First they ignore you: Are we (the Bitcoin/crypto users) about to win?

[d5000]

There's that well-known poem [1] saying:

First they ignore you,
then they laugh at you,
then they fight you,
then you win.

It has been applied several times to Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies. For example, all the "Bitcoin is dead" obituaries and the "Bitcoin is a Ponzi" narrative were interpreted as a sign for the "laugh at you" stage, and the tight regulations in some countries (e.g. China) as the shift to the "then they fight you" stage.

When would we "win"? Well, if there are so many of us Bitcoin / crypto users that we matter for the politicians, because we're becoming an important voter group.

Since a few years ago, signs for this becoming true are increasing. In many countries, now between 5 and 10% of the populations are crypto users and/or holders (about half or them Bitcoin users). And elections are becoming increasingly tight.

The recent shift in US politics which seemingly pressured the SEC to approve Bitcoin and now also Ethereum ETFs now (or are very close) is another strong sign for that, and at the same time the current US government's biggest contender Donald Trump is also trying to catch crypto users in his campaign rallies. Perhaps even Javier Milei's victory in Argentina last year could have been fueled by crypto users, in Argentina for well-known reasons (high inflation) the crypto adoption rate is at least at 10%, so it would be dumb for any politician to ignore them.

So do you think we, the crypto users, are about to win?


There's a catch though. I feel that currently the politicians all over the world are trying to present cryptocurrencies as a "financial asset" and regulate it as such. And the stance of many authorities towards privacy tools for example is still harsh, see the legal action against Tornado Cash and Samourai developers/operators.

But just censorship resistance is one of Bitcoin's major achievements - and the aforementioned actions are acting directly against that censorship resistance. If transactions can't be private, then they can be censored.

So we, the Bitcoin/crypto users, should become even bolder. We shouldn't let politicians fool us with ETFs and other nice financial products. Because cryptocurrencies are not like any other financial product. They are needed to preserve the people's freedom and independence in a digitalized world, as an alternative to their surveillance fantasies (with cooperation from Google, Meta, Apple, OpenAI etc.).

If politicians want our vote, then we should insist that they have to commit to censorship resistance and cease all legal action against privacy tools.


[1] Often incorrectly attributed to Mahatma Gandhi, this quote actually is probably derived from a 1918 speech from trade unionist Nicholas Klein.

[Felicity_Tide]

There's that well-known poem [1] saying:

First they ignore yoy,
then they laugh at you,
then they fight you,
then you win.

Nice poem for the Bitcoin community. This is clearly what we've experienced from the very first day Bitcoin was introduced, but we've unarguably overcame so many oppositions.

So do you think we, the crypto users, are about to win?

Not just win, but also make our allies to become part of us. Decentralization and transparency might be very difficult to get especially when we are been governed by those who are against it, but with time, we will overcome bigger situations, as we've already come this far and still standing strong.

There's a catch though. I feel that currently the politicians all over the world are trying to present cryptocurrencies as a "financial asset" and regulate it as such. And the stance of many authorities towards privacy tools for example is still harsh, see the legal action against Tornado Cash and Samourai developers/operators.

Their intensions are still very much intact. I think those already in power are the number one fighters.

So we, the Bitcoin/crypto users, should become even bolder. We shouldn't let politicians fool us with ETFs and other nice financial products. Because cryptocurrencies are not like any other financial product. They are needed to preserve the people's freedom and independence in a digitalized world, as an alternative to their surveillance fantasies (with cooperation from Google, Meta, Apple, OpenAI etc.).

I just hope the Bitcoin community isn't fooled by this deceitful political strategy that is used in catching the attentions of so many. Just as you've mentioned, "They are needed to preserve the people's freedom and independence in a digital world. The coming governments have seen the importance of all these, and probably using it as a strategic medium to attract followers.

