The severity of the Ordinals Attack is increasing

[Bigpiggy01]

This talk of "fixing the protocol" sounds very much like 2017. I remember the forks that happened then that apparently "fixed the protocol" but wasn't very popular was it.

As I've said numerous times this will only encourage the usage of L2 which until now didn't have much reason for existence, fortunately now they do. Eventually the likes of BRC20 will end up on L2 as well, so only necessary payments will be on the settlement layer. Also kinda bored of people describing this as an attack on Bitcoin when people are using the protocol in the correct manner (following the rules).

Sure I'm waiting to make a transaction myself, but when I started using Bitcoin I knew what I was getting into: an experimental technology. Welcome to the experiment, please try to embrace it.

Only real comparison is SatoshiDice and the evolution it caused. This too will cause evolution, if the protocol doesn't evolve...... L2 is at best a stopgap measure or it leaves the protocol open to more of the same at a later date.

[1714297414]

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[1714297414]

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[pooya87]

But what do you think of making transaction with script size above 10000 bytes or script which contain OP_PUSH (and it's variant) become non-standard?

10k bytes may be too big and remain exploitable (eg. using multiple inputs) and we can't do anything about OP_PUSH itself since the signature and pubkeys are also pushed to the stack that way.
We should first come up with a size that we need based on the transactions that people are making and NOT leave the protocol wide open like this. Unless there is any Taproot scripts that need anything bigger than 100-200 bytes, there is no need to let it be bigger than that.

There is fixed, limited block space and variable demand for that block space. You may not like how that block space is being used but if transactions are consensus compatible and paying fees at the market rate the system is working how it should.

link

This is a dumb argument made by people who either have never looked at bitcoin source code or are intentionally ignoring it. Under the hood, in the consensus rules, spam attacks like this have always been possible but we have been preventing them using the standard rules.
This is also not demand for more block space, this is a spam attack. Period.

I'm in the this too shall pass mode of thinking.
Sooner or later all the ordinal people are going to give up and move on to the next big thing.

Keep in mind that ICO scam is still alive to this day. They kept changing the name and upgrading their scam methods:

Code:

ICO > IDO > IBO > IEO > ITO > STO > DeFi > NFT

Ordinals attack looks somewhat similar:

Code:

Ordinals > BRC-20 > Some other garbage name

Disclaimer: Im not saying this its what its happen right now, but its a possibilitie in the near future, so like the wise said " Prevention is better than cure "

I'm a little busy these days and need to find some links before I can post some historical facts about some of the attacks against bitcoin that let's just say look very suspicious... So hold that thought...

Eventually the likes of BRC20 will end up on L2 as well,

It can't. Tokens need a blockchain where they are stored not just a layer where nothing is stored and only money changes hands. Side chain is the solution and if they wanted to end up there, they would have started there considering how solutions already exist!

Also kinda bored of people describing this as an attack on Bitcoin when people are using the protocol in the correct manner (following the rules).

Wrong. They are not using the protocol, they are abusing an exploit. There is big difference.

[Amphenomenon]

Disclaimer: Im not saying this its what its happen right now, but its a possibilitie in the near future, so like the wise said " Prevention is better than cure "

I'm a little busy these days and need to find some links before I can post some historical facts about some of the attacks against bitcoin that let's just say look very suspicious... So hold that thought...

Jesus Christ did alot of miracles for the people but in the many still support his death, no matter how good a thing is, everyone can't love or support it. Satoshi solve the biggest issues of Blockchain technology and is obvious, not everybody loves him and so there will always be those who hate Bitcoin.
 This may be from the government or some altcoin supporters (but a harm to Bitcoin will affect the whole cryptocurrency   ) or those who will just derive joy the fall of Bitcoin.
Some previous attacks on Bitcoin :

• MTGox: Addressing Transaction Malleability
• Bitcoin's Empty Blocks Analaysis.
• Dust Attack, what it is, why it is dangerous and how to prevent falling to it
• Network Attack on XVG / VERGE
• Mother of all spam attacks on bitcoin network! proof?

