Solution to account seller? I think

[blckhawk]

Someone should create a trap account that advertises itself as someone who sells forum accounts so we can once and for all mark the account buyers, I don't know if it's a weird solution but if we can also cull the account buyers itself then we can ultimately discourage the selling itself because if the buyers are afraid that they might be dealing with a narc then that would mean that they're going to have second-thoughts about buying an account which in turn lessens the demand which discourages sellers. It's also foolproof too if the one who does the entrapment is smart enough to lead on the buyer to their main account which is the likely thing that's going to happen.

PS. I don't know if this is the appropriate board for this so bear with me, I know how to move the topic so just tell me where.

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[SmartGold01]

You think anyone who wants to buy account will reveal their main account
Knowing too well how bad it's to buy account here, well I won't argue because I don't know how smart they could be but know one thing that the only solution to this is to asked any account that was suspected to change to sign a message with a wallet they have used for at least 2 years and above, whomever that can't do that is assume that the account was bought by so doing it should be tag. Account sale is something that could be too hard to stop because anyone can decide to sell his account for another better jobs after feeling tired of the forum or doesn't want to associate themselves with here.

[Solosanz]

This only raise a new drama.

Remember DT members will leave negative feedback to an account that's not only changed hands, but they will leave negative feedback to the buyer or someone who have interest to buy. Let's say you're want do that and you create a new thread if you catch someone sell his account, you could get tagged too.

What if there's a troll who want to destroy someone else reputation?

Bob: Hey I want to buy Sr member rank, how much it is? can I know the username?
Alice: Yes the rate is $999,999,999, the username is blckhawk.

Imagine you're Bob, you will create a new thread and accuse blckhawk's account is the seller account, what do you think?

[hugeblack]

I think that most of the accounts that are sold either have negative trust, natural trust related to spam, or scam in which you pay the money and will not get an account. it is difficult to say that there is active trade in selling accounts, especially since if the account is good, you can achieve +$160 per month and thus The minimum account price is supposed to be $500+, and the higher price = fewer buyers.

It is not something worth digging deeply into, and the best solution may be to tighten the conditions for joining signature campaigns, bounty campaigns, and obtaining loans.

[Zaguru12]

I don’t think they will stop, you will see some account advertising publicly that they sell bitcoin account. You still see many people buying this accounts even though they know that they will get tag. So if such people can persist in this act then this your idea will not aid any positive result. I also doubt it will lead to exposing their original accounts. This account buyers won’t stop no matter the scheme deployed.

The buying of account doesn’t seems to be prohibited by the forum rules just like it is frowned upon by members because of the scam, so this isn’t a Meta discussion but rather scam board discussion

[Nwada001]

Catch which account buyers? Are they a group of people who are just waiting for the sale? Oh no, they are not. Most people here know about this forum as a means of making money, and those who gave them that information have educated them that if you can get a higher-ranking account, you will start getting paid for that account. Now, the person who was introduced with the mindset that accounts can't be getting started looking for means to get a higher rank account, and this person can't be a group of people; they come to look for accounts to buy based on when they get the information. So we can't catch all of them at once, and more people who are going to buy accounts will also continue coming.
 
If there is even going to be a solution, it should be that there should be a close watch attached to old Bitcointalk accounts that are inactive; that's those accounts created in the years 2014–2018 and 2019. If the users are no longer active, at least a few such accounts should be created, and a close eye should be on them. Based on my observation of the accounts that either got a neutral tag or a red tag for account buying, it always appears that most of those accounts are very old accounts that the owners don't make use of again, which makes them prey for hackers, and they already got the required merit airdropped to them to make them rank.
 
If there can be a close mark on such accounts, seeing anyone with a long post sleeping and waking up, we can always question the credibility of such accounts for the owner to prove ownership. If that can be taken seriously and inside 10 bought accounts we can be sure of catching 5–6 of them, then the rate at which people buy will definitely reduce, but it can't be stopped because not all those buyers are aware of how much the forum is against it.

