High transaction fees affects those who DCA

[Distinctin]

Certainly yes. That means the amount of bitcoin to be DCA will be lessen because of the expensive transaction fees, and opportunities will be minimized. But we all know that this won't take forever as the market will recover again and transaction fees will be back to normal. However, if you are determined to maintain the amount of bitcoin through DCA, then that's the time that you should pay the price, otherwise you will lost the opportunity to save and store bitcoin for long term.

[1714667417]

1714667417

[mv1986]

~

It is tough to come up with a solution for people who want to stick to their DCA plans and aren't transacting thousands of dollars. I know that holding anything on exchange is a bad idea. But if someone has a weekly DCA plan and a reliable exchange, perhaps a temporary solution could be to only withdraw every four weeks. It all depends on a decent assessment of the risk factors, like amount of money involved and reputation of the exchange (as far as it is possible to judge that - kind regards from FTX).

But bottom line is that DCA for people who want to control their PKs and do it properly is cumbersome during times of high transaction fees.

For someone who have thousands of dollars for them to DCA then this kind of transactions wont really be that hurting so much yet it would really be just that peanuts if we do speak about transaction fees.
Just like on what people been saying above is that into those people who do only have few money or just not that too much funds will really be having a hard time on making DCA when Bitcoin drops
or if they do really see up such opportunity. Those people who do have tons of money would really be always having the advantage and feel sorry for those who do have less.

Well, there's nothing we can do about on the network condition on which you wouldnt really be having no choice but to deal up with this.We
cant really be having that high fees forever on which it would really be that coming into that time that everything would normalized.
[/quote]

Alternatives to continuing DCA while giving up on self-custody obviously bring in some other risks, but if someone doesn't have a lot of money available, but is fully determined to pursue the DCA investment plan, I guess the best decision would be to do that on a reputable exchange and take the Bitcoin out in reasonable intervals to save on fees. It is far from perfect, but it can make sense from an opportunity cost perspective. But I would definitely pick an exchange that has existed for a long time and is so far not known for shenanigans that could threaten its continued operations. You can never know, but there is also not much else you can do.

[Abiky]

It does hit really hard for people who like DCA and do not keep their money in centralized exchange, in fact because this F*cking ordinal is really hard for everyone except the miner who get 3-6 Btc in a single block.

Merchant or a freelancer like will be also hit by the high fee because they should consider the fee and must to add to their service for a freelancer and merchant might see less people using bitcoin if this not allowing down

Indeed. These high fees will force most people to keep their coins in a centralized exchange. This is bad for Bitcoin, but good for mainstream governments. Maybe this is part of an agenda to prevent self-custody of BTC in the long run? With high fees, it's impossible to use Bitcoin as digital cash. It would only work as a store of value for large money transfers. Most likely, the wealthy (elite) and whales will be able to move their BTC on the Blockchain without issues. Average people will be forced to move to altcoins with lower network congestion.

Even without Ordinals, fees were going to increase if BTC went into the mainstream. It's developers' duty to improve transaction capacity by increasing the block size. The Lightning Network is not a definite solution for Bitcoin's scaling issues. Whatever happens in the future, rest assured BTC won't disappear that easily. As long as decentralization is preserved, nothing else matters.

[Jaycoinz]

The current Bitcoin fees wouldn't have mattered to me because I am not selling, but the fees do matter because I DCA, and I don't want to leave my coins in the centralized exchange. This month, I have spent roughly $5 to $10 in transaction fees when I DCA every week. It may seem small, but in my country, it's enough to cover my feeding expenses for a month cumulatively.

I discussed this issue with my friend, and he suggested I use an exchange that utilizes the Lightning Network. According to him, this would help me get off with no fees any day. While I'm considering this alternative, another option is to wait for a month or two, then use the amount we kept for weekly DCA, hold it for a month or two, and lump sum. This way, i would incur just a one time fee. What are your thoughts on this? I feel like I may use the money kept for DCA for other expenses.

