Have you stopped using bitcoin for small transactions completely ?

[hd49728]

Instead I find myself using Dogecoin & Litecoin more frequently -- fees are almost nil so sometimes it makes sense to do a conversion, especially if an exchange is gonna charge you an arm and a leg for withdrawing BTC.

With you examples, I understand that you want to use Proof of Work altcoins as your alternatives for Bitcoin. You don't mention any Smart contract altcoin and I can feel that you don't like them. I agree with your practice too because using Proof of Work altcoins is safer than Smart contract altcoins.

With Smart contracts, your altcoins can be frozen even you store them in your non custodial wallets. Blockchains and transactions can be rolled back by centralized teams and smart contracts too.

PSA: Most Stablecoins Can Be Frozen, Even in Your Own Wallets

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[Charles-Tim]

the question is have people stopped using bitcoin.. not have people started using other networks

I have stopped using bitcoin for small transaction but which is not what I will like to talk about directly. That was the reason for my indirectly reply. That people can use bitcoin lightning network, altcoins pegged with bitcoin but which has some disadvantages because it can depeg from bitcoin, or to use altcoins instead.

why do some people keep trying t promote other networks while pretending by using other networks they are still using bitcoin

I still use the bitcoin network but for transaction that seem high to me and also that would be when the network is less congested like 30 sat/vbyte or more lower fee rate.

other networks ARE NOT BITCOIN, even LN is not

Lightning network can be beyond bitcoin but bitcoin lightning network is about bitcoin stored offchain. It is bitcoin.

[KiaKia]

Small transactions on bitcoin does not make any sense now at all. Like to make a $20 amount transaction, one has to pay about same amount, $20 in fees. This does not make any sense. Have you stopped using bitcoin for small transactions completely because of this reason ?

Have you ever found yourself in a position whereby you are trying to purchase something and they only accept Bitcoin payment? This was how I ended up paying for something that I really needed but have no choice than to use a high-transaction fee.

If you ever found yourself in such situation you won't have any choice than to proceed unless you really don't need that thing.

Apart from this situations, I don't have any reasons to use Bitcoin to pay for anything unless what I am trying to pay for is worth the money and the transaction fee, all thanks to other Blockchain projects, in fact, the majority prefer to use stable coin aka USDT or USDC to make payment online than Bitcoin.

[kryptqnick]

I don't use on-chain Bitcoin for small transactions, considering the fees. Come to think of it, when fees are above $10, I try not to use on-chain Bitcoin at all. But that doesn't mean I fully stop using it, as I do have small amounts on centralized platforms (for gambling and betting on sports). Since money's already there, small transactions are possible there without any fees, and Bitcoin can still be useful. I know it's different and that it's not a solution, but it also means not stopping using Bitcoin for small transactions completely.

[hd49728]

I don't use on-chain Bitcoin for small transactions, considering the fees. Come to think of it, when fees are above $10, I try not to use on-chain Bitcoin at all.

We can wait for cheap transaction fee time to consolidate small inputs or make on chain transactions to deposit our bitcoins to gambling site or centralized exchange. Consolidate small inputs when fee is cheap, is very good preparation for future on chain transaction when fee is expensive and we don't have time for waiting.

But that doesn't mean I fully stop using it, as I do have small amounts on centralized platforms (for gambling and betting on sports). Since money's already there, small transactions are possible there without any fees, and Bitcoin can still be useful. I know it's different and that it's not a solution, but it also means not stopping using Bitcoin for small transactions completely.

This case you are doing internal transfers, not on-chain transfers if I see it right. Gambling sites and centralized exchanges simply credit you a number you want to transfer or tip from one account to another account. They only proceed an on-chain transaction when a user submit a withdrawal request.

[rodskee]

Have you stopped using bitcoin for small transactions completely because of this reason ?

No i haven't stopped using bitcoin for small transactions. The reason is i the highest i spend on transaction fees is $2.3 which is affordable to me. Anything exceeding that range i find another means to make the payment. Although sometimes the fees are way less and sometimes congestions happen in the blockchain where the fees would be up to the $20 you mentioned. In such cases i would not use bitcoin for transactions anymore until the the fees comes down.

