Mixers to be banned

[Helena Yu]

What's going on? suddenly many newbies jump into this thread.

@Theymos, if this one is really implemented on January 1st, hopefully, we can bring back the "Advertise in this forum" feature. But, of course, promoting mixers is not allowed.

I'm not going to disagree with you, but why the forum need to bring back the ads? This new rule affect the users since they can't advertise centralized mixers anymore, not the forum.

I'd like to point out that mixers are destined to disappear in the future

(Source: myself, I come from the year 3030)

That means we still have 1007 years more before mixers will be banned.

How do these opinions reflect the broader sentiments within the cryptocurrency community regarding regulatory measures and their influence on platforms promoting anonymity and privacy?

Most people simply don't care since they hold their coins in centralized exchange.

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[joker_josue]

Oh USA law is so fucked up complex , layered and contradictory it is amazing.

So asking theymos to do mixers would likely mean asking him to relocate to a far more liberal tax country. Just to run the forum. That may not be realistic at all for him.

You've got the first part right, 100%.  I just saw a woman who was quite obviously in her 50s-60s get denied cigarettes at a gas station because she couldn't produce an ID.  That's an example of law coming into direct conflict with common sense, and it's idiotic.

And moving the forum to an offshore country in order to preserve mixer campaigns?  Yeah, there's no reason for that even if it were easy enough to do, which it isn't.

It's the plastic surgery and botox that women are now wanting to do, like crazy, to blame. 
This woman must have been very happy, because she managed to pass as a 16 year old teenager! 

[JollyGood]

As ludicrous as it might seem, if there is a financial penalty to pay (or if there is a threat of losing your trading licence) in the event vendors sell cigarettes or alcohol without checking ID, then I suppose it really is a matter of the law coming to direct conflict with common sense. Usually common sense prevails but if someone wants to implement the law they are not doing anything wrong.

About moving the forum to another country, not that I endorse that view but keeping that aside I should imagine it cannot be too difficult. The forum is not an LLC (that I know of) and websites can be hosted anywhere. I think the issue that regardless of where the forum is legally based, theymos does not want certain types of mixers being promoted.

Oh USA law is so fucked up complex , layered and contradictory it is amazing.

So asking theymos to do mixers would likely mean asking him to relocate to a far more liberal tax country. Just to run the forum. That may not be realistic at all for him.

You've got the first part right, 100%.  I just saw a woman who was quite obviously in her 50s-60s get denied cigarettes at a gas station because she couldn't produce an ID.  That's an example of law coming into direct conflict with common sense, and it's idiotic.

And moving the forum to an offshore country in order to preserve mixer campaigns?  Yeah, there's no reason for that even if it were easy enough to do, which it isn't.

[vapourminer]

As ludicrous as it might seem, if there is a financial penalty to pay (or if there is a threat of losing your trading licence) in the event vendors sell cigarettes or alcohol without checking ID, then I suppose it really is a matter of the law coming to direct conflict with common sense. Usually common sense prevails but if someone wants to implement the law they are not doing anything wrong.

with cameras in stores 24/7 its hard to let stuff like that slide even if you wanted to. the camera eye sees all..

same as the forum i guess, access 24/7 for anyone to check past post history.

[philipma1957]

So I pulled my avatar and my signature a few days early as I do not want to screw around with Jan 1 deadline.

I left my Text for now

"Your Privacy Matters"

as a question if I left that I would think it is okay.

No link to anything.

My signature reads "Empty"

and I have a blue design for an avatar.

I think I managed to erase all info on the mixer today I am still looking for any more.

[NotATether]

So I pulled my avatar and my signature a few days early as I do not want to screw around with Jan 1 deadline.

I left my Text for now

Why would you be under pressure to pull off your text? (Below the avatar)

Privacy does matter, when you think about it.

[philipma1957]

So I pulled my avatar and my signature a few days early as I do not want to screw around with Jan 1 deadline.

I left my Text for now

Why would you be under pressure to pull off your text? (Below the avatar)

Privacy does matter, when you think about it.

That is what I figured which was why I finally did a signature with mixers.

[JollyGood]

It is a strange parallel but it is true. There are a massive amount of cameras and surveillance in the real world and the forum also has years of history which can be checked or be under surveillance. Parts of the forum that are not available online for the general public to view have been backed up somewhere and can be accessed by a few people.

As ludicrous as it might seem, if there is a financial penalty to pay (or if there is a threat of losing your trading licence) in the event vendors sell cigarettes or alcohol without checking ID, then I suppose it really is a matter of the law coming to direct conflict with common sense. Usually common sense prevails but if someone wants to implement the law they are not doing anything wrong.

with cameras in stores 24/7 its hard to let stuff like that slide even if you wanted to. the camera eye sees all..

same as the forum i guess, access 24/7 for anyone to check past post history.

[joker_josue]

So I pulled my avatar and my signature a few days early as I do not want to screw around with Jan 1 deadline.

