I recently convinced my employer to start paying me in BTC, it has been great

[wd1]

I live in an underdeveloped country, but I work remotely for a fairly good web development agency. We don't have a lot of financial services/wallets here, so we had to go circumvent a lot of obstacles for me the money to get to my local bank account. This whole process took a hefty fee, and time. And the worst part is the currency is absolutely shit and deteriorating (even compared to other fiat currencies),

Recently, I convinced them to start paying me in BTC. I save what I have to save, and convert the rest to fiat via P2P trading. Its so quicker and I get great deals, no more bullshit. I think this has been a great benefit of crypto for underdeveloped nations.

I have been accumulating bitcoin from a long time from my freelance work, but getting paid in it by my regular work feels awesome!

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[un_rank]

The bureaucracy involved in making international transactions complicates the process causing it to take more time and cost more fees for both parties. Good thing you discovered bitcoin and can use that to bypass all the complications while saving on fees. Ensure you protect your privacy by not reusing addresses when receiving bitcoins.

This is where the argument of bitcoin transaction being expensive fails. It is the same irrespective of the location of the parties involved, but fiat transactions is heavily dependent on that.

- Jay -

[wd1]

The bureaucracy involved in making international transactions complicates the process causing it to take more time and cost more fees for both parties. Good thing you discovered bitcoin and can use that to bypass all the complications while saving on fees. Ensure you protect your privacy by not reusing addresses when receiving bitcoins.

This is where the argument of bitcoin transaction being expensive fails. It is the same irrespective of the location of the parties involved, but fiat transactions is heavily dependent on that.

- Jay -

I have a trezor, so I think it does that by default?

Yup, transactions are extremely cheap, and this is one of the myths about BTC people have (especially compared to fiat), I think they are higher when you get into complex stuff like multiple inputs and outputs. But that's way above my use and understanding at the moment.

[un_rank]

I think they are higher when you get into complex stuff like multiple inputs and outputs. But that's way above my use and understanding at the moment.

People use multiple inputs without knowing, you actually need the understanding to not use multiple inputs and save on fees when possible.

Inputs are the amount of unique UTXOs that are used in a new transaction.
- As a freelancer, client A can pay you 0.002BTC for a job, client B pays 0.018BTC for a different job and client C pays 0.01BTC. All these are unique UTXOs in your wallet.
- If you want to send 0.029BTC to a service provider, your wallet has to take all 3 inputs to make it up, which will make the transaction fee higher.

To save on fees, spend whole inputs when possible or spend from a single input and consolidate all inputs when fees are low.

Multiple outputs does not affect the fee as much as inputs does.

- Jay -

[Don Pedro Dinero]

This sounds a bit strange to me.

I live in an underdeveloped country, but I work remotely for a fairly good web development agency. We don't have a lot of financial services/wallets here, so we had to go circumvent a lot of obstacles for me the money to get to my local bank account.

Does he pay you with black money? I find it hard to believe that a bank would have problems with you receiving income from a job, as long as it is legal and declared.

On the other hand, if at the end of the day you have to convert part of the P2P bitcoin to be able to pay in fiat, I don't see much difference to cashing in fiat, spending what you have to spend and buying P2P bitcoin with the rest, apart from the problem with your bank.

[Wind_FURY]

I live in an underdeveloped country, but I work remotely for a fairly good web development agency. We don't have a lot of financial services/wallets here, so we had to go circumvent a lot of obstacles for me the money to get to my local bank account. This whole process took a hefty fee, and time. And the worst part is the currency is absolutely shit and deteriorating (even compared to other fiat currencies),

Recently, I convinced them to start paying me in BTC. I save what I have to save, and convert the rest to fiat via P2P trading. Its so quicker and I get great deals, no more bullshit. I think this has been a great benefit of crypto for underdeveloped nations.

I have been accumulating bitcoin from a long time from my freelance work, but getting paid in it by my regular work feels awesome!

Actually, value remittance through the internet for those people who neither have access to the legacy banking system, nor access to online payments, is one of Bitcoin's greatest use cases. The legacy systems have control over your financial future because they could decide to censor us the plebs, OR decide not their services in some regions. But Bitcoin takes you out of that control. Great job, OP. The next step of your journey is to find people to trade person-to-person from Bitcoin to fiat. Great job!

[Tytanowy Janusz]

Does he pay you with black money? I find it hard to believe that a bank would have problems with you receiving income from a job, as long as it is legal and declared.

it's not that the bank has any problems with the op making money. The point is that banks with low trust do not get along well with others because the banking system operates on trust. So if a large European bank has to send (or receive) a transfer from a small bank in an underdeveloped country with a shitty currency, the fees can be really significant adding to this the currency conversion on a low-liquidity pair.

