Personal Financial Goals vs Government expectations!

[kryptqnick]

I mean, yeah, we're paying a lot in taxes, and people often don't realize that they're paying taxes because some of them are just included in prices (like VAT), so they don't realize how much they're paying. But I think that taxes are okay because I do believe that we need public services, like cleaning the streets, public schools, basic healthcare. In my country, there's actually much more covered as public services, as most universities are public and offer free tuition to a very significant amount of students, and we also have public (state-owned) transport, even a couple of banks. So, to me, it makes sense that taxes should be paid, as there are a lot of things that come "free" (from taxpayers' money) in the end.

[dothebeats]

This is why it's best to look for a company that will help you in terms of your taxes. There are companies that offer you to work for them as a consultant and not a regular employee, but you get all the perks and benefits of a regular employee while only paying a significantly lower tax. I know this is not really applicable to all countries, but this is something that works for me that ends up me paying lower taxes and keeping a bulk of my salary to myself.

Unfortunately most companies didn't care with that, actually they don't have to care with that especially if you desperately need a jobs and your jobs are easy to be taken by other people, I don't think you have bargaining powers.

This is more like about the workers and the companies, not the countries.

Since most of people are average, they can't do anything except agree with all the rules.

That is also true. Most companies could care less about their employees and their wages. A lot would even go so far as to reducing the benefits of their employees in a legal manner, something that is no longer a new practice to majority of huge companies in the world.

Though that is the case, there are still a few companies out there that offer such flexible tax setup for their employees. Again, you just have to find them and you can look for that information on job boards, forums, or even on interviewers themselves. It's not an easy task, but it's worth the shot.

[Asuspawer09]

Have you ever thought about this, what we are trying to achieve in our personal financial life is completely diverge from what the government expects their citizens to do.

We as Individuals always thrive to achieve financial independence in our lives especially someone who is from the average middle person but what the government expects from the middle class is different and is kind of surprising when we give deep thought about it, The Government highly relies on the middle-class tax payers for the money and most of the taxes collected in the form of indirect taxes so that people may not actually aware that they are paying taxes for everything from their salary, fuel, medicine, anything everything has taxes that eat most our earnings.

So as a result we are paying from 10% to over 50% of our earnings just in the form of taxes in one or another way. So one who really wants to achieve financial independence should find a way to reduce their tax pay legally like how the businessmen do.

Or like the bald guy says, we need to find a way to exit the Matrix.

I would say that it is kinda of impossible to find a way to exit the matrix here since we are all controlled and managed by the government I mean we have a government in every country and that is just how it works even in different countries they all have their own government so we can't really escape paying taxes not to mention the fiat money system is the best Ponzi scheme ever, earning money where the government could just easily print money whenever they want, we are the one paying the price by inflation. I mean probably you could if you're gonna do it illegally, in my first job the company didn't really pay taxes, there was no official receipt etc. Since the owner has a lot of connections etc. I guess you could it just wouldn't be legal.

The thing here is we are the ones that needed to adjust since there was just nothing that we could do, I've realized a lot of things because of the low income, if you really wanted to have financial independence you need is have a financial foundation and knowledge on it, One of my favorite quotes that I apply is, do not buy anything that you can't afford. Sometimes there are just things that we buy that we can't really afford that is why we are having a hard time with our financial things. I learned from a financial advisor to save a lot like 40% of your income, which is going to actually be a good thing in the future, I invested a lot and now I can see that it is already working in my financial achievement, Having the financial foundation like savings, emergency funds, insurances, investments, etc. is actually the best advice and would make your cryptocurrency investment long term hold easy.

[Findingnemo]

I would say that it is kinda of impossible to find a way to exit the matrix here since we are all controlled and managed by the government I mean we have a government in every country and that is just how it works even in different countries they all have their own government so we can't really escape paying taxes not to mention the fiat money system is the best Ponzi scheme ever, earning money where the government could just easily print money whenever they want, we are the one paying the price by inflation. I mean probably you could if you're gonna do it illegally, in my first job the company didn't really pay taxes, there was no official receipt etc. Since the owner has a lot of connections etc. I guess you could it just wouldn't be legal.

The thing here is we are the ones that needed to adjust since there was just nothing that we could do, I've realized a lot of things because of the low income, if you really wanted to have financial independence you need is have a financial foundation and knowledge on it, One of my favorite quotes that I apply is, do not buy anything that you can't afford. Sometimes there are just things that we buy that we can't really afford that is why we are having a hard time with our financial things.

