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Author Topic: Tornado cash founders charged with money laundering/sanctions violations  (Read 1079 times)
blckhawk
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May 18, 2024, 07:45:18 AM
 #61

Here is an update.
Tornado Cash developer Alexey Pertsev has been found guilty of laundering $1.2 billion.
It is really idiotic to punish the developer, while the co-founder was declared not guilty.
Well, the problem is that the developers probably didn't have a good lawyer or they're so bad at answering questions during the court proceedings that could've lead to what happened to them, the Jury system is a really biased system so you'll have to expect that this will happen every time, maybe there's also the fact that the co-founder's got some good friends in high places that could've led to this verdict, I mean that's the only that this could've happened. Or they probably have this argument that the developers were the ones that were responsible for making the service and the code that made it so effective and so in a way they did have a heavier contribution to the money laundering but then again, that's a flimsy argument so the possibility is that Pertsev got some bad lawyers or there's more that's not mentioned on this update or in the news.
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May 18, 2024, 11:54:19 PM
 #62

This is idiotic because they blame him on the usage of the people who have used Tornado Cash. This has created a dangerous precedent on anonymous coins, tools and projects in the cryptospace. It also appears that the developer can be charged for the crimes that another person has done. Does this imply that if a terrorist used a Nokia cellphone to detonate bombs, Nokia is also implicit to the crime? A very headshaking argument.
The system is rigged. It's all hell-bent towards criminalizing crypto or anything that respects or encourages user financial privacy and freedom. It's stupid how they use the excuse of anonymous transactions getting used to "finance" terrorism yet the very hypocrites like the US openly finance terrorism under the guise of weapon aid to their allies using tax payers money.

Another lesson to learn is to completely go anonymous when creating tools that anonymize other users or enhance their privacy. It makes no sense if you are to develop a tool that enhances user privacy, yet you are out there in the open known by those Government blood suckers. They will dump all their shame and anger on that one person who created the tool once they land on him/her.




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bbc.reporter
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August 27, 2024, 01:18:46 AM
 #63

@logfiles. They might be also conspiring to criminalize the cryptospace users' right to self custody their cryptocoins and tokens anonymously. They will remove you of this right by forcing you to submit your identification and KYC your wallet. I reckon everyone should begin to buy Monero and other anonymous coins.

In any case after Tornado Cash, it is Telegram. The CEO of Telegram Pavel Durov has been arrested in France. The case against him is Telegram is being used for criminality. I shake my head, should the manufacturer of the device where Telegram was installed not also be arrested? The dangerous precedent has begun.

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NotATether
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August 29, 2024, 11:58:52 AM
 #64

@logfiles. They might be also conspiring to criminalize the cryptospace users' right to self custody their cryptocoins and tokens anonymously. They will remove you of this right by forcing you to submit your identification and KYC your wallet. I reckon everyone should begin to buy Monero and other anonymous coins.

Buying Monero will help you avoid getting your funds under surveillance, but it is going to be quite harder to buy Monero when they keep picking off the private exchanges one by one under the guise of "countering money laundering".

In any case, you can hardly buy Monero with fiat anywhere anymore, with the exception of a few platforms, so now there's a two-step-process where people buy BTC and then swap it for Monero.

shield132
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August 29, 2024, 12:25:44 PM
 #65

Here is an update.
Tornado Cash developer Alexey Pertsev has been found guilty of laundering $1.2 billion.
It is really idiotic to punish the developer, while the co-founder was declared not guilty.
Well, the problem is that the developers probably didn't have a good lawyer or they're so bad at answering questions during the court proceedings that could've lead to what happened to them, the Jury system is a really biased system so you'll have to expect that this will happen every time, maybe there's also the fact that the co-founder's got some good friends in high places that could've led to this verdict, I mean that's the only that this could've happened. Or they probably have this argument that the developers were the ones that were responsible for making the service and the code that made it so effective and so in a way they did have a heavier contribution to the money laundering but then again, that's a flimsy argument so the possibility is that Pertsev got some bad lawyers or there's more that's not mentioned on this update or in the news.
I don't understand why you need a good lawyer to win the case. If we follow the logic, if you are true and have arguments to prove that, you should win. How can a lawyer who is worth millions of dollars make a person innocent while a lawyer who is worth some thousands - can't? I think that lawyers who are worth millions of dollars, have connections and can make you innocent, as always, money buys everything.

This is idiotic because they blame him on the usage of the people who have used Tornado Cash. This has created a dangerous precedent on anonymous coins, tools and projects in the cryptospace. It also appears that the developer can be charged for the crimes that another person has done. Does this imply that if a terrorist used a Nokia cellphone to detonate bombs, Nokia is also implicit to the crime? A very headshaking argument.
The system is rigged. It's all hell-bent towards criminalizing crypto or anything that respects or encourages user financial privacy and freedom. It's stupid how they use the excuse of anonymous transactions getting used to "finance" terrorism yet the very hypocrites like the US openly finance terrorism under the guise of weapon aid to their allies using tax payers money.

Another lesson to learn is to completely go anonymous when creating tools that anonymize other users or enhance their privacy. It makes no sense if you are to develop a tool that enhances user privacy, yet you are out there in the open known by those Government blood suckers. They will dump all their shame and anger on that one person who created the tool once they land on him/her.
Governments want to control people and these tools that give us freedom, take control away from governments, that's why they label every privacy enhancer tool as a tool that helps terrorism and illegal trading. This is insane, can't governments analyze that they won't be forever in control and they'll be changed by one party or another every 4 years? I don't know why each of them make this decision.

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August 29, 2024, 12:28:14 PM
 #66

I don't understand why you need a good lawyer to win the case. If we follow the logic, if you are true and have arguments to prove that, you should win. How can a lawyer who is worth millions of dollars make a person innocent while a lawyer who is worth some thousands - can't? I think that lawyers who are worth millions of dollars, have connections and can make you innocent, as always, money buys everything.

Because most legal codes are written like a clusterfuck and a million-dollar lawyer would be more motivated to turn through every single page of the law in order to find inconsistencies with the case being fought, while the thousand-dollar lawyer is probably burned out from all the other cases they have to handle and won't put in as much effort.

It's not fair, but it can mean the difference between guilty and innocent, sometimes.

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