Isn't Fiat the Real Ponzi

[Baghdad]

I've seen many blog posts describing bitcoin as a ponzi scheme, but looking at the current inflation of fiat it now looks like a Ponzi. Don't know who is the beneficiary in this kind of fiat Ponzi. The earlier generation had enough to buy with few amounts that can't buy anything reasonable today. I also saw Elon in a tweet saying or calling fiat a Ponzi scheme. People suffer to get fiat and lose it on high food prices and products. In a Ponzi, everyone end up losing money, same with fiat. A good number of people around me complain of not being able to purchase product with a fair sum of money they feel is big.

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[Charles-Tim]

Without a local currency, you can not be able to run a business in a country. But you can not run a business with a ponzi scheme as it will later collapse.

Fiat is backed by the government. Ponzi scheme is not back by anything but it may remain hidden until it collapses.

You can do a business with fiat but fiat become like a scam if you hold it. Why would you hold fiat when their are assets that you can go for.

You know everything about fiat and that makes it not a scam.

[EL MOHA]

In as much as I don’t like the things surrounding the use of fiat currency, it is never a Ponzi scheme because Ponzi scheme is something you invest in with high hopes of getting lots of profits off it, but at the end nothing to show for it. The thing is fiat is a currency to be use for transactions and not to be hodl on to as an investment asset because of deflationary effects of it. Treat it as a currency that it’s suited for and look for better asset to use as investment tool and you wouldn’t address fiat as a Ponzi scheme

[albert0bsd]

It is a legal ponzi   

All the bankers are the top of the piramire and all outside of it are paying with inflation.

[Upgrade00]

Inflation does not make something a Ponzi scheme. Bitcoin is wrongly labeled a Ponzi or a pyramid scheme a lot of the times, I will not want to throw the same assertions at fiat when that is inaccurate.

Fiat is a system that was created to solve the problem of exchanging value but has progressively gotten worse over the past 50 or so years. The system is greatly broken now and is just being held together by government backing.

[benalexis12]

I've seen many blog posts describing bitcoin as a ponzi scheme, but looking at the current inflation of fiat it now looks like a Ponzi. Don't know who is the beneficiary in this kind of fiat Ponzi. The earlier generation had enough to buy with few amounts that can't buy anything reasonable today. I also saw Elon in a tweet saying or calling fiat a Ponzi scheme. People suffer to get fiat and lose it on high food prices and products. In a Ponzi, everyone end up losing money, same with fiat. A good number of people around me complain of not being able to purchase product with a fair sum of money they feel is big.

The Ponzi scheme is just a tool to use in Fiat. The same goes with Bitcoin or crypto. And the people who use the Ponzi scheme are the people who have bad intentions to cheat and get a large amount of money from the investors who will be victimized. There is no Ponzi scheme that only takes a small amount from investors.

And another thing is that the inflation rate also has nothing to do with the Ponzi scheme, because inflation is always there and always faced by all countries around the world. The Ponzi scheme will appear suddenly when a scammer is ready to prey on investors.

[Bananington]

In a Ponzi, everyone end up losing money, same with fiat. A good number of people around me complain of not being able to purchase product with a fair sum of money they feel is big.

The system is rigged to favor people who have positioned themselves properly to be the people that majority of other people at the bottom of the pyramid lose money to. Anyone who the system is currently not favoring should try to change the position they occupying in the pyramid to a better one so that they are not at the bottom of the chain and do not get to fell the effect of the economy the most.

[serjent05]

I've seen many blog posts describing bitcoin as a ponzi scheme, but looking at the current inflation of fiat it now looks like a Ponzi. Don't know who is the beneficiary in this kind of fiat Ponzi. The earlier generation had enough to buy with few amounts that can't buy anything reasonable today. I also saw Elon in a tweet saying or calling fiat a Ponzi scheme. People suffer to get fiat and lose it on high food prices and products. In a Ponzi, everyone end up losing money, same with fiat. A good number of people around me complain of not being able to purchase product with a fair sum of money they feel is big.

