Summarizing issues in the bitcoin community and how to address them.

[albert0bsd]

I just checked in a few boards and i don’t see a topic like this, so i am going to start it.

I want to create a list of the current problems of the bitcoin community and open a discussion for possible ways to help to solve it or atleast try it.

Please feel free to correct me if i am wrong or suggest some solutions if don’t mention it, the list of issues is open to new items


List of issues

• The current network congestion caused by the spam/dust transactions of Ordinals.
• …

How to address each of the previous issues

The current network congestion caused by the spam/dust transactions of Ordinals.

If you are a regular user of bitcoin

• Educate yourself how to save try to save every satoshi at the moment of make a transaction
• Choose a good wallet that allow you to setup the fee manually
• stop using legacy addresses, try to start using segwit address or taproot address
• Learn about terms like RBF, Bump fee, CPFP, UXTOs
• You can perform some tests on the TESTNET environment, just to validate your knowledge.
• If a transaction isn’t urgent try to wait for the correct moment to broadcast it and learn how to select a good fee value for it.

If you are a business interested in to accept bitcoin transacctions

• Start accepting payments using the Lightning Network

If you are developer of some exchange or entity that perform bitcoin transactions

• Save every satoshi that you can. (Try to demostrate to your employer that this changes can generate profit for them)
• Implement as soon as possible segwit or taproot wallets
• Try to avoid the use of p2pkh wallets
• Implement an efficient way to select automatically a correct fee for your transaction.
• If your transaction need to be bump for fee, just increment 1 sat/vB, there is no need to double your current amount of fees, your transaction will be included in the next block regardless if you increment the fee in 1 sat/vB or in 100 sat/vB
  

If you are miner

• We know that mining it is a business but the final user experience will dictate the legit demand of bitcoin in the future, nobody is going to like to perform transactions in a network that prioritize dust/spam transactions and have highest fees
  
• Check the possibility of reducing a little the priority to those dust transactions in any case the mempool is full of legit transactions that are also paying fees.
• Check the possibility of reserve some little percentage of space the block to include some stuck transactions, less than 3% or even 1% will be good those transactions can be selected randomly
• Remember that the health of the network depends in a wide way of your actions

I am going to try to make some videos trying to educate to the final users about this topics, also i want to redact some kind of open letter to the miners.

Wha do you think about this, i want to read you.

Regards!

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[Darker45]

Is there only one issue that the Bitcoin community is facing right now? Is the issue about the Ordinals still the hottest issue in the community today?

Anyway, using a native SegWit address should also be an option for a regular Bitcoin user. I also didn't see Lightning. That's a much cheaper and faster alternative, albeit off-chain. Also, checking the mempool before making a transaction helps. Although there are currently a total of more than 600,000 unconfirmed transactions, you can still pay 16 Sats/vB. Furthermore, it is best to choose a wallet that allows you to personalize your fees. You can save a lot with it.

[albert0bsd]

Is there only one issue that the Bitcoin community is facing right now?

No it is not the only issue, that is why I add that the list is open to add more.

,t is best to choose a wallet that allows you to personalize your fees. You can save a lot with it.

Nice options, I think that it was implicit about a good wallet, but if is not clear I am going to edit the list to include them explicitly

[Kakmakr]

I think developers should find side-chain solutions for Ordinals to be used just for that.... it will reduce "dust" on-chain and it can alleviate congestion in the Mempool. 

They developed the "Lightning Network" for faster and cheaper micro transactions, so why can they not develop something just for Ordinals to run on?

They also found better solutions for "On-chain" casinos like SatoshiDice to replace services that congested the Blockchain with "dust" transactions. (find better and more efficient ways to do something) 

[Despairo]

If you are a business interested in to accept bitcoin transacctions

• Start accepting payments using the Lightning Network

If you ask a business to accept lightning network, you must ask a regular user of Bitcoin to use lightning network too because it's pointless if only the seller is accept it when most of customers aren't.

If you are miner

• Check the possibility of reducing a little the priority to those dust transactions in any case the mempool is full of legit transactions that are also paying fees.

