about the bad things people have done. And as long as we can use bitcoin well and only introduce bitcoin for a good cause, that's more than enough to help bitcoin become better known to people. And we also always have to remind people to take good care of their bitcoins so that no one wants to steal them.

I guess disregarding the bad things happening with bitcoin is not a good because it might grow in the future. One problem must solve first as soon as possible cause it will cause more problem as time goes by. Anyhow bitcoin might be really use in the crime because criminal will always find a way to do it. What important is we have this forum to give awareness and for us to be careful all the time.

[Ale88]

So I want to hear your opinion: how to make bitcoin technology "safer" so we could fight a crime committed with crypto and help with bitcoin adoption without taking away the main features of bitcoin like decentralization and anonymity?

Every single item/tool can be both used in good and bad ways, bitcoin is no exception. Cash is used as well for criminal activities, no? And you can take a car and use it for a robbery, so are cars bad? What about screwdrivers? You can kill someone with one of those. Dogs? If trained in a certain way can kill people as well. Using possible criminal activity as a way to attack bitcoin is simply pointless, and sooner or later the majority of will understand that.

[CryptoBuds]

When we talk about global adoption, that means Bitcoin is already regulated. Otherwise, it would be banned due to its association with illegal activities. As you may have noticed, there aren't many successful decentralized exchanges today because governments are making sure they regulate exchanges and ban those that aren't compliant.

As Bitcoin becomes more widely adopted, it will slowly lose its anonymity due to regulation. Speaking of regulation, that means KYC is mandatory, which requires you to provide your real identity to use exchange services.

This is the direction we're headed in, not the promises we heard during the early stages of crypto which is "pure anonymity".

This is what got me wondering, how can we continue to protect our privacy when bitcoin is widely accepted and used as a mass payment method? I see people really want bitcoin to be more accepted and popular, but at the same time, they also want to ensure privacy, which is not possible. But like it or not, regulation is almost inevitable, the government has started to get tougher on us, and the crackdowns are getting bigger and bigger. I really hate regulation, that not only makes us lose our privacy but also makes the market no longer free to move, they will control everything.

[ethereumhunter]

These type of talks only benefit the people who dislike bitcoin and doesn't help us at all. Sure it might have been used in crime activity before, and maybe it will be again in the future as well. But that doesn't change the fact that fiat is used for it as well and has been used for it for a long time as well. Which is why I believe that we shouldn't really be considering that as a negative for crypto and move on. Try not to look at the negative of crypto that is not negative for you, like this one is not a negative to you, so ignore it, because its still by far better than fiat and that is why it is better to have than any other currency.

I doubt it. Those people who believe right away with misconceptions are the ones losing something, not bitcoin. Having talks like these increase awareness on how we can be careful with our asset and how we can build a better bitcoin community. Also, it is the negative feedbacks that made Bitcoin grow up to this date, the users and bitcoin itself were able to prove those misconceptions wrong and improve the network.

And when the community we have built tries to use bitcoin for good things and never talks about bad things and it has grown out there, maybe people out there won't talk about the bad things people have done. And as long as we can use bitcoin well and only introduce bitcoin for a good cause, that's more than enough to help bitcoin become better known to people. And we also always have to remind people to take good care of their bitcoins so that no one wants to steal them.

I guess disregarding the bad things happening with bitcoin is not a good because it might grow in the future. One problem must solve first as soon as possible cause it will cause more problem as time goes by. Anyhow bitcoin might be really use in the crime because criminal will always find a way to do it. What important is we have this forum to give awareness and for us to be careful all the time.

Yes, being on this forum and other crypto forums that aim to educate people will bring awareness that bitcoin is not for criminal things. And if any problems arise related to bitcoins, they will surely resolve themselves. But even though there are criminal things associated with bitcoin, people know that it is a side effect that will be in bitcoin so they will not care about it and will only use bitcoin for good things that do not break the rules.

[cryptoaddictchie]

So its so exaggerated for other to think bitcoin is used for only illegal activities just like those other people or officials who are skeptical about its purpose.

Maybe yes but we can never change that right forever? If some wanted to use an escape goat, they ll go to some mixers and they can never be tracked again. Thats an application which really destroy the image of bitcoin and cryptocurrency. Decentralized is nice but werent living on a place where there is no authority and have some rules.