That's true, because I also faced this fee challenge now and it got worse few weeks back when the fee was crazy high, I normally buy Bitcoin through binance P2P trade and although it's a small amount but I really don't care so long the process is a continual one but the problem now is not buying but actually when you want to move the coins to a non-custodial wallet like electrum for safe keeping because with all the incident I have read and happening that have occured, I can deduce that keeping your coins in an exchange is not an good idea at all but the issue is how can you move coins out when the fees are fucking crazy.

[Winterfrost]

It does hit really hard for people who like DCA and do not keep their money in centralized exchange, in fact because this F*cking ordinal is really hard for everyone except the miner who get 3-6 Btc in a single block.

Merchant or a freelancer like will be also hit by the high fee because they should consider the fee and must to add to their service for a freelancer and merchant might see less people using bitcoin if this not allowing down

Indeed. These high fees will force most people to keep their coins in a centralized exchange. This is bad for Bitcoin, but good for mainstream governments. Maybe this is part of an agenda to prevent self-custody of BTC in the long run? With high fees, it's impossible to use Bitcoin as digital cash. It would only work as a store of value for large money transfers. Most likely, the wealthy (elite) and whales will be able to move their BTC on the Blockchain without issues. Average people will be forced to move to altcoins with lower network congestion.

Even without Ordinals, fees were going to increase if BTC went into the mainstream. It's developers' duty to improve transaction capacity by increasing the block size. The Lightning Network is not a definite solution for Bitcoin's scaling issues. Whatever happens in the future, rest assured BTC won't disappear that easily. As long as decentralization is preserved, nothing else matters.

Well spoken Abiky. It seems you have done a comprehensive underground study of what is happening with the problem of high transaction fees these days. If this is true that the plan is to prevent people using bitcoin as a means of payment then they are going contrary to the whitepaper and the vision of Satoshi. The only way bitcoin can be considered as a hedge against inflation is when it is being used as a means of payment. Not everyone wants to hold bitcoin or be a bitcoin investor and not everyone wants to trade it or store their value in it. Its a matter of choice.

If this high transactions fees persist a lot of persons will migrate to other cryptocurrency which will leave bitcoin to less adoption.

[Abiky]

That's true, because I also faced this fee challenge now and it got worse few weeks back when the fee was crazy high, I normally buy Bitcoin through binance P2P trade and although it's a small amount but I really don't care so long the process is a continual one but the problem now is not buying but actually when you want to move the coins to a non-custodial wallet like electrum for safe keeping because with all the incident I have read and happening that have occured, I can deduce that keeping your coins in an exchange is not an good idea at all but the issue is how can you move coins out when the fees are fucking crazy.

You can only do DCA at a centralized exchange. For non-custodial transactions, you're going to have to wait quite a long time until the dust settles. Things are going to get worse once the BTC halving takes effect in April 2024. That's because there will be FOMO, adding greater congestion to the Blockchain.

Some say we should move to the Lightning Network for cheaper and faster transfers. But you'd still need to pay a high on-chain fee to open/close a channel on the LN. Therefore, average Bitcoin users are completely "deadlocked". No one can predict the future, so lets hope for the best.

[benalexis12]

The current Bitcoin fees wouldn't have mattered to me because I am not selling, but the fees do matter because I DCA, and I don't want to leave my coins in the centralized exchange. This month, I have spent roughly $5 to $10 in transaction fees when I DCA every week. It may seem small, but in my country, it's enough to cover my feeding expenses for a month cumulatively.

I discussed this issue with my friend, and he suggested I use an exchange that utilizes the Lightning Network. According to him, this would help me get off with no fees any day. While I'm considering this alternative, another option is to wait for a month or two, then use the amount we kept for weekly DCA, hold it for a month or two, and lump sum. This way, i would incur just a one time fee. What are your thoughts on this? I feel like I may use the money kept for DCA for other expenses.

Can you tell which Cex and Dex platforms you are talking about where you can buy 5$ crypto on their trading platform? because it just makes me think and wonder because all I know is that the minimum amount of money you can buy is only around 10 dollars, as the community says here.

And apart from what you say, if you are a long-term holder, I also think that you will not be affected by the high fees that miners take from those who conduct transactions on the Bitcoin network. But if you are doing DCA, it is for sure or very likely that you will be affected by the fees that are taken from bitcoin holders, in fact.

