Unusual mnemonic seed and alternative recovery options

[benben2002]

I'm trying to recover a wallet from around 2015 or 2016 for an elderly relative who has some details but can't remember which platform or which wallet she used to create it.

She has the following written down :

- the seed which has only four words (I'm guessing she lost the other ones)
- the email address she used to create it (she says she cleans up her inbox though so there's probably nothing useful in there)
- the email and password she used to register on the platform or wallet
- the account ID with lowercase letters and numbers separated by a hyphen

I tried recovering using the four-word seed in Electrum just in case (the address is a Base58 P2PKH legacy address) but it didn't show up.

Is there any way to recover using the account ID? Is that type of lowercase hyphenated ID a feature of a blockchain.info account? Is my only option to contact blockchain.com here? Or literally just trying Forgot Password on every platform that was around in 2016?

Many thanks in advance !

[BitMaxz]

It seems the details match to blockchain wallet the only problem is the seed backup has 8 missing words. The chances of finding the remaining words is very slim and it would take years or decades to bruteforce this wallet.

Blockchain.info is their old domain have you tried to recover the wallet on blockchain.com?

If not yet check this link below it only requires email.
- https://login.blockchain.com/en/#/recover

[nc50lc]

- the account ID with lowercase letters and numbers separated by a hyphen

Does the "account ID" looks something like this?: 25679c5b-ecbb-4b49-94e3-4b4b572005ce
If so, it's the "wallet ID" and if the separation and number of characters are the same, it's certainly from Blockchain(dot)info.

- the email and password she used to register on the platform or wallet

The context of this part could either be:

• the email and that email's password
• the email and the password used to register to the platform

So which one is it?

With the email and Blockchain account password, she basically has everything she need to login to their website: https://login.blockchain.com/en/#/login?product=wallet
If it's only the email's login credentials, she'll have to go through their 'forgot password' procedure.

- the seed which has only four words (I'm guessing she lost the other ones)

The old version of Blockchain's recovery mnemonic can be recovered here: login.blockchain.com/wallet/forgot-password
If it accepted the old mnemonic, you'll be presented with your wallet ID and password.
But I highly doubt that the 4-words mnemonic will be valid, but it's still worth the try.

[benben2002]

The context of this part could either be:

• the email and that email's password
• the email and the password used to register to the platform

So which one is it?

With the email and Blockchain account password, she basically has everything she need to login to their website: https://login.blockchain.com/en/#/login?product=wallet
If it's only the email's login credentials, she'll have to go through their 'forgot password' procedure.

The second one. Only problem is that when she entered the email address in the login page, she didn't get any verification email, so she probably changed the linked email account in her blockchain.info settings but doesn't remember.

She tried to login with the wallet ID instead of email, which asked for her password, which then gave a "Authorization required, check your email" message. So I'm assuming she also had two factor authentication.

The old version of Blockchain's recovery mnemonic can be recovered here: login.blockchain.com/wallet/forgot-password
If it accepted the old mnemonic, you'll be presented with your wallet ID and password.
But I highly doubt that the 4-words mnemonic will be valid, but it's still worth the try.

Tried but gave checksum invalid. I am not sure if possible to create a wallet.aes.json file with her info and then import here: https://login.blockchain.com/wallet/import-wallet

Or could the two factor authentication be the issue ? I'm guessing asking Blockchain to turn it off is the only solution or ?

[Findingnemo]

The second one. Only problem is that when she entered the email address in the login page, she didn't get any verification email, so she probably changed the linked email account in her blockchain.info settings but doesn't remember.

She tried to login with the wallet ID instead of email, which asked for her password, which then gave a "Authorization required, check your email" message. So I'm assuming she also had two factor authentication.

It's not 2FA authentication, it's authorization required when you log in from a new device.

So in both scenarios, you didn't get the authorization email which means you are using the wrong email for logging in.

or something like this Problem with blockchain.com (I not receive anymore authorization email).

[Drawesome]

The 4-word seed looks strange. Why did she write just four? Did you think of a brain wallet address type? No checksum there, just whatever phrase you put. You can try, but it may be being attacked for brute force mining

[nc50lc]

The old version of Blockchain's recovery mnemonic can be recovered here: login.blockchain.com/wallet/forgot-password
If it accepted the old mnemonic, you'll be presented with your wallet ID and password.
But I highly doubt that the 4-words mnemonic will be valid, but it's still worth the try.

Tried but gave checksum invalid. I am not sure if possible to create a wallet.aes.json file with her info and then import here: https://login.blockchain.com/wallet/import-wallet

That means that the 4-word mnemonic backup is invalid, as expected.

