Biden plan would overhaul 151-year-old mining law, make companies pay royalties

[larry_vw_1955]

https://apnews.com/article/biden-mining-law-minerals-pay-royalties-lithium-gold-155556bba3eaa4c0fdb7b37e76150eee

The Biden administration is recommending changes to a 151-year-old law that governs mining for copper, gold and other hardrock minerals on U.S.-owned lands, including making companies for the first time pay royalties on what they extract.

how long until they get the idea to force usa based bitcoin miners to start paying royalties on the bitcoin they "extract"? i'd say not too long.  

here is how you'll know when that happens. there will be a line on your tax return that says "Did you mine any bitcoin in the past year?"

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[zasad@]

I think that an additional tax of 4-8% will not kill the economy, as they write in the articles, and will not force people to buy resources in other countries, although if the United States buys more resources on foreign markets, then prices for Europe will be more expensive. In Russia, the mineral extraction tax has been in force since 2001 and this tax is much higher.

[avikz]

how long until they get the idea to force usa based bitcoin miners to start paying royalties on the bitcoin they "extract"? i'd say not too long.  

I don't see it happening ever! Mining gold and mining bitcoin are two different things. Government can impose taxes on Bitcoin mining but can't impose royalty on it. Also I believe Bitcoin is considered as a digital security in US. Have you ever seen royalty is imposed on security?

But a government can do whatever they want. However, imposing royalty on Bitcoin mining doesn't make sense!

[zasad@]

how long until they get the idea to force usa based bitcoin miners to start paying royalties on the bitcoin they "extract"? i'd say not too long.  

I don't see it happening ever! Mining gold and mining bitcoin are two different things. Government can impose taxes on Bitcoin mining but can't impose royalty on it. Also I believe Bitcoin is considered as a digital security in US. Have you ever seen royalty is imposed on security?

But a government can do whatever they want. However, imposing royalty on Bitcoin mining doesn't make sense!

What is Bitcoin according to US law?
The SEC did not call Bitcoin a security and, according to recent court decisions, Bitcoin is recognized as a commodity.
But it seems to me that I am being deceived. Bitcoin is not money, but why are FATF regulations the same as for money transfers applied to all cryptocurrency transactions over $1,000?
Such standards are not yet everywhere, but this is only for now.
If the government wants to evict miners from the country, it will find a way to raise taxes and come up with other problems.

[philipma1957]

https://apnews.com/article/biden-mining-law-minerals-pay-royalties-lithium-gold-155556bba3eaa4c0fdb7b37e76150eee

The Biden administration is recommending changes to a 151-year-old law that governs mining for copper, gold and other hardrock minerals on U.S.-owned lands, including making companies for the first time pay royalties on what they extract.

how long until they get the idea to force usa based bitcoin miners to start paying royalties on the bitcoin they "extract"? i'd say not too long.  

here is how you'll know when that happens. there will be a line on your tax return that says "Did you mine any bitcoin in the past year?"

They won't be able to tax it in that manner.

But you may be taxed on it in many other ways.

The U.S.A. taxes and taxes and taxes and taxes.  Plus they don't pay the budget off year after year after year.

It is only a matter of time for this to end.

I suspect the idea of turning the left against the right causing great conflict among most people is their master plan to bail on all the debt they made since 2001.

[larry_vw_1955]

They won't be able to tax it in that manner.

they could if biden stays in office long enough. he would do anything if they put it in front of him...

But you may be taxed on it in many other ways. The U.S.A. taxes and taxes and taxes and taxes.  Plus they don't pay the budget off year after year after year.

it's not just the USA it's also the states. i heard california is having a tax on mansions now when they sell. have to pay the state some percent of the sale price. something like 5%. on a 5 million dollar home that's $50,000 of course the argument could be made that $50,000 is very reasonable for someone collecting $5 million on the sale of something.

It is only a matter of time for this to end.

i don't know. i saw the title to some article saying why they will never pay off the deficit and why it's not a good idea to do that. meant to read that article but i never got around to it.  

What is Bitcoin according to US law?
The SEC did not call Bitcoin a security and, according to recent court decisions, Bitcoin is recognized as a commodity.
But it seems to me that I am being deceived. Bitcoin is not money, but why are FATF regulations the same as for money transfers applied to all cryptocurrency transactions over $1,000?

i think you may be confused. they don't want bitcoin to be treated as just one thing they want it to be treated as different things in different situations so they can control people in lots of different ways. still i don't think it's against the law to fly into an airport in the usa with more than $10,000 worth of bitcoin in your little android bitcoin app. but i could be wrong. you might need to declare it to customs or get locked up.

