Time to file tax returns in the USA

[larry_vw_1955]

What that means is it's time to tell the IRS everything you've been doing as far as selling bitcoin. Enjoy.  

You might owe some taxes too so make sure to pay them.

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[larry_vw_1955]

only 4 days left to let the irs know about all your crypto sales. and coffee you bought using the lightning network...

[BenCodie]

I have been thinking - what (aside from the upcoming CPI announcement) would cause Bitcoin to retrace from the current blast off?
This post reminded me...tax time. The narrative that "People are selling their Bitcoin for tax time" has been in tact every year for as long as I can remember.
Thanks to this post, I can now be prepared Lets see if the same kind of sell-off occurs this year.

On-topic. You also don't recognize any fiat gain or loss (and therefore don't need to report) if you stay on chain...HODL!

[Tytanowy Janusz]

Hopefully (or not) 2022 was a red year for stocks (-20% on sp500), bitcoin (-60%), even gold (-7%). So market on average have realized/unrealized loss not profit, and as far as I'm concerned there is not much tax to pay from loses. I don't think its going to ruin the push we just started (after breaking 29k resistance).

[Flexystar]

That Timeline is mostly synch around the world and everyone needs to get started with the accounts and balance sheets as soon as March ends. The month of financial year end and month for the Government to get paid enormously enough!

I am not sure how much taxes they are levying on US people but most of the countries are going in the window of 30% tax slot. That’s vigorous taxation just to remind everyone that Government is still in charge of everything and they would go to next level to stop the crypto transaction.

However, this time there won’t be much taxation. People might be buying more around this time to hide their assets and manipulate the sheets. USA will surely gain more capital as compared to rest of the world considering the number of crypto related businesses and individuals based there.

[DaveF]

only 4 days left to let the irs know about all your crypto sales. and coffee you bought using the lightning network...

You say that like it's a bad thing. I HATE paying taxes, but the rules are the rules. If you don't like them fight to change them don't complain about them.
If I pay you $65 to wash and wax and detail my car you are supposed to declare that as income. If I give you 1 gram of gold (worth about $65) you are still supposed to declare it if you convert it to fiat. If gold goes to $100 a gram and you sell it then you are supposed to declare it at $100. BTC / crypto is no different.

I think it's BS and vote for people who support crypto and send emails to my representatives that don't asking them to take another look at their views.

Yoda: Do Or Do Not There Is No Try
Dave: Stop Complaining And Do.

-Dave

[larry_vw_1955]

You say that like it's a bad thing. I HATE paying taxes, but the rules are the rules. If you don't like them fight to change them don't complain about them.

Well, who is going to want to EVER use bitcoin for small purchases if they have to keep track of capital gains on the amount of the transaction? no one is. that's not how an economy works. imagine if you had to report to the IRS every time you ever put gas in your car and account for any changes in the value of the us dollar for every one of those purchases...

If I pay you $65 to wash and wax and detail my car you are supposed to declare that as income.

running a business is different than being a consumer.

If I give you 1 gram of gold (worth about $65) you are still supposed to declare it if you convert it to fiat.

i'm not sure about gifts. i heard gifts are not taxable up to a certain amount.

If gold goes to $100 a gram and you sell it then you are supposed to declare it at $100. BTC / crypto is no different.

but what if you trade your gold for a gun with someone? you don't have to declare anything.

Yoda: Do Or Do Not There Is No Try
Dave: Stop Complaining And Do.

well, why would someone want to go to the hassle of using a cryptocurrency to make small transactions if every one of them incurs a reporting requirement to the irs? that just seems like a major headache. probably why alot of businesses don't take bitcoin still. imagine the irs sending you a bill for $40,000 because they treated your entire purchases you made using bitcoin as profit since you didn't know the cost basis every time. 

-Dave

hi dave.

[MusaMohamed]

U.S. IRS to hire nearly 20,000 staff over two years with $80 billion in new funds

They want to get more tax from their US. citizens by hiring more staffs, phone support staffs to give more smoothly support to citizens who make phone calls for support. I don't know what you realized from the report but IRS. lied to us.