I left my Text for now

"Your Privacy Matters"

as a question if I left that I would think it is okay.

No link to anything.

My signature reads "Empty"

and I have a blue design for an avatar.

I think I managed to erase all info on the mixer today I am still looking for any more.

Calm. There's no need to be so obsessed with it either. Old references end up being irrelevant. They may even want to replace it, but don't obsess about it.


Regarding subscription, we can always use TalkImg, especially because it was your suggestion: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5450546.msg62291453#msg62291453 
That is, of course, until you have a real sponsor. 

[JollyGood]

From what I understand, philipma1957 is based in the US and is a US citizen therefore he is keeping an eye on things from that perspective (law, regulation, etc) and that is understandable. Having said that I do think it is an over the top reaction and there was no need to go those extremes by removing a signature or text or deleting post history on the basis mixers were mentioned in a particular manner.

I am not in his shoes and cannot feel what he feels but he has made a decision what must have been after careful consideration. He clearly feels under pressure but I think it is more a case of he is putting himself under stress when there was no need.

 

So I pulled my avatar and my signature a few days early as I do not want to screw around with Jan 1 deadline.

I left my Text for now

Why would you be under pressure to pull off your text? (Below the avatar)

Privacy does matter, when you think about it.

[The Sceptical Chymist]

What's going on? suddenly many newbies jump into this thread.

Yep, I was wondering that myself--and I just reported one of them for most likely being a bot or someone using AI to post.  If that post is still above this one, you'll notice it.  Ugh.


So, roughly two days to go until bye-bye mixers, and my prediction is that business will carry on as usual.  I haven't checked to see what other campaigns are open, but I suspect if there are a few there's going to be a bum rush to join them.  I shan't be a part of that mob.

From what I understand, philipma1957 is based in the US and is a US citizen therefore he is keeping an eye on things from that perspective (law, regulation, etc) and that is understandable. Having said that I do think it is an over the top reaction and there was no need to go those extremes by removing a signature or text or deleting post history on the basis mixers were mentioned in a particular manner.

What's Theymos going to do if someone doesn't remove their signature if they're in a mixer campaign?  Are they going to get banned?  He might have mentioned that when he made the announcement, but for the life of me I can't remember and....I'm not too lazy to check; I'm just not doing it.  But what I was thinking is that perhaps philipma1957 is concerned about that (though that wouldn't explain leaving the personal message in place.  Either way, I don't think it's such an extreme reaction that it's of concern to any of us.  It's just what he feels comfortable with--and yes, philipma1957 is in the US and like Theymos he probably sees the writing on the wall as far as the government and their surveillance of bitcoin, crypto, and mixers.  That said, I doubt the removal of his signature is going to help anything if any shit goes down.

[JollyGood]

What's Theymos going to do if someone doesn't remove their signature if they're in a mixer campaign?  Are they going to get banned?  He might have mentioned that when he made the announcement, but for the life of me I can't remember and....I'm not too lazy to check; I'm just not doing it. 

I thought I had covered that part but unfortunately the post was not clear enough. I was referring to him removing the signature now rather than waiting until new years day which is when all mixer campaign participants will remove them. I was stating I could not understand why he felt under pressure to remove either text or signature when to be honest (from my perspective), there was no need.

But what I was thinking is that perhaps philipma1957 is concerned about that (though that wouldn't explain leaving the personal message in place.  Either way, I don't think it's such an extreme reaction that it's of concern to any of us.  It's just what he feels comfortable with--and yes, philipma1957 is in the US and like Theymos he probably sees the writing on the wall as far as the government and their surveillance of bitcoin, crypto, and mixers.  That said, I doubt the removal of his signature is going to help anything if any shit goes down.

As long he (and others) feel comfortable doing what they think is the best course of action, that is what they should do. I think 2024 is going to be a year when mixers and centralised exchanges are going to be the focus of US law enforcement agencies. The writing is probably on the wall in more ways that most of us can see.

[joker_josue]

What's Theymos going to do if someone doesn't remove their signature if they're in a mixer campaign?  Are they going to get banned?  He might have mentioned that when he made the announcement, but for the life of me I can't remember and....

The links will be removed, and will now contain text like "link removed" or something like that. By chance, I've seen this in a subscription, I don't remember which one.
In other words, signature will no longer show the name and link of the mix, just a few words that do not contain the name or link.

[holydarkness]

What's Theymos going to do if someone doesn't remove their signature if they're in a mixer campaign?  Are they going to get banned?  He might have mentioned that when he made the announcement, but for the life of me I can't remember and....

The links will be removed, and will now contain text like "link removed" or something like that. By chance, I've seen this in a subscription, I don't remember which one.
In other words, signature will no longer show the name and link of the mix, just a few words that do not contain the name or link.

Perhaps you're referring to this post? I made a screenshot of what a sig will look like after the ban take effect for reference, just in case the user remove his sig., I think it's allowed to provide such screenshot? Given the name and brand is already wordfiltered.

