Haney-Garcia Decision Out: Betting Implications

[Darker45]

The New York State Athletic Commission has suspended Ryan Garcia due to positive PED test results. On top of the suspension, Garcia also forfeited his purse worth $1.2 million, fined for $10,000, and his victory over Devin Haney overturned to no-contest.^[1]

Normally, if I'm not mistaken, settled bets are settled bets. Betting sites usually won't overturn results. Lucky for those who bet on Garcia, the underdog in that match, for winning. But I'd like to ask those who bet on Haney, especially those who bet big. Now that the official decision is out, would anyone of you demand that your bets be returned since the fight is now officially declared as a no-contest?

I'm not sure how betting sites would respond if a bettor makes a ticket asking for the bet amount to be returned. They might have different decisions. I remember sending a ticket for a bet to be overturned. It was successful. I can't anymore remember the details but it had something to do with a DOTA II match. There was a disconnection or some technical glitch. The betting site decided that it was a draw and gave us back our money, but the organizing team later on declared one team as the winner. That was the team I placed a bet on.

It would also be interesting if there's a representative of a betting site who could chime in.

[1] https://www.espn.com/boxing/story/_/id/40396474/ryan-garcia-suspended-one-year-positive-ped-test

[bbc.reporter]

I reckon on boxing decisions, it is usually the sportsbooks that will accept the loss on these types of occurrences and continue with an assumption that the outcome has happened fairly. A sportsbook that would begin overturning every decision and every victory on their bettors will certainly become an unpopular sportsbook that will have a risk of bankruptcy because all customers are leaving hehehehe. I reckon on the decisions about overturned betting outcomes, the customer should always be right.

[bisdak40]

I reckon on boxing decisions, it is usually the sportsbooks that will accept the loss on these types of occurrences and continue with an assumption that the outcome has happened fairly. A sportsbook that would begin overturning every decision and every victory on their bettors will certainly become an unpopular sportsbook that will have a risk of bankruptcy because all customers are leaving hehehehe. I reckon on the decisions about overturned betting outcomes, the customer should always be right.

I agree, the sportsbook should adhere to the decision on a game/fight on that day and should not let their customers suffer the outcome if the decision is overturned against their bets as this will only shove their customers away and besides, if i'm not mistaken this kind of scenario is stipulated on the sportsbook policy/guidelines.

[Maslate]

I reckon on boxing decisions, it is usually the sportsbooks that will accept the loss on these types of occurrences and continue with an assumption that the outcome has happened fairly. A sportsbook that would begin overturning every decision and every victory on their bettors will certainly become an unpopular sportsbook that will have a risk of bankruptcy because all customers are leaving hehehehe. I reckon on the decisions about overturned betting outcomes, the customer should always be right.

In this particular result, they have to deal with the losses, and I guess there's a general rule among sportsbooks, so their decision is unified. Besides, there are bettors who bet in favor of Ryan, and they have already graded those bets. Those who bet on Haney lost their bets, so nothing extraordinary about that.

How about the fight between Casimero and Akaho? It was initially ruled as a no-contest, but later it was decided to be a KO win in favor of Casimero. I didn't hear any complaints from gamblers about that, so I guess they will stick with the decision after the fight.

https://www.rappler.com/sports/boxing/fight-results-john-riel-casimero-ryo-akaho-december-3-2022/
https://boxrec.com/en/proboxer/421916

[Lida93]

In as much as I do condemn any act of unprofessionalism by sports men in not following the rules of engagement as laid down guidelines in respective games, I do not agree to the call that overturned decisions by sports organizers after a decision has been taken and results given and settled in all gambling outlets/sites that as a result of an overturned it should also reflect in sportsbooks too.

Doing that can cause a lot of confusion between sportbookies and casino's, between casino's and their customers who will be on two aide of the divide, between those who the overturned decisions favoured and the unfavored. I should believe that issues like this is addressed on gambling sites ToS.

Any gambling site that makes an attempt to carry out an action as a result of the overturn will only be putting it's existence in business at risk. Let leave the sleeping dog sleep.

[OgNasty]

This is interesting. I know I had a few different bets on the fight and I thought Garcia would lose, but I’m not sure if that’s the way I bet it due to odds or not. Will have to look back and see. You bring up a good point about who is liable and what happens. I imagine maybe casinos have some type of insurance for things like this?

[_act_]

I read on the terms and conditions of the first betting site that I used that any match that was not cancelled before the match started or after the match begin but ended successful would be a successful bet. If the decision was later overturned, nothing will the betting site do again after the match has ended and people that won the bet would have been given their money even if the match was later cancelled.

[FinneysTrueVision]

I looked at the terms of service on several casinos and they all say that they will honor the result that is announced at the end of a fight. Once a bet outcome is settled, it can’t be changed even if the result of the fight gets overturned some weeks later.

