2 cold wallets for my crypto assets

[RaraAvis]

Hi all.
I am about to set up my first cold wallet (Ledger Nano X that is - still unboxed).
Still enquiring about it watching YouTube videos about its security, as I am not 100% about how secure is a cold wallet with a Bluetooth connection. Because every coin has the other side and Bluetooth would work both ways to your benefit and to benefit of hackers.
In this video the guy says that Ledger's cold wallet proven themselves not to be so very secure and suggested buying Tangem cold wallet instead.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YekyEj8TUAM

Could you please tell me, knowledgeable people, would it be possible to place my crypto assets on both devices at the same time and, if yes, then, if for example my Nano X would get hacked, Tangem will still have them? Or, if they are gone from one wallet they'd be gone from all cold wallets, because hacker would authorise transactions for me?

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[Stalker22]

Could you please tell me, knowledgeable people, would it be possible to place my crypto assets on both devices at the same time and, if yes, then, if for example my Nano X would get hacked, Tangem will still have them? Or, if they are gone from one wallet they'd be gone from all cold wallets, because hacker would authorise transactions for me?

You can create two separate wallets. One on each device. Clearly, if one of them gets hacked, the other will be safe. But in that case, you have to spread your funds between two different addresses, each on a separate wallet.

Or, you can create your wallet on one device. Then use the backup seed phrase to import the same wallet to another device. In that case, both wallets will hold the same funds, but if either of them gets hacked, your funds are gone.

But the most important question, why would you use two different devices for the same wallet (unless it is due to redundancy). If you do not trust the Ledger wallet, why use it at all?

[Dunamisx]

Hi all.
I am about to set up my first cold wallet (Ledger Nano X that is - still unboxed).
Still enquiring about it watching YouTube videos about its security, as I am not 100% about how secure is a cold wallet with a Bluetooth connection. Because every coin has the other side and Bluetooth would work both ways to your benefit and to benefit of hackers.

If to say you have not bought it yet, i would have advised that you change from ledger to Trezor hardware wallet, all because the privacy with the use of ledger wallet is not secured for its users, i have no idea on using any before now and i don't think the use of Bluetooth connecting on it should have any negative impact as well as when connected to your device, only that they have made their privacy i big concern for users to rely on them with that.

[nakamura12]

OP, you can create or have two cold wallets because it is better if you have more than one wallet rather than having only one wallet. There is a saying "don't put your eggs in one basket" and you can say that if someone did have access to your wallet and contains all your coins or crypto then it is possible to take it all.

You can create two separate wallets. One on each device. Clearly, if one of them gets hacked, the other will be safe. But in that case, you have to spread your funds between two different addresses, each on a separate wallet.

This is what OP wanted which is to have two different cold wallets in the same device. I think that's what OP wanted to know if it's possible to have two cold wallets in a single device or not but we know that it is possible. I'd say the same thing as you which is to spread the funds so that if someone or a hacker gets access to the wallet then the hacker won't be able to get all the funds that OP has because it's in different wallets.

[RaraAvis]

But the most important question, why would you use two different devices for the same wallet (unless it is due to redundancy). If you do not trust the Ledger wallet, why use it at all?

I am not using 2 different devices for the same wallet yet - I am here to ask if that would make sense.

I did not say I do not trust Ledger wallet, I am saying I am not sure that Bluetooth makes it very secure.

I am here for reassurance - for someone knowledgeable to tell me, that it is very secure and I shouldn't be worried and try to come up with different kind of crazy schemes because of my concerns.

[Saint-loup]

This is what OP wanted which is to have two different cold wallets in the same device. I think that's what OP wanted to know if it's possible to have two cold wallets in a single device or not but we know that it is possible. I'd say the same thing as you which is to spread the funds so that if someone or a hacker gets access to the wallet then the hacker won't be able to get all the funds that OP has because it's in different wallets.

No you're wrong, he talked about Tangem in the OP, maybe you don't know about it, but it's a totally different device from Ledger. I wouldn't say it's totally irrelevant to use 2 different devices with the same wallet/seed on it because it's allow you to safeguard your seed in to 2 different places which is good for the safety of the availability of the funds. But it's certainly a better idea to use 2 different seeds/wallets on the 2 devices and to back up the seeds in another way.

