Claw Machines: a category of gambling?

[karabiber]

How do we defined gambling?
In short form; gambling is anything stake with money for intention to receive a large or equals amount in return. So, to say this is gambling and it requires luck for you to win something from the machine and if you don't win then the other person enters to play since there are lots of people wanting to play. if there were no fund included then we can say is not gambling, as far as cash is involved for exchange for another higher or lesser amount then we can consider it to be gambling. This types of gambling are mostly skill based gambling because you must use yourself to play the game, so you must be technical enough or to discover the secret behind the winning before you could be winning regularly unlike online based gambling.

Yes, I can call these machines a different kind of gambling. After all, you pay money into the machine and in return you get a prize if you are lucky. For this not to be gambling, you should not win prizes with money. But you can also buy the toys you win from the machine in a toy shop. So you could also call these machines recreational machines.

I think it's complicated. Obviously, if I'm going to gamble, I want to win money. Because if I get a toy as a prize from these machines in exchange for money, I wouldn't call it gambling. I think it's a purely recreational activity. I am very confused about this. Because I can buy the toy from this machine from any toy store.

[Kakmakr]

I do not play those games, because 90% of the time, those "claws" are rigged. Yes, people might spot the way that these machines operate and some might even find a way to exploit them to their benefit. (Like using a strong magnet to pull metalic objects)

I like to play games that are "Provably fair" and where a little bit of skill and knowledge might render you some profit and not just entertainment. These days games like that are scarce and most games are rigged for higher profit. 

[bakasabo]

Yes, I can call these machines a different kind of gambling. After all, you pay money into the machine and in return you get a prize if you are lucky. For this not to be gambling, you should not win prizes with money. But you can also buy the toys you win from the machine in a toy shop. So you could also call these machines recreational machines.

I think it's complicated. Obviously, if I'm going to gamble, I want to win money. Because if I get a toy as a prize from these machines in exchange for money, I wouldn't call it gambling. I think it's a purely recreational activity. I am very confused about this. Because I can buy the toy from this machine from any toy store.

You are forgetting that 1 game cost less than the price of that toy. Even though they are extremely cheap, the cost of 1 game is still lower than toys actual price. So they arent just recreational machines.  And what about fact, that you risk all the time with money? What about a wish to win, not just buy a toy? People gamble to win, and it does not matter if they win $1 or $100000. They still be happy, only the amount of happiness will be different. It is gambling after all.

[OceanBit]

Although it has many qualities that are similar to gambling, such as luck, odds, and involves risking money, I don't think claw machines should be considered gambling. Because in claw machine any age can play the game, gambling has age restrictions when playing the games. Claw machines is a form of entertainment where you can get physical toys or plushies, although gambling is also seen as entertainment, claw machines are different in a way as for fun or challenge, than in gambling as risk-taking or financial gain or expectation of winning money.

[bakasabo]

Although it has many qualities that are similar to gambling, such as luck, odds, and involves risking money, I don't think claw machines should be considered gambling. Because in claw machine any age can play the game, gambling has age restrictions when playing the games. Claw machines is a form of entertainment where you can get physical toys or plushies, although gambling is also seen as entertainment, claw machines are different in a way as for fun or challenge, than in gambling as risk-taking or financial gain or expectation of winning money.

A person who play claw machine also risk money when he tries to pull out a toy. The cost of 1 game < toy price. Win a toy and sell it = get money. Gambling has age restriction, but when gambling online age is rarely asked. During regular gambling gamblers are also get portion of entertainment. People also get addicted when they want to pull out one specific toy or item and start depositing money into machine like nuts. Everything looks identical.

[Strongkored]

Do you consider this a category of gambling game? What are the chances on long run? Skills matter, or do you have to be lucky, nevertheless?

 

This is gambling because you risk money to be able to get a prize, and even this can lead you to addiction that's why this machine is widely available in shopping centers or any other place that people around because many are interested and they will try to play to get the desired prize which sometimes the money spent has exceeded the price of the prize targeted.
I think this is much more difficult than slot games to get win, because I have never won it even though many videos appear that also show how difficult it is to win prizes in this game, and sometimes I think this is designed so that the chances of getting a prize are almost 0, and I think those who can finally win are those who have spent enough money on this machine.

[OgNasty]

The way claw machines work is that the owner sets how strong the claw can grab and it randomly grabs with different levels of pressure. Every once in a while it grabs with enough pressure to let you win something. While people may fool themselves into thinking it is a game of skill, it is chance that you get a strong enough grip to grab something.