If politicians want our vote, then we should insist that they have to commit to censorship resistance and cease all legal action against privacy tools.[/b]

Their words are not to be trusted even when they declare it in public. If it's possible to reach an agreement based on this matter with the Bitcoin community, then that's fine.


https://twitter.com/WatcherGuru/status/1794469215098859548?t=c4kqxUBWbr4Og5cyuggXKQ&s=19

Just saw this. Don't know his true intentions, but this is clearly a way of of putting oneself ahead of his oppositions. Political strategy as always.

[philipma1957]

pollies are like if you can’t beat them join.


hodl we must.

[uneng]

If politicians want our vote, then we should insist that they have to commit to censorship resistance and cease all legal action against privacy tools.

People who are really concerned about censorship represent a very tiny percentage of the total voters. Therefore, it's not something politicians are going to take into consideration during their governments. Maybe only during the polls, because it's nice and admirable to shout about freedom and individual rights, but once they reach power positions the situation completely changes, because they don't have to be loyal anymore to the people who voted for them.

Rather, they start being loyal to those who can maintain them where they achieved reaching, that is, to be loyal to the judiciary system, businessmen and other politicians. All these people are in favour of censorship, because it's through this mechanism they maintain their positions intact too.

Live your life on your own and forget about political affairs. To find gaps on the rules and regulations they create it's the best thing we can do as average individuals who have nothing to do with those mafias and oligarchies. That is what I see as living worthily nowadays.

You aren't going to change the world, just make sure the world doesn't change you and you will be already a winner!

[btc78]

When would we "win"?

It depends on what does an investor consider a win for himself.

Personally I think just achieving my goals through cryptocurrencies would be a win for me. A lot of people might think so but as a community at large, the ultimate goal would definitely for bitcoin to be recognized and utilized as it was intended to do so.

If politicians want our vote, then we should insist that they have to commit to censorship resistance and cease all legal action against privacy tools.

I’m afraid to question if this will ever happen.

Governments want our community but do not want to give everything that we ask for. All they can give is a little compromise through CBDCs.

[peter0425]

When would we "win"? Well, if there are so many of us Bitcoin / crypto users that we matter for the politicians, because we're becoming an important voter group.

We would only win if bitcoin is mass adapted and openly supported by the government.

Like you said we have now become a very important voter group and lots of politicians would be looking at us and see how they could create laws or bills in our favor as a promise in exchange of our votes. Whether it’s genuine or not is up to us entirely to decipher.

[Poker Player]

So do you think we, the crypto users, are about to win?

Of course not. I find it delusional for you to say this at this point. If you had said it 4 years ago it would still make sense.

More and more mixers, which were the best privacy tool, seized, have been banned from this forum, where the owner is an ancap that is all for privacy and decentralization, more and more KYC in crypto casinos, and you wonder if we are going to win?

It is more than obvious that we are losing, and by a landslide.

Apart from the fact that you talk about the Bitcoiners community as if we were all as one when the reality is that most investors in recent years are investing in Bitcoin as if they were buying a stock or a gold ETF.

So we, the Bitcoin/crypto users, should become even bolder. We shouldn't let politicians fool us with ETFs and other nice financial products. Because cryptocurrencies are not like any other financial product. They are needed to preserve the people's freedom and independence in a digitalized world, as an alternative to their surveillance fantasies (with cooperation from Google, Meta, Apple, OpenAI etc.).

Who is "we"? Not even in this forum will you find a significant percentage of that "we". Just consider the many people who complete a KYC in order to withdraw $50 in Bitcoin from a crypto casino (in most cases only to re-deposit it shortly thereafter and lose it).

When would we "win"? Well, if there are so many of us Bitcoin / crypto users that we matter for the politicians, because we're becoming an important voter group.

Pass me your dealer's phone number. The shit he sells you must be very good.

[Davidvictorson]

I am scared of politicians. They lie so much. And when vying for office, they lie much more. And now that the elections are close, they will lie 100 times more to win over the support and votes of the crypto community.,

This looks like a digression but I want to know, are there seated politician in the US who are as vocal for their support of bitcoin like Warren and Romney is as vocal in leading an anti-bitcoin campaign? If there are, why aren't they as vocal? I stand to be corrected but the only US politician that I know of is the Miami Mayor Francis Suarez who took his salary in Bitcoin.