[NeuroticFish]

I see OP has asked the same question in many places, to make all the discussion even more confusing (even for himself).
I will cross-post my answer:

Could you please tell me, knowledgeable people, would it be possible to place my crypto assets on both devices at the same time and, if yes, then, if for example my Nano X would get hacked, Tangem will still have them? Or, if they are gone from one wallet they'd be gone from all cold wallets, because hacker would authorise transactions for me?

OK, you misunderstood the bitcoin wallets, so let me try to explain.
The bitcoins are not in a bitcoin wallet. Ever. They are (let's say it simple) on the blockchain.
The wallet only holds the KEYS to the bitcoins. The key to spend them, more exactly. Only who has the correct keys for certain bitcoins can spend them (send them away).
And yes, the wallet helps you do certain operations with your keys - usually this means facilitating the spending.

So, if 2 hardware wallets have the same seed will generate the same keys and any of them can be used to spend.
If somebody else will get the seed he will spend/send away all the bitcoins (that can be spent by your keys, so "your" bitcoins) so you no longer have access to them, no matter how many hardware wallets you hold.

Clearer?

[RaraAvis]

OK, you misunderstood the bitcoin wallets, so let me try to explain.
The bitcoins are not in a bitcoin wallet. Ever. They are (let's say it simple) on the blockchain.
The wallet only holds the KEYS to the bitcoins. The key to spend them, more exactly. Only who has the correct keys for certain bitcoins can spend them (send them away).
And yes, the wallet helps you do certain operations with your keys - usually this means facilitating the spending.

So, if 2 hardware wallets have the same seed will generate the same keys and any of them can be used to spend.
If somebody else will get the seed he will spend/send away all the bitcoins (that can be spent by your keys, so "your" bitcoins) so you no longer have access to them, no matter how many hardware wallets you hold.

Clearer?

Yes I think I understood what you said the first time, I just didn't realise that your crypto is still on the blockchain even when in your wallet.

I was wondering: if your crypto is on the blockchain wouldn't it make sense to encrypt your personal details to ad to your assets so no one could steal them?
That way this crypto would be yours forever until sold?

Michael Saylor said that crypto is the only asset you can take to the grave because no one can know your seed phrase.

How come then Ledger Nano X were hacked??

[Zaguru12]

I am not using 2 different devices for the same wallet yet - I am here to ask if that would make sense.

I did not say I do not trust Ledger wallet, I am saying I am not sure that Bluetooth makes it very secure.

I am here for reassurance - for someone knowledgeable to tell me, that it is very secure and I shouldn't be worried and try to come up with different kind of crazy schemes because of my concerns.

It would not make sense to use two different wallet to store just hold one seed phrase or same wallet. The best is having different wallet on both two hardware wallets such that if one is compromised you don’t lose the funds on the other. Another idea is you can one wallet on two different wallets device with two different seed phrase by setting up a 2-2 multi sig wallet. If one gets compromised the attacker still needs the other to move out funds from that wallet

I was wondering: if your crypto is on the blockchain wouldn't it make sense to encrypt your personal details to ad to your assets so no one could steal them?
That way this crypto would be yours forever until sold?

Michael Saylor said that crypto is the only asset you can take to the grave because no one can know your seed phrase.

How come then Ledger Nano X were hacked??

Yes the security of your wallet depends on how you treat your wallet entirely. First thing is where is your wallet connected and how to do you store your seed phrase. Just like Saylor said the seed phrase can be saved securely without anyone knowing if it is done offline and stored in a secure places.

The Ledger Nano X can be hacked if an hacker gets physical access to that hardware wallet and possibly breaks in by knowing the PIN. Or better still if the company keeps hold of your seed phrase and an hacker attacks there data base and steal does informations or details (this is one of the reasons why Ledger is not advised because of their back up of one’s seed phrase)

[FatFork]

Yes I think I understood what you said the first time, I just didn't realise that your crypto is still on the blockchain even when in your wallet.

"Crypto" is a broad term. There are tons of different cryptocurrencies out there, some working in slightly different ways.  Let's just stick to Bitcoin. That way, we can answer your questions more precisely.

In simple terms, wallets store your keys, which are essential for accessing your coins on the blockchain. Anyone who gets their hands on your wallet and its keys can also access your coins. It's like losing your apartment or car keys – if someone finds them, having another set hidden away won't help.

