Unraid or Umbrel? - Discussion and troubleshooting

[RickDeckard]

I have been wanting to build a NAS for some time now and I've been looking for an OS that allows me to run it nicely and Unraid seems to be a good candidate (although not being open source). According to Unraid official documentation[1], Unraid is "an embedded operating system that is designed to provide you with the ultimate control over your hardware. In addition to performing the duties of a robust NAS (network-attached storage), Unraid is also capable of acting as an application server and virtual machine host." As far as hardware goes, this system will be more than enough to run a node (I'm planning on dedicating 8GB of RAM and a 1TB SSD).

Since I intend to run this machine 24/7/365, I also want to run a node on it and I was wondering if anyone is already running this setup? If so, did you encounter any problems with it? Unraid has community applications[2] - apps that are developed by users to be installed in Unraid OS - and there are at least two applications whose purpose is to run a bitcoin node[3][4].

There is, however, another option - Since I can also run VM's on this OS, I can always run one with a Linux Distribution (Fedora - thanks o_e_l_e_o!) and just install Umbrel on it and proceed to run a node on it. Considering Unraid file system, and the fact that I would run the node on an Unassigned device (to avoid writing directly to the array of HDD's), I'm unsure if Umbrel would detect that disk however. Any thoughts on this idea as well?

Independently of the direction that I take, I plan to update this topic with my developments when I get the server up and running (Soon™) in the hopes of helping users that may also find themselves in this situation.
[1]https://docs.unraid.net/unraid-os/manual/what-is-unraid/
[2]https://unraid.net/community/apps
[3]https://unraid.net/community/apps
[4]https://forums.unraid.net/topic/116673-support-smartphonelover-bitcoin-node/
[5]https://forums.unraid.net/topic/112959-support-ofawx-templates-repo/

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[DaveF]

DO NOT USE UMBEL ON ANYTHING ELSE THAT HANDLES BTC FOR ANYTHING ELSE OTHER THEN BTC.
Yes Unraid will do it, BUT it still has access to the VMs and Umbrel works (or at least worked under it) with no issues.

This is how we get the posts that start 'All of a sudden all my BTC vanished out of my wallet help...'

If they (Unraid) change something and there is an issue, do you need the hair pulling stress about it.

RPi and equivalents are back in stock. Used hardware, PC at least around here has plummeted in price.

RAID machine goes here on this machine. BTC wallet goes there on that machine. And done.

Yes, I know it's not what this thread is about, but I wanted it said.


Keeping the above in mind, it's a straight install had no issues doing it. Performance on the IBD was REALLY slow on both Umbreal and MyNode and although I can't articulate it well the overall performance of anything I was running under Unraid felt sluggish, and that was on a 6th gen i7 with 32GB and nothing but SSDs. I eventually ditched the entire Unraid setup before the 30 day trial ended for other reasons.

-Dave

[RickDeckard]

This is first time i heard Unraid OS. But as long as you (1) configure the VM software to mount certain partition/disk when you turn on the VM and (2) configure OS (inside the VM) to mount that partition/disk automatically, Umbrel should detect it without problem.

Alternatively just ask their technical support since Unraid OS is paid OS about how to make OS inside VM detect your parition/disk which categorized as unassigned device.

Thank you for the input ETFbitcoin. The reason that I didn't open this issue on their forum is because there doesn't seem to be a high interest in there regarding containers running bitcoin nodes or even cryptocurrency in general. Since the forum holds both high interest and high knowledge individuals, I figured that I would have better chances of help in here.

Keeping the above in mind, it's a straight install had no issues doing it. Performance on the IBD was REALLY slow on both Umbreal and MyNode and although I can't articulate it well the overall performance of anything I was running under Unraid felt sluggish, and that was on a 6th gen i7 with 32GB and nothing but SSDs. I eventually ditched the entire Unraid setup before the 30 day trial ended for other reasons.
-Dave

Thank you for the warning Dave. My sole purpose for this VM would be rather straightforward: I would run a bitcoin node[1], mempool[2] and perhaps JAM[3] when it reaches a more stable version (meanwhile I would continue using JoinMarket). I don't pretend to store any kind of bitcoin in it (besides the cases where I would use JoinMarket).

As for Unraid updating or changing something in their OS, they can't push their updates without the user consent (at least that's how it has been so far and if they took such action it would surely damage their reputation). There are still some users that have older versions running because simply because they are fine with them and don't see the need to update.

As for Unraid feeling sluggish, I'll be running a Xeon CPU on it and I don't plan on making a beefy use of it, so there is a lot of room to grow (or so I hope).
[1]https://apps.umbrel.com/app/bitcoin
[2]https://apps.umbrel.com/app/mempool
[3]https://apps.umbrel.com/app/jam

[Good_Doctor]

I have been wanting to build a NAS for some time now and I've been looking for an OS that allows me to run it nicely and Unraid seems to be a good candidate (although not being open source). According to Unraid official documentation[1], Unraid is "an embedded operating system that is designed to provide you with the ultimate control over your hardware. In addition to performing the duties of a robust NAS (network-attached storage), Unraid is also capable of acting as an application server and virtual machine host." As far as hardware goes, this system will be more than enough to run a node (I'm planning on dedicating 8GB of RAM and a 1TB SSD).

