Can Satoshi Nakamoto remove the 21 million BTC limit?

[Xal0lex]

Speaking in Davos on Wednesday, JPMorgan CEO and also a well-known bitcoin critic Jamie Dimon made a suggestion that Satoshi Nakamoto might lift the limit on the number of bitcoins, which as we know is 21 million BTC. How would you comment on such a statement?

Referring to the limited supply of Bitcoin, which is to mirror the properties of gold, Dimon said he doubted the finality of the 21 million Bitcoin supply maximum, saying: "I think there's a good chance, when we get to that 20 million bitcoins...Satashi [sic] is going to come on there, laugh hysterically, go quiet, and all Bitcoins [are] going to be erased. How the hell [do] you know it’s going to stop at 21?"

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[riverdip]

well that depends on community, i am pretty sure if that were to ever happen

we will have a fork ( two bitcoin networks)

and you will be able to access both, and evidently one chain will die and you will be left with the chain with most reasonable logic.


plus even if supply is doubled or increased ? wouldn't it double your bitcoin holdings too ?

[Charles-Tim]

That limited amount that makes bitcoin deflationary can not just be added to or erased. What that will cause the supply to be altered will means that miners will all agree to that and nobody will agree to that. People want it to stay at 21 million BTC. I speculate that any attempt to do anything to alter the 21 million supply will only be a failed attempt.

Never expect anything good about bitcoin from bitcoin critics.

[riverdip]

That limited amount that makes bitcoin deflationary can not just be added to or erased. What that will cause the supply to be altered will means that bitcoin community like miners will all agree to that and nobody will agree to that. People want to to stay at 21 million. I speculate that any attempt to do anything to alter the 21 million supply will only be a failed attempt.

agree, or we will have

BITCOIN JV ( Jamie Vision )

ha ha ha

[roller33]

Well, the 21 million BTC is a fundamental aspect of Bitcoin's design. Changing this limit would require a consensus from the network participants, which I believe it is unlikely given the strong commitment to Bitcoin's original protocol.

It also would alter Bitcoin's scarcity value and economic model.

Dimon's comment might be speculative or aimed at provoking thought, but it's good to remember the decentralized nature of Bitcoin that makes such changes pretty hard to make.

I believe that making such a change could mean a huge decrease on BTC value and even the loss of trust on the coin.

[PrivacyG]

Speaking in Davos on Wednesday, JPMorgan CEO and also a well-known bitcoin critic Jamie Dimon made a suggestion that Satoshi Nakamoto might lift the limit on the number of bitcoins, which as we know is 21 million BTC. How would you comment on such a statement?

I would comment by saying Jamie Dimon does not know what he is talking about.  Bitcoin is not J P Morgan.  Bitcoin is DE Centralized.  It is Trust LESS.

Satoshi created Bitcoin and let it run in the wild.  He has no more power of governance over it, ever since Bitcoin became public.  There is no 'access key' to inner workings of Bitcoin and every body pretty much knows that after a five minute serious read on this topic.

The only way this can happen is through a Hard Fork.  I doubt every body is dumb enough to accept such a significant change which has an obvious and very strong negative impact on Bitcoin.

[Adbitco]

Do you know that sometimes I do think about this as well, with the halving Bitcoin will be scarce in time to come and what is the essence of halving to remove some of the supply right?
Okay come to think of this, do you think if the halving continues we would have bitcoin for our 3 to 4 generation? So why halving meaning bitcoin is not singly operating as it was created as peer to peer nature so there's every possibility to be scarcity of bitcoin either the supply should be increased or halving should be extended to every 10 years or more to enable bitcoin Last for generations to come just as we are using cash currently and it has been in existence for centuries so why bitcoin can't be created as that.

[franky1]

That limited amount that makes bitcoin deflationary can not just be added to or erased. What that will cause the supply to be altered will means that bitcoin community like miners will all agree to that and nobody will agree to that. People want to to stay at 21 million. I speculate that any attempt to do anything to alter the 21 million supply will only be a failed attempt.

agree, or we will have

BITCOIN JV ( Jamie Vision )

ha ha ha

bitcoin diamond already created in 2017
210m cap
no one noticed, no one cared no one uses it

[passwordnow]

It is the design of Bitcoin and if Jamie Dimon thinks of something like this, I guess that he's got some plan that will benefit him if it's technically possible. But is there a point from satoshi's post that he'd already told about that it won't be changed and it will stay to the same supply limit? I Maybe there is, right?