In this specific fight, Haney didn’t win on fight night and a no contest is still not a win. People who bet for Garcia are in luck because their prize can’t be forfeited.

[Yaunfitda]

I reckon on boxing decisions, it is usually the sportsbooks that will accept the loss on these types of occurrences and continue with an assumption that the outcome has happened fairly. A sportsbook that would begin overturning every decision and every victory on their bettors will certainly become an unpopular sportsbook that will have a risk of bankruptcy because all customers are leaving hehehehe. I reckon on the decisions about overturned betting outcomes, the customer should always be right.

Yep, a win is a win already and that they have paid the winner bettors already. So I guess they can't do anything about it as this is one risk as well perhaps and this case is rare though that the result is overturn. True again, they will lost a lot of their gamblers if every overturn results that this casinos will asked their bettors to return the money? Doesn't make sense. So they will have to let go of this. Same with the Haney bettors, they shouldn't cry over spilled milk here. And as what we say, better luck next time. There are a lot of boxing events that the underdog might win just like the recent Paro vs Matias wherein Paro is a 7:1 underdog as well.

[Natalim]

I read on the terms and conditions of the first betting site that I used that any match that was not cancelled before the match started or after the match begin but ended successful would be a successful bet. If the decision was later overturned, nothing will the betting site do again after the match has ended and people that won the bet would have been given their money even if the match was later cancelled.

I agree with this, otherwise, they'll be creating a mess on the gambling world as things like this could happen from time to time. When a boxer loss, they'll complain and the decision will be reverted, so if sportsbook will allow any adjustment based on that, things will be hard for them as gamblers would just easily complain, and since casino is reputation based, they won't gamble with that.

[Helena Yu]

I reckon on boxing decisions, it is usually the sportsbooks that will accept the loss on these types of occurrences and continue with an assumption that the outcome has happened fairly.

This is not a loss, the sportsbook is making money from gamblers who bet on Haney or draw. Even there are a lot people bet on Garcia, the sportsbook will adjust the odd and make sure they're not in loss.

It just that this decision make gamblers who bet on Garcia is really lucky, while gamblers who bet on Haney or draw, they lose their money without any reason.

[Marvelockg]

I read on the terms and conditions of the first betting site that I used that any match that was not cancelled before the match started or after the match begin but ended successful would be a successful bet. If the decision was later overturned, nothing will the betting site do again after the match has ended and people that won the bet would have been given their money even if the match was later cancelled.

this should be the ideal narrative for all site. What do you think will be the decision of thoe that the initial result of the fight favoured? Would they think to refund the amount they've won because the game has been canceled and assumed not to have held?

This kind of event should have little or nothing to do with the gamblers involved cause you can't hold both those that have won and those that have lost to start paying back the amount they've won and the one they've lost. It's damn unnecessary and I guess due to the effect of time on the individuals that played the bet at the time, they must have hilled from thier losses or used up the amount they've won through the bet. As for the reduction in the level of ethical sportsmanship we've experienced in literally all the sports around, they need to be seriously penalized so they can reduce these excesses and do better as sportsman so we don't see these kinds of things repeating itself over and over again.

[Odohu]

The New York State Athletic Commission has suspended Ryan Garcia due to positive PED test results. On top of the suspension, Garcia also forfeited his purse worth $1.2 million, fined for $10,000, and his victory over Devin Haney overturned to no-contest.^[1]

Normally, if I'm not mistaken, settled bets are settled bets. Betting sites usually won't overturn results. Lucky for those who bet on Garcia, the underdog in that match, for winning. But I'd like to ask those who bet on Haney, especially those who bet big. Now that the official decision is out, would anyone of you demand that your bets be returned since the fight is now officially declared as a no-contest?

I don't think there is anything both the gambling companies and the gamblers can do about this, those who won on the match have cashed out their monies while those who lost have already lost, the decision of the regulators holds no water in this case because they came to that decision after the event have been concluded within the time they set for it. Assuming the even was cancelled for whatever reason, then it would have been a different case. 

I'm not sure how betting sites would respond if a bettor makes a ticket asking for the bet amount to be returned. They might have different decisions. I remember sending a ticket for a bet to be overturned. It was successful. I can't anymore remember the details but it had something to do with a DOTA II match. There was a disconnection or some technical glitch. The betting site decided that it was a draw and gave us back our money, but the organizing team later on declared one team as the winner. That was the team I placed a bet on.

In sportsbook,  this kinds of things happens often especially during time of snow where matches are postponed or suspended regularly. When this happens, the odds for the particular event is usually returned as 1, meaning there was no bet so the funds of everyone who bet on those matches are returned to them. However, there is a kind of gambling in my country called pools in which there is a panel that decides the outcome of suspended or postponed matches and their decision is binding on all parties. U

[_act_]

this should be the ideal narrative for all site. What do you think will be the decision of thoe that the initial result of the fight favoured? Would they think to refund the amount they've won because the game has been canceled and assumed not to have held?