I don't think the miner will consider this because they will see on the different perspective.

High fee is good for them while low fee is bad for them regardless it's BRC-20 transaction or Bitcoin transaction.

Network congestion problem isn't about the miner isn't prioritizing the Bitcoin transaction, but the main problem is those people who're transact BRC-20 tokens. If they're educated, they will not care about BRC-20 tokens aka shitcoins.

[retreat]

I think developers should find side-chain solutions for Ordinals to be used just for that.... it will reduce "dust" on-chain and it can alleviate congestion in the Mempool. 

They developed the "Lightning Network" for faster and cheaper micro transactions, so why can they not develop something just for Ordinals to run on?

-snip-

That's right, they have various solutions to problems on the Bitcoin network but they don't seem to really try to solve this congestion problem caused by Ordinal. It's like the Bitcoin devs don't want the Ordinal community to leave the network because their transactions cause fees to go up which will benefit the miners on the network. And maybe this is the reason why until now they haven't solved this Ordinal problem.

[BlackBoss_]

If a wallet has dust attacks and dust UTXOs, you will need to use Freeze an address feature in your wallet.

Dust Attack, what it is, why it is dangerous and how to prevent falling to it

In Electrum wallet, click on that address, right click and choose Freeze.

[Yamane_Keto]

How will these tips help in solving the problem of spam/dust transactions of Ordinals?

It can be said that your advice is good for those who want to reduce fees, but it will not solve the problem of Ordinals.

To reduce fees, I can add tips such as:

• Consolidate your inputs when fees are low.
• Use coin control to reduce the number of entries.
• Use better fee estimation like mempool.space and https://jochen-hoenicke.de/queue/#BTC,24h,weight

If you are miner

• Check the possibility of reserve some little percentage of space the block to include some stuck transactions, less than 3% or even 1% will be good those transactions can be selected randomly
• Remember that the health of the network depends in a wide way of your actions

This is definitely something that no mining pool will do. Trying to refuse to accept transactions or allocate block space to transactions and give priority to them apart from fees is not the correct approach. Dust transactions are valid transactions and can be bypassed by preventing nodes from broadcasting  transactions with less than 5-7 sat/vByte

[albert0bsd]

I think developers should find side-chain solutions for Ordinals to be used just for that.... it will reduce "dust" on-chain and it can alleviate congestion in the Mempool. 

Totally agree with that. Ordinal problems can be solved if they move to anoter chain or simplely shut it down that shit

I don't think the miner will consider this because they will see on the different perspective.

High fee is good for them while low fee is bad for them regardless it's BRC-20 transaction or Bitcoin transaction.

Yes that is why i add "a little" even if they allow 1% of the block for non dust TX, they aren't lose 1% of their profits.. (I want to make a calculation about this)

How will these tips help in solving the problem of spam/dust transactions of Ordinals?

It can be said that your advice is good for those who want to reduce fees, but it will not solve the problem of Ordinals.

From my point of view (that it may be wrong) the main idea of use segwit addresses or Taproot address is that those Transactions need less space on the block, for example so if we can change 100 UXTOs P2PKH by 150 UXTOS P2TR or P2WPKH then i think that "it is something" good.

My bet it is on the long run, a faster adoption of those Address may lead in more transactions included in a single block and yes i know that this don't have anything with the fee sat/vB that people opt to pay in their transacctions, but atleast i think that having more educated people can raise more awareness about how to handle this situtation IMHO

[Doan9269]

The current network congestion caused by the spam/dust transactions of Ordinals.

I don't know if this still exist as a problem or challenge facing the bitcoin community any longer ever since it was addressed and talked about by many, transaction fee is no more a contention for us to make a bitcoin transaction, you have many alternatives to make you avoid any exorbitant hike on transaction fee, whereas ordinals are no more that affecting the network with high transaction fee, you can also customize your fee, or look at the mempool for when it's less congested before making your transactions with lower fee rate.