[WhyFhy]

Can I get an option on the verbiage wasabiwallet uses on their website ?
Basically would this be considered a safe campaign to participate in with the verbiage on site.

wasabiwallet.io

AFFORDABLE
Coinjoining coins with a value above 0.01 BTC costs 0.3% as a coordinator fee + mining fees. Inputs of 0.01 BTC or below don't pay coordinator fees, nor do remixes, even after one transaction. Thus, a payment made with coinjoined funds allows the sender and the recipient to remix their coins without paying any coordinator fees.

I have the strangest dejavu writing this.

I also wanted to add in response to y'all's speculation that these campaigns will continue on other cryptocurrency forums.

[acroman08]

Can I get an option on the verbiage wasabiwallet uses on their website ?
Basically would this be considered a safe campaign to participate in with the verbiage on site.

wasabiwallet.io

AFFORDABLE
Coinjoining coins with a value above 0.01 BTC costs 0.3% as a coordinator fee + mining fees. Inputs of 0.01 BTC or below don't pay coordinator fees, nor do remixes, even after one transaction. Thus, a payment made with coinjoined funds allows the sender and the recipient to remix their coins without paying any coordinator fees.

I have the strangest dejavu writing this.

I also wanted to add in response to y'all's speculation that these campaigns will continue on other cryptocurrency forums.

would love to see a response to this, reading the OP, wassabiwallet.io feels like it would be considered a mixer based on what was written on the "definition of a mixer", I would like to read a clarification on this.

[Stalker22]

would love to see a response to this, reading the OP, wassabiwallet.io feels like it would be considered a mixer based on what was written on the "definition of a mixer", I would like to read a clarification on this.

Read the OP again:

Examples of things that are not banned mixers include exchangers (unless they have a mixing function), CoinJoin-supporting non-custodial wallets, and Monero.

As I see it, Wasabi Wallet fits the description of "CoinJoin-supporting non-custodial wallet" perfectly.

Wasabi is an open-source, non-custodial, privacy-focused Bitcoin wallet for desktop, that implements trustless coinjoin over the Tor anonymity network.

[philipma1957]

What's going on? suddenly many newbies jump into this thread.

Yep, I was wondering that myself--and I just reported one of them for most likely being a bot or someone using AI to post.  If that post is still above this one, you'll notice it.  Ugh.


So, roughly two days to go until bye-bye mixers, and my prediction is that business will carry on as usual.  I haven't checked to see what other campaigns are open, but I suspect if there are a few there's going to be a bum rush to join them.  I shan't be a part of that mob.

From what I understand, philipma1957 is based in the US and is a US citizen therefore he is keeping an eye on things from that perspective (law, regulation, etc) and that is understandable. Having said that I do think it is an over the top reaction and there was no need to go those extremes by removing a signature or text or deleting post history on the basis mixers were mentioned in a particular manner.

What's Theymos going to do if someone doesn't remove their signature if they're in a mixer campaign?  Are they going to get banned?  He might have mentioned that when he made the announcement, but for the life of me I can't remember and....I'm not too lazy to check; I'm just not doing it.  But what I was thinking is that perhaps philipma1957 is concerned about that (though that wouldn't explain leaving the personal message in place.  Either way, I don't think it's such an extreme reaction that it's of concern to any of us.  It's just what he feels comfortable with--and yes, philipma1957 is in the US and like Theymos he probably sees the writing on the wall as far as the government and their surveillance of bitcoin, crypto, and mixers.  That said, I doubt the removal of his signature is going to help anything if any shit goes down.

I see the USA becoming a shithole country. (they already are)

It will just be more obvious to all of us.


My biggest issue is my pension's and my wife's pension are USA federal paid.  They are good pensions you can live pretty well on them.
Plus they have insurance coverage. The only way you can lose them is to be jailed. So I am quite frankly somewhat owned by them.

In my 66 soon to be 67 year old life I have seen some outlandish arrests done by my government.  So I ended 3 days early and decided to give my signature away to talkimg.com

I still believe in privacy so I will leave it up. It is the best I can do for now. Maybe in a year or two I will get a bit braver than I am today. Time will tell.

[Woodie]

After this is implemented, I am expecting to see this development run on some of the biggest crypto news sites in 2024 #History_in_the_making 

[joker_josue]

In my 66 soon to be 67 year old life I have seen some outlandish arrests done by my government.  So I ended 3 days early and decided to give my signature away to talkimg.com

I still believe in privacy so I will leave it up. It is the best I can do for now. Maybe in a year or two I will get a bit braver than I am today. Time will tell.

Above all, the person has to manage things in the most appropriate way for their life. A person can continue to have their ideas and ideals, but there are certain risks that it is not necessary to take to simply defend them madly. The person must look at the tools that exist, and use them in the best way without being harmed, or with as little harm as possible.

Thank you, once again, for your support of TalkImg.