[TopTort777]

Claw machine is on a top of category of things to avoid with kids. Trying to impress or make kid happy, parents spend tons of money on it. Every parents wants to be kids hero, who has got a toy. Buying toy is different. Winning it in a game of luck owners greed is different.

I have googled gambling machine and found this https://www.gamblingcommission.gov.uk/licensees-and-businesses/guide/gaming-machine-categories. According to it, claw machine or crane machine are D category gambling machine. Same as coin pushers. Even wikipedia say that claw machine are considered as gambling devices in some jurisdictions.

[angrybirdy]

The way claw machines work is that the owner sets how strong the claw can grab and it randomly grabs with different levels of pressure. Every once in a while it grabs with enough pressure to let you win something. While people may fool themselves into thinking it is a game of skill, it is chance that you get a strong enough grip to grab something.

I have the same hunch, it's possible that the claw is set up on how tight or loose they can be to make it difficult for the players to get prizes. Of course, as a businessman who wants to make players happy, we can't agree that we won't make money from the machines we set up in our place, right? then others will even like to play it more because it is challenging to do. There are times when other players have techniques that make them win a lot of prizes, like when it was trending on social media that they used a magnet for the claw, but that's not allowed, because that's cheating.

[Dave1]

The way claw machines work is that the owner sets how strong the claw can grab and it randomly grabs with different levels of pressure. Every once in a while it grabs with enough pressure to let you win something. While people may fool themselves into thinking it is a game of skill, it is chance that you get a strong enough grip to grab something.

I have the same hunch, it's possible that the claw is set up on how tight or loose they can be to make it difficult for the players to get prizes. Of course, as a businessman who wants to make players happy, we can't agree that we won't make money from the machines we set up in our place, right? then others will even like to play it more because it is challenging to do. There are times when other players have techniques that make them win a lot of prizes, like when it was trending on social media that they used a magnet for the claw, but that's not allowed, because that's cheating.

And with that, maybe we can compare them to slot machines as well that can be set up with RTP so that it will be difficult for players to win same with claw machine and so it could be define as gambling already.

Maybe are hook in this game, specially young kids who is motivated to win big prices. But their young mind can't comprehend that the machine is rigged in the first place and the only way to win is by extreme luck that you get in at the right spot and bring it back to fall.

[Peanutswar]

This type of game is just a casual game but does not bring a huge return of rewards, imagine you spend a lot of money just to get the particular reward you want this just bring fun and thrill but if you tried to compute the number of expenses to the actual price is doesn't worth it at all, this brings different effect the player because they keep a hard work to get the reward on the machine so that's the thing but unlike in slot games there's a potential chance of winning you earned back your losses plus having a profit.

[Lida93]

Here's another definition I dug out from my own end which the first supports yours while the second definition supports my view too: That's why I can say we are both not wrong in which ever way to view claw machine  in regards to gambling

Definitions
1. play games of chance for money;
2. take risky action in the hope of a desired result.

Look at the two definitions and tell me which one appeals more to casinos, and sports betting. Your second definition pertains to life endeavors and has no correlation with casinos or sports betting. Having established this, do you now agree that claw machines is not gambling even though they can be rigged like slots machine. The difference between the two is that in the former you will prize while in the latter you win cash. However, arguing whether it gambling or not doesn't matter. From this Wikipedia article claw machine may be considered gambling depending on its jurisdiction.

For example in the state of California, claw machine according to the law is considered gambling device. See this answer given by an attorney in one of the online forums.

Yes, a claw machine is considered a gambling device under California law.According to the Bureau of Gaming Control, an illegal gambling device has three features: It is a machine, apparatus, or device (coin operation is not required); Something of value is given to play the device; and The player has the opportunity to receive something of value by any element of hazard orchance (“something of value” is not limited to coins, bills, or tokens—it also includes free replays, additional playing time, redemption tickets, gift cards, game credits, or anything else with a value, monetary or otherwise.) (Penal Code, §§ 330a, 330b & 330.1.)
https://www.justanswer.com/criminal-law/o97zs-claw-machine-considered-gambling-device.html

I wouldn't say I haven't learnt one or two from this and it's quite interesting that we could disagree to agree with proven details to back up the arguments. So it's all a Matter of jurisdiction about the claw machine. But then;

About the meaning of gambling, in a broad sense I think my second definition covers it all in all aspect of the sense of the word "gambling". And I  can say @Stepstowealth  has saved me a lot of explaining just with the way he has couched it with added example of real life issues, which goes to show that gambling or gambling doesn't have to mean just about getting cash as profit or reward but as a phenomenon it goes beyond just cash for a price.