[Cantsay]

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There have been a few cases where users go undercover and we’re able to uncover accounts that were supposed to be sold, but if you carefully access the whole situation you’ll see that they are so many things that could go wrong.

Take for example, I busted a large account farming and in other for them to get their revenge on me, they decide to come to the forum create an account sales thread and then list my account there or just create the thread waiting for anyone (let’s say the undercover person) to message them and during the course of their discussion my account was showed to the person(the undercover) and eventually he comes to the forum and create a thread against my account for being sold or hacked, how do you think I’ll be able to defend myself?

If anyone wants to go undercover so that they can fish out account that are being sold then they can do it quietly and not make loud noise about it, because if you make it obvious then scammers will just take advantage of it and use it to punish those that have hunted them in the past.

[Lucius]

~snip~

You think no one has tried that? What seems to me is that there are people who have hundreds (if not thousands) of BTT accounts and know that by selling them they can make a very nice profit. Whoever touched that mafia found themselves on their target (including me personally), and fighting them is like fighting cockroaches and bedbugs, they are very resistant and keep coming back again and again.

The only thing we can do is to really work to discourage those who want to buy BTT accounts by tagging sellers, but also buyers who do it publicly. It would be best if the forum clearly prohibits such things and those who offer such services are permanently removed from the forum.

One example of the fight against the Account Mafia

[Majestic-milf]

 It's not an easy something and it's not like they will want to expose themselves because as long as there's anonymity in the forum, those doing this can come with a different username, enter the forum and who knows stumble on this suggestion you gave and may get guarded, don't you think?
Account buying is not accepted and as such those who are doing it won't just leave tracks that are easy to trace. This suggestion you gave is just one out of many that have been given but the stuff still happens right? Let's say the suggestion given by @lucius might help this cause if many take it to heart.
 

[dumbymamby]

I agree with @hugeblack. Most people who buy accounts will only end up being scammed. They are not aware of this even though they have been warned many times.

You can get rid of one seller. But does that guarantee there are no other sellers? It may be the same seller.

[Upgrade00]

Account sales usually happen off the forum. The account seller puts up an ad and asks anyone interested to chat them on telegram or some other platform then they complete the trade there. In this case the user does not reveal their forum account throughout the trade, they just need to send the payment to the seller and wait for confirmation.

What could work is to try to identify accounts which are owned by sellers and tag them. But the farms are so big that even if you tagged a hundred it will not make a significant difference and you cannot be certain the seller owns the account till you pay at which time I believe they send you the proof of ownership (emails and password).

Overall, it's not worth the stress you will go through and you will not get cinclusve results.

[PytagoraZ]

Are you kidding me? If you do that then your account will be tagged. One way to prevent buying and selling accounts is to prohibit it, or legalize it with a high minimum price. Or use KYC so that 1 person only has 1 account. However, this forum is an reedom forum by limiting it, we destroy freedom in this forum, the current system is good and nothing needs to be changed.

[Helena Yu]

legalize it with a high minimum price. Or use KYC so that 1 person only has 1 account. However, this forum is an reedom forum by limiting it, we destroy freedom in this forum, the current system is good and nothing needs to be changed.

This forum isn't controlling the price, either high or not, it's not change a fact someone who bought an account is using cheat to have a high rank account. Having KYC rule in this forum surely will make people to leave this forum.

Remember Bitcointalk is a place to discuss about Bitcoin, not purely as a place to work or making money.

If theymos not agree with merit selling, I don't think he will agree to legalize it.

If a DT member tags you for something stupid involving merit (ie. probably anything less than selling merit), then they're not going to be a DT member for much longer.

[LoyceV]

This only raise a new drama.

Indeed. It has been tried, and lead to drama. Don't go there, it's not worth it.

[Wapfika]

Account selling is not that much an issue nowadays since there’s only fee user selling and most of them has a record of scamming so no one trusted them already. Also there’s no trusted escrow that accept this kind of deal anymore so dealing with account sellers is always discourage.