If we can wait a little time the fees are decreasing in such time but the problem about
others are they don't know or wanted to use customization and the one lower fee transacting
in which Lightning network.

However congestion doesn't stay for long and i dont buy things using bitcoin everyday. Most times only when i want to gamble or pay for something online that is when i make use of Bitcoin. Either am not really affected with high fees.

correct , we can wait for short period to the fee lowering and that is a normal way
for people like us who knows how it works.

[Crypt0Gore]

Small transactions on bitcoin does not make any sense now at all. Like to make a $20 amount transaction, one has to pay about same amount, $20 in fees. This does not make any sense. Have you stopped using bitcoin for small transactions completely because of this reason ?

Right now it takes a dollar to make a transaction on Bitcoin but even with a dollar I dont want to make any transaction under $10 using one dollar, I prefer using another blockchain instead.

Don't stress it, the higher the success of a crypto project the more its transaction fee will grow, even the cheaper ones like Tron and others gas fee are still cheap because their value are still very small.

It's been a long time since I've paid for something using Bitcoin, but the last time that I did I paid for something that's over $800 in value using $4 at the time as the transaction fee.

The convenience about paying with Bitcoin is that it happens in private.

[leeboy]

Even big transactions on bitcoin can be painful if you are lucky enough to wait for 50 minutes for new block. Im using ltc for payments mostly

[Rabbitqt]

Small transactions on bitcoin does not make any sense now at all. Like to make a $20 amount transaction, one has to pay about same amount, $20 in fees. This does not make any sense. Have you stopped using bitcoin for small transactions completely because of this reason ?

Yes but regardless of transfer size I always transfer using LTC then convert to BTC.

[DanWalker]

Instead I find myself using Dogecoin & Litecoin more frequently -- fees are almost nil so sometimes it makes sense to do a conversion, especially if an exchange is gonna charge you an arm and a leg for withdrawing BTC.

With you examples, I understand that you want to use Proof of Work altcoins as your alternatives for Bitcoin. You don't mention any Smart contract altcoin and I can feel that you don't like them. I agree with your practice too because using Proof of Work altcoins is safer than Smart contract altcoins.

With Smart contracts, your altcoins can be frozen even you store them in your non custodial wallets. Blockchains and transactions can be rolled back by centralized teams and smart contracts too.

PSA: Most Stablecoins Can Be Frozen, Even in Your Own Wallets

But no one will have time to freeze your account if you don't have too much money and that money is related to money laundering, hacking...even centralized exchanges, they will not freeze your account for no reason if you comply with their regulations. I see many people like to buy bitcoin, USDT or altcoins of unknown origin outside at cheap prices then switch to exchanges and immediately their accounts are locked. They started spreading negativity on social networks but they did not admit that they bought bitcoins from hacked sources.

[GbitG]

Small transactions on bitcoin does not make any sense now at all. Like to make a $20 amount transaction, one has to pay about same amount, $20 in fees. This does not make any sense. Have you stopped using bitcoin for small transactions completely because of this reason ?

In Bitcoin we have a high fee and the Lightning network has the same lack of privacy, like it can be easily vulnerable for a fraud and nasty (malicious) attacks. So both have their porn and corn. I have never used Lighting Network because I have not done small transactions in Bitcoin and if I have, I have resorted to Altcoin because it has a low fee for small transactions.
 
So it is true that Bitcoin doesn't make any sense for small transactions because for small transactions paying a high fee is not a wise act Despite, if we talk about doing small transactions, then now i would go for Lightning Network. because Lighting Network is much more fast than others, and the best thing is that his low fee like almost equal to Zero. So Lighting Network have been used by many users since September 2023 almost 1.2 million people i.e Social media tipping, Streaming sector etc. This shows that many people prefer the Lightning Network for small transactions. due low fee and within a few seconds, the transaction is done.

[Z390]

Small transactions on bitcoin does not make any sense now at all. Like to make a $20 amount transaction, one has to pay about same amount, $20 in fees. This does not make any sense. Have you stopped using bitcoin for small transactions completely because of this reason ?

I have fallen into the category too, I do not use Bitcoin for small transactions anymore, I use other crypto coins and prefer to keep holding my Bitcoin, the only things I can use my Bitcoin to purchase are lands, houses or cars, heavy stuffs that are costly.