There is always a way and in fact these policies were made decades old so finding a loophole will be so much easier than ever. First of all we need to understand how things work where we live which will be completely different in another country so get yourself familiar with the laws, taxation and everything that's almost available to learn for free.

Going under the table, breaking the laws, and still operating the company is kind of evading tax which is possible too but we can't be sure when things will change but the rich guys are actually taking advantage of doing everything legally so no one can question them because they do everything by the books.

Adjusting, reducing all our expenses is typical mindset of an average person so we hinder out expenses for now and this is never-ending story so at one point there will be no place to shrink anything unless we act on it.

[Queentoshi]

Have you ever thought about this, what we are trying to achieve in our personal financial life is completely diverge from what the government expects their citizens to do.

Sometimes I'm forced to believe that most governments do not really want their citizens to become very exposed financially so that they can remain under their control. For instance, just as you've mentioned, People who are not financially expose think they are not paying tax whereas they're the ones who pay tax on every commodity they get and because of this lack of knowledge the government keeps making a lot of money off them. The financially exposed find ways to control their taxes to ensure that the government is not taking too much from them.

[Gaza13]

The payment of tax is really necessary for the development of  the country. But in most cases, taxes paid by the people are not regulated, they pay more than what they should pay ordinarily. It is sad to note that the same citizens who pay taxes directly from their incomes and indirectly when they purchase any item, cannot enjoy certain services like medical and academic services in the country due to high charges. This is day time robbery carried out by the government to its people and it is pathetic. Incomes are being taxed and what is left after charging personal income tax is still taxed when you purchase a commodity or enjoy any service. Every government claim they want the best for their citizens but in real sense, everyone is working for the government. They collect a huge part of our earnings and leave very little for us to fend for ourselves with.

It has nothing to do with whether you pay taxes directly or not, if you buy any of the items you mentioned above, you won't be able to enjoy medical services? I think this has a different connection, tax is medical tax or medical? Not all of the world's inhabitants cannot avoid the name tax, taxes collected by the government in every country certainly have benefits for their people, those who rob these irresponsible individuals must be dealt with firmly. Of course, the government is obliged to facilitate health or medical care for people who cannot afford it by subsidizing it and returning tax money to help them. Likewise with academics which are built or facilitated by the government, if the lower classes who cannot afford it want to go to school, the government facilitates this by competing at the national level in that country.

[Y3shot]

so yes governments want people to spend money as soon as they get it so it circulates faster and they can get several rounds of chunks of tax per year from one allotment of cash

The system is designed and programmed to take from us.
I don't think there is a way to beat the system legal unless the individual goes off-grid and starts living the mountains or forest.
As long as the individual is receiving the government currency, a portion of it must return to them..safe to say we spend our years working for the government. There's no escaping from it.

The government knows how to do this without one even having a thought of it , and the truth is that we can't run away from it. People must pay taxes directly or indirectly and their is nothing we can do about it, that's why this should be a reason why we need to try our best to be financially no matter what we found ourselves doing to be able to pay for this taxes at all time.  Well, this is just in a way support the government in return because I do not think if they can do without it. This is a thing that have been in existence long time ago, personal financial goals is just the solution for individuals not to feel it as burden.

[Faisal2202]

Or like the bald guy says, we need to find a way to exit the Matrix.

Bald guy hahaha, nice term, are we forbidden to use his actual name here!! just in case. Well, I was also having the same thoughts that what government actually wants from us, and what we are doing. Although my thoughts were not fully like yours but 90% they were same. I was thinking that most of the citizens in my countries from a long time are not paying taxes of their business, properties etc. etc. And I learned how US or other tier 1 citizens are paying taxes. I realize that these citizens are earning for themselves and earning another part of the salary for there country which then makes the economy of the country more strong.

But what my country citizens are thinking is totally different, they wants to earn for themselves only, they want to fill there pockets only and don't want to contribute to the economy of the country. The middle man is the one who actually pays the tax, because of lack of resources in higher departments and lack of knowledge. I think paying tax to the country is a good think and also saving some funds in taxes legally is a good thing too and I support that idea.

But what I don't support is people who don't want to pay the tax at all and use illegal ways.

[Negotiation]

Tax should be given to the government nothing can be done by the government alone. The government is thinking about the people's expectations and these things and making changes. This is what people want to hear from an elected representative government see in the areas where changes are needed the government is making changes in those areas. The government has to resolve the crisis the government has started taking steps on issues that need to be resolved right after the elections. There are many political diplomatic and economic challenges ahead.