• Craig Steven Wright is a liar and a fraud - Tulip Trust addresses signed message
• List of Sybil Attacks and Attackers

But in the end Bitcoin still conquers all, now developers will try to fix this and any other flaws that can be exploited

[mindrust]

So who hates Bitcoins today?,

We all know  that in 2017, Roger ver or MemoryDealers and friends try to attack Bitcoin blockchain such as today, they seek to tell the world if the size of the Bitcoin blockchain is small and can't accommodate the transactions.

So if someone (maybe altcoin enthusiastic) tries to do the same thing in 2017, that is possibly the same person (or community).

From today we have to watch carefully also Craig Wright, Roger Ver, and their friend. Those communities still mining Bitcoin, right? maybe they did this for profit purposes, and simultaneously drop the prestige of bitcoin.

Tbh I don't care who is attacking bitcoin because it doesn't matter at all. It could be anybody. Maybe it is just a group of random haters... The point is, bitcoin should be stronger than these attacks. If bitcoin dies after an attack like that then bitcoin don't deserve to survive at all. Like you said, Bitcoin survived these attacks before. They tried to bring it down in 2017 and bitcoin didn't care.

What changed this time? I missed the late events but it seems like these NFT thing is responsible for it. And how did ordinals&NFT's become available on bitcoin? The last time I was interested in the tech, bitcoin didn't give a crap about token creation. Who let that happen? Whoever it is, he miscalculated everything and now we are paying the price.

I think the more features getting added to bitcoin, the more vulnerable it gets to the new attack vectors. (just like any other software) I hate Craig Wright for everything he is but maybe he was right about this one.

Sometimes less is more.

[NotATether]

Good news, it appears that in the past few hours, the shitcoins activity is cooling down, and 200 sat/vbyte transactions should be within the top 2 vMB of the mempool.

I still think it will take a while for fees to drop from three digits, but this is some minor progress.

[be.open]

There is fixed, limited block space and variable demand for that block space. You may not like how that block space is being used but if transactions are consensus compatible and paying fees at the market rate the system is working how it should.

link

This is a dumb argument made by people who either have never looked at bitcoin source code or are intentionally ignoring it. Under the hood, in the consensus rules, spam attacks like this have always been possible but we have been preventing them using the standard rules.
This is also not demand for more block space, this is a spam attack. Period.

Please lower your level of aggressiveness in your rhetoric, because I may qualify this as a verbal attack on the self-identity of bitcoin. Like any human creation, bitcoin was not perfect at the time of its creation and remains imperfect now. This leaves room for the development of bitcoin itself and also gives room in the sun for a thousand altcoins that may be faster than bitcoin, more private than bitcoin, but they are not bitcoin.

From a certain point of view, the mixed transactions from the mixer you advertise here are also spam on the open Bitcoin blockchain. Think about it at your leisure.

[NotATether]

From a certain point of view, the mixed transactions from the mixer you advertise here are also spam on the open Bitcoin blockchain. Think about it at your leisure.

So what do you suggest people do to solve this problem?

[LocalMonero]

Let's be realistic, even if your initiative is implemented in the form of a new version of the bitcoin core, we will not be able to reach a consensus in voting for its implementation, given that the current situation is beneficial for miners. But you can always initiate a hard fork and create your own little improved lamp version of bitcoin with blackjack and whores, it just won’t be quite bitcoin anymore. And the real true bitcoin is exactly the same as it is now - with expensive and slow transactions and with a small block size filled to the brim with stupid pictures.

Among those who have the right to vote, there are enough companies that will definitely take this step.

Although I am skeptical of Binance, their mining pool will also support the change as the current situation is significantly hurting their core business.

[darkv0rt3x]

And wait, peeps... There is more of this crap...
https://thebitcoinmanual.com/articles/orc-20-tokens/

WTF is these people thinking?? I hope that these scams die quickly along with the people who created them!