As for those who hate altcoins, this is one of the reasons why you should be thankful that altcoins exist, they are faster and cheaper, more suited for payment solutions than Bitcoin, I wonder what it will feel like to make transactions using Bitcoin when $150,000 per Bitcoin is happening.

There are Litecoin, Dogecoin, Kaspa, BCH, Tron, and many more that are good for settling a small debt or transactions, there aren't many online stores accepting crypto payment in general but even if there are tons of them it still won't make people to start using Bitcoin as payment settlement when others are available.

[Easteregg69]

Nexo has no fee on wd.. On my tier.

[Easteregg69]

Small transactions on bitcoin does not make any sense now at all. Like to make a $20 amount transaction, one has to pay about same amount, $20 in fees. This does not make any sense. Have you stopped using bitcoin for small transactions completely because of this reason ?

I have fallen into the category too, I do not use Bitcoin for small transactions anymore, I use other crypto coins and prefer to keep holding my Bitcoin, the only things I can use my Bitcoin to purchase are lands, houses or cars, heavy stuffs that are costly.

As for those who hate altcoins, this is one of the reasons why you should be thankful that altcoins exist, they are faster and cheaper, more suited for payment solutions than Bitcoin, I wonder what it will feel like to make transactions using Bitcoin when $150,000 per Bitcoin is happening.

There are Litecoin, Dogecoin, Kaspa, BCH, Tron, and many more that are good for settling a small debt or transactions, there aren't many online stores accepting crypto payment in general but even if there are tons of them it still won't make people to start using Bitcoin as payment settlement when others are available.

Listen man. BTC is the /dev/null of money at this stadium. You learn to love altcoins.

So far I have only been able to pay for virtual services. On the internet.

Meaning: I am not gonna buy a real bulldozer and run it over your house with the real money! Cheers! I be on defense.

It makes sense as long as you get rugged by fee's.

[philipma1957]

Isn't it obvious though, that when the fees are high, making a small transaction doesn't make any sense. But it doesn't mean we will go on the argument that Bitcoin should increases and be a big blockers, we have that kind of Bitcoin forks and they seem to die down already.

And it's not Bitcoin's fault that the fees are getting ridiculous, it's a deliberate attack on the network itself and just trying to put pressure on the devs and other individuals. Anyhow, for now, it's better not to do another small transactions and the best thing to do is wait for the mempool to clear.

Also there is a option called LN (Lightning Network).

bitcoin has no technical reason to be restrained. its dev political motivated. when you follow the funding and roadmap plans of core devs it is their plan to segregate and migrate people away from native use of bitcoin. bitcoin core added an exploit 8 years ago, which is being abused 2years ago to cause these annoyances/attacks and core devs have had 8 years of knowledge of the exploit and a few years of seeing the annoying results of its impact. but all they care about is migrating people away from using the bitcoin network.
even those performing the attack/annoyance are funded by the same groups promoting the segregation of majority/trying to push people into migrating people over to the other network(rich/poor divide)

anyone telling people to:
use another network
stop using bitcoin
wait weeks, month, years and hope the utopia fixes itself

is not a ally/friend of bitcoin

if they think their reasons are justified that spending $50 for 1 tx is fine but spending $50 spread over several years for a hard drive to store decades of transactions is some how bad economics.. those fools have their maths the wrong way round, and no understanding of math/economics of utility

as for the 'do nothing, just wait' i think 8 years of waiting for the promises of bitcoin scaling to offer more transactions of cheaper fee is enough waiting. lets accept it the promises made 8 years ago have not been met. and no, other networks are not the solution. they are the diversion

other networks only provide small niche sub services of options. and should not be thought of as the ultimate replacement utility.

its funny how those that support other networks are the solution where 'small' transactions should occur. but in same breath they dont want the 'small' transactions of bloat/spam to be stopped

anyone promoting to not censor junk, but to sensor genuine bitcoiner utility have thigns the wrong way round
bitcoin HAD rules to articulate every byte as having purpose. those rules have been softened and many transactions always have been:
'dropped', 'scrubbed', 'evicted', 'orphaned', 'pruned', 'unrelayed' and many other terms that made bitcoin clean and purposeful.
suggesting bitcoin should be filled with junk but actual use should be delayed/migrated elsewhere is a social-con, a social abuse of trying to suggest bitcoin shouldnt be used by bitcoiners

so if you use the main chain and do a 1 sat I think the lowest fee is 162 sats per tx.