For the "wallet.aes.json" file, you'll have to download it from their server using "download-blockchain-wallet.py" script from btcrecover but it also requires email authorization since they wont just provide something sensitive without verification.
AFAIK, they provide that file to users in the old version after creating a wallet, try to search if she still has a backup/email of it.
You'll also see the contents of the 'wallet.aes.json' file if you put your wallet ID in this URL: https://blockchain.info/wallet/00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000?format=json (replace 0's with your Wallet ID)
But then again, it will only work with accounts without a linked email address or it will show something else if the session (IP & browser) isn't verified yet with your email.

Anyways, they have issues with authorization email most of the time.
Try their support if they can verify that you have the correct email address and it's just their system that cannot send the email.

-snip-
So which one is it?

The second one. Only problem is that when she entered the email address in the login page, she didn't get any verification email, so she probably changed the linked email account in her blockchain.info settings but doesn't remember.

That's still good news, since you have the password.
The '2FA code' only comes after that 'email authorization' if she enabled it.

[Yamane_Keto]

She tried to login with the wallet ID instead of email, which asked for her password, which then gave a "Authorization required, check your email" message. So I'm assuming she also had two factor authentication.

Let her try to create a new account using that email or recover the wallet-ID using it. If a new account is created, this means that it is not the email associated with your account, and if you get a notification with the wallet-ID, then the problem is on their part in sending authorization mails.

There is a suggestion: If she is using a device from 2016 or from a device that she has connected to before, then try to connect through it. People rarely delete cookies, and if cookies are present, they may bypass authorization, although I think the probability of this option being successful is slim.

[crypto-recovery]

>Only problem is that when she entered the email address in the login page, she didn't get any verification email
This is a real problem, and one that we have seen repeatedly with our clients.

One of the potential issues (that Blockchain.com mentions here: https://support.blockchain.com/hc/en-us/articles/4417092364180-I-am-not-receiving-email-notifications-What-do-I-do-) is that email addresses are stored in a case-sensitive format in Blockchain.com's database. So, if you try to login to your Blockchain defi wallet with the email address "abc@example.com" and you initially configured your email address as "Abc@example.com" then you will not receive an authorization email.

It doesn't sound like this is the OP's problem as they also tried to log in with their Wallet ID.

The last ditch solution is to change the email address associated with your wallet. This article covers troubleshooting the problem, as well as how to change your email: https://cryptoassetrecovery.com/posts/not-receiving-blockchain-authorization-emails

[whanau]

> email addresses are stored in a case-sensitive format in Blockchain.com's database. So, if you try to login to your Blockchain defi wallet with the email address "abc@example.com" and you initially configured your email address as "Abc@example.com" then you will not receive an authorization email.

Try entering the email address with caps lock on.
Also try with caps lock on after any a,q,z, in the email address.

I often hit   caps lock+a   at the same time. 

[benben2002]

An update on this. I read around and looks like the four words that were saved aren't mnemonics in the same sense. This was before the new implementation on blockchain.info and they're passphrases related to decrypting wallet id and password.

The four words we have saved aren't in any BIP39 wordlists but I found them on an archived page of blockchain.info in a mnemonic_words.txt file. There is about 60,000 not 2048 words.

So it's not a brain wallet as someone said. I already tried bitaddress.org but it didn't give me my correct wallet. It seems it's a phrase that was given by blockchain.info itself.

It looks like this page used to be used back then to decrypt wallets in such case : https://blockchain.info/DecryptWallet.html. But that redirects to this tool which doesn't even work : https://github.com/blockchain/my-wallet-backup-decryption-tool

It's crazy that I can't restore my wallet when I have the correct wallet id, correct password, correct bitcoin address, and a mnemonic from an outdated system that blockchain.info provided almost 10 years back and which they don't support anymore.

Blockchain.com's support is not very helpful with this. I don't think the current support staff even know what blockchain.info was back in 2015 or that this was before they provided seeds that are like private keys. Support are asking for the registered email address so they can update it on file but we have no idea which email address back then was used and if we still even have access to it.

Is there any other way to recover a wallet using these old blockchain.info mnemonic words?

[Text]

I’ve been there. It's frustrating when the methods you're trying don't seem to work as expected, especially with the complexity involved here. I also tried to recover our separate accounts with my partner on that platform, but no success.

It's quite confusing and feels like there are many twists and turns, then you end up back at the beginning until you can't retrieve what you want to retrieve. I tried several times too, but eventually, I just gave up because, like you mentioned, their support or assistance really can't be relied upon. I just thought maybe the contents are gone and I've transferred everything when I was introduced to other bitcoin wallets.

But I'm not saying you should give up too. Who knows, there might still be hope left in your situation.