First I believe we must know what ponzi scheme is and it said:

A Ponzi scheme is an investment fraud that pays existing investors with funds collected from new investors. Ponzi scheme organizers often promise to invest your money and generate high returns with little or no risk. But in many Ponzi schemes, the fraudsters do not invest the money.

source: https://www.investor.gov/protect-your-investments/fraud/types-fraud/ponzi-scheme#

According to the article the following list are the signs that the investment is more likely a Ponzi scheme:

1. High returns with little or no risk
2. Overly consistent returns
3. Unregistered investments
4. Unlicensed sellers
5. Secretive, complex strategies
6. Issues with paperwork
7. Difficulty receiving payments



So from the definition, fiat is far from being a Ponzi scheme, Bitcoin is more likely nearer to the explanation but we all know that Bitcoin is not a Ponzi scheme.  The reason for this is that Bitcoin is in the open market free from any centralized authority that can control the trend of the Bitcoin price.

[coupable]

I've seen many blog posts describing bitcoin as a ponzi scheme, but looking at the current inflation of fiat it now looks like a Ponzi. Don't know who is the beneficiary in this kind of fiat Ponzi. The earlier generation had enough to buy with few amounts that can't buy anything reasonable today. I also saw Elon in a tweet saying or calling fiat a Ponzi scheme. People suffer to get fiat and lose it on high food prices and products. In a Ponzi, everyone end up losing money, same with fiat. A good number of people around me complain of not being able to purchase product with a fair sum of money they feel is big.

It cannot be said that it is Ponzi because it was a revolutionary idea when it was created. Today the facts has changed and the solutions of the past are no longer valid for nowadays problems/needs. Fiat money could be used safely in the days of feudalism until the beginning of the victory of capitalism, but it is no longer valid today. this is what i think.
Today we need to re-establish a new financial system that responds to the requirements of the times. Fiat money has been making successive failures since the late 18th century, and in fact we need to reconsider the entire global financial system, not just fiat money.
In this context, various experiments appear, including Bitcoin.

[komisariatku]

I've seen many blog posts describing bitcoin as a ponzi scheme, but looking at the current inflation of fiat it now looks like a Ponzi. Don't know who is the beneficiary in this kind of fiat Ponzi. The earlier generation had enough to buy with few amounts that can't buy anything reasonable today. I also saw Elon in a tweet saying or calling fiat a Ponzi scheme. People suffer to get fiat and lose it on high food prices and products. In a Ponzi, everyone end up losing money, same with fiat. A good number of people around me complain of not being able to purchase product with a fair sum of money they feel is big.

In my opinion, the fiat money system is not a Ponzi scheme. I think if you have different views or don't agree with the fiat money system, that's fine but it's too much to think that fiat money is a Ponzi scheme. However fiat money has a big role in human life and trade, if there was no fiat money then maybe we would still use gold and silver to trade and that is quite difficult to do, especially if we buy goods in large quantities then we need to carry a lot of gold , and it will be more troublesome than putting fiat money in the wallet

[Ben Barubal]

   Some people will believe what you say, and some will not. That means a long, debatable matter. Maybe Fiat really has similarities with Ponzi in other things, but in reality, it's not really. And we also know that Fiat is made through the central bank, where it can lead to inflation.

  Ponzi is not that much like Fiat. In addition to this, Ponzi is not used by people to pay for the products or items they want to get; instead, fiat is used in situations like this. So if there are people who believe that Ponzi is also Fiat, it still remains an opinion or speculation.

[hatshepsut93]

I also saw Elon in a tweet saying or calling fiat a Ponzi scheme. People suffer to get fiat and lose it on high food prices and products. In a Ponzi, everyone end up losing money, same with fiat. A good number of people around me complain of not being able to purchase product with a fair sum of money they feel is big.