[Jating]

That's true, because I also faced this fee challenge now and it got worse few weeks back when the fee was crazy high, I normally buy Bitcoin through binance P2P trade and although it's a small amount but I really don't care so long the process is a continual one but the problem now is not buying but actually when you want to move the coins to a non-custodial wallet like electrum for safe keeping because with all the incident I have read and happening that have occured, I can deduce that keeping your coins in an exchange is not an good idea at all but the issue is how can you move coins out when the fees are fucking crazy.

You can only do DCA at a centralized exchange. For non-custodial transactions, you're going to have to wait quite a long time until the dust settles. Things are going to get worse once the BTC halving takes effect in April 2024. That's because there will be FOMO, adding greater congestion to the Blockchain.

Sadly this is true, and if the transaction will go up during the bull run, it could be worst that 2017. I remember that time that the fees are so high. But in any case, we shouldn't deter bitcoin enthusiast and continue what they have been doing for years or months.

Some say we should move to the Lightning Network for cheaper and faster transfers. But you'd still need to pay a high on-chain fee to open/close a channel on the LN. Therefore, average Bitcoin users are completely "deadlocked". No one can predict the future, so lets hope for the best.

Or maybe just familiarize ourselves with Lightning Network, I think we will need it just in case. Maybe in the future, more online or offline stores are going to used LN for small transactions. And it will be good if we know how to used it.

[arabspaceship123]

It's going to show negatively on total numbers of bitcoin traded when ppl trying DCA get affected by high transactions fees. It's a drop on traded numbers if they can't afford to save. If one thing goes wrong more's going to go wrong so if bitcoin's price gets affected when less ppl buy where's the confidence in the market.

When fees get expensive ppl have to save in larger amounts less times a year there isn't another way to avoid high fees.

Alternatives to continuing DCA while giving up on self-custody obviously bring in some other risks, but if someone doesn't have a lot of money available, but is fully determined to pursue the DCA investment plan, I guess the best decision would be to do that on a reputable exchange and take the Bitcoin out in reasonable intervals to save on fees. It is far from perfect, but it can make sense from an opportunity cost perspective. But I would definitely pick an exchange that has existed for a long time and is so far not known for shenanigans that could threaten its continued operations. You can never know, but there is also not much else you can do.

[milewilda]

That's true, because I also faced this fee challenge now and it got worse few weeks back when the fee was crazy high, I normally buy Bitcoin through binance P2P trade and although it's a small amount but I really don't care so long the process is a continual one but the problem now is not buying but actually when you want to move the coins to a non-custodial wallet like electrum for safe keeping because with all the incident I have read and happening that have occured, I can deduce that keeping your coins in an exchange is not an good idea at all but the issue is how can you move coins out when the fees are fucking crazy.

You can only do DCA at a centralized exchange. For non-custodial transactions, you're going to have to wait quite a long time until the dust settles. Things are going to get worse once the BTC halving takes effect in April 2024. That's because there will be FOMO, adding greater congestion to the Blockchain.

Sadly this is true, and if the transaction will go up during the bull run, it could be worst that 2017. I remember that time that the fees are so high. But in any case, we shouldn't deter bitcoin enthusiast and continue what they have been doing for years or months.

Some say we should move to the Lightning Network for cheaper and faster transfers. But you'd still need to pay a high on-chain fee to open/close a channel on the LN. Therefore, average Bitcoin users are completely "deadlocked". No one can predict the future, so lets hope for the best.

Or maybe just familiarize ourselves with Lightning Network, I think we will need it just in case. Maybe in the future, more online or offline stores are going to used LN for small transactions. And it will be good if we know how to used it.

Wasnt aware of LN now is already that been that usable or still on test phase but if ever this one would be pushed through then problems with huge or high fees wont really be that happening anymore.
Almost all of this month of December on which the fee is really that staying up on huge sat/byte numbers.

High Priority
99 sat/vB
$5.88

This is the current fee on high priority as of this writing. Imagine that you would be buying up something like $1 worth then you would be paying up that x5 of the said amount.
Do we really think that it would be that ideal? No its not.. Lots of us did really not like the current network condition or situation on which
it is really that prohibiting us to make transactions specially into those smaller ones. Just like been said that if you are some sort of whale or does have
tons of money then this situation wont really bothering you.