I was wondering: if your crypto is on the blockchain wouldn't it make sense to encrypt your personal details to ad to your assets so no one could steal them?
That way this crypto would be yours forever until sold?

All good wallets encrypt your personal data (private keys). That's why you have to enter a password or pin to unlock it.

How come then Ledger Nano X were hacked??

How come anything gets hacked? There is no such thing as absolute security.

[hugeblack]

How come then Ledger Nano X were hacked??

If Ledger knows your private key, there is no point in using it as a hardware wallet as the main purpose of these devices is to ensure that the private key generation is offline. Instead of trying your luck and venturing into using their hardware, why not use better, open source HW wallets?

[dansus021]

I would suggest you to use 2 wallet

1. Cold wallet to keep all your money and not connected to the internet unless you send it and use this wallet for HODL only and use hardware wallet
2. Hot wallet to use everyday and connected to internet you can use it for play with Defi like pancake or uniswap or anything like that

[pawanjain]

Hi all.
I am about to set up my first cold wallet (Ledger Nano X that is - still unboxed).
Still enquiring about it watching YouTube videos about its security, as I am not 100% about how secure is a cold wallet with a Bluetooth connection. Because every coin has the other side and Bluetooth would work both ways to your benefit and to benefit of hackers.
In this video the guy says that Ledger's cold wallet proven themselves not to be so very secure and suggested buying Tangem cold wallet instead.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YekyEj8TUAM

Could you please tell me, knowledgeable people, would it be possible to place my crypto assets on both devices at the same time and, if yes, then, if for example my Nano X would get hacked, Tangem will still have them? Or, if they are gone from one wallet they'd be gone from all cold wallets, because hacker would authorise transactions for me?

I think you can use same address on 2 separate devices but that doesn't mean your coins have double security.
If your ledger gets hacked and your coins are stolen from that device then your other device will reflect the same balance as on ledger.
If coins are transferred from one device then it will reflect the same on other.
It would be better to use two separate wallets instead and divide your coins among them.
This would decrease your risk of getting your coins stolen by 50%.

[Outhue]

Do not open a fresh account on Tangem and then proceed to import the account into the Ledger wallet, because it seems this is what you are talking about? Ifbyes its a bad idea.

If  one of these wallets get hacked, they are both gone, I will sell the ledger if I were you, since its still unboxed, and keep the tangem, this Tangem wallet as better feature and its open source too, ledger isn't an open source hardware wallet.

A single hardware wallet is enough for any amount of assets you own or plan to own, but if you insist on having two hardware wallet, then replace the Ledger with a Trezor wallet instead.

[boyptc]

I would suggest you to use 2 wallet

1. Cold wallet to keep all your money and not connected to the internet unless you send it and use this wallet for HODL only and use hardware wallet
2. Hot wallet to use everyday and connected to internet you can use it for play with Defi like pancake or uniswap or anything like that

This is what I do but I hope that OP wont be using the ledger recover feature.

It is best to have that cold storage or wallet that you will store your funds and you will not connect it to the internet but just once in a while.

And stick only to the known ones, many haven't heard of this tangem thing.

[RaraAvis]

Hello again everyone and thank you for participating in this discussion.

I understood all the points that you made. The main two of which are:

1. Do not connect your cold wallet to the internet unless absolutely necessary!
2. If you own 2 or more cold storage wallets split your funds evenly among them for extra security.

I have few more questions if you don't mind:

1. If your cold wallet is offline 99% of the time does that mean that if/when offline it cannot be hacked?
2. Those who read this question please let me know which cold wallet you would choose if you were me with the knowledge you have today?
3. Why open source cold wallet is better than none open source wallets?

I could probably read about these things but my head is spinning already, my brain just can't process so much information within such a short time and it is very difficult to make a decision on your own without asking those who know all ins and outs of it already.

Last question:

Maybe if I keep Laedger Nano X that I got here on my desk offline I shouldn't worry about my funds being safe? And shouldn't look further? What do you think?

