New EU AML ban bitcoin anonymous payment

[Oshosondy]

It is not only bitcoin payment but other cryptocurrencies.

I have just seen this on X. I think it will be true.

BREAKING

NEW EU AML LAWS BAN ALL ANONYMOUS CRYPTO PAYMENTS.

ANY CASH PAYMENT ABOVE €10,000 WILL BECOME ILLEGAL, WHILE ALSO ANONYMOUS CASH PAYMENTS ABOVE €3,000.

https://twitter.com/Ashcryptoreal/status/1771470306848170399?t=Mos0R80oSD44bjinonMJww&s=1

Government just want control when there paper fiat is anonymous. But this is rubbish because some people will still use noncustodial wallet for transactions.

Stupid law.

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[Kruw]

I just sent an anonymous payment for my phone bill that confirmed 15 minutes ago - https://mempool.space/tx/bc1d47736e2c9cecff996efb191406ac40c96b858170941c0f9b40cb5e04875b

AND I'M GONNA DO IT AGAIN NEXT MONTH TOO 

[Husires]

It is still good that stores can accept payments in cryptocurrencies without KYC that are less than €3000.
Does this include coinJoin transactions? Daily transactions are less than €10k, as I can use P2P to exchange €9999 several times a day.

[Plaguedeath]

The press was release on January 18, 2024, but it's become popular recently.

In this press, they're put attention with cryptocurrency transactions that only worth 1K Euros instead of 3K Euros. It's really a problem for people who have a lot Bitcoins and want to protect their privacy.

The provisional agreement expands the list of obliged entities to new bodies. The new rules will cover most of the crypto sector, forcing all crypto-asset service providers (CASPs) to conduct due diligence on their customers. This means that they will have to verify facts and information about their customers, as well as report suspicious activity.

According to the agreement, CASPs will need to apply customer due diligence measures when carrying out transactions amounting to €1000 or more. It adds measures to mitigate risks in relation to transactions with self-hosted wallets.

[goldkingcoiner]

It is not only bitcoin payment but other cryptocurrencies.

I have just seen this on X. I think it will be true.

BREAKING

NEW EU AML LAWS BAN ALL ANONYMOUS CRYPTO PAYMENTS.

ANY CASH PAYMENT ABOVE €10,000 WILL BECOME ILLEGAL, WHILE ALSO ANONYMOUS CASH PAYMENTS ABOVE €3,000.

https://twitter.com/Ashcryptoreal/status/1771470306848170399?t=Mos0R80oSD44bjinonMJww&s=1

Government just want control when there paper fiat is anonymous. But this is rubbish because some people will still use noncustodial wallet for transactions.

Stupid law.

And how exactly are they going to stop people? It is an anonymous deal, lol.

[Hamza2424]

It is not only bitcoin payment but other cryptocurrencies.

I have just seen this on X. I think it will be true.

BREAKING

NEW EU AML LAWS BAN ALL ANONYMOUS CRYPTO PAYMENTS.

ANY CASH PAYMENT ABOVE €10,000 WILL BECOME ILLEGAL, WHILE ALSO ANONYMOUS CASH PAYMENTS ABOVE €3,000.

https://twitter.com/Ashcryptoreal/status/1771470306848170399?t=Mos0R80oSD44bjinonMJww&s=1

Government just want control when there paper fiat is anonymous. But this is rubbish because some people will still use noncustodial wallet for transactions.

Stupid law.

So, OP what are you expecting their motive with the ETF's they just want to accumulate the maximum supply here in my view to suppress the market and eliminate the concept of self-custody again with their shity tactics.

I'm super curious why retail investors trust ETFs to buy Bitcoins for them when they can interact with the market themselves and can have a better value compared to the ETF's so-called service.

At the same time, it's sad to hear but fortunately, we are not facing any such situations for now except for the corrupt officers of the FBR, they demand data from the centralized exchanges and track down the users to take advantage of them by using that data to blackmail them, as still there's no clear stand of Paksitani government on the crypto market.

[Davidvictorson]

The press was release on January 18, 2024, but it's become popular recently.

In this press, they're put attention with cryptocurrency transactions that only worth 1K Euros instead of 3K Euros. It's really a problem for people who have a lot Bitcoins and want to protect their privacy.

The provisional agreement expands the list of obliged entities to new bodies. The new rules will cover most of the crypto sector, forcing all crypto-asset service providers (CASPs) to conduct due diligence on their customers. This means that they will have to verify facts and information about their customers, as well as report suspicious activity.