I have never thought gambling could be restricted to only cash rewards until now when it has been a topic for debate and here I am actually wondering what I could describe or call this claw machine. 
For one, gambling has been used in reference to many concepts not only because money must be the used or earned, but also because it can refer to a very risky and deadly endeavor.
When parents speak to their children on making a decision about their academic future, they could often use a sentence that involves the word 'gamble,' but without meaning it to be, placing money to win or loss money.
For example, Please John, don't gamble away this once in a life time scholarship opportunity to study at this highly reputable college.
This sentence uses the word gamble but doesn't mean staking money to win or loss money.

[Fara Chan]

Although it has many qualities that are similar to gambling, such as luck, odds, and involves risking money, I don't think claw machines should be considered gambling. Because in claw machine any age can play the game, gambling has age restrictions when playing the games. Claw machines is a form of entertainment where you can get physical toys or plushies, although gambling is also seen as entertainment, claw machines are different in a way as for fun or challenge, than in gambling as risk-taking or financial gain or expectation of winning money.

So is it wrong for some people to consider this claw machine as gambling when there are people who never get anything after playing it several times? I don't think there is anything wrong with this kind of opinion by some people because in gambling there is also such a thing as luck, even though not all ages are allowed to gamble because they remember the risks that must be understood. But it seems like this claw machine can be considered as anything because it wouldn't be wrong if someone thought of it as entertainment or gambling.

[qwertyup23]

Hmm this is an interesting take- some might argue that it can be gambling; while others may view this as a source of entertainment. Personally, I view it as a form of gambling due to the nature and the risks involved.

In a claw machine, a person would need a coin in order to gain an attempt of getting the prize through the "claw" when you successfully snatched the item. Some may say that there has no skills involved in this game but again, slot machines are purely by luck.

The element of money is involved since you have to spend in order to gain an attempt. The element of prize is also involved since the "prize" is the toy or the item inside the machine. Lastly, the element of luck is present since there are times where the position of the items play a crucial factor on whether you could be successful or not.

In conclusion, claw machines are a form of gambling though not as aggressive compared to others due to the prize that a person may win.

[rahmad2nd]

~~
Do you consider this a category of gambling game? What are the chances on long run? Skills matter, or do you have to be lucky, nevertheless?

~~

to be honest, I never once played it in physical mode.  but at least a few times in online mode, even in ordinary games that are not related to betting. referring to your question, I actually can't answer for sure. however, based on my assumptions, this type of claw machine game can be classified as gambling. yeah, like you said. someone who wants to play it, has to dig into their pockets before they can start running the claw machine. It's just that there are differences with real betting or gambling, whether fictional or online based.
As far as I know, claw machines don't have to spend a large bankroll like we make deposits on our favorite casino sites. The claw machine has been set up in such a way, without having to involve large funds. I mean, just one penny we can use this machine. although, sometimes someone can do it repeatedly in order to get the available prizes. of course, we are very familiar with this claw machine, starting from dolls and currently innovating with the various prizes provided. yeah, at least in my country the prizes were initially dolls. but now, there is a variety offered by this type of claw machine. In essence, if money is involved, it is already classified as betting mode. although, there are differences with real gambling. Well, if I observe, there are many who try to do various tricks to get the prizes available. Sometimes, there are those who succeed even though they have done it repeatedly. but I can't comment too far, because I've never really played it. Whether using skills will work, I don't have the answer. I think luck also plays an important role when we play it.

[348Judah]

Nowadays you can find these claw machines in many stores, restaurants and malls. They are popular among young people, and are always shining captivating colours to the eyes. Most of them reward soft toy or cuddly toy and electronic gadgets, while there are also few versions where you can grab paper money available. You just have to be skilled enough to manage collecting the prize with the claw, dropping it into the collect box right after.

In order to play, you have to risk money from your pocket for a single or few attempts with the claw. In most attempts, however, it's like the prize will slip from the claw or you won't even achieve collecting anything with it, since it's made of a slippy metal.

Do you consider this a category of gambling game? What are the chances on long run? Skills matter, or do you have to be lucky, nevertheless?