[zasad@]

What is Bitcoin according to US law?
The SEC did not call Bitcoin a security and, according to recent court decisions, Bitcoin is recognized as a commodity.
But it seems to me that I am being deceived. Bitcoin is not money, but why are FATF regulations the same as for money transfers applied to all cryptocurrency transactions over $1,000?

i think you may be confused. they don't want bitcoin to be treated as just one thing they want it to be treated as different things in different situations so they can control people in lots of different ways. still i don't think it's against the law to fly into an airport in the usa with more than $10,000 worth of bitcoin in your little android bitcoin app. but i could be wrong. you might need to declare it to customs or get locked up.

I think that it is difficult to confuse any person with good knowledge, because he will not obey stupid laws and follow idiotic instructions.

One more important moment at the g20 meeting
https://cointelegraph.com/news/g20-moves-forward-international-crypto-framework
"Leaders of the 20 biggest economies in the world — collectively known as G20 — are pushing for a speedy implementation of a cross-border framework for crypto assets.

According to local reports in New Delhi — where the group members are attending a two-day summit — the framework will facilitate information exchange between countries beginning in 2027."

[larry_vw_1955]

According to local reports in New Delhi — where the group members are attending a two-day summit — the framework will facilitate information exchange between countries beginning in 2027."

just what everyone needs. their home country or any country snitching on them to other countries about their crypto activity...before long they'll be asking if you have a bitcoin wallet on your phone or anywhere. and you need to declare it if you're travelling. so they can see how much money you have. then you become a criminal if you lie. a bitcoin fugitive!

[Poker Player]

They won't be able to tax it in that manner.

But you may be taxed on it in many other ways.

The U.S.A. taxes and taxes and taxes and taxes.  Plus they don't pay the budget off year after year after year.

This is the point. Is anyone surprised by this? Politicians have an insatiable voracity for spending, usually those on the left more, but many on the right as well. Just look at the expansion of the global debt by countries.

https://www.usdebtclock.org/world-debt-clock.html

It is only a matter of time for this to end.

Well, I've been hearing this for a long time. Some people have been saying it since 1971 and it's been a long time since then. In the end, it will be a matter of time, but it won't affect me much if it ends in 200 years.

I suspect the idea of turning the left against the right causing great conflict among most people is their master plan to bail on all the debt they made since 2001.

It sounds too conspiranoid to me but I'm not saying you're not right, although for me the most likely scenario is that they will continue printing more and more, with some timid balance sheet reduction and periods of rate hikes like now until they can't take it anymore and we go back to full non stop printing.

Next year is a presidential election in the USA, isn't it? I would bet that they will casually lower rates.

[philipma1957]

They won't be able to tax it in that manner.

But you may be taxed on it in many other ways.

The U.S.A. taxes and taxes and taxes and taxes.  Plus they don't pay the budget off year after year after year.

This is the point. Is anyone surprised by this? Politicians have an insatiable voracity for spending, usually those on the left more, but many on the right as well. Just look at the expansion of the global debt by countries.

https://www.usdebtclock.org/world-debt-clock.html

It is only a matter of time for this to end.

Well, I've been hearing this for a long time. Some people have been saying it since 1971 and it's been a long time since then. In the end, it will be a matter of time, but it won't affect me much if it ends in 200 years.

I suspect the idea of turning the left against the right causing great conflict among most people is their master plan to bail on all the debt they made since 2001.

It sounds too conspiranoid to me but I'm not saying you're not right, although for me the most likely scenario is that they will continue printing more and more, with some timid balance sheet reduction and periods of rate hikes like now until they can't take it anymore and we go back to full non stop printing.

Next year is a presidential election in the USA, isn't it? I would bet that they will casually lower rates.

Yeah rates are going to drop maybe spring 2024. Not next week most likely they pause next week then go up in November.

I have watch a lot of cycles of Fed tighten every one ends with a bust out.  So we have not had the bust out.  So they are not

done.  I do think the mining tax for  coins issue in this thread won't happen. As they will not be able to say the internet is federal property.  If we ever get one world wide government it could happen.