[be.open]

From a certain point of view, the mixed transactions from the mixer you advertise here are also spam on the open Bitcoin blockchain. Think about it at your leisure.

So what do you suggest people do to solve this problem?

I do not consider this a serious problem that deserves an immediate search for ways to solve it. As well as the problem with Ordinals Attack.

But if you want to delve into this dialogue in more detail - first remove your commercial signature so that I stop thinking that you are not trying to earn another four dollars and for you this is a key driver for continuing the conversation.

[Z390]

So, you are sure that in this section one more topic is needed to discuss the current situation. What are your constructive proposals for overcoming this crisis?

Pooya87 doesn't need to come forth with a solution to the problem, the fact that many people don't see this as a new problem that will greatly affect Bitcoin is what makes it a good discussion, many people think that this ks something we have seen several times in the past, and because it's also making Bitcoin miners rip good amount of profits but this is going to throw Bitcoin in a new BS situation.

Many new projects are getting on Bitcoin Ordi right now and some are just preparing to launch, the transaction fee will keep going higher from now on and many investors will quit Bitcoin, this is a valid reason to quit Bitcoin because people are violating its purpose.

[Yaunfitda]

I wonder how much more should we wait to stop this attack? The fees are ridiculous, 100sat/vbyte is a reality already now (if you want reasonable transaction times). I'm waiting for the core devs to respond to this hostile action against Bitcoin. Taproot bug must be fixed.

I think we should only wait for the hype to die down. Degen peoples are increasing the trading of those so called ordinals. Its true this will affect regular business or merchants that use of bitcoin for transaction. But does this action by the creatoe who established this new tech of ordinals is illegal? I mean does core devs can somehow fix this? Since the creator choose to use a decentralized platform for this idea.

As far as I know there's nothing illegal here, the creator of BRC-20 token was able to find a loophole in Bitcoin’s 2021 Taproot upgrade and then that's it. It's the start of this 'inscription'.

But this is an attack to bitcoin's fungibility and I don't think that the community is divided, majority doesn't support BRC-20.

In any case, this is hype and we all know how fast this kind of fad is going to die down.

[NotATether]

From a certain point of view, the mixed transactions from the mixer you advertise here are also spam on the open Bitcoin blockchain. Think about it at your leisure.

So what do you suggest people do to solve this problem?

I do not consider this a serious problem that deserves an immediate search for ways to solve it. As well as the problem with Ordinals Attack.

But if you want to delve into this dialogue in more detail - first remove your commercial signature so that I stop thinking that you are not trying to earn another four dollars and for you this is a key driver for continuing the conversation.

I'm already maxed out on my post count for the week since yesterday - further conversation about that is comical.

[jrrsparkles]

Good news, it appears that in the past few hours, the shitcoins activity is cooling down, and 200 sat/vbyte transactions should be within the top 2 vMB of the mempool.

I still think it will take a while for fees to drop from three digits, but this is some minor progress.

Yesterday it was around 650sats/byte now its around 230 which is good news but looking at the number of unconfirmed transaction is still high above 400K so I guess the problem is going to stay here for a while until those craze for brc20 goes away until that the price of Bitcoin surely under a big concern and no wonder it it falls below 20K too for short period.

[Bigpiggy01]

To those who think this is going to go away without some proactive community mitigation, "You're naive fools."

So many BTC related services and businesses operate on a cots + basis and might enjoy the lower frequency but juicier tx. And so many in "the community" are from pampered US and EU backgrounds where they forget what these fee increases mean in the areas of the world where actual growth has been happening.

Loosing the voices of people in South and Central America and parts of Asia will set the overall Bitcoin and crypto back by years as a whole.

Best alleviation I see right now is ATM producers getting their fingers out about lightning and moving onto it. But I have serious doubts that will happen as they too do cost+ and greed is a powerful motivator for doing nothing.