Elon Musk brainfarts a lot of stupid things. Fiat currency system has no characteristics of a Ponzi scheme. Early holders of fiat don't benefit from being early, in fact they lost the most. Someone who decided to put $1M into cash 50 years ago is a lot more today than if they put it into real estate or gold or nearly any other asset.

The previous generations didn't benefit from fiat, they benefited from technological progress, post-WW2 rebuilding, urbanization and other things. Nowadays the living space is becoming more saturated, maybe even hitting its limits, and the previous economic growth rates of the boom period can't be repeated.

[Dr.Bitcoin_Strange]

Fiat is not Ponzi; Ponzi is something that cannot work for a long time; it's something that doesn't last longer than the pioneers have speculated. Fiat was never like this in the past; the devaluation of Fiat was not as crazy as it is now, and the volume of printed money was not like it is then. So, because of the situation with Fiat now, we cannot still call it Ponzi. We are living in a world where you can exercise your freedom of choice. If you love Bitcoin, acquire it; if you love Fiat, acquire and save; if you like both, keep it, so long as it doesn't cause problems for you. That's what I think.

Some countries don't allow the free use and adoption of Bitcoin, and if you find yourself in such a country but you want to invest in Bitcoin and you have means of doing so, as long as it won't cause you trouble, then go ahead. Some people also see Bitcoin as a Ponzi, but that doesn't mean that's what it is.

[philipma1957]

I've seen many blog posts describing bitcoin as a ponzi scheme, but looking at the current inflation of fiat it now looks like a Ponzi. Don't know who is the beneficiary in this kind of fiat Ponzi. The earlier generation had enough to buy with few amounts that can't buy anything reasonable today. I also saw Elon in a tweet saying or calling fiat a Ponzi scheme. People suffer to get fiat and lose it on high food prices and products. In a Ponzi, everyone end up losing money, same with fiat. A good number of people around me complain of not being able to purchase product with a fair sum of money they feel is big.

Be definition it is not and can not be a ponzi.  But in reality if a country gets in a hyperinflation cycle it looks like fiat was a ponzi for that country.

I think of fiat as fuel for the military industrial complex.

I am 66 and I can remember 30 plus wars since I was a kid.

Nicholas Cage’s movie “the lords of war” shows the relationship of fiat and weapons.

[tbct_mt2]

I've seen many blog posts describing bitcoin as a ponzi scheme, but looking at the current inflation of fiat it now looks like a Ponzi. Don't know who is the beneficiary in this kind of fiat Ponzi. The earlier generation had enough to buy with few amounts that can't buy anything reasonable today. I also saw Elon in a tweet saying or calling fiat a Ponzi scheme. People suffer to get fiat and lose it on high food prices and products. In a Ponzi, everyone end up losing money, same with fiat. A good number of people around me complain of not being able to purchase product with a fair sum of money they feel is big.

Is Bitcoin a Ponzi scheme?

It is not if you read the definition of Ponzi.

Ponzi scheme (wikimedia)

A Ponzi scheme (/ˈpɒnzi/, Italian: [ˈpontsi]) is a form of fraud that lures investors and pays profits to earlier investors with funds from more recent investors.

To do this, Ponzi operators have make promises to their potential victims that by investing money into their scheme, investors will get profit that usually is high enough to be attractive. To get money paying for first investors, it is easy but any Ponzi scheme has to rely on flow of money, inflow and outflow. If inflow is bigger than outflow, newcomers keep coming and spending money, the scheme will continue to work smoothly and operators can pay for late comers.

Unfortunately, all Ponzi schemes will end with inflow break by that outflow will become bigger than inflow and the scheme will come to a point of collapse. The whole Ponzi system will collapse quickly at that time.

There is no promised from anyone that you will get 10%, 20%, 50% APY with BTC, nobody pay you in any scheme so Bitcoin basically is not a Ponzi scheme but you must aware that some scammers will create their Ponzi schemes and add Bitcoin as one of their used assets for scam.

[Despairo]

Fiat isn't ponzi, unless there's someone is offering send $5 and get $10 after a day, is there any banks or government use that kind promotion? nope.

