Thoughts about the person renting an apartment with Bitcoin in Argentina

[btc78]

if you pay your rent with bitcoin, wouldn't you be exposing your identity to your landlord? Including your wallet address, hopefully this is just a concern that won't really happen at all but it's still worth talking over.

I agree with you since it’s very rare for an apartment to not ask for a specific identification or documents to prove their own identity. One who is too secretive and private would be suspicious but if you plan on using bitcoin in argentina to rent then it’s probably implied that you don’t care as much about decentralization or privacy or maybe it’s just something you are going to need to sacrifice.

[yudi09]

-snip-

Well, it's true that the government will slowly implement crypto currency in the community or in the country, but also this kind of movement should be planned and thought through thoroughly because we know how volatile a crypto currency can be, so there may be a conflict for both the customer and owner of the business. If this is about the land of rent, then this has to have a proper contract with a proper handling of bitcoin because there will be no fixed amount in crypto currency, so anytime the rent fee could change, and there should be a way to handle that situation in a contract to avoid conflict. Anyway, in conclusion, this article or news is good because we can see now that the government itself is taking bold and new steps in order to give people more options and be more open to new innovations and opportunities.

The fluctuating price of cryptocurrency is a consideration for some who do not want to make Bitcoin legal tender. But I don't have a specific argument to justify whether price fluctuations are really the reason they are considering making Bitcoin legal tender.
If we refer to El Salvador's great decision, what I know is that they do not force their citizens to use Bitcoin as a means of payment, they provide convenience and freedom between Bitcoin and using fiat currency.

Making Bitcoin a means of payment provides good opportunities in the investment field.
For me, I do not require the government to make Bitcoin a means of payment if the government is not ready for various considerations. However, making it an alternative provides quite good opportunities for the business world.

[d5000]

Now, first of all that sounds very cheap for a full month of rent, but the most interesting part to me is that the price was set in USDT, which can at any time depeg: https://cointelegraph.com/news/how-and-why-do-stablecoins-depeg So, any month, those 100 USDT can represent a completely different amount of USD, which will then be converted to BTC.

The second thing to highlight here is that they are not paying the BTC directly to the other person wallet. They are using a centralized exchange called Fiwind, and basically they deposit their Argentinean Peso into the platform, exchange it to BTC, and then transfer the BTC in the platform to the landlord, monthly:

Quite interesting details. I think I share the doubts about that one being really a "freely celebrated" contract.

The second part of the contract can be explained though, at least a bit. You need a reference price for that kind of contract, and using a single CEX is maybe the most simple way to do that. Otherwise there may be disputes about the "correct" weighting of the prices on different exchanges, and AFAIK there is no company publishing really an "ARS reference price" and even less an "Argentina USDT reference price" for Bitcoin. So if both parties had just an account at Fiwind (that's written in the Pagina12 article) then this may have been the most convenient way for them, although I definitely think there are strong signs that there was some sponsorship deal or so.

Explaining why they used USDT instead of USD is a bit harder. Perhaps the tenant wanted to (at least sometimes) pay in USDT instead of ARS. Or Fiwind doesn't have an USD/BTC pair but only an USDT/BTC pair. The landlord probably didn't want ARS nor USD but Bitcoins.

100 USD by the way isn't a totally uncommon price in Argentina for a small apartment in a poorer part of a city. Rosario isn't an expensive city, it has some problems with crime.

[Kakmakr]

USDT is not Bitcoin, it is a Stable Alt coin and just another of the wannabe "GovCoins" that are pegged for stability to something else.

I also see that it is using a third party payment processor, so it is not even a "pure" Crypto currency payment.

Nah..   try again.

[nullama]

USDT is not Bitcoin, it is a Stable Alt coin and just another of the wannabe "GovCoins" that are pegged for stability to something else.

I also see that it is using a third party payment processor, so it is not even a "pure" Crypto currency payment.

Nah..   try again.

So, it is priced in USDT, but the landlord receives Bitcoin.

Yes, there is an exchange involved. It could be better, but it's still some starting point.