[zasad@]

According to local reports in New Delhi — where the group members are attending a two-day summit — the framework will facilitate information exchange between countries beginning in 2027."

just what everyone needs. their home country or any country snitching on them to other countries about their crypto activity...before long they'll be asking if you have a bitcoin wallet on your phone or anywhere. and you need to declare it if you're travelling. so they can see how much money you have. then you become a criminal if you lie. a bitcoin fugitive!

By then it will probably be very difficult or expensive to travel
What I'm saying is that it's all about interaction procedures, which may not be as effective as it seems at first glance.
But all the bans only make crypto users smarter, and governments will have to spend a lot of money on control.

[philipma1957]

According to local reports in New Delhi — where the group members are attending a two-day summit — the framework will facilitate information exchange between countries beginning in 2027."

just what everyone needs. their home country or any country snitching on them to other countries about their crypto activity...before long they'll be asking if you have a bitcoin wallet on your phone or anywhere. and you need to declare it if you're travelling. so they can see how much money you have. then you become a criminal if you lie. a bitcoin fugitive!

By then it will probably be very difficult or expensive to travel
What I'm saying is that it's all about interaction procedures, which may not be as effective as it seems at first glance.
But all the bans only make crypto users smarter, and governments will have to spend a lot of money on control.

If they want to stop the could. It would be costly and you would need the vast majority of countries to agree to ban it.

Fortunately I doubt that most countries would agree to a ban.

They might agree to a tax setup and if you are in one of the high tax countries you will need to move.

Money wise btc and the other coins are not big enough for this to happen.

[larry_vw_1955]

It sounds too conspiranoid to me but I'm not saying you're not right, although for me the most likely scenario is that they will continue printing more and more, with some timid balance sheet reduction and periods of rate hikes like now until they can't take it anymore and we go back to full non stop printing.

the more they print the more worthless everyone's paper money is and bitcoin might go up in "usd value" but if the usd can't hold its value then it doesn't mean much. people will need to be making $100 per hour at minimum wage to afford their non stop printing. 

Next year is a presidential election in the USA, isn't it? I would bet that they will casually lower rates.

maybe they'll raise the federal minimum wage to something that people could afford to buy an apple with.

[zasad@]

According to local reports in New Delhi — where the group members are attending a two-day summit — the framework will facilitate information exchange between countries beginning in 2027."

just what everyone needs. their home country or any country snitching on them to other countries about their crypto activity...before long they'll be asking if you have a bitcoin wallet on your phone or anywhere. and you need to declare it if you're travelling. so they can see how much money you have. then you become a criminal if you lie. a bitcoin fugitive!

By then it will probably be very difficult or expensive to travel
What I'm saying is that it's all about interaction procedures, which may not be as effective as it seems at first glance.
But all the bans only make crypto users smarter, and governments will have to spend a lot of money on control.

If they want to stop the could. It would be costly and you would need the vast majority of countries to agree to ban it.

Fortunately I doubt that most countries would agree to a ban.

They might agree to a tax setup and if you are in one of the high tax countries you will need to move.

Money wise btc and the other coins are not big enough for this to happen.

No government can ban or stop Bitcoin, and it is not required. All movements of coins are very easy to control and it is not profitable to close such a casino.
The main problem with Bitcoin is that it can no longer be quickly exchanged for cash in many countries. And if you manage to exchange it for cash, then with this money you cannot buy real estate, a car or deposit large sums into bank accounts.

[larry_vw_1955]

The main problem with Bitcoin is that it can no longer be quickly exchanged for cash in many countries. And if you manage to exchange it for cash, then with this money you cannot buy real estate, a car or deposit large sums into bank accounts.

well yeah, if they can cut bitcoin off from making it easy to convert it into fiat then they've pretty much destroyed bitcoin.

[zasad@]

The main problem with Bitcoin is that it can no longer be quickly exchanged for cash in many countries. And if you manage to exchange it for cash, then with this money you cannot buy real estate, a car or deposit large sums into bank accounts.

well yeah, if they can cut bitcoin off from making it easy to convert it into fiat then they've pretty much destroyed bitcoin.

https://www.coinbase.com/blog/a-call-to-action-mobilizing-52-million-crypto-owners-into-an-army-of-1
A Call To Action: Mobilizing 52 Million Crypto Owners Into An Army of One Million Advocates For Change

Bitcoin has already become popular and it is not profitable to fight with it.
You can fight by closing exchanges, but as experience shows, where there is profit, there is a shadow market.
Therefore, states are actively fighting cache and reducing its amount to a minimum.