[Darker45]

And how would you exit the matrix? By taking the orang pill? Uh-uh, it's also taxed, Neo.

I'm not sure in other countries but the taxes here in mine are already overlapping. And it's impossible to avoid them. Taxes are already deducted from your salary even before it reaches your wallet. And every time you spend, there are also taxes you're paying. Whether you're buying a pack of salt or riding a cab, you're paying taxes. Not to mention that your money itself is subject to inflation.

I'm afraid one can only escape taxes if one lives like a hermit.

[justdimin]

Unfortunately most companies didn't care with that, actually they don't have to care with that especially if you desperately need a jobs and your jobs are easy to be taken by other people, I don't think you have bargaining powers.

This is more like about the workers and the companies, not the countries.

Since most of people are average, they can't do anything except agree with all the rules.

That is also true. Most companies could care less about their employees and their wages. A lot would even go so far as to reducing the benefits of their employees in a legal manner, something that is no longer a new practice to majority of huge companies in the world.

Though that is the case, there are still a few companies out there that offer such flexible tax setup for their employees. Again, you just have to find them and you can look for that information on job boards, forums, or even on interviewers themselves. It's not an easy task, but it's worth the shot.

.
Honestly, we have seen so many companies who fired tens of thousands of people all at once just because their quarterly results were bad, we have seen companies literally get rid of whole operations, just to make sure that they have a short term income to show for the shareholders. That is what matters for big companies nowadays, they only care to make sure that shareholders are happy, if you are making shareholders happy then nothing else matters at all.

Even small companies look at these big companies and try to mimic them, trying to just fire people whenever times get tough. The reality is that if you stick with your people when times are tough, then they will stick with you when the times are great and you will make a lot more money that way.

[blckhawk]

If you use any of the public infrastructures and you benefit in some level to the programs that are hosted by the government and you think that your government is doing just fine and they're not incompetent and corrupt then paying your taxes is probably a fine thing to do, it should always come with your financial goals, after all, it's only fair that you give back to your society one way or the other when you're getting a lot of money. Another thing that you can probably do is to give back through your taxes. Unless you're a goddamn money laundering genius or you're part of a money laundering conspiracy, you can't really avoid taxes, as the saying goes, there's only two things that a man can't avoid in their life: death and taxes.

[lixer]

We can't really save a lot if our extra income just goes to pay taxes but we can't do anything because that's what is stated in the law, sometimes it's just unfair because we know where the tax we pay goes especially when it's corrupt the government officials sitting, Sad but that's the truth. Imagine, for everything we purchase, there is a tax on it, the kind that you work overtime to earn extra money and save, but what you earned in overtime, will just be deducted from you because of the tax.

Working overtime and earning extra is still better because if not, your regular salary will be the one who will get deducted. You can go home with a lesser amount of money and your family will be sad this time.

We are able to see the tax that we pay, I mean if we look around us like for example the concrete street that we are walking/crossing is already an example of tax expenses but if it's already implemented before and there are no new implementations yet from the newly elected government official, then that might be the time to suspect them of corruption. I think we still can do something and that is by reporting them to the other officials or organizations.

[Alone055]

This is not just for the middle class, do you think the elite or the rich don't go grocery shopping, buy medicine, or get their treatments done from medical facilities within the country? They do, and as you said, all these things have inclusive taxes that go to the government, and there is no way for anyone to avoid that because when you buy something to get a service provider to do something for you, they charge you more than what they need for their work or the product being sold because they have to pay taxes on its sale as well.

Anyone literate enough to understand simple economics would know this happens and that we pay taxes on almost anything starting from our salaries to our purchases. In some countries, cryptocurrencies are not regulated which makes it tax-free when you are earning cryptocurrencies and not declaring it because there might not be any clear law about it, but in countries where there are regulations about it, even cryptocurrency transactions are taxed.

So, it's something we have to live with, unfortunately.

[Spaceman1000$]

Have you ever thought about this, what we are trying to achieve in our personal financial life is completely diverge from what the government expects their citizens to do.

We as Individuals always thrive to achieve financial independence in our lives especially someone who is from the average middle person but what the government expects from the middle class is different and is kind of surprising when we give deep thought about it, The Government highly relies on the middle-class tax payers for the money and most of the taxes collected in the form of indirect taxes so that people may not actually aware that they are paying taxes for everything from their salary, fuel, medicine, anything everything has taxes that eat most our earnings.