which means at 100 mill a btc the fee would always be at least $162 usd.
at 10 mill a btc the fee would always be at least $16.20 usd
at 1 mill a btc the fee  would always be at least $1.62
at 100 thou a btc the would always be at least 16.2 cents

so we are pretty close to 100 k a coin  this means buying a 2 dollar item and paying at least 16 cents is pretty much going to be the lowest we ever pay.

and this means the main blockchain simply can’t work for small tranasctions.

who wants  to pay 16 cents on two dollars on a good day. no one really.

thus there are three realistic choices once btc gets to 100 k.

use doge
use ltc
use ln

it is simply not that the stats fees  are high this is that a sat has more and more value.

somewhere in the 100k to 1 million a btc smallest fee will be not practical.

I am not paying 16 cents to 1.62 for one or two dollar btc moves.


we are at 10-11 cents for the lowest chain fee of 162 sats.  I have zero desire to pay 10 cents to send 1 or 2 dollars.

I just sent 100 usd in LTC  to buy a Nano 3 my send cost was under 1 penny

if btc was letting 1 sat I would have spent 10 cents.

[peter0425]

Small transactions on bitcoin does not make any sense now at all. Like to make a $20 amount transaction, one has to pay about same amount, $20 in fees. This does not make any sense. Have you stopped using bitcoin for small transactions completely because of this reason ?

Yes actually which is just proof of the concern we have that must be addressed if we want to use bitcoin as intended. Even if it’s not for payment but rather investment purposes, lots of investors are still hesitant to buy or sell because of the high price of transactions.

Some end up waiting trying to save more funds but then bitcoin just becomes more and more expensive so it’s harder to find the right time to make these transactions

[sokani]

Small transactions on bitcoin does not make any sense now at all. Like to make a $20 amount transaction, one has to pay about same amount, $20 in fees. This does not make any sense. Have you stopped using bitcoin for small transactions completely because of this reason ?

Based on how congested the network is right now, I'd say it's not ideal to use Bitcoin to facilitate smaller transactions. Selecting a lower fee would take much longer for the transaction to go through and paying almost the same amount in fees as the amount for good or services is not wise. In this situation, the Bitcoin lightning network should be used or altcoins that attract smaller charges like TRX, SOL, BNB etc.

[arwin100]

Small transactions on bitcoin does not make any sense now at all. Like to make a $20 amount transaction, one has to pay about same amount, $20 in fees. This does not make any sense. Have you stopped using bitcoin for small transactions completely because of this reason ?

Yes, I'd stop using this because doing any small transaction with bitcoin is not really worth it since we know that the required fee to make our transaction fast is so expensive.

That's why I choose other alts which offer convenience and low fees since this is more decision to do.

Right now I decide to hodl my bitcoin since I speculate about some possible big changes to happen since a lot of people giving such nice feedback that bitcoin price could able to reach a lot more that what we currently see nowadays.

[Plaguedeath]

I might either send Bitcoin using other chains or cheap altcoins, I'm not rich, so I can't bear the fees just to support Bitcoin on-chain.

Don't stress it, the higher the success of a crypto project the more its transaction fee will grow, even the cheaper ones like Tron and others gas fee are still cheap because their value are still very small.

That's true, but if the network is centralized, they can still offer cheap fees even though both of the market cap and trading volume are big.

The convenience about paying with Bitcoin is that it happens in private.

If you mean privacy, Monero is better than Bitcoin.

[BITCOIN4X]

I don't know, I don't use bitcoin for small transactions so far, even if the transaction fee drops to 10 sat/vbyte. I also don't use bitcoin for large transactions such as thousands of dollars, meaning bitcoin is not a means of payment for me so far. There are reasons why I don't use bitcoin as a means of payment so far in my country, of course one of them is a legal reason that completely prohibits me and everyone else from using it as a means of payment.

There are several options for making micro transactions with bitcoin, one of which is using the lightning network. You can of course take advantage of the lightning network to fulfill your desire for micro transactions, but there are also other options you can try including inter-chain transactions.