On the other hand, if at the end of the day you have to convert part of the P2P bitcoin to be able to pay in fiat, I don't see much difference to cashing in fiat, spending what you have to spend and buying P2P bitcoin with the rest, apart from the problem with your bank.

You receive a bitcoin transfer at a cost of $1 and only what you need for food is converted into the local currency by p2P trade at a small cost because you exchange bitcoins for cash outside the banking system (banknotes hand to hand).
I do bealive that such a solution can reduce costs and make life easier, especially if the local currency has high inflation and low liquidity.

[Solosanz]

This is what Bitcoin better than any asset, you don't have to worry because converting Bitcoin to fiat is fast and easy. So whenever you want to buy something, just convert it and at the same time you're still hold the rest of your coins.

Does he pay you with black money? I find it hard to believe that a bank would have problems with you receiving income from a job, as long as it is legal and declared.

But there's no way to know that.

Yep, sending foreign currency using local banks is possible as long as the banks accept it, the matter is only higher fee. Even it's not possible, I think Paypal is more popular in freelancing, but definitely it's better to use Bitcoin when it comes to cross border transaction.

[wd1]

This sounds a bit strange to me.

I live in an underdeveloped country, but I work remotely for a fairly good web development agency. We don't have a lot of financial services/wallets here, so we had to go circumvent a lot of obstacles for me the money to get to my local bank account.

Does he pay you with black money? I find it hard to believe that a bank would have problems with you receiving income from a job, as long as it is legal and declared.

On the other hand, if at the end of the day you have to convert part of the P2P bitcoin to be able to pay in fiat, I don't see much difference to cashing in fiat, spending what you have to spend and buying P2P bitcoin with the rest, apart from the problem with your bank.

Well, maybe its because you have no knowledge about how things work here. First getting a bank account that accepts international payments is very hard here, there are a lot of fees, it takes a lot of time for funds to arrive, banks ask you stupid questions etc. These are just a few major examples. And no its not black money, its completely legal money from an established and registered business. I guess it would even be harder for someone who wants to receive black money This has been my experience, experience of my friends and countless people who do business internationally. Just do some research on some freelance boards on how much of a pain it is to get money in underdeveloped nations and you would find this more sound. It isn't hard to look for.

Now onto your second point, did you read what I posted before imprudently writing your message here? Yes, I am converting to fiat because I have to spend some money of course for living, but the good part is all the bullshit and problems go away. Its so much quicker and cheaper. And I can save the rest in the BTC.

I think they are higher when you get into complex stuff like multiple inputs and outputs. But that's way above my use and understanding at the moment.

People use multiple inputs without knowing, you actually need the understanding to not use multiple inputs and save on fees when possible.

Inputs are the amount of unique UTXOs that are used in a new transaction.
- As a freelancer, client A can pay you 0.002BTC for a job, client B pays 0.018BTC for a different job and client C pays 0.01BTC. All these are unique UTXOs in your wallet.
- If you want to send 0.029BTC to a service provider, your wallet has to take all 3 inputs to make it up, which will make the transaction fee higher.

To save on fees, spend whole inputs when possible or spend from a single input and consolidate all inputs when fees are low.

Multiple outputs does not affect the fee as much as inputs does.

- Jay -

This is pretty informative stuff, thanks! I will look into it more.

I live in an underdeveloped country, but I work remotely for a fairly good web development agency. We don't have a lot of financial services/wallets here, so we had to go circumvent a lot of obstacles for me the money to get to my local bank account. This whole process took a hefty fee, and time. And the worst part is the currency is absolutely shit and deteriorating (even compared to other fiat currencies),

Recently, I convinced them to start paying me in BTC. I save what I have to save, and convert the rest to fiat via P2P trading. Its so quicker and I get great deals, no more bullshit. I think this has been a great benefit of crypto for underdeveloped nations.

I have been accumulating bitcoin from a long time from my freelance work, but getting paid in it by my regular work feels awesome!

Actually, value remittance through the internet for those people who neither have access to the legacy banking system, nor access to online payments, is one of Bitcoin's greatest use cases. The legacy systems have control over your financial future because they could decide to censor us the plebs, OR decide not their services in some regions. But Bitcoin takes you out of that control. Great job, OP. The next step of your journey is to find people to trade person-to-person from Bitcoin to fiat. Great job!

Yup this is absolutely true, the online payment system and banking is so limited here. I think people living in underdeveloped nations like me can start using BTC with palpable use cases already. I am certainly doing it.

[Patrol69]

You claim that your country is an underdeveloped country so we can assume that bitcoin is not legal in your country, if bitcoin is not legal then it will be safe for you to pay salary through bitcoin. Just saying from my opinion about bitcoin legality because as you mentioned your country is underdeveloped and as far as I know underdeveloped countries never accept bitcoin. It is a very good decision if you proceed with caution. Accepting payments through Bitcoin instead of accepting payments in local currency is another level of thinking. If you accept payment through bitcoin, you can hold that bitcoin for a long time if you want, and if you want, you can sell your btc through P2P.  Undoubtedly, you have taken a commendable initiative.