The new IRS chief, said that he would enforce Treasury Secretary Janet Yellen's pledge to not increase historical audit rates for Americans earning under $400,000 and would base this on "historically low" 2018 audit rates.

They lied us that they aim at wealth people but I see it differently. They do know that the rich have good supports from their lawyers and it's harder to charge more tax from the rich. They will have many problems in law suits with the rich which they don't want to engage with. It is more easily of they aim at the poor who don't have money to hire lawyers to fight against IRS and their accusations. So the poor will more easily to spend $1000 or $2000 tax fine just to make their life easier.

[larry_vw_1955]

U.S. IRS to hire nearly 20,000 staff over two years with $80 billion in new funds

They want to get more tax from their US. citizens by hiring more staffs, phone support staffs to give more smoothly support to citizens who make phone calls for support. I don't know what you realized from the report but IRS. lied to us.

there really does need to be some overhaul of the tax system. i'm surprised no one has done anything about it but tax returns are too complicated and take too much time to "figure out". it shouldn't be that way. thousands of rules, probably tens of thousands. who needs them?  

They lied us that they aim at wealth people but I see it differently. They do know that the rich have good supports from their lawyers and it's harder to charge more tax from the rich. They will have many problems in law suits with the rich which they don't want to engage with. It is more easily of they aim at the poor who don't have money to hire lawyers to fight against IRS and their accusations. So the poor will more easily to spend $1000 or $2000 tax fine just to make their life easier.

the irs is how the government stops inflation from getting too much out of hand. print too much money? nothing to worry about, we'll just collect more taxes to take it back...stealing from peter to pay paul type of thing.

I am not sure how much taxes they are levying on US people but most of the countries are going in the window of 30% tax slot. That’s vigorous taxation just to remind everyone that Government is still in charge of everything and they would go to next level to stop the crypto transaction.

so you make 40% return in 2021 and pay 30% taxes on that profit. 2022 rolls around and you end up buying back into bitcoin and losing all your profits you made putting you back at break even EXCEPT, you paid 30% on your profit that you won't get back...that's why it's not so easy to make money "investing" in crypto. not if you're having to pay 30% in taxes. kind of a waste of time in my opinion... now if there was a way you could invest in crypto and not have to pay ANY taxes at all then maybe that could be a possibly interesting thing to do. but you still have to be careful and not lose money.

the short version of the above is this:

the house always wins. and you aren't the house. the house is the irs for example. no one wins except them in the longrun when it comes to paying 30% on profits in trading. there may be profitable traders but they are in the minority and even they lose more than they should because of how things work...

[majeed]

What that means is it's time to tell the IRS everything you've been doing as far as selling bitcoin. Enjoy.  

You might owe some taxes too so make sure to pay them.

It's unbelievable how far Bitcoin has come, and now it's time to deal with the outcomes of its triumph! The IRS has always been searching for something to tax, and it was just a matter of time before they targeted Bitcoin. Cryptocurrencies are now being recognized and are making a name in the financial sector, which is truly exciting. However, with every new opportunity, there are new obligations to fulfill, and paying taxes on your Bitcoin income is unquestionably one of them. This reminds us that regardless of how innovative and groundbreaking the technology is, there are still rules to adhere to.

[DaveF]

You say that like it's a bad thing. I HATE paying taxes, but the rules are the rules. If you don't like them fight to change them don't complain about them.

Well, who is going to want to EVER use bitcoin for small purchases if they have to keep track of capital gains on the amount of the transaction? no one is. that's not how an economy works. imagine if you had to report to the IRS every time you ever put gas in your car and account for any changes in the value of the us dollar for every one of those purchases...

Nobody, the same way a lot of people don't report a lot of things.

You say that like it's a bad thing. I HATE paying taxes, but the rules are the rules. If you don't like them fight to change them don't complain about them.

Well, who is going to want to EVER use bitcoin for small purchases if they have to keep track of capital gains on the amount of the transaction? no one is. that's not how an economy works. imagine if you had to report to the IRS every time you ever put gas in your car and account for any changes in the value of the us dollar for every one of those purchases...