[Upgrade00]

Is there any other way to recover a wallet using these old blockchain.info mnemonic words?

Outside blockchain.com there is no way to recover the wallet with the available information. Access to the email used to register the blockchain.info wallet looks to be very necessary for recovery of the account, I believe they used to send encrypted files of the private key at some point.

Best to keep reaching out to their support on all available platforms, that's the best way to recover the wallet at this time.

[LoyceV]

for an elderly relative ~ can't remember which platform or which wallet she used to create it.

Just 4 words without any information, what makes you even think there is a wallet?

Best to keep reaching out to their support on all available platforms

That's terrible advice, it would be considered spamming. How would you feel if someone keeps sending you messages about something you have nothing to do with?

The four words we have saved aren't in any BIP39 wordlists but I found them on an archived page of blockchain.info in a mnemonic_words.txt file. There is about 60,000 not 2048 words.

I doubt it: 60000^4 possibilities is not enough to be secure.

[nc50lc]

This was before the new implementation on blockchain.info and they're passphrases related to decrypting wallet id and password.

Those old mnemonic is still supported by the link I provided in my first reply, recheck my note of what it'll present you if the mnemonic is valid.
If it's a valid old account recovery mnemonic, it should be valid there; but the result is negative. (the page for their new BIP39 mnemonic is different)
Usually Blockchain's old mnemonic is longer than 12 words but I never heard of 4 words.

Blockchain.com's support is not very helpful with this. I don't think the current support staff even know what blockchain.info was back in 2015 or that this was before they provided seeds that are like private keys.

Sounds like them.
Check this thread for reference on how inconsistent their support is: http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5147174.msg63872145#msg63872145
Go back to page3 to see how their customer support missed the whole point of the user's query.

The good news is, with the proper explanation, patience (some reply took weeks) and luck (to get to an actual technical support).
Both users got to change their linked Email address (link to post). (read the thread and see if you can replicate what they did)

[benben2002]

Just 4 words without any information, what makes you even think there is a wallet?

A correct wallet ID, password (that the login page accepts and then shows the 'Email authorization' message) and address that I have checked exists.

Those old mnemonic is still supported by the link I provided in my first reply, recheck my note of what it'll present you if the mnemonic is valid.
If it's a valid old account recovery mnemonic, it should be valid there; but the result is negative. (the page for their new BIP39 mnemonic is different)
Usually Blockchain's old mnemonic is longer than 12 words but I never heard of 4 words.

It's probably that we didn't write down all of the words yeah. Probably would take years to brute force the remaining 6 words out of that 60,000 list.

I'm not sure that page works with the old mnemonic lists though, it returns 'unknown word' for one of my mnemonic words that is certainly in this list: https://web.archive.org/web/20180406224820/https://blockchain.info/Resources/js/mnemonic/mnemonic_words_v3.txt

Sounds like them.
Check this thread for reference on how inconsistent their support is: http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5147174.msg63872145#msg63872145
Go back to page3 to see how their customer support missed the whole point of the user's query.

The good news is, with the proper explanation, patience (some reply took weeks) and luck (to get to an actual technical support).
Both users got to change their linked Email address (link to post). (read the thread and see if you can replicate what they did)

Thanks, I'll take a peek and keep trying.

[alexeyneu]

two strange things together : "she" (hehe) changed linked email(last thing girl will mind to do) and you somehow have four words only.

[nc50lc]

It's probably that we didn't write down all of the words yeah. Probably would take years to brute force the remaining 6 words out of that 60,000 list.

I'm not sure that page works with the old mnemonic lists though, it returns 'unknown word' for one of my mnemonic words that is certainly in this list: https://web.archive.org/web/20180406224820/https://blockchain.info/Resources/js/mnemonic/mnemonic_words_v3.txt

That list is still live, don't have to refer to an archived page.
Here: login.blockchain.com/legacy-pages/js/mnemonic/mnemonic_words_v3.txt
Or here: github.com/blockchain/blockchain-wallet-v4-frontend/blob/development/legacy-pages/js/mnemonic/mnemonic_words_v3.txt
I don't know if that's actually used though since I never saw an account recovery phrase with words: "a", "aa" "aaa" and "aaaa".
Probably used as prototype or something.

But maybe you're referring to a different word list.
See if your words belong here instead: github.com/blockchain/blockchain-wallet-v4-frontend/blob/development/legacy-pages/js/mnemonic/mnemonic.js#L488
(all those words are in that 65,591 words list)

Anyways, since you got the important details and login credentials, just go for the "change email" method like they did in the other thread.
Trying to get to the old mnemonic wont get you anywhere since it'll just show the login info that you already have.