According to the agreement, CASPs will need to apply customer due diligence measures when carrying out transactions amounting to €1000 or more. It adds measures to mitigate risks in relation to transactions with self-hosted wallets.

This is absolutely insane and I am very outraged at this. Their intent is clearly in some ways to crush crypto which is terrifying. My understanding of this is that for example if you want to take 1K Euros according to the press release out of your Coinbase account and send it to someone, Coinbase will be required to collect store and verify information of the other party which is not their customer that is before the transfer is even allowed. So even people who are not Coinbase customers, Coinbase will now have to store all kinds of KYC documents on them before the transaction is even allowed. This is the stupidest thing and very ridiculous. Businesses based in the EU will just have to move out.

[Lucius]

Have cryptocurrency payments ever been anonymous? This now means that I will not be able to pay for a sandwich and a coffee with Bitcoin until the seller checks me in the system, because actually the geniuses in power want to say that we are some kind of criminals, I guess?

However, Bitcoin exists to bypass such nonsense, because all their bans are worthless if you have a non-custodial wallet and send coins to someone who has the same wallet. First they fought against crypto mining, then they discovered that there is practically no such thing in the EU, and now they want to scare people from using Bitcoin - what's next, hunting Bitcoiners and burning them like witches in the Middle Ages?

[Aanuoluwatofunmi]

It is not only bitcoin payment but other cryptocurrencies.

I have just seen this on X. I think it will be true.

BREAKING

NEW EU AML LAWS BAN ALL ANONYMOUS CRYPTO PAYMENTS.

ANY CASH PAYMENT ABOVE €10,000 WILL BECOME ILLEGAL, WHILE ALSO ANONYMOUS CASH PAYMENTS ABOVE €3,000.

https://twitter.com/Ashcryptoreal/status/1771470306848170399?t=Mos0R80oSD44bjinonMJww&s=1

Government just want control when there paper fiat is anonymous. But this is rubbish because some people will still use noncustodial wallet for transactions.

Stupid law.

All these will only be effective on users who have refused to desist from the use of a custodial wallet and think their privacy is nothing in anyway to affect them, until they are been banned from using any of the exchanges by the government regulation and their asset frozen along with these centralized exchanges before learning their lessons, if we could only realized that bitcoin is not what is expected of us to hold on centralized exchanges, instead on our personal non custodial wallets.

[Husires]

And how exactly are they going to stop people? It is an anonymous deal, lol.

They target stores, digital stores, exchanges, and decentralized exchanges.
I don't know if the wallets will be in the same category, meaning that you need to complete identity verification to get a $10,000 transaction for your wallet, but their current focus will be on banning decentralized exchanges.

[Liquid Flower]

Have cryptocurrency payments ever been anonymous?....

Good question: I read that years ago there was many people calling BTC anonymous when it really isn't. Sounds like the early users pulled off a huge scam on the world? I still love crypto for small payments, but you need to be careful going forward.

[goldkingcoiner]

And how exactly are they going to stop people? It is an anonymous deal, lol.

They target stores, digital stores, exchanges, and decentralized exchanges.
I don't know if the wallets will be in the same category, meaning that you need to complete identity verification to get a $10,000 transaction for your wallet, but their current focus will be on banning decentralized exchanges.

yes, they can target centralized, public elements. But they cannot really target the decentralized, anonymous ones. How would they stop a decentralized p2p marketplace, for example? Or even a DEX? There is no core control element for them to target and intimidate into following their orders.

Have cryptocurrency payments ever been anonymous?....

Good question: I read that years ago there was many people calling BTC anonymous when it really isn't. Sounds like the early users pulled off a huge scam on the world? I still love crypto for small payments, but you need to be careful going forward.

Bitcoin is not anonymous (by its nature of being a literal public ledger). It is private. People tend to confuse anonymity with privacy, and it is not the same thing. However there exist ways of making Bitcoin anonymous, if need be.

[Kruw]

Good question: I read that years ago there was many people calling BTC anonymous when it really isn't. Sounds like the early users pulled off a huge scam on the world? I still love crypto for small payments, but you need to be careful going forward.

You can make your Bitcoins fully anonymous with coinjoins. Wasabi Wallet, BTCPay Server's coinjoin plugin, and Trezor's coinjoin account prevent the addresses in your wallet from becoming linked to each other.

See how you can't determine where the funds for this transaction came from, or where the change from this transaction went to?