In the article they mentioned that both were users of the exchange, so maybe they wanted to minimize fees and just trade in the same platform (which is not really moving BTC on the chain by the way).

[FinePoine0]

JUST IN: 🇦🇷🇸🇻 Government officials in Argentina met with their counterparts in El Salvador to discuss adopting cryptocurrencies similar to how they have done under the Bukele presidency with #Bitcoin   .
Details
The two groups “exchanged concepts about the growth of the use of cryptocurrencies in economies in general, and in particular exchanged details of the Salvadoran case […] we want to strengthen ties with the Republic of El Salvador and therefore, we are going to explore the possibility of signing collaboration agreements with them.”

[kryptqnick]

If this idea of paying in Bitcoin works the way the op described, I agree that it's a missed opportunity to truly adopt Bitcoin. A centralized platform is one problem, and the USDT, while historically stable, always poses a risk of destabilization. But, on a positive note, it could be the first step toward adoption of Bitcoin, and maybe the situation will improve in the future, especially considering how determined the current president of Argentina is to foster economic growth, abolish the central bank, etc.

[darkangel11]

It was reported months before the elections that brought in Javier Milei that he is pro Bitcoin and will turn Argentina into another El Salvado. I guess we are seeing that come to reality today because for an active government official to rent apartment with Bitcoin in a country where the president is restructuring the governance, is an indication that Bitcoin is a welcomed in the country. Since late last year, Argentina approves Bitcoin as its official currency, no wonder Elon Musk is passionate about Argentina because whether we believe it or not, Elon Musk has become the new face of freedom. What this development will do is that by the time more countries see the success recorded by Bitcoin in the countries where it has been allowed to flourished, they will begin to shift towards legalizing Bitcoin and this is something huge for Bitcoin and the Bitcoin community.

U feel like Milei is greatly overestimated by bitcoiners. AFAIK he supports FATF, which is an nonelected private organization that tries to enforce its monetary rules on other countries and is clearly anti-bitcoin and against freedom of transaction and privacy. On one hand he's for bitcoin and freedom, on the other he enforces KYC rules and wants people's wallets to be assigned to real identities.
As for renting apartments it's a great idea because bitcoin is made for these larger transactions, where you have to pay a few hundred dollars (or in these case pesos) at once. IMO car dealerships should all accept bitcoin because those are one of the largest one time transactions people make.

[Baki202]

if you pay your rent with bitcoin, wouldn't you be exposing your identity to your landlord? Including your wallet address, hopefully this is just a concern that won't really happen at all but it's still worth talking over.

A very valid point made you will be exposing your privacy and identity and and I don't think is smart to be spending something of value for a rent. I will rather keep my self unknown and pay with fiat. Becaue what if bitcoin is in bad condition and you expect me to pay with my bitcoin. To aviod a lot of things just pay with cash and their won't be any attention drawn to your self  and people will have various reasons why they spend their bitcoin. Since it also a legal tender in some countries so people might use it as an exchange to money. And since its personal decision. Because their are people that use it various things even give to charity. So what anyone do with their bitcoin concerns them but privacy matters a lot.

I agree with you since it’s very rare for an apartment to not ask for a specific identification or documents to prove their own identity. One who is too secretive and private would be suspicious but if you plan on using bitcoin in argentina to rent then it’s probably implied that you don’t care as much about decentralization or privacy or maybe it’s just something you are going to need to sacrifice.

When it comes to Bitcoin, you should take your privacy seriously. It's better to be known for something else than being engaged with bitcoin or having access to your wallet, as this can lead to tracking of your transactions and reveal your anonymity. And I believe the landlord accepted Bitcoin. Even in legal tender scenarios, I prefer to convert my bitcoin to cash rather than spending it directly. For example, if I needed to pay house rent, I would plan ahead of time and avoid spending my Bitcoin. I believe Bitcoin is solely meant to be used for profit, not spending. With any genuine cause, it remains a personal choice.