Yeah! From official documentation, UNRAID is designed to provide control over hardware and can function as a robust NAS, application server, and virtual machine host.This is really interesting considering the features of UNRAID and it roles in NAS. Wow!

Since I intend to run this machine 24/7/365, I also want to run a node on it and I was wondering if anyone is already running this setup? If so, did you encounter any problems with it? Unraid has community applications[2] - apps that are developed by users to be installed in Unraid OS - and there are at least two applications whose purpose is to run a bitcoin node[3][4].

Regarding running a Bitcoin node on Unraid, the community applications renders various options. It's worth noting that there are two applications specifically developed for running a Bitcoin node- These community-developed apps can provide valuable insights from the  users here  who have already explored this setup which I too would look forward to hearing from.

There is, however, another option - Since I can also run VM's on this OS, I can always run one with a Linux Distribution (Fedora - thanks o_e_l_e_o!) and just install Umbrel on it and proceed to run a node on it. Considering Unraid file system, and the fact that I would run the node on an Unassigned device (to avoid writing directly to the array of HDD's), I'm unsure if Umbrel would detect that disk however. Any thoughts on this idea as well?

Also, if you consider running a Linux distribution as a virtual machine on UNRAID, installing Umbrel as a Bitcoin node is a viable option. Another kudos to the versatility of Unraid's OS, running Umbrel on a Linux VM can be a suitable alternative. However, it's important to verify if Umbrel can detect the disk when using an Unassigned device. It might be helpful to seek feedback from the UNRAID community or explore relevant moves to ensure the success of this idea.

Independently of the direction that I take, I plan to update this topic with my developments when I get the server up and running (Soon™) in the hopes of helping users that may also find themselves in this situation.

It's really cool to hear that you plan on sharing your developments with the community. Best of luck! Looking forward to hearing of your progress and When you get your server up and running, your updates can be valuable for users facing similar situations. I'm sure you'd share updates too 😊

[DaveF]

As for Unraid feeling sluggish, I'll be running a Xeon CPU on it and I don't plan on making a beefy use of it, so there is a lot of room to grow (or so I hope).

This is the IT nerd in me coming out so feel free to ignore.

1) Saying Xeon is kind of like saying Ford. They have had many generations of them and even now with the current geneation the slower ones are actually worse in some applications then mid range I5 CPUs.

2) Drives also play an important part. There are some better generation or two older SSD that are just faster then cheap current SSD, it's just the way it is.

Any reason you are not doing this on a dedicated just for BTC platform?

-Dave

[RickDeckard]

That seems to be true, but you could just ask how to make OS inside VM automatically mount specific partition/disk. And actually i refer to this contact page, https://unraid.net/contact.

Thank you for the input ETFbitcoin. In fact I didn't thought of the contact form. I was just thinking of exposing my question to the forum, but that option is also a solid one.

This is the IT nerd in me coming out so feel free to ignore.

Why would I ignore valid questions? I was the one that came here looking to discuss and share opinions, it wouldn't feel right cherry picking them .

1) Saying Xeon is kind of like saying Ford. They have had many generations of them and even now with the current geneation the slower ones are actually worse in some applications then mid range I5 CPUs.

I'm looking to grab something around the E5-2600ve line of Xeon. Does that help?

2) Drives also play an important part. There are some better generation or two older SSD that are just faster then cheap current SSD, it's just the way it is.

I'm also thinking in buying 970 Evo Plus SSD's (Samsung).

Any reason you are not doing this on a dedicated just for BTC platform?

Well it simply boils down to the fact that I would avoid running two separate machines when one of them (in this case the node) could easily be integrated in the server. This would also allow me some savings regards electricity (and avoid buying more hardware to build the bitcoin dedicated machine). I suppose that the OS's that are mentioned in section "One-click Installation" in mempool GitHub page[1] are all open source?
[1]https://github.com/mempool/mempool

[RickDeckard]

I briefly checked Unraid docs and found out the VM use QEMU/KVM under the hood[1-2]. And they even mention how to use physical disk on VM[2].

Meanwhile I've also found those docs as well, thank you for that! I'll take a look in them and if I ever go forward with hosting my node in the server, I'll surely have use for them.

I believe you mistyped something since "ve" variant of Xeon ES-2600 doesn't exist. While E5-2600 v1/v2/v3/v4 exist, all of them was released between 2012-2016.

I blame my fat fingers for that, you are correct. I wanted to type v2 and ended up hitting the "e" underneath...