[Fiatless]

If politicians want our vote, then we should insist that they have to commit to censorship resistance and cease all legal action against privacy tools.

Trump and other politicians who have promoted crypto want the votes of crypto users and also funding from crypto firms. Sadly majority of crypto users don't care about privacy because their interest is mainly how to benefit from the industry. People just want to invest in the sector and make a profit; they don't care about privacy. Most of them are okay with ETFs, centralized exchanges, and so on. The government has been attacking exchanges in my country, which has made buying and selling crypto difficult. I am sure that they will get all the support during elections if they begin to allow the operation of these centralized exchanges.

The big firms that will support these politicians financially are owners of these censorship-promoting firms. The population of crypto users who are against censorship is small, which means that their voices will not be heard. The crypto space is moving towards centralization, and only a few people know the danger of this move.

[davis196]

So we, the Bitcoin/crypto users, should become even bolder. We shouldn't let politicians fool us with ETFs and other nice financial products. Because cryptocurrencies are not like any other financial product. They are needed to preserve the people's freedom and independence in a digitalized world, as an alternative to their surveillance fantasies (with cooperation from Google, Meta, Apple, OpenAI etc.).

If politicians want our vote, then we should insist that they have to commit to censorship resistance and cease all legal action against privacy tools.

1.The Bitcoin/crypto users are a very small voter group. The politicians will keep ignoring us as a voter group and focusing on other electoral groups. The active cryptocurrency users around the world aren't more than 30 million in a global population of 8 billion. This is less than 1%.
2.The Bitcoin/crypto users are more divided, rather than being united. There are Bitcoin maximalists, altcoin traders, NFT "investors", etc..
The division among the crypto community is a disadvantage and the "powers that be" will use that disadvantage for sure.
3.I think that around 80-90% of all crypto users don't care about privacy and censorship resistance. They care about making profits.

[Poker Player]

1.The Bitcoin/crypto users are a very small voter group.

I deny the premise. They are not even a group. And there are many people like me, that practically nobody knows that I have Bitcoin and I want to keep it that way. If I'm concerned about privacy in this regard, I'm not going to go talk to a politician about it, nor am I going to demonstrate, nor am I going to go on TV to defend that we have a right to privacy with Bitcoin. It's an oxymoron.

With points 2 and 3 I agree.

[wxxyrqa]

1.The Bitcoin/crypto users are a very small voter group.

I deny the premise. They are not even a group. And there are many people like me, that practically nobody knows that I have Bitcoin and I want to keep it that way. If I'm concerned about privacy in this regard, I'm not going to go talk to a politician about it, nor am I going to demonstrate, nor am I going to go on TV to defend that we have a right to privacy with Bitcoin. It's an oxymoron.

With points 2 and 3 I agree.

Our problem is that we want to be anonymous users of cryptocurrency and in this case we cannot defend our interests publicly. Of course, the situation will change and the process has already started, when large players and large capital enter the cryptocurrency, which the government and legislator will have to take into account.

[kotajikikox]

I am scared of politicians. They lie so much. And when vying for office, they lie much more. And now that the elections are close, they will lie 100 times more to win over the support and votes of the crypto community.,

See this is why we shouldn't believe in politicians too much and even if they promise us one thing after the other it shouldn't allow us to be soft and too dependent on these politicians. Don't be fooled too much. Instead we should find for politicians or characters that have genuine support for bitcoin and cryptocurrency even before they were aiming for a position so at least  we know that they actually care for bitcoin or crypto and its community and they are not just talking about it to gain votes.