[Volgastallion]

Disclaimer: Im not saying this its what its happen right now, but its a possibilitie in the near future, so like the wise said " Prevention is better than cure "

I'm a little busy these days and need to find some links before I can post some historical facts about some of the attacks against bitcoin that let's just say look very suspicious... So hold that thought...

Also kinda bored of people describing this as an attack on Bitcoin when people are using the protocol in the correct manner (following the rules).

Wrong. They are not using the protocol, they are abusing an exploit. There is big difference.

Well, nice to see somebody have more info about this.

About the second quoted, man i cant believe some people here saying this its not an attack on BTC, i know maybe its not a coordinate or inittially its not an attack directly against BTC, but now in an abstrac way its an attack.

I dont understand people who say "its not against the rules" yes man, we know that but do you know the difference between law and moral? or do you know if something its legal not always its good?.

Let me explain the point with a simple example:

You live in a street with only one can of trash for the whole street. When youa re gonna drop your garbage to the can, you see the can its filled until the top and you cant deposit your trash, and this keep repeting everyday.
When you start to seek an answer for that, you see a neighbor of you put ton of garbage made by him in the trash can and full the can by only his trash. So nobody in the street can drop their garbage.

Well he is not doing nothing against the rule he its only throwing away his garbage. But you can see its not good for the community and also its not a good behavior.

[cryptoaddictchie]

Yup, wishful thinking. Maybe it won't technically "last", but it could easily take years until they run out of funds to spam, and that's all they need...

I doubt these ordinals geeks who loves nft (now BRC-20) that earned them good money would stop as long as they keep earning from the trend of it. So maybe we are talking about a long time problem here for the bitcoin community as these high fees wouldnt regress for a while. It will go down but some folks are now spamming on socials on how good profits are being drawn on brc20. Ive saw some airdrops being posted on twitters with dozens of feed and comments. Crazy it is!

[coolcoinz]

Good news, it appears that in the past few hours, the shitcoins activity is cooling down, and 200 sat/vbyte transactions should be within the top 2 vMB of the mempool.

I still think it will take a while for fees to drop from three digits, but this is some minor progress.

It's still bloated, just the amount of red tx went down, but yellow level went up.

Anyways, these whole thing doesn't even last a week. How long would you say it's going to last before the ordinals-based shitcoins implode and people realize they've been investing in scams? I give it another week and the drain is going to unclog and wash them all down.

Yup, wishful thinking. Maybe it won't technically "last", but it could easily take years until they run out of funds to spam, and that's all they need...

I doubt these ordinals geeks who loves nft (now BRC-20) that earned them good money would stop as long as they keep earning from the trend of it. So maybe we are talking about a long time problem here for the bitcoin community as these high fees wouldnt regress for a while. It will go down but some folks are now spamming on socials on how good profits are being drawn on brc20. Ive saw some airdrops being posted on twitters with dozens of feed and comments. Crazy it is!

Only the top of the scheme is earning. Have you seen statistics of some of these coins? They have addresses that hold more than 5% of total supply each, and I'm not talking about the exchanges. When these insiders cash out, it's going to look like the Terra Luna chart.

[cabron]

What else can we do to stop their exploits?
We don't want to split the chain again all because of the Ordinals. I may not be coordinated attack from the start when they tried that NFTs on top but its the idea now because when there are a lot of them benefiting this, they will all continue to do it.

This is gonna diminish the demand of BTC.

[Volgastallion]

What else can we do to stop their exploits?
We don't want to split the chain again all because of the Ordinals. I may not be coordinated attack from the start when they tried that NFTs on top but its the idea now because when there are a lot of them benefiting this, they will all continue to do it.

This is gonna diminish the demand of BTC.

Well i dont know really what to do but i have to point something, the main problem with exploits its this, you know they were you know they exist but until they dont get exploited you dont make anything to solve them, its like a lazy thing.

They are useless and harmless until they become harmful, and you are not prepared in the right way to overcome the issue.

But the good things its... it can be solved and its a minor issue in the big movie.