The merit system make account seller impossible nowadays while most of the campaigns has a tough competition for participants so buying someone account is already useless because you will need to start from scratch. It’s better to create account and rank up naturally by posting constructive post for a better chance on campaign acceptance. Account selling is not a major issue anymore.

[JeromeTash]

Account sales can never stop, and I don't think it's worth the trouble. If people can sell accounts on strict platforms where it's prohibited and need even KYC then how about Bitcointalk where multiple accounts are allowed?
Remember, selling of Bitcointalk accounts doesn't only happen in the forum, but there are other third party sites where adverts are made as well. How are you going to track and stop all that?

Lastly, the account sellers won't just reveal the details of the account until they receive some money from you.

[Don Pedro Dinero]

Account selling is not that much an issue nowadays since there’s only fee user selling and most of them has a record of scamming so no one trusted them already. Also there’s no trusted escrow that accept this kind of deal anymore so dealing with account sellers is always discourage.

The merit system make account seller impossible nowadays while most of the campaigns has a tough competition for participants so buying someone account is already useless because you will need to start from scratch. It’s better to create account and rank up naturally by posting constructive post for a better chance on campaign acceptance. Account selling is not a major issue anymore.

I agree with this, nowadays campaigns ask you for a minimum of merits in the last 120, or at least tell you that you have to be active, things like that. So even if you buy the account, you won't be able to monetise it from day one, although it will probably cost you less time. Monetizing an account that you create from 0 is going to cost you at least 9 months, while a purchased account can start to be amortized in a month. That is if the person who sells it to you doesn't scam you or if some DTs don't realise that it's a purchased account and red tag you, so for me it's not worth it either (apart from the fact that it's ethically incorrect).

[Coyster]

Other than the fact that this has been tried before and didn't work out, who is going to set up the trap accounts? Moderators, admin or just any user? It is definitely going to cause more harm than good and i'm pretty sure one should have better things doing with their time than controlling "trap accounts" to catch account sellers/buyers.

It is quite difficult to hide forever from a bought account, some are even caught within the first few weeks after buying the account, i think this alone is a deterrent, because you risk spending a lot of money only to see the account tagged a few weeks later. I know that despite this, users still buy accounts, but only a few can manage to stay completely out of the radar and not be caught either due to change in posting style/pattern, language improvement or downgrade, etc

[PytagoraZ]

legalize it with a high minimum price. Or use KYC so that 1 person only has 1 account. However, this forum is an reedom forum by limiting it, we destroy freedom in this forum, the current system is good and nothing needs to be changed.

This forum isn't controlling the price, either high or not, it's not change a fact you're using cheat to have a high rank account. Having KYC rule in this forum surely will make people to leave this forum.

Remember Bitcointalk is a place to discuss about Bitcoin, not purely as a place to work or making money.

If theymos not agree with merit selling, I don't think he will agree to legalize it.

If a DT member tags you for something stupid involving merit (ie. probably anything less than selling merit), then they're not going to be a DT member for much longer.

Yes, I know that the forum does not facilitate or controlling buying and selling accounts. btw, what do you mean by saying I used a cheat?

Theymos will not agree with the legalization of buying and selling accounts but it also cannot prohibit buying and selling accounts. So I don't think there is a better solution. Currently DT is working hard to identify buying and selling accounts, so I think the existing system is good. Let the forum take care of all this

[Lucius]

~snip~
 Currently DT is working hard to identify buying and selling accounts, so I think the existing system is good. Let the forum take care of all this

Do you know what DT is and which DT members are "working hard" on that problem? It used to be possible to buy and sell BTT accounts without any sanctions, then people started getting red tags only if they asked if it was possible to buy a BTT account, and today there are members who sell BTT accounts for months without having a single red tag from DT1 members. I would conclude that the majority simply do not care and do not want to spend their time on such things.