[Dr.Bitcoin_Strange]

Well, this time around, some people seem to have forgotten the normal per-per sending of Bitcoin without the involvement of a third-party exchange. I could be wrong, though, because the second guess that is running through my mind is that those people might just be seeking attention and don't seem to have a proper knowledge of it all. If perhaps the house owner wanted to accept Bitcoin payments, then he should have just stated a particular fraction of Bitcoin to be paid by the tenant, and that's the fraction that will have to pay every year. He will benefit more because of volatility. Also, the tenant who wanted to rent the house and pay with Bitcoin may not necessarily be an old investor of Bitcoin; maybe he was just someone who wanted to do something different and make a name for himself. If he was an old investor, then he should have some Bitcoin in his wallet and would have just paid directly from his self custodian wallet.

[dothebeats]

OP. Any news that reports about businesses or other things that can be paid for using Bitcoin is always fun.
We know Argentina with its new president as someone who likes Bitcoin and based on this, it makes it easier for business people to use Bitcoin as a means of payment. It may not be as total as the implementation in El Salvador, but policies like this report have made it easier for citizens to implement them.

But in this case, the two parties did it with a third party involved instead of them two agreeing on their terms and exchanging bitcoins directly. IMO it kind of defeats the purpose of being able to pay directly with bitcoins because you still need a centralized exchange in 'facilitating' the whole thing. I think that this is just a ploy to promote the crypto exchange platform and not really about a person renting an apartment with bitcoin. They just used this story to highlight how could they be used as a facilitator when in fact, the landlord and the tenant could just straight up do the whole thing with themselves.

We continue to hope that many countries can make Bitcoin what it should be. We are also proud here that we can still make Bitcoin a commodity asset.

Apparently, this does not make bitcoin what it should be. You can always send and receive bitcoins without the need for a third-party facilitator.

[d5000]

U feel like Milei is greatly overestimated by bitcoiners. AFAIK he supports FATF, which is an nonelected private organization that tries to enforce its monetary rules on other countries and is clearly anti-bitcoin and against freedom of transaction and privacy. On one hand he's for bitcoin and freedom, on the other he enforces KYC rules and wants people's wallets to be assigned to real identities.

I agree with the first sentence. Milei has quite contradictory political positions in many fields. For example, he supports free markets and competition, but has no problems with monopolies. WTF? In general I think he has some interesting ideas but is not the adequate person to lead a country.

In the case of crypto regulation his stance can however be explained a bit. Argentina is constantly in danger to get added to the "grey list" of FATF, and thus the government proceeded to regulate exchanges in simlar ways to other countries. However, the regulation is a bit less strict than for example in the US. There is for example no obligation for exchanges outside of Argentina to obey the country's regulations if they want to offer services to Argentine customers, with the exception on them being directed directly to Argentinians (e.g. with an Argentine website or domain or an official ARS fiat ramp). There is also an exception for small exchanges. So I think in general, taking into account the FATF pressure, the regulation wasn't excessively hard, although of course the government could also have been bolder.

JUST IN

Nope, this is already a week old I also think it shouldn't be overestimated. The meeting was centered around collaboration agreements and regulations. And Milei isn't a supporter of "legal tenders", he wants a free competition of payment means (and the concept of legal tender is the opposite if you're forced to accept a single currency).

[Sandra_hakeem]

Missed opportunity. I think the main point here is setting the price in USD equivalent instead of the Argentinean Peso which devalues a lot over time.

What if he requires using the monthly payment for his upkeep, checks and balances etc? What if he demands for repairs of one of his houses with immediate effect?  I'd say, unless he's not always in need of those cash, he could stake them sats.

It is like I told you I am renting my apartment for Gold.  But the price is calculated in Dollars and in order to pay you will have to sign up on eToro, deposit Dollars, buy Gold Stocks and send me some.

Honestly! The news carries that they made a transaction with Bitcoin, but reading through, you gotta quickly understand what zher motive was. 100 USDt might equate exactly the same value as 0.0015 bitcoin, but that doesn't make it Bitcoin itself.