So as a result we are paying from 10% to over 50% of our earnings just in the form of taxes in one or another way. So one who really wants to achieve financial independence should find a way to reduce their tax pay legally like how the businessmen do.

Or like the bald guy says, we need to find a way to exit the Matrix.

Ordinarily as an individual in a middle class, you wouldn't feel much of the impact on the tax collected from you, because that is what is needed to keep the system functioning, especially for developed countries that has a functioning social structure.
If people decide to reduce the tax they pay, is more like saying there shouldn't be enough money for the government to use and run the system, because those are the revenue government collect to give us electricity, healthcare, and other infrastructure. However there are other ways of gaining financial independence.

[0t3p0t]

Yes, of course I have thought about it. My goal is not necessarily financial independence but a high level of financial peace of mind, which I have already achieved to a large extent. That is partly achieved by saving and what governments prefer in these casino economies is that you spend. Spend a lot and get into debt, so that you spend your whole life in what is called the rat race.

I think "financial peace of mind" is for me a much better term for it if we are trying to say financial freedom or independence. Though taxes will only apply to fiat assets or centralized assets in general I think decentralized assets will exempt us from paying much more taxes which is good for us but not for the government as we all know it will hurt them a lot if crypto income in a specific country is way to high "if" that is the case. Maybe this is also the reason why government has strong regulation with decentralized assets like crypto because they may not be able to collect the fair amount of tax for the good of the country or their own purses. 😆 Just kidding.

[Gozie51]

So as a result we are paying from 10% to over 50% of our earnings just in the form of taxes in one or another way. So one who really wants to achieve financial independence should find a way to reduce their tax pay legally like how the businessmen do.

Tax reduction is a legal means to pay lower fees but to evade it is a crime. However, despite the numbers of taxes that we pay, it also means we are generating income from such means. Therefore, it shouldn't stop anyone to establish a business because of numerous tax payments. You are not taxed if you are not earning from a particular taxable source and diversification is always a better way to financial independence.

Or like the bald guy says, we need to find a way to exit the Matrix.

Are you talking of tax evasion? This is the illegal means that the bad guys use to run away from paying taxes but that also has a way to stop government achieving its goals. If you don't pay your taxes then government will not have sufficient IGR to take care of certain exigencies. You can have tax reduction if properly discussed and not to steal from the government or pay reduced fee to certain people in the tax office who don't remit to government tax purse.

[iv4n]

...
Or like the bald guy says, we need to find a way to exit the Matrix.

What does "financial independence" mean? You don't make big money without the help of the state, whoever makes big money depends on the state, because the state is what protects him and his wealth. The state takes care of its rich people by trying to kill critical thinking in everyone... children learn how to be humble and obedient in school (like in the army), and the state expects everyone to blindly listen and even more importantly to blindly trust the state and do whatever state says.

So we don't get out of the matrix with the help of money, for that we need a mind that can think for itself and question things, and not blindly accept everything that is served.

[o48o]

Have you ever thought about this, what we are trying to achieve in our personal financial life is completely diverge from what the government expects their citizens to do.

We as Individuals always thrive to achieve financial independence in our lives especially someone who is from the average middle person but what the government expects from the middle class is different and is kind of surprising when we give deep thought about it, The Government highly relies on the middle-class tax payers for the money and most of the taxes collected in the form of indirect taxes so that people may not actually aware that they are paying taxes for everything from their salary, fuel, medicine, anything everything has taxes that eat most our earnings.

So as a result we are paying from 10% to over 50% of our earnings just in the form of taxes in one or another way. So one who really wants to achieve financial independence should find a way to reduce their tax pay legally like how the businessmen do.

Or like the bald guy says, we need to find a way to exit the Matrix.

That's how countries work. You are welcome to look some country that doesn't rely on their people to build the infrastructure from normal taxes. Just don't be surprised when you need to pay high import duties, or something like that because those countries need to fund themselves as well. When you pay taxes, you are ideally paying for working infrastructure, stability and safety.

Tax avoidance is risky, costly and immoral. And it doesn't make any sense if you aren't earning enough anyway. And best part is, you never were independed, as you rely on the infrastructure of the country you were born in. Depending where you live, they can provide different kind of things, but at least ideally it's security, by laws and army. And those things cost money.

[oktana]

But I think of taxes as a good thing. I just wonder how citizens of certain cope with really large taxes to pay. However, without taxes, the government may barely have any money. And that will affect the country at large because what then can the country afford. In most cases these taxes aren’t always that big that paying it is impossible, so I think it’s something we should all comply.