[Blitzboy]

a gaping hole exists: mass education. How to drill down these dense topics to the average user? They often possess limited technical know-how; a comprehensive, user-friendly knowledge base, universally accessible, solves this.

Secondly, community consensus is invaluable in streamlining transaction priorities. Should developers create a decentralized voting system embedded into the blockchain? Users, miners, and businesses alike could upvote/downvote types of transactions. Decentralized democracy at play. And we'll need incentives to participate in such systems; micro-rewards, perhaps?

You touched upon miner ethics. The power dynamics between miners and users are stark. A decentralized “code of conduct” ratified by the community would hold them accountable. This isnt merely theoretical; its a systemic overhaul that would sustain Bitcoin's core philosophy.

[ABCbits]

I think developers should find side-chain solutions for Ordinals to be used just for that.... it will reduce "dust" on-chain and it can alleviate congestion in the Mempool. 

Such solution already exist even before Ordinal gaining popularity. For starter, take a look at Liquid and RSK. But sidechain is generally unpopular, even among Bitcoin enthusiast.

If you are miner

• Check the possibility of reducing a little the priority to those dust transactions in any case the mempool is full of legit transactions that are also paying fees.

I don't think the miner will consider this because they will see on the different perspective.

ViaBTC actually does that[1] with some limitation. Although it's possible their main goal isn't community service, but rather promote their pool and offer their paid service.

[1] https://www.viabtc.com/tools/txaccelerator/

[Jating]

The current network congestion caused by the spam/dust transactions of Ordinals.

I don't know if this still exist as a problem or challenge facing the bitcoin community any longer ever since it was addressed and talked about by many, transaction fee is no more a contention for us to make a bitcoin transaction, you have many alternatives to make you avoid any exorbitant hike on transaction fee, whereas ordinals are no more that affecting the network with high transaction fee, you can also customize your fee, or look at the mempool for when it's less congested before making your transactions with lower fee rate.

Few months back though, it was a huge issues, the network congestion was due to the BRC20 and Ordinals and it really took bitcoin enthusiast by storm. But lately though, at least at this point is has slow down a bit.

But there is occasional spikes in the network, and just like now, I see that the fastest is around 20 sat/vB which I think it's too expensive for us average Joe and all we can do is wait for the mempool to at least clear in the next hour and see how the fees will be.

[Lucius]

~snip~
But there is occasional spikes in the network, and just like now, I see that the fastest is around 20 sat/vB which I think it's too expensive for us average Joe and all we can do is wait for the mempool to at least clear in the next hour and see how the fees will be.

So you really think $0.65 is too expensive for the average Joe? The one who cannot pay that amount for the transaction has much bigger problems than the current situation with mempool...


As for ordinals and their nonsense, there are several threads discussing this so I really don't see the point in making this another one. Besides, none of those who can do something concrete will lift a finger to change something about how someone feels about blockchain being used in this way.

[albert0bsd]

https://www.viabtc.com/tools/txaccelerator/

Nice to know @ETFbitcoin always good post with you.
I just checked the lastest blocks of that minner and I see that it is true, there are some block with a few ADDED transaction with low fee like 3 or 5 sat/vB.

Regardless that they page advertise some 10000 sat/kB ~10 sat/vB

Paste or enter the TXID you want to accelerate. The volume of a single transaction must be ≤0.5 KB, and the transaction fee rate should be ≥ 0.0001 BTC/KB.

I am going to test it today

So you really think $0.65 is too expensive for the average Joe? The one who cannot pay that amount for the transaction has much bigger problems than the current situation with mempool...

Agree with you, that depends of course of the amount that are you going to move, if you are moving 1 BTC you really don't worry about the fee to pay for it, but if you are going to move only 30K sat those fees may worry you, anyway i recomend to anyone that is moving smalls sats amounts just wait for lower fee to consolidate their uxtos.

there are several threads discussing this so I really don't see the point in making this another one.

The title of the topic said "Summarizing issues..."

none of those who can do something concrete will lift a finger to change something about how someone feels about blockchain being used in this way.