[wd1]

You claim that your country is an underdeveloped country so we can assume that bitcoin is not legal in your country, if bitcoin is not legal then it will be safe for you to pay salary through bitcoin. Just saying from my opinion about bitcoin legality because as you mentioned your country is underdeveloped and as far as I know underdeveloped countries never accept bitcoin. It is a very good decision if you proceed with caution. Accepting payments through Bitcoin instead of accepting payments in local currency is another level of thinking. If you accept payment through bitcoin, you can hold that bitcoin for a long time if you want, and if you want, you can sell your btc through P2P.  Undoubtedly, you have taken a commendable initiative.

Yeah, I don't think its legal. But I am not worried about it at all, people use it all the time, there are ads and as far as I know nobody has ever gotten in trouble for just transacting it in BTC here, exchanges and crypto sites operate here without any hassle.

I think there is some nuance and complexity in what these terms mean all over the world, and it has some implications. But I don't think it affects people like me in any way or creates any apprehensions for me to get in legal trouble.

[dothebeats]

I live in an underdeveloped country, but I work remotely for a fairly good web development agency. We don't have a lot of financial services/wallets here, so we had to go circumvent a lot of obstacles for me the money to get to my local bank account. This whole process took a hefty fee, and time. And the worst part is the currency is absolutely shit and deteriorating (even compared to other fiat currencies),

Recently, I convinced them to start paying me in BTC. I save what I have to save, and convert the rest to fiat via P2P trading. Its so quicker and I get great deals, no more bullshit. I think this has been a great benefit of crypto for underdeveloped nations.

I have been accumulating bitcoin from a long time from my freelance work, but getting paid in it by my regular work feels awesome!

This is pretty smart. You can save some of the BTC that you don't need to spend and convert the rest to fiat as of course, you need it for your daily expenses like food and essentials. I'm glad that there are companies that are taking the initiative to be different and consider what is best for their employees. Also, kudos to you for finding a way around the system so things will at least get easier.

[pooya87]

Recently, I convinced them to start paying me in BTC. I save what I have to save, and convert the rest to fiat via P2P trading. Its so quicker and I get great deals, no more bullshit. I think this has been a great benefit of crypto for underdeveloped nations.

If you are indeed getting "great deals" then this whole thing makes sense but usually in all cases of P2P trading specially when people trade bitcoin to their local fiat currency, they get terrible deals with a huge spread. Meaning the price they sell their bitcoins is far lower than the current price on CEX and a lot lower from what they have to buy bitcoin at in P2P orders.

Yeah, I don't think its legal. But I am not worried about it at all, people use it all the time, there are ads and as far as I know nobody has ever gotten in trouble for just transacting it in BTC here, exchanges and crypto sites operate here without any hassle.

You shouldn't make assumptions about these things specially if you are getting serious about receiving bitcoin as your official salary. I don't know which country we are discussing here but there may actually be some regulations in place, considering how almost all countries have some regulations regarding bitcoin already. So try to consult a legal expert in this matter to avoid future problems.

[Rruchi man]

I live in an underdeveloped country, but I work remotely for a fairly good web development agency. We don't have a lot of financial services/wallets here, so we had to go circumvent a lot of obstacles for me the money to get to my local bank account. This whole process took a hefty fee, and time. And the worst part is the currency is absolutely shit and deteriorating (even compared to other fiat currencies),

In the case of next time, try to include where you from, makes the discussion more direct and reduces the stress of us wondering where you are from.

Recently, I convinced them to start paying me in BTC. I save what I have to save, and convert the rest to fiat via P2P trading. Its so quicker and I get great deals, no more bullshit. I think this has been a great benefit of crypto for underdeveloped nations.

I have been accumulating bitcoin from a long time from my freelance work, but getting paid in it by my regular work feels awesome!

You were successful because your employers know about bitcoins, If they have had no idea, trying to convince them to use a new payment method for just you that they do not know would have been more cumbersome.

[wd1]

Recently, I convinced them to start paying me in BTC. I save what I have to save, and convert the rest to fiat via P2P trading. Its so quicker and I get great deals, no more bullshit. I think this has been a great benefit of crypto for underdeveloped nations.

If you are indeed getting "great deals" then this whole thing makes sense but usually in all cases of P2P trading specially when people trade bitcoin to their local fiat currency, they get terrible deals with a huge spread. Meaning the price they sell their bitcoins is far lower than the current price on CEX and a lot lower from what they have to buy bitcoin at in P2P orders.

Yeah, I don't think its legal. But I am not worried about it at all, people use it all the time, there are ads and as far as I know nobody has ever gotten in trouble for just transacting it in BTC here, exchanges and crypto sites operate here without any hassle.