This is why i do make out some diversification on other altcoins on which it does have lesser fees but at the same time, the potential is still there
in speaking about profit making but of course not everything is really that assured.

[Abiky]

Or maybe just familiarize ourselves with Lightning Network, I think we will need it just in case. Maybe in the future, more online or offline stores are going to used LN for small transactions. And it will be good if we know how to used it.

If only the LN was easy to use, many people would've switched to it already. But the added complexity, forces most people to look elsewhere. No one has the time to learn about LN addresses, LN urls, invoices, channels, etc. Not to mention, the network itself is full of bugs. That's why on-chain scaling is the only viable long-term solution to help maintain low fees without sacrificing security/reliability or reducing user experience.

Hopefully, developers gain the approval of the community for a series of network upgrades meant to tackle the "high fee problem". The Ordinals craze is starting to fade away, so it should only be a matter of time before Bitcoin becomes great again. Just my opinion

[arabspaceship123]

We don't want to pay more if it's possible to get confirmations by paying less so if you're trying to save in transaction fees you'll need something to help so try https://jochen-hoenicke.de/queue/#BTC,24h,weight

[DaNNy001]

Or maybe just familiarize ourselves with Lightning Network, I think we will need it just in case. Maybe in the future, more online or offline stores are going to used LN for small transactions. And it will be good if we know how to used it.

If only the LN was easy to use, many people would've switched to it already. But the added complexity, forces most people to look elsewhere. No one has the time to learn about LN addresses, LN urls, invoices, channels, etc. Not to mention, the network itself is full of bugs. That's why on-chain scaling is the only viable long-term solution to help maintain low fees without sacrificing security/reliability or reducing user experience.

Hopefully, developers gain the approval of the community for a series of network upgrades meant to tackle the "high fee problem". The Ordinals craze is starting to fade away, so it should only be a matter of time before Bitcoin becomes great again. Just my opinion

Then how much again before it gets back to the normal frustrating high fee? This problem is a one that has come to taunt Bitcoin lovers and believe me it has damage and crumbled so many businesses as the fees are just too crazy to manage and like you said the adamant view to the lightning network is making things with fee look impossible and the only way possible is for the developers like you said to come up with maybe upgrades to it that's makes it proficient and less complicated to use.

[moneystery]

The current Bitcoin fees wouldn't have mattered to me because I am not selling, but the fees do matter because I DCA, and I don't want to leave my coins in the centralized exchange. This month, I have spent roughly $5 to $10 in transaction fees when I DCA every week. It may seem small, but in my country, it's enough to cover my feeding expenses for a month cumulatively.

I discussed this issue with my friend, and he suggested I use an exchange that utilizes the Lightning Network. According to him, this would help me get off with no fees any day. While I'm considering this alternative, another option is to wait for a month or two, then use the amount we kept for weekly DCA, hold it for a month or two, and lump sum. This way, i would incur just a one time fee. What are your thoughts on this? I feel like I may use the money kept for DCA for other expenses.

it's nothing new that we see bitcoin fees that are so high, but bitcoin fees will return to normal and will continue to happen like that. for those who did dca, it must have felt very difficult in the last few months because the bitcoin fees were quite annoying.

discussing the best bitcoin wallet to deal with the current uncertain bitcoin fees, i simply recommend bluewallet, because it has an rbf feature so your transactions can be processed with cheap fees.

[teamsherry]

I guess you better start planning to run your own node of you want to enjoy the lightning network, so I guess to wait for a month to lump sum do you would be paying the charge only once should be your best option, unless you can utilise the Ln  to speed things up.

[CODE200]

I guess you better start planning to run your own node of you want to enjoy the lightning network, so I guess to wait for a month to lump sum do you would be paying the charge only once should be your best option, unless you can utilise the Ln  to speed things up.

That's the talk between me and my small circle of crypto friends, the best way to solve the issue with the high fees is this but we're not really good with tech so we're still a bit in the dark when it comes to running nodes but I do think that this is a good solution. Also, we shouldn't really tolerate or celebrate ordinals anymore, they've been gone on for far too long and I've seen that the transaction fees have gone much lower than ever so I guess, we've stopped being fans of ordinals. Hopefully, this thing won't ever happen again because I don't know if I'll ever be able to make a profit if bitcoin starts pumping up and the transaction fees are so damn expensive, I'm not willing to sacrifice a huge chunk of what I hodl just to profit.