One example from Russia. The regulator prohibited banks from selling currency. The bank could only sell the dollars and euros it bought from citizens. The shadow market for exchanging rubles for stablecoins immediately grew.

[larry_vw_1955]

Bitcoin has already become popular and it is not profitable to fight with it.
You can fight by closing exchanges, but as experience shows, where there is profit, there is a shadow market.

if exchanges were outlawed then people wouldn't be able to use their bank accounts to buy and sell bitcoin. pretty much tanking the price of it. but i think that's the least of bitcoin's worries because i don't see amazon letting people pay with bitcoin. or ebay or anywhere. seems like it hasn't really become useful form of payment yet. which is probably why regulators haven't paid alot of attention to it. yet. but the more places it is used the more regulations as we all know...

[zasad@]

Bitcoin has already become popular and it is not profitable to fight with it.
You can fight by closing exchanges, but as experience shows, where there is profit, there is a shadow market.

if exchanges were outlawed then people wouldn't be able to use their bank accounts to buy and sell bitcoin. pretty much tanking the price of it. but i think that's the least of bitcoin's worries because i don't see amazon letting people pay with bitcoin. or ebay or anywhere. seems like it hasn't really become useful form of payment yet. which is probably why regulators haven't paid alot of attention to it. yet. but the more places it is used the more regulations as we all know...

larry_vw_1955, what country are you from? It is very interesting to me.
In Russia, drugs, weapons, prostitution, and currency exchange for large sums are prohibited, but all this is available in any small city of 50,000 or more people. Bans don't work in Russia; they're useless. Thanks to global sanctions, Russia is now experiencing an economic boom.

Any ban is a sign of weakness. I talk to Europeans and they themselves say that if their government bans cryptocurrencies, they will go on strike.

Yes, banks can prohibit payments, but most likely they will kill many other businesses at the same time, which will be an even more severe blow to the economy.

[larry_vw_1955]

larry_vw_1955, what country are you from? It is very interesting to me.

I'm in the USA.

In Russia, drugs, weapons, prostitution, and currency exchange for large sums are prohibited, but all this is available in any small city of 50,000 or more people.
Bans don't work in Russia; they're useless. Thanks to global sanctions, Russia is now experiencing an economic boom.

police love busting people for drugs, weapons and prostitution here. they set up sting operations and everything go to elaborate lengths to bust people so they can get a nice news story written about them. meanwhile they don't do anything about public safety and robberies and murders and rapes. because those don't make them any money.

Any ban is a sign of weakness. I talk to Europeans and they themselves say that if their government bans cryptocurrencies, they will go on strike.

no one here is going on any type of strike against the government i can guarantee you that. they're too busy with other things.

Yes, banks can prohibit payments, but most likely they will kill many other businesses at the same time, which will be an even more severe blow to the economy.

i would say that bitcoin is kind of like the stock market to most people here in the usa. they hear it being talked about maybe here and there but don't really think of it doing anything. just something you can buy like a stock. but you can't really use it to do anything...

[zasad@]

larry_vw_1955, what country are you from? It is very interesting to me.

I'm in the USA.

In Russia, drugs, weapons, prostitution, and currency exchange for large sums are prohibited, but all this is available in any small city of 50,000 or more people.
Bans don't work in Russia; they're useless. Thanks to global sanctions, Russia is now experiencing an economic boom.

police love busting people for drugs, weapons and prostitution here. they set up sting operations and everything go to elaborate lengths to bust people so they can get a nice news story written about them. meanwhile they don't do anything about public safety and robberies and murders and rapes. because those don't make them any money.

Any ban is a sign of weakness. I talk to Europeans and they themselves say that if their government bans cryptocurrencies, they will go on strike.

no one here is going on any type of strike against the government i can guarantee you that. they're too busy with other things.

Yes, banks can prohibit payments, but most likely they will kill many other businesses at the same time, which will be an even more severe blow to the economy.

i would say that bitcoin is kind of like the stock market to most people here in the usa. they hear it being talked about maybe here and there but don't really think of it doing anything. just something you can buy like a stock. but you can't really use it to do anything...

I don't think the police need special operations because everyone already knows who sells drugs, where the illegal casinos are, and where the illegal currency exchanges take place.
I want to talk badly about the Russian police. The work of the police has become more transparent, and people come there who want to help people, and not earn money from bribes.
It seems to me that people in the USA are more afraid of tax inspectors than the police. I'm right?