 

Maybe is something more or less to a raffle draw whereby you win base on what your luck gives, it could actually be another form of having entertainment in satisfying their customers through engaging them into playing any of these games, but i don't want to see it as gambling since you're not using your personal money with the intention of winning or losing the bet you place, they are not gambling at all, but it may appear so to some as some of these shopping malls make use of such during their promo offers to their customers.

[Oilacris]

Although it has many qualities that are similar to gambling, such as luck, odds, and involves risking money, I don't think claw machines should be considered gambling. Because in claw machine any age can play the game, gambling has age restrictions when playing the games. Claw machines is a form of entertainment where you can get physical toys or plushies, although gambling is also seen as entertainment, claw machines are different in a way as for fun or challenge, than in gambling as risk-taking or financial gain or expectation of winning money.

So is it wrong for some people to consider this claw machine as gambling when there are people who never get anything after playing it several times? I don't think there is anything wrong with this kind of opinion by some people because in gambling there is also such a thing as luck, even though not all ages are allowed to gamble because they remember the risks that must be understood. But it seems like this claw machine can be considered as anything because it wouldn't be wrong if someone thought of it as entertainment or gambling.

We do have our own impressions on things but we do know that when it comes to these claw machines then it would really be just that not that wrong on telling that these are gambling but actually
this is really just that for fun. You would really make yourself paying up for some fee or bet or whatever to get that stuff toys or whatsoever prize inside that machine. Risks is there but
when it comes to overall idea on how these machines been created in the first place then it is really just that for fun. There are really just that people who are really that having those kind of
insights that it is really just that like betting. This is why it would really just that a matter of approach which it isnt really that wrong after all.

[tottong]

Do you consider this a category of gambling game?

I think it's another part of gambling, but the game is different and most of the people who play on claw machines like that are quite young, although there are some older people who also play.

What are the chances on long run?

It is gaming in nature and perhaps in the long run it has the potential to reach a much bigger stage, because when people bring their families to such places they can play while enjoying the challenge.
After all, when we visit certain places we will also spend money and maybe it will become a place for children to play.

Skills matter, or do you have to be lucky, nevertheless?

This type of game is available in several places such as shopping centers and places where money games are made, what I see is that there are many games of this kind that are starting to be made for the benefit of young people. I don't think you need skill to play this game because it still relies on luck.

[summonerrk]

Have you ever noticed how rare it is to see someone actually win in a claw machine?
It seems that these toys are always out of reach. I wonder if there is a way to check the winning percentage in any claw machine. It would be interesting to know if these are really fair games or if they are designed to make winning almost impossible.

I am not sure if these arcades have been setting up and making it easy to believe that each of us can win those toys that can easily be reached. It seems to me that they hire someone or one of their staff pretends to be a goer and just plays there casually with a lot of tokens and trying to get those toys that even if they're far from reach, they're attracting us as if they're easy to make. I am not sure if those tiktok videos that I have watched showing some tricks on how to easily take those toys are for real. It's a setup I believe and there's no hack in it and they are more of a promotional video that they're doing to attract goers go to them and buy tons of tokens or avail their discounted prices and promos.

I don't think that they're a fair game and none of them really is fair because it's a business. Expect that these games that can be found in amusement parks and arcades are there to play fair only for the establishment itself while giving small percentage of winners win. You see that these claw machines won't really have a strong grip unless you go in Japan and I think that games there are fairer and they're honest people. So, in the conclusion if these are gambling, I'd say yes. The same goes for the casinos that has their own tokens, we exchange real fiat money in exchange for their native tokens to be admitted and allowed to play inside.

I think that promoters know perfectly well how to advertise a claw machine, and that's why there are so many videos with "secrets of success" in TikTok and similar video services where pretty girls easily pull out toys. I don't believe any of these videos and consider them promotional.

Judge for yourself: if you were the owner of a many o claw machines, would you not have made such promotional videos? after all, their cost is scanty: a hired girl and a tik tok.

[Twentyonepaylots]

It really depends on how an individual will view the claw machine. It can be viewed as gambling since you are risking your money. If money is involved and players are playing for the prize, especially if they are spending a lot, then it can be interpreted as gambling since some of the claw machines are influenced by chance. Another thing we can consider is that if the grip of the claw in the machine is randomized every time you try, it can be considered gambling since there are chances involved. On the other hand, it cannot be considered gambling since players are using a joystick or a controller to control the claw. With that, players are using their skill to get the prize rather than luck or chance, which are the key factors of gambling like slots and lottery. 

Gambling or not, the more important thing is that the player is having fun!