But fiat is scam because the banks and government are convincing people to use save their money in banks where the inflation rate is higher than the interest rate. Theoretically if you save your money in banks, you're not make your safe (due to centralization) and you're not earn more money (inflation > interest).

[YUriy1991]

I've seen many blog posts describing bitcoin as a ponzi scheme, but looking at the current inflation of fiat it now looks like a Ponzi. Don't know who is the beneficiary in this kind of fiat Ponzi. The earlier generation had enough to buy with few amounts that can't buy anything reasonable today. I also saw Elon in a tweet saying or calling fiat a Ponzi scheme. People suffer to get fiat and lose it on high food prices and products. In a Ponzi, everyone end up losing money, same with fiat. A good number of people around me complain of not being able to purchase product with a fair sum of money they feel is big.

Everything is an individual perspective and what Elon said is a criticism of inflation or the conventional financial system where the value of fiat also fluctuates due to inflation. Inflation itself is an economic phenomenon that is different from a Ponzi scheme, especially now and this looks like a Ponzi scheme.

So, what must be noted for BTC is that there is no element of fraud. If the Bitcoin exchange rate fluctuates wildly, that is normal cause it is traded on the open market, and its price is influenced by supply and demand.

[adaseb]

Fiat is a scam but it’s not considered a ponzi. Ponzi is what Madoff did and it’s where he took the money from his newest investors to pay off the oldest investors which were cashing out.

The fact that he got away with this for years is what’s crazy. You would think some accountant would find something off sooner than later.

Eventually when too many people tried to withdraw at once it’s when the ponzi crumbled and he was exposed.

[Fiatless]

I've seen many blog posts describing bitcoin as a ponzi scheme, but looking at the current inflation of fiat it now looks like a Ponzi. Don't know who is the beneficiary in this kind of fiat Ponzi. The earlier generation had enough to buy with few amounts that can't buy anything reasonable today. I also saw Elon in a tweet saying or calling fiat a Ponzi scheme. People suffer to get fiat and lose it on high food prices and products. In a Ponzi, everyone end up losing money, same with fiat. A good number of people around me complain of not being able to purchase product with a fair sum of money they feel is big.

The blogs that call bitcoin a ponzi scheme simply don't know the difference between bitcoin and altcoins. It is common to see different altcoins been presented to the public as a scheme to that brings instant and high returns on investment.

A Ponzi scheme is an investment that is built to deceive investors. My country's fiat currency could be said to be a legalized Ponzi scheme because politicians will always make promises of how they will make the currency stronger and more valuable. One politician in my country promised to make our local currency to be equal to the USD. Many people believed him and kept their investments in the local currency. Today the currency has lost almost half of its value and the money is gradually becoming worthless.

[pinggoki]

Fiat is a scam but it’s not considered a ponzi. Ponzi is what Madoff did and it’s where he took the money from his newest investors to pay off the oldest investors which were cashing out.

I guess when you really hate the financial system, you just have to plaster in that it's a Ponzi scheme without a care about the very definition of that so you can generate reactions from other who don't like to think too much and just sympathize that fiat is bad and central banks are just an evil organization (which I agree they are but that's not the point). Maybe next time, try to direct the hate in a way that it's informative and not just a senseless rant about why the government and the current is oppressing the people, no one listens to the crazy homeless guy, make your statements presentable OP.

The fact that he got away with this for years is what’s crazy. You would think some accountant would find something off sooner than later.

Eventually when too many people tried to withdraw at once it’s when the ponzi crumbled and he was exposed.

I don't have all the info on this and it's just a conjecture but I believe the reason why Madoff has got away from the sniffing of forensic accountants is probably the fact that he's a reputable and influential investor in the Wallstreet and if there's someone snooping then he can just use his connections to stop the snooping or even discredit the investigations but it seems these didn't last long, after all that investment scheme like any Ponzi out there, is a house of cards.