People have bought and invested on Bitcoin for this very reason. The halving that's making the rewards for miners cut into half every cycle or 4 years makes it even scarcer and for that reason, many are believing that its design is perfect and just don't take the opinion of the people like Jamie Dimon. He would always say something that won't matter at all. He might be the owner of JP Morgan Chase or the CEO of it but he's been telling shit about Bitcoin since long time ago.

[hatshepsut93]

All that statement does is proving that Dimon understands nothing about Bitcoin. Satoshi hasn't been active for over a decade, but even if he returned, he wouldn't be able to make any changes in Bitcoin, he could only propose them. In fact everyone can only propose changes, even Jamie Dimon can, but it's up to us users to decide whether we want them or not.

[oktana]

Yes, it is extremely possible. In the mind of a dreamer . It isn’t possible folks hence it’s not happening. It isn’t even something to put into consideration unless you’re in the dreamland and imagining another universe. Bitcoin is nothing more than 21M. Does he not know that if it were possible, Bitcoin wouldn’t have the value it has today? People would have invested with the fear that more could be created. That scarcity is key if not it’s just like fiat then. Shrugs.

[sheenshane]

IMO, yes it can be possible if Satoshi wants to but the 21 million max limits is already on the Bitcoin protocol.
So to change that protocol there could be widely accepted consensus among the Bitcoin community, including miners, developers, and users as mentioned above.  Because the decentralized nature of Bitcoin means that changes to the protocol are proposed and implemented through a consensus mechanism that involves miners, developers, and users.

IMO, even Satoshi has nothing to do now with the Bitcoin supply.

[thecodebear]

Speaking in Davos on Wednesday, JPMorgan CEO and also a well-known bitcoin critic Jamie Dimon made a suggestion that Satoshi Nakamoto might lift the limit on the number of bitcoins, which as we know is 21 million BTC. How would you comment on such a statement?

Referring to the limited supply of Bitcoin, which is to mirror the properties of gold, Dimon said he doubted the finality of the 21 million Bitcoin supply maximum, saying: "I think there's a good chance, when we get to that 20 million bitcoins...Satashi [sic] is going to come on there, laugh hysterically, go quiet, and all Bitcoins [are] going to be erased. How the hell [do] you know it’s going to stop at 21?"

lol that's hilarious. Dimon really is just a complete idiot when it comes to Bitcoin. That's pretty much equivalent to saying how do we know the sun is going to rise tomorrow, maybe God (or whatever other imaginary all powerful beings) is going to come and laugh hysterically and turn off the sun.


OP, I don't even see why you would make this topic, unless you are new to Bitcoin and simply don't know how it works. If that is the case, Dimon is an idiot and he either has no clue how Bitcoin works or he is deliberately spreading anti-bitcoin propaganda (as he has been for years). Satoshi has zero control over Bitcoin. Bitcoin is decentralized. Nobody can change the supply limit. There will never be a single Sat over the 21 million bitcoin limit.

[Churchillvv]

I wouldn't say it's not possible, Yeah because before JP Morgan made such statement he must have done some research and found the possibility rate to be high, so he wouldn't just say things for saying sake.

But IMO, I don't believe it's gonna ever happen because of the trust it have already gain and investors believe that in less than no time BTC will be so scarce that the ones that has been held already will now become so expensive then their profits will be so guaranteed. So if this 21 million feature of bitcoin is lost the value will drop hence investors will loss interest gradually everything that has been working well will now be like every other Altcoins. Which is a major reason it won't be possible.

[Dr.Bitcoin_Strange]

Dimon concluded his statement by asking how Bitcoiners know that Bitcoin will remain at 21 million.

As far as I know, that was just a rhetorical question for the audience so that he (Dimon) could conclude his criticism speech.

How then did he also know that Satoshi could just appear and increase the supply of Bitcoin? What would Satoshi stand to gain if he increased the limited supply of Bitcoin? How did he know if Satoshi was still alive or not?