You shouldn't make assumptions about these things specially if you are getting serious about receiving bitcoin as your official salary. I don't know which country we are discussing here but there may actually be some regulations in place, considering how almost all countries have some regulations regarding bitcoin already. So try to consult a legal expert in this matter to avoid future problems.

Yeah so when I sell any amount of btc, I usually get 1-2% more than the value of that btc in that fiat currency. This is a massive improvement over actually losing hefty money. Do you have any tips where I should look at for P2P? Currently I use Binance, I know we are not fans of centralized exchanges here and justifiably so. But I have been using it specifically for P2P and to be fair it hasn't been bad. Decent search process, escrow and chat are available.

I appreciate your concern, but I really believe I am absolutely safe. Just to add some context, I have been getting BTC ever since I started freelancing, its recently that I convinced my employer for my main job to do so too.

I live in an underdeveloped country, but I work remotely for a fairly good web development agency. We don't have a lot of financial services/wallets here, so we had to go circumvent a lot of obstacles for me the money to get to my local bank account. This whole process took a hefty fee, and time. And the worst part is the currency is absolutely shit and deteriorating (even compared to other fiat currencies),

In the case of next time, try to include where you from, makes the discussion more direct and reduces the stress of us wondering where you are from.

Recently, I convinced them to start paying me in BTC. I save what I have to save, and convert the rest to fiat via P2P trading. Its so quicker and I get great deals, no more bullshit. I think this has been a great benefit of crypto for underdeveloped nations.

I have been accumulating bitcoin from a long time from my freelance work, but getting paid in it by my regular work feels awesome!

You were successful because your employers know about bitcoins, If they have had no idea, trying to convince them to use a new payment method for just you that they do not know would have been more cumbersome.

Not disclosing my country was intentional, I wanted to keep that private. And yes its true that they had some prior knowledge about that, I am in the web dev business, so they were proficient and computers and had knowledge about crypto. Otherwise trying to tout them about it would indeed have been an arduous process.

[pooya87]

Do you have any tips where I should look at for P2P? Currently I use Binance, I know we are not fans of centralized exchanges here and justifiably so. But I have been using it specifically for P2P and to be fair it hasn't been bad. Decent search process, escrow and chat are available.

Binance is a centralized exchange, even what they refer to as "DEX" is not exactly a P2P trade or decentralized. CEXes have their merits too, as long as people are aware of the risks and disadvantages involved in using them.

As for alternative for a true decentralized P2P trading platform, check out Bisq.
https://bisq.network/
https://github.com/bisq-network/bisq

[wd1]

Do you have any tips where I should look at for P2P? Currently I use Binance, I know we are not fans of centralized exchanges here and justifiably so. But I have been using it specifically for P2P and to be fair it hasn't been bad. Decent search process, escrow and chat are available.

Binance is a centralized exchange, even what they refer to as "DEX" is not exactly a P2P trade or decentralized. CEXes have their merits too, as long as people are aware of the risks and disadvantages involved in using them.

As for alternative for a true decentralized P2P trading platform, check out Bisq.
https://bisq.network/
https://github.com/bisq-network/bisq

Pretty cool, so these have no actual KYC process in any capacity, even for P2P trading? Or is it just a veneer?

[bluebit25]

Compared to traditional forms such as bank transfers, using Bitcoin can minimize transaction costs, especially when transferring money between different countries. The message here is that smallscale individual cases see limited financial problems and have solutions through the use of bitcoin. Not only OP, but I think we would all be very happy if our work was paid in BTC, as BTC becomes more and more popular, people see many benefits through using it. We still have to look backwards because this is a personal issue, so we need more time for people to become familiar with the technology and use BTC.

[Xcode7]

Compared to traditional forms such as bank transfers, using Bitcoin can minimize transaction costs, especially when transferring money between different countries. The message here is that smallscale individual cases see limited financial problems and have solutions through the use of bitcoin. Not only OP, but I think we would all be very happy if our work was paid in BTC, as BTC becomes more and more popular, people see many benefits through using it. We still have to look backwards because this is a personal issue, so we need more time for people to become familiar with the technology and use BTC.

This is a little difficult because many countries have not legalized Bitcoin so there is a fear among people to pay wages using Bitcoin. It is true that there are many positive things that can be obtained from this transaction, for example, small transaction fees or recipients can use Bitcoin with the intention and own goals (if indeed he is a Bitcoin user) but again we cannot equate everyone because Bitcoin has not been legalized and not many people agree with this.
However, in countries that accept many purchases using Bitcoin, this might make it easier.

[pooya87]

Pretty cool, so these have no actual KYC process in any capacity, even for P2P trading? Or is it just a veneer?

Bisq is so far the most Decentralized EXchange with no KYC that I know of and every trade is peer to peer with the company providing the servers to connect peers and the option to use escrow.