Satoshi did a clever innovation of putting bitcoin into the scene.

[Plaguedeath]

This is what got me wondering, how can we continue to protect our privacy when bitcoin is widely accepted and used as a mass payment method? I see people really want bitcoin to be more accepted and popular, but at the same time, they also want to ensure privacy, which is not possible. But like it or not, regulation is almost inevitable, the government has started to get tougher on us, and the crackdowns are getting bigger and bigger. I really hate regulation, that not only makes us lose our privacy but also makes the market no longer free to move, they will control everything.

I think it's good because you can spend your coins directly on the merchants or trade through direct P2P with someone in your country. As long as the country where you live doesn't force you to use their own wallet or exchange, you can still protect your privacy. Many people are very hard want to convert their coins to cash because there's Bitcoin holders aren't exposed and not many people accept Bitcoin as a currency.

[YUriy1991]

Almost all currencies are misused in one way or another. Centralization here does not mean that currencies will not be misused. Cash is used in most of the drug trade. As for central systems, if we take banks as an example, despite the strict regulations, we note that the banking system is used in money laundering and extensively in illegal activities.

• French authorities raid banks in massive tax fraud case
  
• French authorities search 5 banks in Paris in tax fraud case
• The Five Biggest Money Laundering Scandals
  
• Danske Bank Pleads Guilty to Fraud on U.S. Banks in Multi-Billion Dollar Scheme to Access the U.S. Financial System

These are a few examples of banking systems in countries that are known to be strict in censorship, let alone in countries whose system was designed mainly to hide money laundering.

It is true that cash is often used in illicit trade and the banking system is also used extensively in illegal activities and money laundering, despite strict regulations But it is important to know that the decentralized nature of Bitcoin does not inherently make it any more or less vulnerable to criminal activity.
Just like any currency or financial system, there will always be individuals who seek to exploit it for illegal purposes. However, there are also many legitimate use cases for Bitcoin, such as international remittances, micropayments and as a store of value.

[Farma]

speaking of crime, bitcoin is not the only tool that can be used for things that are illegal. it can happen to all transaction tools, even fiat. we know that before bitcoin existed, there had been a lot of crime going on, starting from money laundering, and other illegal things. it was even still happening and more when bitcoin appeared.
Actually, the government is already taking action on this, like KYC, or even something else. the proof of that is that quite a lot of criminals are caught for abusing the use of bitcoin. however, it is very difficult to stop crime. even when we look at the legal things that a country has made, there are still some people who try to plan crimes.

[jostorres]

The problem here is that the system should have some way to fight these criminals because we don't want bitcoin to be associated with drugs and sex trafficking,  but the problem is, by solving these problems we should get rid of anonymity which is a pillar for the bitcoin technology, so it can't be done. And this problem might be a big obstacle in mass bitcoin adoption and regulations that are coming.

Almost every single currency or asset that exists in the world is used somewhere in a criminal or bad activity, and that doesn't really make much of a difference as those using it are the ones who are bad and not the currency or asset that is being used. People used to think Bitcoin is a currency used only in criminal activities some years ago, but did that stop Bitcoin from becoming famous or proving everyone wrong? No.

So no matter how hard a certain group of people or authorities try to convey it so that it looks bad and people stay away from it, it will become more and more popular and people will start using it more. So we don't really need to worry about that thing.

[siedemtrzy]

The problem here is that the system should have some way to fight these criminals because we don't want bitcoin to be associated with drugs and sex trafficking,  but the problem is, by solving these problems we should get rid of anonymity which is a pillar for the bitcoin technology, so it can't be done. And this problem might be a big obstacle in mass bitcoin adoption and regulations that are coming.

Almost every single currency or asset that exists in the world is used somewhere in a criminal or bad activity, and that doesn't really make much of a difference as those using it are the ones who are bad and not the currency or asset that is being used. People used to think Bitcoin is a currency used only in criminal activities some years ago, but did that stop Bitcoin from becoming famous or proving everyone wrong? No.

So no matter how hard a certain group of people or authorities try to convey it so that it looks bad and people stay away from it, it will become more and more popular and people will start using it more. So we don't really need to worry about that thing.

True. I can't believe some people and even politicians are accusing Bitcoin and other coins of that. But fiat was involved in crimes for centuries, but you're not banning it because of that!