[Abiky]

it's nothing new that we see bitcoin fees that are so high, but bitcoin fees will return to normal and will continue to happen like that. for those who did dca, it must have felt very difficult in the last few months because the bitcoin fees were quite annoying.

discussing the best bitcoin wallet to deal with the current uncertain bitcoin fees, i simply recommend bluewallet, because it has an rbf feature so your transactions can be processed with cheap fees.

I think fees were higher in the past (late 2017). It led us to a scaling debate which triggered a hard fork called "Bitcoin Cash" and the adoption of SegWit on the main BTC blockchain. Perhaps, the Ordinals craze will lead us to similar events in the long run. Whatever happens, you can rest assured on-chain fees won't stay high forever.

In the meantime, you should seek for ways to save as much money as possible. Altcoins like Litecoin, Dogecoin, BNB, Solana, and Polygon are cheaper to use than Bitcoin itself. Or if you want to keep your BTC, you can always switch to the Lightning Network. Considering that Bitcoin has gone this far, it's safe to assume it will be with us for generations. Who knows if it becomes the next reserve currency of the world?

[EarnOnVictor]

I guess you better start planning to run your own node of you want to enjoy the lightning network, so I guess to wait for a month to lump sum do you would be paying the charge only once should be your best option, unless you can utilise the Ln  to speed things up.

That's the talk between me and my small circle of crypto friends, the best way to solve the issue with the high fees is this but we're not really good with tech so we're still a bit in the dark when it comes to running nodes but I do think that this is a good solution. Also, we shouldn't really tolerate or celebrate ordinals anymore, they've been gone on for far too long and I've seen that the transaction fees have gone much lower than ever so I guess, we've stopped being fans of ordinals. Hopefully, this thing won't ever happen again because I don't know if I'll ever be able to make a profit if bitcoin starts pumping up and the transaction fees are so damn expensive, I'm not willing to sacrifice a huge chunk of what I hodl just to profit.

And you think what @teamsherry said is cost-effective? I don't think so. Making payment transactions online does not have to be that burdensome if the Bitcoin system has been best planned from the beginning. I know that the founder will never know that such a situation like this would happen, but as it is now, I think that when the time comes, the best thing is for us to use the LN, it is better, but we should be getting ready for some issues that are associated with it as well. Before using it, we should try to learn it as it is not working like the direct way that Bitcoin transactions work. Alternatively, one can use the service of the free accelerators too, but since the last time I used it, I mean about 2 months ago or more, it is the ViaBTC accelerating service that was working in this regard. If one can part away with a mere 18s/vb fee, I know that this will be a very good choice for us all.

But running our own nodes as suggested by that guy is not so encouraging if I were the one.

[arabspaceship123]

We'll see fees move high & low but they'll have to go down or else it's going to be expensive sending micro payments. There's cheaper options to save fees but you'll want to hold your bitcoin if you can.

I think fees were higher in the past (late 2017). It led us to a scaling debate which triggered a hard fork called "Bitcoin Cash" and the adoption of SegWit on the main BTC blockchain. Perhaps, the Ordinals craze will lead us to similar events in the long run. Whatever happens, you can rest assured on-chain fees won't stay high forever.

In the meantime, you should seek for ways to save as much money as possible. Altcoins like Litecoin, Dogecoin, BNB, Solana, and Polygon are cheaper to use than Bitcoin itself. Or if you want to keep your BTC, you can always switch to the Lightning Network. Considering that Bitcoin has gone this far, it's safe to assume it will be with us for generations. Who knows if it becomes the next reserve currency of the world?

[ivankoh]

I think the high fee is natural, it comes from taproot and ordinal's boom, it means bitcoin has more utility to use, for bitcoin this cannot be changed, I think it is characteristic of bitcoin - POW. it is also the reason that many bitcoin l2 projects are building to compensate and increase the opportunity to use bitcoin with lower transaction fees. it will be like ETH with polygon or Arb