Thay may be true, but one of my sugestion is to educate people:

but atleast i think that having more educated people can raise more awareness about how to handle this situtation IMHO

[dothebeats]

This is actually a very helpful post. Most of the time, there are a bunch of us who lose track of the current events and issues surrounding the Bitcoin community, especially those who are only treating Bitcoin as a side investment, hence having this post we will be able to just go here and update ourselves. Knowing the current issues and possible ways to address them are also a good way for beginners to get themselves familiar with and ready as they learn more about Bitcoin, it also shows them the reality of the Bitcoin community, that it is not perfect and there are some risks to deal with. Hence, I will surely save this post and get back to this as more updates are made, especially when I feel like I am losing track of the things happening in the community. And perhaps I'll add some of my own ways in addressing these issues.

[franky1]

So you really think $0.65 is too expensive for the average Joe? The one who cannot pay that amount for the transaction has much bigger problems than the current situation with mempool...

average joe is not part of the the hundreds of millions of "first worlders" but the multi billion populous of "3rd worlders"

you might want to check minimum wage amounts of the average joe

after all bitcoin was made for the unbanked not the elitists

[Faisal2202]

You have started a good topic here and this is my 3rd or 4th topic related to the issue of ordinals and at current state I am started to bit confused as things are acting normal but the only difference might be one facing is they have to pay more TX fee to increase the priority level so their transaction could not be delayed. Well ordinals are not considered as good for BTC blockchain while they are tagged as spam by stompix and DDmr said miner are trying to manipulate the transaction fee by making small transactions just to fill up the block so that tx makers have to select more higher fee using RBF so that there transaction could get more priority. (Not mentioning the links to there threads but you can find them in my recent replies).

And one more thing, which would help a lot, you can add links to the useful threads which actually are tutorials of how to reduce or pay lesser fee using wallets or any platform. I found this one about the use of electrum to pay lesser fee which is a good one actually I was trying to find another thread but did not found it so instead of that this might work too. i know this is not enough but still as I said it would ve better in my thoughts otherwise it is ignorable.

Ps: you said you did not found any topic related ro this issue and now I think i am reading your reply late while I already read 3 topics on this issue before reading yours.

[ZAINmalik75]

This is actually a very helpful post. Most of the time, there are a bunch of us who lose track of the current events and issues surrounding the Bitcoin community, especially those who are only treating Bitcoin as a side investment, hence having this post we will be able to just go here and update ourselves. Knowing the current issues and possible ways to address them are also a good way for beginners to get themselves familiar with and ready as they learn more about Bitcoin, it also shows them the reality of the Bitcoin community, that it is not perfect and there are some risks to deal with. Hence, I will surely save this post and get back to this as more updates are made, especially when I feel like I am losing track of the things happening in the community. And perhaps I'll add some of my own ways in addressing these issues.

Actually this is not something new instead it was a issue initiated way before when the Ordinals came into being. This is just starting to cause problems again. To be honest I was now aware of the whole story before but after reading some topics related to this issue I also aware of this know and you are right just like you I also cane to know about such issue due to this forum as members here are really active. And they all are sharing insightful ideas too, to solve the problems.

Currently, the only issue to BTC blockchain is due to Ordinals but there are many other issues which BTC needs to solve them.
How are we going to beat the reptilians when monkeys are kicking our ass? You should read this new thread and also read some replies to get better ideas about which issues BTC is facing and which issues need instant solutions.

The solutions which OP had mentioned in his post,  are definitely not enough but that's why he has said I want to read you. As he might not bw a BTC developer neither I am but in my opinion these issues can only be solved by the developers while people like us who are after BTC and are miners too then they might try to manipulate the network with dust transactions. This needs to be stopped otherwise it might create problems for the whole network in future.

[serveria.com]

Guys, it seems to me you're focusing on ordinals too much. This thread is named "Summarizing issues in the bitcoin community and how to address them", OP just mentioned ordinals as an example of a Bitcoin issue. Remember that bad publicity is still publicity so you're in fact promoting the damn thing. Just let it die natural death.