If I pay you $65 to wash and wax and detail my car you are supposed to declare that as income.

running a business is different than being a consumer.

Didn't make myself clear with that. It's not running a business, it's Larry the person showing up to wash Dave's car. Not Larry's detailing shop.

If I give you 1 gram of gold (worth about $65) you are still supposed to declare it if you convert it to fiat.

i'm not sure about gifts. i heard gifts are not taxable up to a certain amount.

Once again, me not being clear, I was saying if I gave you the gold instead of cash for the car wash.

-Dave

hi dave.

Hi Larry :-)

I think, and I don't want to put words in you mouth here, that we both think the rules are ridiculous, hard to follow and just stupid.
Personally, I have been complaining about the rules for so long that I stopped doing it and just keep poking the politicians.

-Dave

[UniJoin]

Doesn't the IRS treat Bitcoin the same as stocks or bonds? (capital gains tax in cryptocurrency).

But I'm interested in something else, how the tax is calculated if someone bought Bitcoin at the peak, and later sold it at a loss.

[kryptqnick]

I still find it very difficult to understand that the USA is a country where you're generally accepted to file and pay your own taxes, as if you're an accountant of a firm or something. In my country, most people don't pay their own taxes because that responsibility falls on the employers, so unless you have your own business, or are self-employed, you don't need to think about it. It's also funny how the IRS wants people to pay taxes even for illegal activities and will allegedly not disclose the info and doesn't really care about the activities themselves.
As for crypto hodling, it seems that the IRS treats cryptos are assets, so you need to pay a tax when you sell at a profit, but if you don't sell, you don't pay, right?

[larry_vw_1955]

Doesn't the IRS treat Bitcoin the same as stocks or bonds? (capital gains tax in cryptocurrency).

probably.

But I'm interested in something else, how the tax is calculated if someone bought Bitcoin at the peak, and later sold it at a loss.

apparently capital gains losses are not able to be fully offset against normal income, only up to like $3000 per year. anything more has to be carried forward to future years. so you get punished for going broke and having to get a normal job...  

https://www.investopedia.com/articles/personal-finance/100515/heres-how-deduct-your-stock-losses-your-tax-bill.asp

As for crypto hodling, it seems that the IRS treats cryptos are assets, so you need to pay a tax when you sell at a profit, but if you don't sell, you don't pay, right?

i mean that goes without saying. but they want you to tell them if you received any crypto too like a payment or a gift. you need to check the box.

In my country, most people don't pay their own taxes because that responsibility falls on the employers, so unless you have your own business, or are self-employed, you don't need to think about it.

theres alot of people that are classified as self employed but they really aren't because they depend on a single company like lift or uber drivers. they're really not self employed...anytime you can be deleted with the push of a button, aka fired, you're not self employed. 

[worldofcoins]

What that means is it's time to tell the IRS everything you've been doing as far as selling bitcoin. Enjoy.  

You might owe some taxes too so make sure to pay them.

The IRS considers Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies' property in the United States for tax purposes. This means that when you sell Bitcoin at a profit, you are generally subject to capital gains taxes. If you have sold Bitcoin during the tax year, you must report those transactions on your tax return and pay any taxes owed. Therefore, it is always important to comply with tax laws in your country to avoid any legal issues.

[larry_vw_1955]

The IRS considers Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies' property in the United States for tax purposes.

more like THEIR property  

This means that when you sell Bitcoin at a profit, you are generally subject to capital gains taxes. If you have sold Bitcoin during the tax year, you must report those transactions on your tax return and pay any taxes owed. Therefore, it is always important to comply with tax laws in your country to avoid any legal issues.

who really wants to have to do that though? no one. so for alot of people it's probably better to not be involved in cryptocurrencies for that reason. it just complicates things. and their not going to get rich...

question for the day: how many times does a us dollar get taxed until it's taxed out of existence?

[larry_vw_1955]

I hate doing taxes. And I hate this time of the year because of taxes. Maybe I need to hire someone for this work.

make sure they read this:

https://www.irs.gov/individuals/international-taxpayers/frequently-asked-questions-on-virtual-currency-transactions

someone has to know that type of stuff if you been trading bitcoin...