I just sent an anonymous payment for my phone bill that confirmed 15 minutes ago - https://mempool.space/tx/bc1d47736e2c9cecff996efb191406ac40c96b858170941c0f9b40cb5e04875b

AND I'M GONNA DO IT AGAIN NEXT MONTH TOO 

[takuma sato]

But does this mean ANY amount is now banned if it's done through a private self custody wallet? because they are talking about limits on cash transactions (which they lowered from 3k to 1k as far as I can tell) but they do not talk about any limits on crypto transactions, so the way I see it is that ANY amount is now banned, and only basically institutions and registered businesses can legally transact?

Wouldn't this basically mean that people with crypto that have it in self custody cannot sell? since the transaction to the exchange would be illegal. Now that's funny.

[PX-Z]

Good thing i don't live in EU, unfortunately to those. But it looks like useless to me if transacting using non-custodial wallets. Not unless there's only a required wallet to use in every transaction which will be a fuck up to every EU citizen. But if not, this is just absurd law.

[dkbit98]

This is looking more and more like 1984 scenario.
I said it before but they are going to make more and more crazy rules and regulations in the next few years, and you all need to realize that we are in the middle of the war, and they are trying to make us fight each other.

If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face—for ever.
- George Orwell

[NotFuzzyWarm]

Have cryptocurrency payments ever been anonymous?....

Good question: I read that years ago there was many people calling BTC anonymous when it really isn't. Sounds like the early users pulled off a huge scam on the world? I still love crypto for small payments, but you need to be careful going forward.

Wrong. BTC has never been totally anonymous. What part of it being an open public ledger does not make that clear?

Only people who truly have no idea of what a public blockchain ledger is think that it is anonymous.

The only anonymous bit about it is that finding who owns any given wallet/address is very hard to do until it is either used to buy physical items or is converted to fiat. That said, every single Tx in & out is a fully traceable open record.

Getting back on topic, several months ago the EU passed laws restricting fiat transactions. All the new EU regulations do is treat all crypto Tx's the same as fiat Tx's. In either case -- THEY SUCK! If I have the cash on hand to say, buy a car or high end TV I damn well should be able to do it

[PrivacyG]

Good thing i don't live in EU, unfortunately to those. But it looks like useless to me if transacting using non-custodial wallets. Not unless there's only a required wallet to use in every transaction which will be a fuck up to every EU citizen. But if not, this is just absurd law.

Do not celebrate too early because this is coming world wide soon.  I thought United States law about Cryptocurrencies was very diabolic years ago.  Now it is coming to Europe.  Maybe in an even worse version.

It will be like this in big countries at least.  Smaller countries will make an effort to profit off this by letting us continue paying anonymously and making Know Your Customer NON mandatory.

-----

This is looking more and more like 1984 scenario.

Unfortunately this is very real and very true.  Who ever thinks this is just imaginary should take three steps back and look at the picture of the world again.

[Kruw]

Wrong. BTC has never been totally anonymous. What part of it being an open public ledger does not make that clear?

Only people who truly have no idea of what a public blockchain ledger is think that it is anonymous.

The only anonymous bit about it is that finding who owns any given wallet/address is very hard to do until it is either used to buy physical items or is converted to fiat. That said, every single Tx in & out is a fully traceable open record.

This isn't the case, you are completely anonymous when you coinjoin. Participants in a group transaction can't be distinguished from each other since there's multiple clones created with the exact same value -

I just sent an anonymous payment for my phone bill that confirmed 15 minutes ago - https://mempool.space/tx/bc1d47736e2c9cecff996efb191406ac40c96b858170941c0f9b40cb5e04875b

AND I'M GONNA DO IT AGAIN NEXT MONTH TOO 

[Hispo]

Good thing i don't live in EU, unfortunately to those. But it looks like useless to me if transacting using non-custodial wallets. Not unless there's only a required wallet to use in every transaction which will be a fuck up to every EU citizen. But if not, this is just absurd law.

I would be very ironic and funny if in the end these kinds of laws being applied in the European Union and in the United States, in the end convinced people to move most of their money to non-custodial wallets, instead using their exchanges to manage their money and carry out transactions. If so, what would the European Union and the USA do? Since we are talking about free software/open source, it would be very difficult for anyone to police people downloading wallets of their phones and computers. I still believe this could be about preparing the path for the incoming Digital Euro to be launched and becoming widespread with little resistance from Bitcoin and alternative currencies. Afterall, if they are all about replacing paper with electronic money, the restrictions on electronic money will be lighter than those applied to crypto.

Also, it is easy to say that those who live in the EU and happen to be holders of Bitcoin are unfortunate, but living in Europa has other advantages which may or may not be related to Bitcoin and alternative currencies.