[jrrsparkles]

Politicians are sweet liars, they know how to make most out of a situation so they just use cryptocurrency as an opportunity to gain more attention to their names and the party they belong which will obviously going to be beneficial for them to win the elections but they do keep their promise? Never so we should not trust everything they say as well, probably they can use the situation now but if they don't fulfill their promises then the next election which itself going to be a disadvantage for them.

[Maus0728]

That's almost the trend for revolutionary stuff, the concept, idea, theory, and the method is so radical to the norm that it's almost always that the majority of the population will have a hard time believing that something so novel or new will change the world and so they just always go with the safe side that it will pass and that it's just not going to last for a really long time but then they're all proven wrong and so they end up having to get into it a bit too late.

Isn't that always the case with most disaster movie tropes, they ignore the scientists because they can't believe that something like that can happen and then it happens. It's the same thing with bitcoin, people think that it's a scam and that it's really stupid that an Internet money has a value, they can't open their mind to comprehend that bitcoin is here to stay and being a hater will just make you the loser at the end of the day.

[maydna]

Our problem is that we want to be anonymous users of cryptocurrency and in this case we cannot defend our interests publicly. Of course, the situation will change and the process has already started, when large players and large capital enter the cryptocurrency, which the government and legislator will have to take into account.

We can still to be anonymous and hides ourselves from public by not telling them that we are one of the crypto users. Many people who involved in crypto doing this to prevents from the crime that can happens to them. Perhaps they can teach other people about crypto but not telling them about how many coins we have because that will be too risky for us.

Larger players and large capital already enter to the crypto worlds and that helps crypto changed and becomes more popular than last few years. People who abandon crypto from the first already regrets it because they are too late to realizes that crypto can becomes popular like now. But they can still join in crypto like other people who already involved.

[Aanuoluwatofunmi]

I don't blame some people on their reactions once they heard about bitcoin, the next thing that comes their mind is scam, because they don't know and were not willing to know anything about this digital currency, that is why some may not have to express themself to others on what they do and instead, they make it private to avoid related issues like this, nevertheless, the government as well are not helping in the situation on what is happening, we don't have to look on all these than to face what we want with bitcoin.

[SamReomo]

I am scared of politicians. They lie so much. And when vying for office, they lie much more. And now that the elections are close, they will lie 100 times more to win over the support and votes of the crypto community.

I highly agree with your opinion, the politicians often try their best to lie in order to win more votes but we have no other option available and that's why we should give them some chance to see if they are lying or they're sincere about their promises.

Donald Trump can be a good politicians who may support the narrative of cryptocurrencies and may reduce the strict actions against the crypto community and at the same time he may make it easier for American citizens to hold crypto currencies. I believe he's better than Biden when it comes to crypto support, however, no one is fully aware about his real intentions.

[Casdinyard]

Besides the copium aspect of this post I have nothing against it.

The thing is that regardless of if whether the people around you ridicule you for being a cryptobro or not, the right course of action is to always continue to hold and accumulate your coins. Their sentiments of support/discouragement isn't gonna grow your portfolio, although the former is always appreciated and welcome. Plus it's not like they have a stake at what you have right now, so why let these people get into your skin in the first place? The people that are most unshaken in this industry, regardless of what happens internally or externally are the ones that will bag the most out of everyone. After all, the biggest playing factors in this industry no matter how you look at it is FOMO.

We're looking at a really bright crypto bull season this year, and besides that I do not need any more support/motivation to keep investing and putting in more money. Long as my money's getting longer and the coins in my portfolio continue to get fatter, I'm all good.

[Jawhead999]

If politicians want our vote, then we should insist that they have to commit to censorship resistance and cease all legal action against privacy tools.

You're talking about maximalists, maximalists are clearly lose here, only crypto users are win.

The number of Bitcoin maximalist is really low, the proof is majority of people choose to hold their coins in centralized exchange over non custodial wallet. Even all the maximalists hate the politician and didn't want to vote him, there's a big chance he will win considering a lot people don't care with privacy and self custodial.

I think maximalist will never win since year by year the government want to destroy privacy in Bitcoin.