Dimon doesn't like Bitcoin, so he would rather make some hypocritical speech just to create thoughts of doubt about Bitcoin in the minds of people. I really don't care because what he said is not what will happen. If there was any intention by Satoshi to increase the supply of Bitcoin, he probably would have done it since the value of Bitcoin started increasing rapidly after the first halving and the bull market that followed it.

[PytagoraZ]

Speaking in Davos on Wednesday, JPMorgan CEO and also a well-known bitcoin critic Jamie Dimon made a suggestion that Satoshi Nakamoto might lift the limit on the number of bitcoins, which as we know is 21 million BTC. How would you comment on such a statement?

Referring to the limited supply of Bitcoin, which is to mirror the properties of gold, Dimon said he doubted the finality of the 21 million Bitcoin supply maximum, saying: "I think there's a good chance, when we get to that 20 million bitcoins...Satashi [sic] is going to come on there, laugh hysterically, go quiet, and all Bitcoins [are] going to be erased. How the hell [do] you know it’s going to stop at 21?"

I don't know about the code behind bitcoin but 21 million is what everyone believes to this day. If bitcoin exceeds 21 million then trust in bitcoin will collapse overnight and bitcoin will be considered a scam

[Cvetik56]

Speaking in Davos on Wednesday, JPMorgan CEO and also a well-known bitcoin critic Jamie Dimon made a suggestion that Satoshi Nakamoto might lift the limit on the number of bitcoins, which as we know is 21 million BTC. How would you comment on such a statement?

Referring to the limited supply of Bitcoin, which is to mirror the properties of gold, Dimon said he doubted the finality of the 21 million Bitcoin supply maximum, saying: "I think there's a good chance, when we get to that 20 million bitcoins...Satashi [sic] is going to come on there, laugh hysterically, go quiet, and all Bitcoins [are] going to be erased. How the hell [do] you know it’s going to stop at 21?"

I don't know about the code behind bitcoin but 21 million is what everyone believes to this day. If bitcoin exceeds 21 million then trust in bitcoin will collapse overnight and bitcoin will be considered a scam

True, even if it's possible it would kill BTC since a lot of believers are using this as an example of why BTC is so important. Scarcity truly defines BTC.

[DanWalker]

I wouldn't say it's not possible, Yeah because before JP Morgan made such statement he must have done some research and found the possibility rate to be high, so he wouldn't just say things for saying sake.

But IMO, I don't believe it's gonna ever happen because of the trust it have already gain and investors believe that in less than no time BTC will be so scarce that the ones that has been held already will now become so expensive then their profits will be so guaranteed. So if this 21 million feature of bitcoin is lost the value will drop hence investors will loss interest gradually everything that has been working well will now be like every other Altcoins. Which is a major reason it won't be possible.

I think on the contrary, he just says what he thinks, he has never done any research on bitcoin. Because if he researched carefully, he would know that Satoshi is only the creator of bitcoin, not the person who will have full authority to change everything about bitcoin. Bitcoin is decentralized and controlled by the community, and if we want to change anything, we need consensus from everyone. To do that is extremely difficult, if not impossible.

Although bitcoin scarcity is not the only factor causing bitcoin prices to skyrocket, it is one of the important factors and everyone knows it. So I believe no one wants to change the bitcoin supply.

[SilverCryptoBullet]

Speaking in Davos on Wednesday, JPMorgan CEO and also a well-known bitcoin critic Jamie Dimon made a suggestion that Satoshi Nakamoto might lift the limit on the number of bitcoins, which as we know is 21 million BTC. How would you comment on such a statement?

Satoshi Nakamoto can not and we can not.

JP Morgan CEO, Jamie must do his research and learn about basics. His statement like this means he did not do any research and did not find any basic about Bitcoin.

How is the 21 million bitcoin cap defined and enforced?

[ObscurePen]

Yes Bitcoins 21mil cap can be removed. In a hard fork, we would essentially have Bitcoin and another coin branch off. Bitcoin will continue with the 21 mil cap but the new coin will have a new cap or no cap. I am sure there must have been a fork in the past where this was done. One coin will continue being used while the other dies off.

It’s a good question to think about actually. What happens when the 21 mil cap is reached and miners get no more block reward. What will incentivise the miners to continue mining. Will transactions fees have to compensate for the loss of block reward? In that case wouldn’t tx fees be incredibly high? So where is the utility as a currency at that point? I don’t know the answers to these. They should be another thread all together to be honest.