When many of them have even withdrawn the money  . If that is what would happen, some people will not use the gambling site again because they will think that if they deposit money, the gambling site will deduct the money. It is better how it is in there terms and conditions of the gambling sites that any match that has been ended would be counted as successful and nothing can reverse it even if the match is later cancelled.

Only games that are cancelled by the gambling sites are games that have not started and games that was not played finished which can be due to environment like heavy snow fall or disagreement and fight.

[EluguHcman]

Affirmatively, your bet was retrieved as a result of technical issues being computational system error which lucky for you all that the site engineers and the gambling site owner agreed that there was such an error while you processes your bets

So it was as able to be undo due to error transparency.
But it's about bettors requesting for retrieval or undo to their bets, that would absolutely be impossible because it has been stamped and officially approved in the system.
And if I am not mistaking, all casinos do obviously states it that there is no revert if a game has been confirmed processed.

So, the need for such bettors would be invalid so, just pray that it goes to your favour as your predicted. Hence, there will always be lost and losers amongst bettors betting at the opposites. 

[stompix]

Now that the official decision is out, would anyone of you demand that your bets be returned since the fight is now officially declared as a no-contest?

Yeah and everyone that is successful in doing so better keep the money ready cause if Garcia manages to appeal the decision and overturn it then you lose again!  Settled bets are settled bets, only an inquiry before announcing the result and changes the outcome can influence what bookie pays or not, a 3 months event is already dead.

Lance Armstrong was stripped of 7 titles 6 years later, imagine trying to get your bets back....

[Japinat]

Now that the official decision is out, would anyone of you demand that your bets be returned since the fight is now officially declared as a no-contest?

Yeah and everyone that is successful in doing so better keep the money ready cause if Garcia manages to appeal the decision and overturn it then you lose again!  Settled bets are settled bets, only an inquiry before announcing the result and changes the outcome can influence what bookie pays or not, a 3 months event is already dead.

Lance Armstrong was stripped of 7 titles 6 years later, imagine trying to get your bets back....

I guess that's the right words, it's already a "settled bets", and we cannot go back in the past anymore. Imagine, if the sportsbook would offset those amount that they paid on the winners because they used the "no contest" as its basis, that would only result to gamblers leaving the sportsbook to avoid that from happening to them.

[Kemarit]

They've processed everything already, so there's no implication whatsoever as they have settled it already. So I wouldn't demand the sports bookies to bring back my money, I will accept defeat or win regardless and just move on.

And what others said, this will just complicate things on their end and the result might not be good to them as there are customers who might leave them because of this controversies. And there are no technical issues here, it's simply Ryan was caught with peds, but as boxing fans, we all know that Haney would have lost anyways even if Ryan didn't take peds, IMHO.

[alegotardo]

Normally, if I'm not mistaken, settled bets are settled bets. Betting sites usually won't overturn results. Lucky for those who bet on Garcia, the underdog in that match, for winning. But I'd like to ask those who bet on Haney, especially those who bet big. Now that the official decision is out, would anyone of you demand that your bets be returned since the fight is now officially declared as a no-contest?

Yes!

In the same way that, if the bet were judged fair (as is the case most of the time), I would not want my money to be blocked for several hours or days at the brokerage firm, waiting for this "verification".

Understand that, if I were to return the amounts, the casino would certainly lose out, since many users who were winners have already withdrawn their prize or bet on other games and lost everything (and this money went to other people).

Have you ever seen a casino losing money?

Also consider that in in-person bets, the money is "distributed" right after the fight ends, no one waits for hours or only comes back the next day to collect the money. So, whoever won would probably be away for a few days if they were called to return the money.

Is it unfair? Maybe so! But I don't see any practical solutions to this type of problem.

[AmoreJaz]

They've processed everything already, so there's no implication whatsoever as they have settled it already. So I wouldn't demand the sports bookies to bring back my money, I will accept defeat or win regardless and just move on.

And what others said, this will just complicate things on their end and the result might not be good to them as there are customers who might leave them because of this controversies. And there are no technical issues here, it's simply Ryan was caught with peds, but as boxing fans, we all know that Haney would have lost anyways even if Ryan didn't take peds, IMHO.

I can understand that you can easily move on if the money involved is small or not significant. But if you are a high roller and betting thousands of dollars, I believe, such bettor will reach out the bookie and will try to get it from the site. But we can also consult their terms when it comes to sportsbetting. Because for sure, they have their conditions when it comes to finality of the results. And how they will resolve if such situation arises.

Checking at stake, you can check their sportsbook rules and policies. An example is how the results are being decided as stated below - 

https://stake.com/policies/sportsbook

For other sports, you can check their rules on how each one is being resolved. So before you file a complaint to any bookie, better check their rules on how they are resolving the finality of the results of your bets.