[KiaKia]

Hi all.
I am about to set up my first cold wallet (Ledger Nano X that is - still unboxed).
Still enquiring about it watching YouTube videos about its security, as I am not 100% about how secure is a cold wallet with a Bluetooth connection. Because every coin has the other side and Bluetooth would work both ways to your benefit and to benefit of hackers.
In this video the guy says that Ledger's cold wallet proven themselves not to be so very secure and suggested buying Tangem cold wallet instead.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YekyEj8TUAM

Could you please tell me, knowledgeable people, would it be possible to place my crypto assets on both devices at the same time and, if yes, then, if for example my Nano X would get hacked, Tangem will still have them? Or, if they are gone from one wallet they'd be gone from all cold wallets, because hackers would authorize transactions for me?

Unfortunately, Ledger has not been doing a great job so far, It is a closed-source hardware wallet, and the team is not very reliable either, Trezor is a better choice, so why not sell this Ledger since you said it's not opened yet, and use the money to buy Trezor hardware wallet?

The feature I look for in a hardware wallet is cold storage with no internet access available, this makes your asset safer than others, and this is why I like Keystone and others like it.

Using the same recovery seed on two separate hardware wallets is not good, if one is down the other follows, its too many risks, instead I will advise splitting your assets and send into two separate wallets, like the Trezor and another hardware wallet, this means that you have to safeguard two different recovery seeds.

[Coyster]

1. If your cold wallet is offline 99% of the time does that mean that if/when offline it cannot be hacked?

If it is offline and isn't connected to the internet, it cannot be hacked. Having said that, if it is offline 99% of the time, and online for only 1% of the time, then there is a chance it can be hacked, in other words, your cold wallet must never be connected to the internet.

2. Those who read this question please let me know which cold wallet you would choose if you were me with the knowledge you have today?

Choose a hardware wallet:
Open source hardware wallet
Airgapped hardware wallet

3. Why open source cold wallet is better than none open source wallets?

In open source wallets you can check/review the original code by yourself and make sure it is safe for use, in closed source wallets you have to depend on or trust the developers because you cannot review the original code.

[RaraAvis]

Unfortunately, Ledger has not been doing a great job so far, It is a closed-source hardware wallet, and the team is not very reliable either, Trezor is a better choice, so why not sell this Ledger since you said it's not opened yet, and use the money to buy Trezor hardware wallet?

The feature I look for in a hardware wallet is cold storage with no internet access available, this makes your asset safer than others, and this is why I like Keystone and others like it.

Using the same recovery seed on two separate hardware wallets is not good, if one is down the other follows, its too many risks, instead I will advise splitting your assets and send into two separate wallets, like the Trezor and another hardware wallet, this means that you have to safeguard two different recovery seeds.

This is what I needed to hear. Thank you!

1. If your cold wallet is offline 99% of the time does that mean that if/when offline it cannot be hacked?

If it is offline and isn't connected to the internet, it cannot be hacked. Having said that, if it is offline 99% of the time, and online for only 1% of the time, then there is a chance it can be hacked, in other words, your cold wallet must never be connected to the internet.

2. Those who read this question please let me know which cold wallet you would choose if you were me with the knowledge you have today?

Choose a hardware wallet:
Open source hardware wallet
Airgapped hardware wallet

3. Why open source cold wallet is better than none open source wallets?

In open source wallets you can check/review the original code by yourself and make sure it is safe for use, in closed source wallets you have to depend on or trust the developers because you cannot review the original code.

Thank you!

[moderator's note: consecutive posts merged]

[NeuroticFish]

1. If your cold wallet is offline 99% of the time does that mean that if/when offline it cannot be hacked?

As said, it matters more to be offline than whether it's started or not.
I will add that in theory a hardware wallet should (absolutely) never send out the seed and just sign the transaction they should. Of course, in reality Ledger decided "heck with that", sadly.

2. Those who read this question please let me know which cold wallet you would choose if you were me with the knowledge you have today?

There are hardware wallets that work completely offline and transfer information only via images.
You should take a look at 55 Hardware Wallets, compared feature by feature
Getting those open source and 100% airgapped should be a good step forward.

Also, if you consider them expensive and are you sure you can generate a proper seed by throwing dices (but beware, it's not as easy as you'd think, please read the topics on the matter in this forum) you can add for example SeedSigner to your list.

3. Why open source cold wallet is better than none open source wallets?

Because if it's closed source there can be literally anything in that code, including, as Ledger has shown, the possibility to extract the seed. Or the seed generator can be flawed (intentionally or not) and the seed is from a narrow set and can be found by brute force. Or... really sky is the limit.